The 12 Greatest Utes of All Time

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10-26-2017, 08:17 AM
DrumNFeather

The 12 Greatest Utes of All Time

This is probably a thread for the off-season, but the in-season ain't giving us much to talk about, so here we are. I watched the Pac 12 special last night (it ran in August) on the 12 greatest Utes of all time.

Here they are in order of how they were announced:

12. Roy Jefferson
11. Steve Smith
10. Nate Orchard
9. Scott Mitchell
8. Devonte Booker
7. Tom Hackett
6. Larry Wilson
5. Star Lotuleli
4. Jordan Gross
3. Luther Ellis
2. Eric Weddle
1. Alex Smith

Thoughts?

Who else do you think would go on the list?
10-26-2017, 12:41 PM
Applejack

Quote:

Originally Posted by DrumNFeather

This is probably a thread for the off-season, but the in-season ain't giving us much to talk about, so here we are. I watched the Pac 12 special last night (it ran in August) on the 12 greatest Utes of all time.

Here they are in order of how they were announced:

12. Roy Jefferson
11. Steve Smith
10. Nate Orchard
9. Scott Mitchell
8. Devonte Booker
7. Tom Hackett
6. Larry Wilson
5. Star Lotuleli
4. Jordan Gross
3. Luther Ellis
2. Eric Weddle
1. Alex Smith

Thoughts?

Who else do you think would go on the list?

I know that Tom is a two time RAY GUY AWARD WINNER, but having a punter ranked ahead of Steve Smith feels wrong.
10-26-2017, 01:26 PM
UTEopia

Quote:

Originally Posted by Applejack

I know that Tom is a two time RAY GUY AWARD WINNER, but having a punter ranked ahead of Steve Smith feels wrong.

I guess it depends on whether you include their professional careers or not. If you are simply considering their performances while at Utah, there are some other players that should be on the list.

Hunter Dimick - If you include Orchard, you need to include the guy who broke his record.
Carl Monroe RB - most electric RB I can ever remember the Utes having
Eddie Johnson RB - best RB over a 4 year career.

Guys with good/great careers in the pros.

Norm Thompson CB - 1st round draft choice of St. Louis - better college player than pro.
Bob Trumpy TE - long time pro with Cincinnati
Manny Fernandez OL - played 8 years with Miami and in 3 Super Bowls
10-26-2017, 01:28 PM
DrumNFeather

As I understand it, this was strictly a college performance list, which has to be why Steve was so low on the list. Of course, when they talk about Larry Wilson, they mention him as a Hall of Famer.

I still think it would be cool for the stadium to have a ring of fame of some kind.
10-26-2017, 02:02 PM
Diehard Ute

Quote:

Originally Posted by DrumNFeather

As I understand it, this was strictly a college performance list, which has to be why Steve was so low on the list. Of course, when they talk about Larry Wilson, they mention him as a Hall of Famer.

I still think it would be cool for the stadium to have a ring of fame of some kind.

Steve’s college stats were pretty good really. He never hit that magical 1,000 yard mark, but he averaged 20.6 YPC for his 2 years.

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10-26-2017, 02:10 PM
concerned

Roy Jefferson was an all-american. How many of those have we had?
10-26-2017, 02:50 PM
Applejack

This is maddening: WHAT IS THE STANDARD BY WHICH THEY ARE MEASURED!?!?!!?!?

The JC guys mess this up; if it is their college performance only, I understand knocking JCs down a peg or two. But then you also have Alex Smith (2 yr player, pretty much) who is #1.

I would just say which guy would you like to have on the Utes for a one-year, Carrington-like sojourn. If that is the criteria, here are my top ten:

1. Alex
2. Luther
3. Star
4. Weddle
5. Mitchell (just so he could beat BYU again)
6. Steve Smith Sr.
7. Devonte
8. Fakahafua (Orchard)
9. K Dyson
10. Darnell Arcenaux
10-26-2017, 03:20 PM
Nice Marmot

Quote:

10. Darnell Arcenaux

Arcenaux always seemed so close to being great but just never got there. Very good on his best day but average most of the time.
10-26-2017, 03:28 PM
Diehard Ute

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nice Marmot

Arcenaux always seemed so close to being great but just never got there. Very good on his best day but average most of the time.

Yup. Very average numbers.

His yards per attempt was good, 8.1, but he had only 26 TD’s to 21 INT’s with a low completion percentage.

His rushing numbers weren’t all that great either. 3.3YPC.

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10-26-2017, 05:18 PM
UtahsMrSports

Considering college only, give me a healthy hunter d over nate orchard.
10-26-2017, 08:25 PM
mUUser

Quote:

Originally Posted by DrumNFeather

This is probably a thread for the off-season, but the in-season ain't giving us much to talk about, so here we are. I watched the Pac 12 special last night (it ran in August) on the 12 greatest Utes of all time.

Here they are in order of how they were announced:

12. Roy Jefferson
11. Steve Smith
10. Nate Orchard
9. Scott Mitchell
8. Devonte Booker
7. Tom Hackett
6. Larry Wilson
5. Star Lotuleli
4. Jordan Gross
3. Luther Ellis
2. Eric Weddle
1. Alex Smith

Thoughts?

Who else do you think would go on the list?

Not my exact list, but no major beefs. Perhaps Bryan Rowley would displace Steve Smith as a WR. Also I'd have to make room for Filipo Mokofisi Sr for being the hardest hitter I ever saw in a Utah uniform....although Marquis Blair is giving him a run for his money.
10-26-2017, 08:44 PM
Diehard Ute

Quote:

Originally Posted by mUUser

Not my exact list, but no major beefs. Perhaps Bryan Rowley would displace Steve Smith as a WR. Also I'd have to make room for Filipo Mokofisi Sr for being the hardest hitter I ever saw in a Utah uniform....although Marquis Blair is giving him a run for his money.

Rowley was a family friend, but I’d take Steve. Higher YPC, was an excellent punt returner.

Rowley had the 1,000 yard season, but his YPC is about 3 yards lower than Steve.

I’d also have to say having Dolce and McCoy as Rowley’s QB’s for 2 years beats Darnell.

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10-27-2017, 06:46 AM
Applejack

Quote:

Originally Posted by Diehard Ute

Yup. Very average numbers.

His yards per attempt was good, 8.1, but he had only 26 TD’s to 21 INT’s with a low completion percentage.

His rushing numbers weren’t all that great either. 3.3YPC.

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It was a joke.
10-27-2017, 11:12 AM
SeattleUte

No Brian Johnson? QB on our greatest or highest achieving team ever. This discussion is stupid. I'm not engaging in this.
10-27-2017, 12:00 PM
Applejack

Quote:

Originally Posted by SeattleUte

No Brian Johnson? QB on our greatest or highest achieving team ever. This discussion is stupid. I'm not engaging in this.

Yeah, switch Arcenaux for BJ on my list.
10-27-2017, 05:05 PM
snafu

I would have Errol Tucker on my list
11-01-2017, 09:11 AM
SoCalPat

Quote:

Originally Posted by concerned

Roy Jefferson was an all-american. How many of those have we had?

We've probably had 15-20, but Roy wasn't consensus. I believe the only consensus A-A's we've had are Luther, Weddle, Sakoda, Hackett and Wishnowsky.
11-01-2017, 10:11 AM
SoCalPat

Quote:

Originally Posted by DrumNFeather

This is probably a thread for the off-season, but the in-season ain't giving us much to talk about, so here we are. I watched the Pac 12 special last night (it ran in August) on the 12 greatest Utes of all time.

Here they are in order of how they were announced:

12. Roy Jefferson
11. Steve Smith
10. Nate Orchard
9. Scott Mitchell
8. Devonte Booker
7. Tom Hackett
6. Larry Wilson
5. Star Lotuleli
4. Jordan Gross
3. Luther Ellis
2. Eric Weddle
1. Alex Smith

Thoughts?

Who else do you think would go on the list?

1. I agree with the idea that the criteria should be largely limited to their collegiate careers. I think an exception should be made for kicking specialists. Punters never make "the play" that helps you win a game. That said, if we're going off college production, Louie Sakoda belongs on this list ahead of Hackett. Sakoda was crushed by BCS bias, and had he played at Utah in the Pac-12 era, he would've won both the Guy (2006) and Groza (2008) awards, which would not only be unprecedented, but in all likelihood, never duplicated.

"But Tom Hackett won the Ray Guy Award twice!" Yes, and his successor might equal that feat this year. Are we gonna put Wishnowsky in future lists like these? Hell no. Now, if both guys went on to have outstanding pro careers, then I could see both competing for a spot amongst players that have a greater impact during a game. But Hackett and Wishnowsky could create quite a predicament for future list-makers.

2. There have been plenty of great running backs at Utah. That there's only room for one on this list because they all cannibalize each other is understandable. I blame Jamal Anderson for this, who had the best pro career of any Utah RB, but even he himself would say he's not on this list because he wasn't heavily utilized until the end of his career. However, Devontae Booker is not the one I'd have here in the Top 10. John White had better numbers and played on significantly lesser teams. Del Rodgers and Carl Monroe played 11-game seasons and both would've played in bowl games under the current glut of games. And Monroe only had one year as The Man, because he played behind ... Del Rodgers. This is where the beauty of lists like these emerges -- you have your guy, I have mine and both of us are right and neither one of us is wrong.

3. Jordan Gross belongs on this list, but I'm not sure he's the slam dunk I originally believed, and don't tell me his placement at No. 4 isn't highly influenced by his pro career. This is a guy who wasn't the best O-lineman on his team until his senior year, and was only honorable mention all-MWC as a sophomore and junior. In fact, Doug Kaufusi made 1st team all-MWC the two years preceding Gross' senior year.

Gross was an Outland finalist, and that alone carries significant weight. But how is Gross any different than Jamal Anderson, who we readily admit wasn't featured enough until the final half-season of his career? Again, position bias carries some weight here. If you're gonna be No. 4 on this list, you need to play for a transcendent offensive unit that ran the ball at will and won games, and maybe if Marty Johnson doesn't get hurt in Week 2, we have that unit. I can cut Jordan some breaks for things around him that were out of his control (Marty's injury, horrible QB play from a returning starter who was ultimately benched, the pressure on Mac to deliver an outright crown, etc.), but not enough to put him all the way at No. 4.

FWIW, I think Larry Wilson is a little high at 6, but he (along with Roy Jefferson) played in the single-platoon era, an era which really can't be compared to today's era, so I'll cut his spot in these rankings some slack.

Good list overall. The top 3 is undisputable
11-01-2017, 03:26 PM
mUUser

Quote:

Originally Posted by SoCalPat

We've probably had 15-20, but Roy wasn't consensus. I believe the only consensus A-A's we've had are Luther, Weddle, Sakoda, Hackett and Wishnowsky.

and Jordan Gross (2002)