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Thread: Was Mitt Romney Right About Everything?

  1. #1
    Sam the Sheepdog LA Ute's Avatar
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    Was Mitt Romney Right About Everything?

    That's the title of this Buzzfeed piece by McKay Coppins, who covered Romney's campaign. Excerpt:

    In the most actively cited example of the Republican nominee’s foresight, Romneyites point to the candidate’s hardline rhetoric last year against Russian President Vladimir Putin and his administration. During the campaign, Romney frequently criticized Obama for foolishly attempting to make common cause with the Kremlin, and repeatedly referred to Russia as “our number one geopolitical foe.”


    Many observers found this fixation strange, and Democrats tried to turn it into a punchline. A New York Times editorial in March of last year said Romney’s assertions regarding Russia represented either “a shocking lack of knowledge about international affairs or just craven politics.” And in an October debate, Obama sarcastically mocked his opponent’s Russia rhetoric. “The 1980s are now calling to ask for their foreign policy back because the Cold War’s been over for 20 years,” the president quipped at the time.


    That line still chafes Robert O’Brien, a Los Angeles lawyer and friend of Romney’s who served as a foreign policy adviser.

    “Everyone thought, Oh my goodness that is so clever and Mitt’s caught in the Cold War and doesn’t know what he’s talking about,” O’Brien said. “Well guess what. With all of these foreign policy initiatives — Syria, Iran, [Edward] Snowden — who’s out there causing problems for America? It’s Putin and the Russians.”


    Indeed, earlier this summer, Moscow defiantly refused to extradite National Security Agency leaker Edward Snowden to the United States, prompting Obama to cancel a meeting he had scheduled with Putin during the Group of 20 summit. Russia has blocked United Nations action against Syria. And on Wednesday, Defense Secretary Chuck Hagel told lawmakers that Russia was one of the countries supplying Syria with chemical weapons.


    To Romney’s fans, these episodes illustrate just how unfairly their candidate was punished during the election for speaking truths the rest of the country would eventually come around to.

    "It is only with the heart that one can see rightly; what is essential is invisible to the eye."
    --Antoine de Saint-Exupery

    "Things fall apart; the centre cannot hold."
    --Yeats

    “True, we [lawyers] build no bridges. We raise no towers. We construct no engines. We paint no pictures - unless as amateurs for our own principal amusement. There is little of all that we do which the eye of man can see. But we smooth out difficulties; we relieve stress; we correct mistakes; we take up other men's burdens and by our efforts we make possible the peaceful life of men in a peaceful state.”

    --John W. Davis, founder of Davis Polk & Wardwell

  2. #2
    Sam the Sheepdog LA Ute's Avatar
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    "It is only with the heart that one can see rightly; what is essential is invisible to the eye."
    --Antoine de Saint-Exupery

    "Things fall apart; the centre cannot hold."
    --Yeats

    “True, we [lawyers] build no bridges. We raise no towers. We construct no engines. We paint no pictures - unless as amateurs for our own principal amusement. There is little of all that we do which the eye of man can see. But we smooth out difficulties; we relieve stress; we correct mistakes; we take up other men's burdens and by our efforts we make possible the peaceful life of men in a peaceful state.”

    --John W. Davis, founder of Davis Polk & Wardwell

  3. #3
    Quote Originally Posted by LA Ute View Post
    seriously, nobody misses Mitt Romney. Everybody may want anybody other than Obama, with the exception of Mitt Romney. They're 50 Republicansthat Republicans and independents would prefer to Obama, but Mitt is not one of them. Time to move on.
    Last edited by concerned; 09-07-2013 at 12:16 PM.

  4. #4
    Sam the Sheepdog LA Ute's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by concerned View Post
    seriously, nobody misses Mitt Romney. Everybody may want anybody other than Obama, with the exception of Mitt Romney. They're 50 Republicansthat Republicans and independents would prefer to Obama, but Mitt is not one of them. Time to move on.
    Easy for you to say.

    "It is only with the heart that one can see rightly; what is essential is invisible to the eye."
    --Antoine de Saint-Exupery

    "Things fall apart; the centre cannot hold."
    --Yeats

    “True, we [lawyers] build no bridges. We raise no towers. We construct no engines. We paint no pictures - unless as amateurs for our own principal amusement. There is little of all that we do which the eye of man can see. But we smooth out difficulties; we relieve stress; we correct mistakes; we take up other men's burdens and by our efforts we make possible the peaceful life of men in a peaceful state.”

    --John W. Davis, founder of Davis Polk & Wardwell

  5. #5
    Quote Originally Posted by concerned View Post
    seriously, nobody misses Mitt Romney. Everybody may want anybody other than Obama, with the exception of Mitt Romney. They're 50 Republicansthat Republicans and independents would prefer to Obama, but Mitt is not one of them. Time to move on.
    Yes, but those 50 are all crap.
    "It'd be nice to please everyone but I thought it would be more interesting to have a point of view." -- Oscar Levant

  6. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by USS Utah View Post
    Yes, but those 50 are all crap.
    In other words, the Republicans have nothing to offer...

    Actually I think Chris Christie would be good. But he would need to lose 150 lbs to contend, since appearance is 85% of the election.

    Romney was too short-sighted to realize that a significant portion of his potential supporters fall within the 47% whom he maligned. I also fear he would have been far too hawkish, and also would have tried something silly to defund the Affordable Care Act rather than work to improve it.

  7. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by NorthwestUteFan View Post
    In other words, the Republicans have nothing to offer...

    Actually I think Chris Christie would be good. But he would need to lose 150 lbs to contend, since appearance is 85% of the election.

    Romney was too short-sighted to realize that a significant portion of his potential supporters fall within the 47% whom he maligned. I also fear he would have been far too hawkish, and also would have tried something silly to defund the Affordable Care Act rather than work to improve it.
    Christie wouldn't be accepted any more than Romney was by the right wing of the party.
    "It'd be nice to please everyone but I thought it would be more interesting to have a point of view." -- Oscar Levant

  8. #8
    Quote Originally Posted by USS Utah View Post
    Christie wouldn't be accepted any more than Romney was by the right wing of the party.
    I agree. That is why Republicans are spinning their wheels. They spend so much time pandering to the extreme Right in the primaries that they can't pivot to the center for the national.

    Romney was still to the Right of center in the minds of most Americans, but was far too liberal for that far Right Wing of the Republican party.

    The next R to win the Presidency will be a supporter of gay marriage, will be moderately pro-abortion, will be supportive of welfare and job training programs, and will decriminalize non-violent drug offenses. I just can't see anybody getting enough broad support without seeming antagonistic to poor and disadvantaged people.

  9. #9
    Also the Tax Cuts for 'the Rich' position is poisonous.

  10. #10
    Sam the Sheepdog LA Ute's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by concerned View Post
    seriously, nobody misses Mitt Romney. Everybody may want anybody other than Obama, with the exception of Mitt Romney. They're 50 Republicansthat Republicans and independents would prefer to Obama, but Mitt is not one of them. Time to move on.
    There are not 50, but I like the GOP up-and-comers. They're all more interesting than the Democrat contenders so far (Hillary and Biden). Rubio is a talented political leader and so are Ryan and Cruz. Of the three I think Rubio is most electable. If Christie can lose 80 lbs. or so and get nominated (both tough tasks for him) he'll beat Hillary or Biden. The guy is just a natural.

    P.S. No one is responding to my original point: Even if you don't want him as POTUS, it looks like he was right about a lot of things, even though the news media and the left-of-center part of the punditocracy pooh-poohed him at the time.
    Last edited by LA Ute; 09-07-2013 at 03:15 PM.

    "It is only with the heart that one can see rightly; what is essential is invisible to the eye."
    --Antoine de Saint-Exupery

    "Things fall apart; the centre cannot hold."
    --Yeats

    “True, we [lawyers] build no bridges. We raise no towers. We construct no engines. We paint no pictures - unless as amateurs for our own principal amusement. There is little of all that we do which the eye of man can see. But we smooth out difficulties; we relieve stress; we correct mistakes; we take up other men's burdens and by our efforts we make possible the peaceful life of men in a peaceful state.”

    --John W. Davis, founder of Davis Polk & Wardwell

  11. #11
    Quote Originally Posted by NorthwestUteFan View Post
    I agree. That is why Republicans are spinning their wheels. They spend so much time pandering to the extreme Right in the primaries that they can't pivot to the center for the national.

    Romney was still to the Right of center in the minds of most Americans, but was far too liberal for that far Right Wing of the Republican party.

    The next R to win the Presidency will be a supporter of gay marriage, will be moderately pro-abortion, will be supportive of welfare and job training programs, and will decriminalize non-violent drug offenses. I just can't see anybody getting enough broad support without seeming antagonistic to poor and disadvantaged people.
    If you don't pander to the extreme right wing, they will take their ball and go home in November.

    Big deal, you say? A Republican needs a turnout of at least 90% of GOP voters to win.

    One glaring problem for the GOP right now is the demographics as Hispanic voters become an ever more significant factor. But the extreme right wing will declare anything short of deportation of illegals amnesty and, in the process of killing immigration reform, will hand the White House to the Democrats for the next 20 years.
    "It'd be nice to please everyone but I thought it would be more interesting to have a point of view." -- Oscar Levant

  12. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by LA Ute View Post
    That's the title of this Buzzfeed piece by McKay Coppins, who covered Romney's campaign. Excerpt:
    Romney is not the only one who regarded Putin as evil. This was no revelation.
    One thing I have learned in a long life: that all our science, measured against reality, is primitive and childlike -- and yet it is the most precious thing we have.

    --Albert Einstein

    The fact that life evolved out of nearly nothing, some 10 billion years after the universe evolved out of literally nothing, is a fact so staggering that I would be mad to attempt words to do it justice.

    --Richard Dawkins

    Be kind to all, for everyone you meet is fighting a great battle.

    --Philo

  13. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by NorthwestUteFan View Post
    In other words, the Republicans have nothing to offer...

    Actually I think Chris Christie would be good. But he would need to lose 150 lbs to contend, since appearance is 85% of the election.

    Romney was too short-sighted to realize that a significant portion of his potential supporters fall within the 47% whom he maligned. I also fear he would have been far too hawkish, and also would have tried something silly to defund the Affordable Care Act rather than work to improve it.
    Didn't he have lap band surgery?

    Sent from my MB865 using Tapatalk 2
    “The world is so exquisite with so much love and moral depth, that there is no reason to deceive ourselves with pretty stories for which there's little good evidence. Far better it seems to me, in our vulnerability, is to look death in the eye and to be grateful every day for the brief but magnificent opportunity that life provides.”
    Carl Sagan

  14. #14
    Sam the Sheepdog LA Ute's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SeattleUte View Post
    Romney is not the only one who regarded Putin as evil. This was no revelation.
    Who were the others and how clearly and prominently did they speak out about Putin?

    "It is only with the heart that one can see rightly; what is essential is invisible to the eye."
    --Antoine de Saint-Exupery

    "Things fall apart; the centre cannot hold."
    --Yeats

    “True, we [lawyers] build no bridges. We raise no towers. We construct no engines. We paint no pictures - unless as amateurs for our own principal amusement. There is little of all that we do which the eye of man can see. But we smooth out difficulties; we relieve stress; we correct mistakes; we take up other men's burdens and by our efforts we make possible the peaceful life of men in a peaceful state.”

    --John W. Davis, founder of Davis Polk & Wardwell

  15. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by LA Ute View Post
    Who were the others and how clearly and prominently did they speak out about Putin?
    Good grief. Russia's abysmal human rights record and lack of basic freedoms including free speech has been reported on extensively since well before the last elections. Here is a 2009 article I found after a cursory Google search.

    http://humanrightshouse.org/Articles/9574.html

    I know Romney and many of his supporters now calling him prophetic because he identified Putin as an enemy of U.S. interests probably didn't care much about Putin's human rights record per se, but many of us regard that as a litmus test for alignment of American interests with said country. I don't know about you, but it didn't take Putin disagreeing with Obama over Syria for many to realize that Russia is still a focus of evil. In my debates with Lebowski before the Syrian crisis arose I've been commenting on the irony of Snowden defecting to a country like Russia that has forever including to the present been ruled by authoritarian regimes.
    One thing I have learned in a long life: that all our science, measured against reality, is primitive and childlike -- and yet it is the most precious thing we have.

    --Albert Einstein

    The fact that life evolved out of nearly nothing, some 10 billion years after the universe evolved out of literally nothing, is a fact so staggering that I would be mad to attempt words to do it justice.

    --Richard Dawkins

    Be kind to all, for everyone you meet is fighting a great battle.

    --Philo

  16. #16
    Sam the Sheepdog LA Ute's Avatar
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    Was Mitt Romney Right About Everything?

    Quote Originally Posted by SeattleUte View Post
    Good grief. Russia's abysmal human rights record and lack of basic freedoms including free speech has been reported on extensively since well before the last elections. Here is a 2009 article I found after a cursory Google search.

    http://humanrightshouse.org/Articles/9574.html

    I know Romney and many of his supporters now calling him prophetic because he identified Putin as an enemy of U.S. interests probably didn't care much about Putin's human rights record per se, but many of us regard that as a litmus test for alignment of American interests with said country. I don't know about you, but it didn't take Putin disagreeing with Obama over Syria for many to realize that Russia is still a focus of evil. In my debates with Lebowski before the Syrian crisis arose I've been commenting on the irony of Snowden defecting to a country like Russia that has forever including to the present been ruled by authoritarian regimes.
    The point is, Romney was right about that and the Left, which has always gotten Russia wrong, was wrong again this time.


    "It's men in shorts."

    -- Rick Majerus
    Last edited by LA Ute; 09-08-2013 at 03:11 PM.

    "It is only with the heart that one can see rightly; what is essential is invisible to the eye."
    --Antoine de Saint-Exupery

    "Things fall apart; the centre cannot hold."
    --Yeats

    “True, we [lawyers] build no bridges. We raise no towers. We construct no engines. We paint no pictures - unless as amateurs for our own principal amusement. There is little of all that we do which the eye of man can see. But we smooth out difficulties; we relieve stress; we correct mistakes; we take up other men's burdens and by our efforts we make possible the peaceful life of men in a peaceful state.”

    --John W. Davis, founder of Davis Polk & Wardwell

  17. #17
    Of course he was right. But just like in '08, there were too many people who were afraid of being marked a racist if they didn't vote for Obama. Political correctness won. Again.
    "Ninety feet between home plate and first base may be the closest man has ever come to perfection." - Red Smith

  18. #18
    Quote Originally Posted by LA Ute View Post
    The point is, Romney was right about that and the Left, which has always gotten Russia wrong, was wrong again this time.


    "It's men in shorts."

    -- Rick Majerus
    Harry Truman was a democrat, he got the Russians right, Nixon and Ford were Republicans who got them wrong.
    One thing I have learned in a long life: that all our science, measured against reality, is primitive and childlike -- and yet it is the most precious thing we have.

    --Albert Einstein

    The fact that life evolved out of nearly nothing, some 10 billion years after the universe evolved out of literally nothing, is a fact so staggering that I would be mad to attempt words to do it justice.

    --Richard Dawkins

    Be kind to all, for everyone you meet is fighting a great battle.

    --Philo

  19. #19
    Sam the Sheepdog LA Ute's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SeattleUte View Post
    Harry Truman was a democrat, he got the Russians right, Nixon and Ford were Republicans who got them wrong.
    I am talking about the Left, the guys who thought Stalin was a great guy back in the 30s and 40s. Truman was a liberal, not a man of the Left. Obama's instincts seem to be is somewhere between liberal and Left, learning hard to the Left.

    "It is only with the heart that one can see rightly; what is essential is invisible to the eye."
    --Antoine de Saint-Exupery

    "Things fall apart; the centre cannot hold."
    --Yeats

    “True, we [lawyers] build no bridges. We raise no towers. We construct no engines. We paint no pictures - unless as amateurs for our own principal amusement. There is little of all that we do which the eye of man can see. But we smooth out difficulties; we relieve stress; we correct mistakes; we take up other men's burdens and by our efforts we make possible the peaceful life of men in a peaceful state.”

    --John W. Davis, founder of Davis Polk & Wardwell

  20. #20
    Quote Originally Posted by SeattleUte View Post
    Harry Truman was a democrat, he got the Russians right, Nixon and Ford were Republicans who got them wrong.
    And let's not forget that George W. Bush went to Russia to meet Putin, noticed the crucifix the Bear-Wrestling former head of the KGB wears around his neck, shook his hand, looked deeply into his eyes, and cane away believing he can 'trust' Putin and Russia...

    Bush was about the only recent leader to NOT be suspicious of Putin.

  21. #21
    But I will actually balance that statement against the fact that Condoleezza Rice is a Subject Matter Expert on Russia and is fluent in the language, so at least he had somebody on staff with knowledge of the situation

  22. #22
    Quote Originally Posted by LA Ute View Post
    I am talking about the Left, the guys who thought Stalin was a great guy back in the 30s and 40s. Truman was a liberal, not a man of the Left. Obama's instincts seem to be is somewhere between liberal and Left, learning hard to the Left.
    who were the guys who thought Stalin was a great guy back in the 30's? FDR? Hull? Acheson? Stimson? How did they implement their instincts into foreign policy?

  23. #23
    Sam the Sheepdog LA Ute's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by concerned View Post
    who were the guys who thought Stalin was a great guy back in the 30's? FDR? Hull? Acheson? Stimson? How did they implement their instincts into foreign policy?
    I'm not talking about guys like them. I'm flaming the intellectual left, guys like Walter Duranty. There were dozens of such folks who admired Stalin and started breaking with him after the Non-Aggression Pact, and were (mostly) horrified to learn of his crimes as the evidence emerged. To this day the debate continues: Was he merely a tyrant who took over the Soviet government for a while, or the inevitable result of Communism and the author of the Cold War?

    Anyway, this thread is about how Romney was right about Putin. You and Seattle keep trying to threadjack, but I see what you are doing.

    "It is only with the heart that one can see rightly; what is essential is invisible to the eye."
    --Antoine de Saint-Exupery

    "Things fall apart; the centre cannot hold."
    --Yeats

    “True, we [lawyers] build no bridges. We raise no towers. We construct no engines. We paint no pictures - unless as amateurs for our own principal amusement. There is little of all that we do which the eye of man can see. But we smooth out difficulties; we relieve stress; we correct mistakes; we take up other men's burdens and by our efforts we make possible the peaceful life of men in a peaceful state.”

    --John W. Davis, founder of Davis Polk & Wardwell

  24. #24
    Quote Originally Posted by LA Ute View Post
    I am talking about the Left, the guys who thought Stalin was a great guy back in the 30s and 40s. Truman was a liberal, not a man of the Left. Obama's instincts seem to be is somewhere between liberal and Left, learning hard to the Left.
    Really. Then I wonder why Tavis Smiley and Cornell West were calling Obama "a house negro" on NPR yesterday. Actually, except for the Affordable Care Act, which isn't really "Leftist" legistlation whether or not you support it (except to those who identify themselves as men of the "Right"), I have a hard time distinguishing Bush's policies from Obama's at least insofar as what really matters. Seems like Obama has been just more of the same in Iraq, Pakistan, etc. As those wars wind down he wants to sart a new one (I'm sure you and Il Pad would be vociferous in your support for a strike on Syria were Bush the president advocating that action). Obama's justice department has pretty much let go scot-free the Wall Street fat cats who were substantial factors in the 2008 financial crisis that led to the greatest economic downturn since the 1930's. Obama continued Bush's awful Keynsian economic measures in response to said recesssion.
    One thing I have learned in a long life: that all our science, measured against reality, is primitive and childlike -- and yet it is the most precious thing we have.

    --Albert Einstein

    The fact that life evolved out of nearly nothing, some 10 billion years after the universe evolved out of literally nothing, is a fact so staggering that I would be mad to attempt words to do it justice.

    --Richard Dawkins

    Be kind to all, for everyone you meet is fighting a great battle.

    --Philo

  25. #25
    Many republicans' hatred for any democratic president no matter moderate or similar to prior republican presidents is something I can't explain. I'm sure that Il Pad's blazing hatred for Obama has nothing to do with the president's race. But nor does it have much to do with his actual actions or positions taken while in office. It's simply because Obama is a democrat.
    One thing I have learned in a long life: that all our science, measured against reality, is primitive and childlike -- and yet it is the most precious thing we have.

    --Albert Einstein

    The fact that life evolved out of nearly nothing, some 10 billion years after the universe evolved out of literally nothing, is a fact so staggering that I would be mad to attempt words to do it justice.

    --Richard Dawkins

    Be kind to all, for everyone you meet is fighting a great battle.

    --Philo

  26. #26
    Quote Originally Posted by LA Ute View Post
    I'm not talking about guys like them. I'm flaming the intellectual left, guys like Walter Duranty. There were dozens of such folks who admired Stalin and started breaking with him after the Non-Aggression Pact, and were (mostly) horrified to learn of his crimes as the evidence emerged. To this day the debate continues: Was he merely a tyrant who took over the Soviet government for a while, or the inevitable result of Communism and the author of the Cold War?

    Anyway, this thread is about how Romney was right about Putin. You and Seattle keep trying to threadjack, but I see what you are doing.
    Oh my god. Good grief again. Now you're being truly ridiculous. Have you read the acclaimed book Bloodlands? Please post a link where any real "intellectual" is in any way defending the Soviet Union or downplaying its genocides. From "intellectuals" to thriller novelists like Martin Cruz Smith and even "leftist" novelists like Le Carre the totalitarian Soviet Union system is trashed.
    One thing I have learned in a long life: that all our science, measured against reality, is primitive and childlike -- and yet it is the most precious thing we have.

    --Albert Einstein

    The fact that life evolved out of nearly nothing, some 10 billion years after the universe evolved out of literally nothing, is a fact so staggering that I would be mad to attempt words to do it justice.

    --Richard Dawkins

    Be kind to all, for everyone you meet is fighting a great battle.

    --Philo

  27. #27
    Sam the Sheepdog LA Ute's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SeattleUte View Post
    Really. Then I wonder why Tavis Smiley and Cornell West were calling Obama "a house negro" on NPR yesterday. Actually, except for the Affordable Care Act, which isn't really "Leftist" legistlation whether or not you support it (except to those who identify themselves as men of the "Right"), I have a hard time distinguishing Bush's policies from Obama's at least insofar as what really matters. Seems like Obama has been just more of the same in Iraq, Pakistan, etc. As those wars wind down he wants to sart a new one (I'm sure you and Il Pad would be vociferous in your support for a strike on Syria were Bush the president advocating that action). Obama's justice department has pretty much let go scot-free the Wall Street fat cats who were substantial factors in the 2008 financial crisis that led to the greatest economic downturn since the 1930's. Obama continued Bush's awful Keynsian economic measures in response to said recesssion.
    Since you don't want to admit that Romney was right about Putin (you dislike him, perhaps, because he is an active Mormon, much as you accuse Garth of disliking Obama because he's a Democrat?), I'll bite here. I don't dislike Obama personally and think he is a decent fellow, although not very interesting. For example, I don't think Bill Clinton is a decent fellow but it would be interesting to have dinner with him. I think dinner with Obama would be boring.

    There are plenty of people besides me who think Obama is a man of the Left. Norman Podhoretz, for example (Podhoretz is a former leftist and knows the type):

    The key to understanding what Mr. Obama has pulled off is the astonishing statement he made in the week before being elected president: "We are five days away from fundamentally transforming the United States of America." To those of us who took this declaration seriously, it meant that Mr. Obama really was the left-wing radical he seemed to be, given his associations with the likes of the anti-American preacher Jeremiah Wright and the unrepentant terrorist Bill Ayers, not to mention the intellectual influence over him of Saul Alinsky, the original "community organizer."

    So far as domestic affairs were concerned, it soon became clear—even to some of those who had persuaded themselves that Mr. Obama was a moderate and a pragmatist—that the fundamental transformation he had in mind was to turn this country into as close a replica of the social-democratic countries of Europe as the constraints of our political system allowed.
    As for Obamacare, if you don't see how it will pull the country towards single-payer healthcare you haven't studied it very carefully.

    "It is only with the heart that one can see rightly; what is essential is invisible to the eye."
    --Antoine de Saint-Exupery

    "Things fall apart; the centre cannot hold."
    --Yeats

    “True, we [lawyers] build no bridges. We raise no towers. We construct no engines. We paint no pictures - unless as amateurs for our own principal amusement. There is little of all that we do which the eye of man can see. But we smooth out difficulties; we relieve stress; we correct mistakes; we take up other men's burdens and by our efforts we make possible the peaceful life of men in a peaceful state.”

    --John W. Davis, founder of Davis Polk & Wardwell

  28. #28
    Romney lost because he wasn't a very good politician. Also, the republican party's alliance with the Christian right turned into a net negative in the last election.
    One thing I have learned in a long life: that all our science, measured against reality, is primitive and childlike -- and yet it is the most precious thing we have.

    --Albert Einstein

    The fact that life evolved out of nearly nothing, some 10 billion years after the universe evolved out of literally nothing, is a fact so staggering that I would be mad to attempt words to do it justice.

    --Richard Dawkins

    Be kind to all, for everyone you meet is fighting a great battle.

    --Philo

  29. #29
    So you are saying that Obama is far to the left of FDR and Truman, that his instincts are the equivalent of Duranty or any other communist sympathizer in the 1930's? Really? How has he manifested this instinct into foreign policy? How has his being "wrong" about Putin affected foreign policy one iota?

    P.S. I didn't highjack the thread. You posed the question "Miss me yet," and I responded with the unanimous answer (present company excepted).

  30. #30
    Sam the Sheepdog LA Ute's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SeattleUte View Post
    Oh my god. Good grief again. Now you're being truly ridiculous. Have you read the acclaimed book Bloodlands? Please post a link where any real "intellectual" is in any way defending the Soviet Union or downplaying its genocides. From "intellectuals" to thriller novelists like Martin Cruz Smith and even "leftist" novelists like Le Carre the totalitarian Soviet Union system is trashed.
    The historical record is full of the likes of Emma Goldman, who thought Lenin and Stalin were just great guys until the Non-Aggression Pact. The disaffection began then but you cannot deny that prior to that time many American leftists loved the guy. Even now I'll bet the majority of American poli sci professors think Stalin was just an aberration. Guys like Le Carre think Gorbachev was the man who really ended the Cold War. All I am saying is that historically the Left has tended to be wrong about Russian Communism. Attack that proposition.

    "It is only with the heart that one can see rightly; what is essential is invisible to the eye."
    --Antoine de Saint-Exupery

    "Things fall apart; the centre cannot hold."
    --Yeats

    “True, we [lawyers] build no bridges. We raise no towers. We construct no engines. We paint no pictures - unless as amateurs for our own principal amusement. There is little of all that we do which the eye of man can see. But we smooth out difficulties; we relieve stress; we correct mistakes; we take up other men's burdens and by our efforts we make possible the peaceful life of men in a peaceful state.”

    --John W. Davis, founder of Davis Polk & Wardwell

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