We already did "compete and not get embarrassed." Next year I want to win.Originally Posted by crazyute
We already did "compete and not get embarrassed." Next year I want to win.
I think Whit is a great coach and it would be a shame to lose him. He runs a clean program (presumably) and he knows how to deal with the culture in Utah (missions and such). That said, I think the rest of the staff needs to be reworked. Make Erickson the outright OC and give him whatever he wants on offense, including some control over who is coaching under him. Finn will end up being a sacrificial lamb, so bring in someone with a strong resume to replace him. On defense, Whit needs to take the reigns and make some coaching changes if necessary. I think Shaw will be replaced regardless. I think the staff in general needs to diversify; travel around in the offseason and talk to coaches and broaden their horizons a little bit.
I also think one of the new coaches needs to be a motivator. Gary Andersen is so successful partially because he has an uncanny ability to motivate his players while still maintaining discipline. I suspect Urban Meyer is this way too. Their teams never come out flat; they're always ready to play their hardest. We've been really inconsistent in that aspect as of late: we seem to play hardest only when there's an easy motivation to do so (e.g. "we're the underdogs").
As far as the team's prospects for next year, I think we have a ton of potential. The linebacker situation should improve with Gionni Paul and Blechen getting in the mix, among others. The corners have a lot more experience. The D-line will reload. Scott and Dres will lead a deeper WR corps. I'm assuming Murphy and Tonga will be back. The OL should have plenty of bodies. There will be more QB depth, although having Wilson back at 100% would be the best possible scenario.
If KW is going to make changes to the staff, I hope he makes them sooner rather than later. Just with players, either he believes a guy can get the job done or he doesn't. It really doesn't matter who else is out there or who else you can get. If you don't trust the guy you have to get it done, have some balls and fire him. The only excuse i can think of for not doing so is giving the guy a week or so to get another job.
LA we can merge them......
“The world is so exquisite with so much love and moral depth, that there is no reason to deceive ourselves with pretty stories for which there's little good evidence. Far better it seems to me, in our vulnerability, is to look death in the eye and to be grateful every day for the brief but magnificent opportunity that life provides.”
― Carl Sagan
Brain cramp. I'll do that.
"It is only with the heart that one can see rightly; what is essential is invisible to the eye."
--Antoine de Saint-Exupery
"Things fall apart; the centre cannot hold."
--Yeats
“True, we [lawyers] build no bridges. We raise no towers. We construct no engines. We paint no pictures - unless as amateurs for our own principal amusement. There is little of all that we do which the eye of man can see. But we smooth out difficulties; we relieve stress; we correct mistakes; we take up other men's burdens and by our efforts we make possible the peaceful life of men in a peaceful state.”
--John W. Davis, founder of Davis Polk & Wardwell
Or I can if you don't remember how.
“The world is so exquisite with so much love and moral depth, that there is no reason to deceive ourselves with pretty stories for which there's little good evidence. Far better it seems to me, in our vulnerability, is to look death in the eye and to be grateful every day for the brief but magnificent opportunity that life provides.”
― Carl Sagan
We are merging the former "2013 mid-season where do we go from here?" thread into "The 2013 Season Review Thread."
Last edited by LA Ute; 12-03-2013 at 08:46 AM.
"It is only with the heart that one can see rightly; what is essential is invisible to the eye."
--Antoine de Saint-Exupery
"Things fall apart; the centre cannot hold."
--Yeats
“True, we [lawyers] build no bridges. We raise no towers. We construct no engines. We paint no pictures - unless as amateurs for our own principal amusement. There is little of all that we do which the eye of man can see. But we smooth out difficulties; we relieve stress; we correct mistakes; we take up other men's burdens and by our efforts we make possible the peaceful life of men in a peaceful state.”
--John W. Davis, founder of Davis Polk & Wardwell
Its about time. I was getting annoyed clicking on these two threads thinking there was some new insight or impt info only to discover it is you two continuing to discuss how or whether to merge them.
The Pac 12 network is constantly running the clip of Graham at ASU in the lockerroom saying: "I don't care about making a good showing, I care about winning." We need a little more of that in 2014.
“It only ends once. Anything that happens before that is just progress.”
Well, because he thought it was good sport. Because some men aren't looking for anything logical, like money. They can't be bought, bullied, reasoned, or negotiated with. Some men just want to watch the world burn.
I hate him so much.
In addition to "recruiting specialist", let's bring in a motivational speaker coach.
Maybe Orgeron? The guy has connections and players love him.
Well... I'm embarrassed.
5-7 Sucks... again. Hell, the conference record is even worse than last year, and we lost to Washington State.
Recruiting will be more difficult with a successive weak-ass record like ours.
We haven't sucked this bad (except maybe last year) for a decade and since firing McBride.
Close losses? Close wins. The only team we destroyed was Weber (and what the Hell is that worth).
Last edited by Devildog; 12-03-2013 at 12:08 PM.
We as fans are as wide-eyed, awestruck, and country bumpkin as the damn team. Comments such as "the Pac 12 is so good this year" are killing me.
Who the fawk did we think we were here to play?
This is the damn league, we've been here for a few years now... these are the guys you're expected to beat. Yeah..how bout that, No shit.
Washington State? We can't lose to Washington State.
We could start by winning consistently in our own damn house.
Taking that sold out loud ass stadium for granted is a mistake. Winning breeds winners...the inverse is also true.
Last edited by Devildog; 12-03-2013 at 01:04 PM.
The painful truth is in our PAC-12 record since joining:
2011: 4-5
2012: 3-6
2013: 2-7
In my world, I can't lose 7 of 9 cases and get away with saying, "Well, we came close each time." Or, in sales, you can't say, "Hey! I made sales to 2 of 9 customers, but pay me anyway because I almost got some of those 7 sales I lost." I'm not being Gloomy Gus, just reminding everyone how bad our conference record really is. It's terrible. I do think things will turn around, but there is a lot of turning around to do.
"It is only with the heart that one can see rightly; what is essential is invisible to the eye."
--Antoine de Saint-Exupery
"Things fall apart; the centre cannot hold."
--Yeats
“True, we [lawyers] build no bridges. We raise no towers. We construct no engines. We paint no pictures - unless as amateurs for our own principal amusement. There is little of all that we do which the eye of man can see. But we smooth out difficulties; we relieve stress; we correct mistakes; we take up other men's burdens and by our efforts we make possible the peaceful life of men in a peaceful state.”
--John W. Davis, founder of Davis Polk & Wardwell
There's far more substance to our 2-7 mark this year than our 3-6 mark last year.
I want to win as much as the next guy, and I've hammered people for suggesting in other sports that close losses were a sign of improvement, but the reality is the loss column was the only negative stat increase this year. We finally beat a team with a winning record, one that might represent our league in the Rose Bowl. We had three losses by a TD or less -- one of those losses, again, coming to a team that might represent our league in the Rose Bowl.
When the schedule is more favorable, the QB is healthy and productive and we have better luck than most along the injury front ... and we still go 5-7? Call for Kyle's head all you want. I hate to be that guy preaching patience, because I've hated that guy for years, but we are really close to being a threat in this league. What Auburn and Missouri are this year, we could be that team next year. Have faith! (I've hated the "Have Faith" guy for years, too)
I think we'll know in the next 1-2 years whether the turning around will occur. If things go so poorly for the next two years that we are forced to fire one of the most successful coaches we've ever had, we will basically cement our status as another ISU, Minnesota, Arizona, Ole Miss, Vandy, NCState, etc. Nobody cares or thinks about those programs. If, however, a turnaround occurs in the next 1-2 seasons, people will say "see, they just needed to get their bearings in the new conference."
Reality is much of our fan base thought too highly of our teams in the MWC and thus don't deal well with the seasons we've had.
And it's silly to ignore how improved the entire conference is. Now some choose to say that's an excuse, I just see it as being realistic. We entered a rough league that's become significantly tougher since we joined.
I also think we as fans were a bit naive in not realizing the disadvantage the graduated money schedule put us in.
Yes we've now been here 3 years...but we're still not "full" members.
The first year we played in the PAC with a MWC income.
The next two years are going to be telling...it's do or die time.
(And it's sports...as a fan I'll never be embarrassed, this is entertainment, it doesn't reflect on me)
I agree with everything you say. I am mainly reminding myself that our results are terrible, and at the end of the day that's how success in college football is measured.
"It is only with the heart that one can see rightly; what is essential is invisible to the eye."
--Antoine de Saint-Exupery
"Things fall apart; the centre cannot hold."
--Yeats
“True, we [lawyers] build no bridges. We raise no towers. We construct no engines. We paint no pictures - unless as amateurs for our own principal amusement. There is little of all that we do which the eye of man can see. But we smooth out difficulties; we relieve stress; we correct mistakes; we take up other men's burdens and by our efforts we make possible the peaceful life of men in a peaceful state.”
--John W. Davis, founder of Davis Polk & Wardwell
This probably doesn't belong in this thread, but we don't have a thread dedicated to my disdain of all things Stanford. Since this thread is currently the most active, I'm gonna put it here.
My brother had a good suggestion over Thanksgiving regarding Stanford. We should convince the entire world - all fans, all journalists, all opposing coaches - to refer to Stanford as the Cardinals. How long do you think Stanford could go on correcting the world -- "Excuse me, it's Cardinal. No "s". Like the color." -- before they finally just accept it? I think they could go for years, and I would enjoy watching it play out.
There will be a lot of rebuilding in the conference next year. Stanford has something like 19 seniors in its two deep. Hundley, Manning and probably Holiday will turn pro early; Wash, USC, and maybe UCLA will have new coaches. We will see what the new year brings. It is true that if our place becomes set in stone, the only way to break the mold and reenergize recruiting is to bring in a new staff and make the recruits believe it is a new ballgame.
On a related note ...
http://displacedtrojan.blogspot.com/...thern-cal.html
I believe this as well, but let's hope it doesn't come to that. That approach has a very low success rate for teams in our demographic.
I think it's silly to keep repeating how good the conference is.
How many times have we heard this from Kyle? What do the players think when the coach keeps telling the media how good the conference is?
I'm sick of justifying the losing.
And it's silly to keep wanting to pretend that the quality of opposition doesn't matter.
Your posts reek of someone who longs for the glory days of the MWC which boggles me.
Well damn. Mariota is coming back.
In my circle, we've been calling them Leland or Junior University.
I would rather hear Kyle say, "We're just not good enough yet. We're getting better as quickly as we can." That's true, and it is not an excuse.
"It is only with the heart that one can see rightly; what is essential is invisible to the eye."
--Antoine de Saint-Exupery
"Things fall apart; the centre cannot hold."
--Yeats
“True, we [lawyers] build no bridges. We raise no towers. We construct no engines. We paint no pictures - unless as amateurs for our own principal amusement. There is little of all that we do which the eye of man can see. But we smooth out difficulties; we relieve stress; we correct mistakes; we take up other men's burdens and by our efforts we make possible the peaceful life of men in a peaceful state.”
--John W. Davis, founder of Davis Polk & Wardwell
I believe he did essentially say this after the CU game. He said we need to get a lot better and he would evaluate everything (players, coaches, processes) to determine how we could do that. So what if he also acknowledges a factual piece of context (that Utah played the #1 toughest SOS this year)? It's a fact and it may not make everyone feel better, but it matters. There are many of us of the opinion that Utah 2013 was better than Utah 2012 by being closer against a tougher schedule. If you're looking for year over year improvement I think the program took a step forward in 2013 even though it didn't manifest itself in the record. Obviously, there is a very limited amount of time that the program can lean on improvement that doesn't move the W/L column.
Pet peeve time. I HATE this line of thinking. I've never followed any logic that compares coaching a major team to any job of the real world. It's just not the same at all. (And in many industries, closing a sale with 2/9 potential customers would be considered a huge success...again, it just doesn't translate like that).
Amen.
While as fans we certainly can and will want a better team with more wins, we all get too caught up in knowing what should happen....even if we don't know much of anything about what goes on outside the lines of the field on Saturday.
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