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Thread: Dealing with narcotics offenders

  1. #31
    Sam the Sheepdog LA Ute's Avatar
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    My brother was the branch president in the Women's Unit of the S.L. County Jail for 10 years. Almost all of the inmates were drug offenders. The experience changed him a great deal personally (overwhelmingly for the better, he believes) and caused him to change his views on how drug abuse should be treated. On his way to his MSW, my son (who lurks here) works with recent parolees (he calls it a "crimogenic population") and has similar views. They both have influenced my views greatly. (I didn't really have much of a view beforehand because I had no experience with that population.) It seems to me that most people who work with individual addicts who want to change feel the same way. (I realize that folks like Diehard, who deal with the offenders, have a different perspective.)

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  2. #32
    Quote Originally Posted by LA Ute View Post
    My brother was the branch president in the Women's Unit of the S.L. County Jail for 10 years. Almost all of the inmates were drug offenders. The experience changed him a great deal personally (overwhelmingly for the better, he believes) and caused him to change his views on how drug abuse should be treated. On his way to his MSW, my son (who lurks here) works with recent parolees (he calls it a "crimogenic population") and has similar views. They both have influenced my views greatly. (I didn't really have much of a view beforehand because I had no experience with that population.) It seems to me that most people who work with individual addicts who want to change feel the same way. (I realize that folks like Diehard, who deal with the offenders, have a different perspective.)
    I think that is true with most social issues. I know a number of people who are really on the round up the illegal immigrants and send them home bandwagon. I asked a couple of them if they felt that way about the families in our LDS Stake whose visitor visas expired years ago and who have been here illegally for 20+ years. There immediate response was, well that is different. Well, no it isn't. A significant percentage of the illegal immigrant population came here legally on some type of temporary visitor, work or education visa and simply stayed. Currently, the only option for those people is to leave and get in line. One of my son's close friends falls into that group. His family came from South America to the States when he was 4 or 5 on a visitors visa. They stayed and he grew up as an American. He really wanted to go to Brazil on his LDS mission, but was told by Church authorities that if he did, it was unlikely he would be allowed back in the States. He went to Idaho and took the bus to get there.

  3. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by UTEopia View Post
    I think that is true with most social issues. I know a number of people who are really on the round up the illegal immigrants and send them home bandwagon. I asked a couple of them if they felt that way about the families in our LDS Stake whose visitor visas expired years ago and who have been here illegally for 20+ years. There immediate response was, well that is different. Well, no it isn't. A significant percentage of the illegal immigrant population came here legally on some type of temporary visitor, work or education visa and simply stayed. Currently, the only option for those people is to leave and get in line. One of my son's close friends falls into that group. His family came from South America to the States when he was 4 or 5 on a visitors visa. They stayed and he grew up as an American. He really wanted to go to Brazil on his LDS mission, but was told by Church authorities that if he did, it was unlikely he would be allowed back in the States. He went to Idaho and took the bus to get there.
    Why does being LDS change the equation? Yes. I think they should get here legally regardless of their religion. Why have laws at all if we can disregard them at will.

  4. #34
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    Seriously UTEopia... which laws should we disregard because the violator is LDS? Just immigration law? How about violence against another person?

  5. #35
    Quote Originally Posted by Devildog View Post
    Why does being LDS change the equation? Yes. I think they should get here legally regardless of their religion. Why have laws at all if we can disregard them at will.
    Service Members, Not Citizens: Meet The Veterans Who Have Been Deported:

    http://www.npr.org/2016/01/13/462372...-been-deported

    A Mexican immigrant here illegally just became a citizen, thanks to his U.S. military service

    http://www.latimes.com/local/lanow/l...423-story.html

    There are always exceptions, and yet not always.

  6. #36
    Quote Originally Posted by Devildog View Post
    Seriously UTEopia... which laws should we disregard because the violator is LDS? Just immigration law? How about violence against another person?
    You completely missed his point. Being LDS has nothing to do with it. The example works to make his point if it was a Catholic, episcopal, or even a PTA organization. It's easy to take hardline position on social issues until it hits close or or becomes personal. Then people tend to change position or start to rationalize.
    “To me there is no dishonor in being wrong and learning. There is dishonor in willful ignorance and there is dishonor in disrespect.” James Hatch, former Navy Seal and current Yale student.

  7. #37
    Quote Originally Posted by chrisrenrut View Post
    You completely missed his point. Being LDS has nothing to do with it. The example works to make his point if it was a Catholic, episcopal, or even a PTA organization. It's easy to take hardline position on social issues until it hits close or or becomes personal. Then people tend to change position or start to rationalize.
    And when you are a little kid you aren't exactly choosing to cross the border illegally.

    That's one of the problems is kids who were brought here illegally by their parents or even born here while their parents were here illegally, have no connection to their parents country and may not even speak the language but are also not US citizens. Sending a kid to their parents home country makes no sense.


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  8. #38
    Administrator U-Ute's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Devildog View Post
    Seriously UTEopia... which laws should we disregard because the violator is LDS? Just immigration law? How about violence against another person?
    You need to read his whole post. This is exactly what he was saying.

    People are quick to paint with a broad brush unless it comes to someone familiar to them, then they want the rules bent.

    My dad has been all Trump all the time until the Senate produced the BHCA which cuts Medicaid that my sister (who was born with cerebral palsy) depends on. I've noticed his Trump posts on Facebook have slowed dramatically since then.

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