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Thread: Bravo UofU!

  1. #151
    Sam the Sheepdog LA Ute's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Diehard Ute View Post
    While I think in the long run this is probably best for the U, I'm a bit surprised at Jon Huntsman Sr's comments to the media. I understand he's got a very personal interest in this, but his comments today just don't seem real professional.


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    I agree. I was surprised at how vehement it was and how public it was. For a man of his stature in the community and in the nation, it was a little disappointing. Was it not possible for him to accomplish the same thing behind the scenes?


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    "It is only with the heart that one can see rightly; what is essential is invisible to the eye."
    --Antoine de Saint-Exupery

    "Things fall apart; the centre cannot hold."
    --Yeats

    “True, we [lawyers] build no bridges. We raise no towers. We construct no engines. We paint no pictures - unless as amateurs for our own principal amusement. There is little of all that we do which the eye of man can see. But we smooth out difficulties; we relieve stress; we correct mistakes; we take up other men's burdens and by our efforts we make possible the peaceful life of men in a peaceful state.”

    --John W. Davis, founder of Davis Polk & Wardwell

  2. #152
    Quote Originally Posted by Diehard Ute View Post
    While I think in the long run this is probably best for the U, I'm a bit surprised at Jon Huntsman Sr's comments to the media. I understand he's got a very personal interest in this, but his comments today just don't seem real professional.


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    He's almost 80 years old, and is rich as hell. He is in the power position because of his donations. He has no reason to be professional. The only thing he has to worry about is his legacy, and I doubt he is going to worry about tarnishing his legacy over a few comments, when he has multiple buildings and a cancer hospital named for him.
    Dyslexics of the world, untie!

  3. #153
    Quote Originally Posted by LA Ute View Post
    Guy's got a grudge against the U. Pathetic.
    Well, unlike the athletics audit, I believe the questionable donation/contract deal with Dr. Siong raises some issues that should be examined by someone.

  4. #154
    Quote Originally Posted by chrisrenrut View Post
    He's almost 80 years old, and is rich as hell. He is in the power position because of his donations. He has no reason to be professional. The only thing he has to worry about is his legacy, and I doubt he is going to worry about tarnishing his legacy over a few comments, when he has multiple buildings and a cancer hospital named for him.
    Exactly
    "Don't apologize; it's not your fault. It's my fault for overestimating your competence."

  5. #155
    Quote Originally Posted by chrisrenrut View Post
    He's almost 80 years old, and is rich as hell. He is in the power position because of his donations. He has no reason to be professional. The only thing he has to worry about is his legacy, and I doubt he is going to worry about tarnishing his legacy over a few comments, when he has multiple buildings and a cancer hospital named for him.
    Except his comments reflect on his family as well, especially his son who leads the cancer foundation and his son who owns the Tribune.

    He got what he wanted. Did he really need to gloat in such a mean spirited way?


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  6. #156
    Quote Originally Posted by Diehard Ute View Post
    Except his comments reflect on his family as well, especially his son who leads the cancer foundation and his son who owns the Tribune.

    He got what he wanted. Did he really need to gloat in such a mean spirited way?


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    I mentioned his age first for a reason. It may not be universal, but I have seen many people as they get up in years be much more likely to say what is on their mind without tact or inhibition.
    Dyslexics of the world, untie!

  7. #157

  8. #158
    Sam the Sheepdog LA Ute's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dwight Schr-Ute View Post
    Wow. I thought he'd at least get a "decent interval."

    "It is only with the heart that one can see rightly; what is essential is invisible to the eye."
    --Antoine de Saint-Exupery

    "Things fall apart; the centre cannot hold."
    --Yeats

    “True, we [lawyers] build no bridges. We raise no towers. We construct no engines. We paint no pictures - unless as amateurs for our own principal amusement. There is little of all that we do which the eye of man can see. But we smooth out difficulties; we relieve stress; we correct mistakes; we take up other men's burdens and by our efforts we make possible the peaceful life of men in a peaceful state.”

    --John W. Davis, founder of Davis Polk & Wardwell

  9. #159
    http://www.deseretnews.com/article/8...ntroversy.html

    This certainly paints a different picture of what's gone on.

    As many of us said from the beginning, there's more to this than what was reported.


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  10. #160
    Quote Originally Posted by Diehard Ute View Post
    http://www.deseretnews.com/article/8...ntroversy.html

    This certainly paints a different picture of what's gone on.

    As many of us said from the beginning, there's more to this than what was reported.


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    I have heard that a month or so ago,a group of doctors went to Pershing and told him that they could not work for Beckerele any longer, and that if she remained they would leave. That was part of what precipitated all of this.

  11. #161
    Nothing about this is good. We've lost a cutting edge world class medical administrator, forced a university president to retire under pressure and p/o the university's largest donors.

    It's a cluster no matter how you look at it.
    “Children and dogs are as necessary to the welfare of the country as Wall Street and the railroads.” -- Harry S. Truman

    "You never soar so high as when you stoop down to help a child or an animal." -- Jewish Proverb

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  12. #162
    Malleus Cougarorum Solon's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by LA Ute View Post
    My crystal ball tells me that after 3 months or so have passed Pershing will quietly announce that he is stepping down and returning to his duties as a full professor of engineering. He's not going to be president of another university. I doubt anything will happen to Burton, but he won't continue after his current term ends. Lee will leave within a year. The question has always been how long she would stay. She's a world-class talent and could be anywhere she wants to be. This is the most badly-handled matter at the U. since the botched re-naming of the medical school under Chase Peterson. (We'll leave out Mike Young's decision to leave his wife for a woman 25 years younger than he. That was a personal matter.)
    A little too accurate, LA Ute. Are you pulling the strings behind the scenes?
    σοφῷ ἀνδρὶ Ἑλλὰς πάντα.
    -- Flavius Philostratus, Life of Apollonius 1.35.2.

  13. #163
    Sam the Sheepdog LA Ute's Avatar
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    I think Huntsman looks really bad. What Dr. Lee wanted to do is consistent with what healthcare providers everywhere are trying to do regarding the organization of patient care. I don't know anymore than what I have read in the newspapers, but this is pretty disturbing.


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    "It is only with the heart that one can see rightly; what is essential is invisible to the eye."
    --Antoine de Saint-Exupery

    "Things fall apart; the centre cannot hold."
    --Yeats

    “True, we [lawyers] build no bridges. We raise no towers. We construct no engines. We paint no pictures - unless as amateurs for our own principal amusement. There is little of all that we do which the eye of man can see. But we smooth out difficulties; we relieve stress; we correct mistakes; we take up other men's burdens and by our efforts we make possible the peaceful life of men in a peaceful state.”

    --John W. Davis, founder of Davis Polk & Wardwell

  14. #164
    Quote Originally Posted by LA Ute View Post
    I think Huntsman looks really bad. What Dr. Lee wanted to do is consistent with what healthcare providers everywhere are trying to do regarding the organization of patient care. I don't know anymore than what I have read in the newspapers, but this is pretty disturbing.


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    I agree. This latest article does not put the Huntsman's in good light.

    As I said early on in this, the whole idea that people with lots of money to throw around are automatically correct is not good.


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  15. #165
    Quote Originally Posted by LA Ute View Post
    I think Huntsman looks really bad. What Dr. Lee wanted to do is consistent with what healthcare providers everywhere are trying to do regarding the organization of patient care. I don't know anymore than what I have read in the newspapers, but this is pretty disturbing.


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    I also agree.You can't have something this big and important be treated outside the normal university umbrella because somebody gave a ton of money (how much I guess is subject to some dispute; I keep hearing the the Huntsman family inflates the amount of money they actually give.)
    Last edited by concerned; 05-02-2017 at 03:05 PM.

  16. #166
    Sam the Sheepdog LA Ute's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by concerned View Post
    I also agree.You can't have something this big and important be treated outside the normal university umbrella because somebody gave a ton of money (how much I guess is subject to some dispute; I keep hearing the the Huntsman family inflates the amount of money they actually give.)
    I just can't get past the "optics," to borrow the term that PR people use all the time. Big donor is upset about an administrative/management direction that is entirely consistent with current trends in the industry, and is angry because his favorite person is demoted from a leadership position in the institution bearing his name. He throws a public tantrum. In the end, the university president resigns, along with the vice president for health sciences, and the big owner gets his way. Terrible.

    "It is only with the heart that one can see rightly; what is essential is invisible to the eye."
    --Antoine de Saint-Exupery

    "Things fall apart; the centre cannot hold."
    --Yeats

    “True, we [lawyers] build no bridges. We raise no towers. We construct no engines. We paint no pictures - unless as amateurs for our own principal amusement. There is little of all that we do which the eye of man can see. But we smooth out difficulties; we relieve stress; we correct mistakes; we take up other men's burdens and by our efforts we make possible the peaceful life of men in a peaceful state.”

    --John W. Davis, founder of Davis Polk & Wardwell

  17. #167
    Quote Originally Posted by LA Ute View Post
    I just can't get past the "optics," to borrow the term that PR people use all the time. Big donor is upset about an administrative/management direction that is entirely consistent with current trends in the industry, and is angry because his favorite person is demoted from a leadership position in the institution bearing his name. He throws a public tantrum. In the end, the university president resigns, along with the vice president for health sciences, and the big owner gets his way. Terrible.

    Yep. No question.

  18. #168
    Quote Originally Posted by LA Ute View Post
    I just can't get past the "optics," to borrow the term that PR people use all the time. Big donor is upset about an administrative/management direction that is entirely consistent with current trends in the industry, and is angry because his favorite person is demoted from a leadership position in the institution bearing his name. He throws a public tantrum. In the end, the university president resigns, along with the vice president for health sciences, and the big owner gets his way. Terrible.
    On the other hand, it's nice to be reminded every once in a while that administrators are entirely replaceable. It's not like the university needs either Pershing or Lee.

    It was well past time for Pershing. Dumb that it ended up like this, but for presidents, it usually ends with someone unhappy.

  19. #169
    Quote Originally Posted by sancho View Post
    On the other hand, it's nice to be reminded every once in a while that administrators are entirely replaceable. It's not like the university needs either Pershing or Lee.

    It was well past time for Pershing. Dumb that it ended up like this, but for presidents, it usually ends with someone unhappy.
    I don't think there was anyone thinking they weren't replaceable.

    All indications on Pershing was already planning to step down.

    You read the D News article, then see Jon Huntsman Sr's rants in the media and if really looks bad, it'll make getting high quality replacements more difficult IMO.


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  20. #170
    Sam the Sheepdog LA Ute's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Diehard Ute View Post
    You read the D News article, then see Jon Huntsman Sr's rants in the media and if really looks bad, it'll make getting high quality replacements more difficult IMO.
    Finding a successor to Lee and Pershing will be harder. For the health sciences job they'll need someone who is willing to kiss Huntsman's ring prior to taking the job, and who is willing to give him a veto on all major personnel decisions and community outreach plans. I am only half-joking. Maybe not even half.

    "It is only with the heart that one can see rightly; what is essential is invisible to the eye."
    --Antoine de Saint-Exupery

    "Things fall apart; the centre cannot hold."
    --Yeats

    “True, we [lawyers] build no bridges. We raise no towers. We construct no engines. We paint no pictures - unless as amateurs for our own principal amusement. There is little of all that we do which the eye of man can see. But we smooth out difficulties; we relieve stress; we correct mistakes; we take up other men's burdens and by our efforts we make possible the peaceful life of men in a peaceful state.”

    --John W. Davis, founder of Davis Polk & Wardwell

  21. #171
    Quote Originally Posted by LA Ute View Post
    Finding a successor to Lee and Pershing will be harder. For the health sciences job they'll need someone who is willing to kiss Huntsman's ring prior to taking the job, and who is willing to give him a veto on all major personnel decisions and community outreach plans. I am only half-joking. Maybe not even half.
    Yeah, it's not good. I'd be curious to know the dynamic within the Huntsman family. If this is a all for one one for all thing, or just a case of no one is willing to tell the founder of it all he's off base.


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  22. #172
    I spoke with some former colleagues at the U today. They have not been privy to all inside details but they had a few interesting thoughts. One of which was that Vivian Lee was not forced to resign - she did so on her own. Vivian has confessed to a few colleagues that she really mishandled the situation - I'm assuming situation means the way she communicated with Beckerle and perhaps her communications with the trustees and Pres. Pershing.

    I think both the Tribune piece by Stuckey and the D'News piece that ran today are very good pieces. No one comes away looking perfect. I maintain that while I admired Vivian's vision while working in health sciences at the U, her behavior was paradoxical to the vision. In simple terms she wanted to transform healthcare at the U by tearing down silos and asking for much more interdisciplinary collaboration. To her credit, it is happening much more at the U. Ironically, she was a walking silo - very difficult to reach.

    I hope that the new president and health sciences vp will be able to persuade Huntsman/HCI towards more collaboration. The MOU the D'News put their hands on paints a picture of HCI desiring not only more reporting autonomy but much more operational autonomy.
    Last edited by Utebiquitous; 05-02-2017 at 09:31 PM.

  23. #173
    Whole thing is a blundering mess. The fact that Lee fired Beckerle by email still remains the root of this.

    Hard to believe this sort of stuff happens. FWIW the people I know involved with Lee do not like her. That is contrasted by the letter written by her direct reports there, but you also wonder how much of that is like having to sign your boss's birthday card.


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  24. #174
    Quote Originally Posted by LA Ute View Post
    Finding a successor to Lee and Pershing will be harder.
    Replacing a research one president is like replacing a coach in the nfl. There are always plenty of interested, qualified people around.

    It's all true - huntsman looks bad, etc, etc. But it's not going to do any lasting damage. Politics happens. This is embarrassing because it happened in public.

  25. #175
    Sam the Sheepdog LA Ute's Avatar
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    Bravo UofU!

    Random thoughts:

    Nobody looks good here. Huntsman looks worse than anyone else.

    This will pass. I agree with Sancho that the U will be able to find a replacement to serve in the president's office, but I wonder about that person's quality. We'll never know who did not apply for the position because of this.

    The next Health Sciences VP is going to have some repair work to do.

    I am surprised and disappointed at Huntsman's outright boorishness. From my younger days I remember him as one of the classiest men I ever met.

    Maybe it's true, as chrisrenrut said, that Huntsman simply doesn't care anymore because he's old and has pretty much been there and done that. Maybe he's losing it to some extent in old age. In any case, he may not be with us much longer. There may not be many more episodes like this, if any.

    I wonder who the next president will be. I hope they don't simply promote another dean from within.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

    "It is only with the heart that one can see rightly; what is essential is invisible to the eye."
    --Antoine de Saint-Exupery

    "Things fall apart; the centre cannot hold."
    --Yeats

    “True, we [lawyers] build no bridges. We raise no towers. We construct no engines. We paint no pictures - unless as amateurs for our own principal amusement. There is little of all that we do which the eye of man can see. But we smooth out difficulties; we relieve stress; we correct mistakes; we take up other men's burdens and by our efforts we make possible the peaceful life of men in a peaceful state.”

    --John W. Davis, founder of Davis Polk & Wardwell

  26. #176
    Quote Originally Posted by LA Ute View Post
    Random thoughts:

    Nobody looks good here. Huntsman looks worse than anyone else.

    This will pass. I agree with Sancho that the U will be able to find a replacement to serve in the president's office, but I wonder about that person's quality. We'll never know who did not apply for the position because of this.

    The next Health Sciences VP is going to have some repair work to do.

    I am surprised and disappointed at Huntsman's outright boorishness. From my younger days I remember him as one of the classiest men I ever met.

    Maybe it's true, as chrisrenrut said, that Huntsman simply doesn't care anymore because he's old and has pretty much been there and done that. Maybe he's losing it to some extent in old age. In any case, he may not be with us much longer. There may not be many more episodes like this, if any.

    I wonder who the next president will be. I hope they don't simply promote another dean from within.


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    I think they need to bring in somebody with gravitas from outside too, maybe like Machen, esp. with the need to replace Vivian Lee. The key, as always, will be, can he/she smooth over relationships with the Legislature. If I were a candidate, what would give me pause is whether I am in charge or one donor is? That Huntsman is 80 or close to it may moderate that concern, but dealing with big donors and our Legislature would be a drawback i would think.

  27. #177
    Quote Originally Posted by concerned View Post
    I think they need to bring in somebody with gravitas from outside too, maybe like Machen, esp. with the need to replace Vivian Lee. The key, as always, will be, can he/she smooth over relationships with the Legislature. If I were a candidate, what would give me pause is whether I am in charge or one donor is? That Huntsman is 80 or close to it may moderate that concern, but dealing with big donors and our Legislature would be a drawback i would think.
    Reading even more on this last night I wonder if Huntsman's age played a role.

    The Tribune reports the MOU that was in place was signed in 2014.....and ran for 10 more years. Seems odd to change that so quickly, which makes me wonder if Huntsman is wanting to lock up years of his wishes because he won't be around to oversee it himself


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  28. #178
    Quote Originally Posted by LA Ute View Post
    This will pass. I agree with Sancho that the U will be able to find a replacement to serve in the president's office, but I wonder about that person's quality. We'll never know who did not apply for the position because of this.
    The largest part of a university president's job is dealing with donors. Anyone good candidate would already be aware that donors are powerful.

  29. #179
    Sam the Sheepdog LA Ute's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sancho View Post
    The largest part of a university president's job is dealing with donors. Anyone good candidate would already be aware that donors are powerful.
    Yeah. But this donor was willing to humiliate publicly the university president and the most visible and important V.P., and he got away with it.

    "It is only with the heart that one can see rightly; what is essential is invisible to the eye."
    --Antoine de Saint-Exupery

    "Things fall apart; the centre cannot hold."
    --Yeats

    “True, we [lawyers] build no bridges. We raise no towers. We construct no engines. We paint no pictures - unless as amateurs for our own principal amusement. There is little of all that we do which the eye of man can see. But we smooth out difficulties; we relieve stress; we correct mistakes; we take up other men's burdens and by our efforts we make possible the peaceful life of men in a peaceful state.”

    --John W. Davis, founder of Davis Polk & Wardwell

  30. #180
    Quote Originally Posted by LA Ute View Post
    ....... I hope they don't simply promote another dean from within.


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    Won't happen, but personally I'd be thrilled with Taylor Randall. Smart as they come, a Ute through and through and all the right donors love him.

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