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Thread: If Not Arizona, Then a Land Not Too Far Away: Utah vs. Arizona and Arizona St.

  1. #91
    Sam the Sheepdog LA Ute's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by chrisrenrut View Post
    If you told me 2 weeks ago we'd be 2-2 at this point, I would have taken it. But it feels a bit worse to have done so well on the road in Oregon, then give up these two winnable games.
    Yeah, I would have liked to see us win at least one of those two.

    "It is only with the heart that one can see rightly; what is essential is invisible to the eye."
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    --John W. Davis, founder of Davis Polk & Wardwell

  2. #92
    Booby Hurley is a god coach, but also a complete jerk. Never shuts up.

    He would be wise to get out after this year---most of his better players are seniors. And he is now a hot ticket.
    But maybe he is waiting to follow Coach K at Duke? (tough to follow a legend.)

    A Florida school or ??

  3. #93
    Hard to know how to feel after two close, but no cigar losses. Particularly after going on the road and sweeping the Oregon road trip. I think that we would generally feel fine about it, as though it were expected, had Colorado not swept this weekend, there might not be as much hand wringing I suppose. ASU is going to be a tough out for most teams because of their ability to launch the three from seemingly anywhere on the court. And yet...we were right there. I'd like to see Larry employ some of the Tom Izzo rebounding tactics where he puts the guys in football gear and has them do rebounding drills. This team desperately needs some toughness, particularly from Johnson and Collette.

    This weekend showed that Barefield and Bibbins can be a nice one-two punch on our offense with Rawson and Collette in supporting roles. Need to get something from our bench between Bealer, Johnson, Caldwell, Van Dyke, etc.
    It only ends once. Anything that happens before that is just progress.

    Well, because he thought it was good sport. Because some men aren't looking for anything logical, like money. They can't be bought, bullied, reasoned, or negotiated with. Some men just want to watch the world burn.

  4. #94
    A few random thoughts after looking at some numbers............

    The starting guards are both playing at an all-Pac-12 level in the first four games.

    Barefield (17.3 points, 2.5 assists, 2.3 rebounds, 42% from downtown)
    Bibbins (18.3 points, 5.5 assists, 1.3 steals, 2 rebounds, 45% from downtown)

    Both are getting to the line at a decent clip (Bibbins game last night an obvious outlier) and aren't turning the ball over.

    Problem is, out of 320 possible minutes at their positions so far in Pac-12 play, they have played 297 of them, or 93%. That is fine in the short term but will likely lead to fatigue down the road.

    A potential solution lies with Kolbe Caldwell who has been a nice depth piece in conference play. Unfortunately, he has been spending his time at the 3 backing up Gabe Bealer who has been a no-show so far in conference play (1.5 points and 1.5 rebounds on 17% shooting- he literally has not recorded any other positive statistic.).

    This has forced Parker Van Dyke (who gets a disproportionate amount of hate and blame on twitter- its truly amazing.) into those rare back up minutes along the guardline and it has not gone well for him either. With a comparable shooting percentage to Bealer, PVD has managed to grab a couple of steals and collect some assists. As much as I am a fan, if he is not hitting from the outside, he is not playable (I am awarding myself the Ron Boone of the day award for this comment).

    Surprsingly, the guys behind them have not been good enough in non con against inferior competition to justify stealing any minutes, so the lack of depth gets exacerbated. Chris Seeley is either still getting back into shape after the injury, or he is not good enough to play. Time will tell.

    In a 'Perfect' world this year......

    -We start Bibbins, Barefield, Tillman, Rawson, and Collette with Johnson, Seeley, Caldwell and Bealer off the bench. PVD can be used as a heat check guy/10th man. If he is not hitting, he is out.

    Donnie Tillman's injury has taken him out of the game and injuries always cause somewhat of a ripple effect. I had no idea it was this big until I looked more closely.

  5. #95
    Administrator U-Ute's Avatar
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    This happened during the post game press conference



    I haven't seen much reporting of it. I wonder what the heck that was all about.

  6. #96
    Quote Originally Posted by UtahsMrSports View Post
    A few random thoughts after looking at some numbers............

    The starting guards are both playing at an all-Pac-12 level in the first four games.

    Barefield (17.3 points, 2.5 assists, 2.3 rebounds, 42% from downtown)
    Bibbins (18.3 points, 5.5 assists, 1.3 steals, 2 rebounds, 45% from downtown)

    Both are getting to the line at a decent clip (Bibbins game last night an obvious outlier) and aren't turning the ball over.

    Problem is, out of 320 possible minutes at their positions so far in Pac-12 play, they have played 297 of them, or 93%. That is fine in the short term but will likely lead to fatigue down the road.

    A potential solution lies with Kolbe Caldwell who has been a nice depth piece in conference play. Unfortunately, he has been spending his time at the 3 backing up Gabe Bealer who has been a no-show so far in conference play (1.5 points and 1.5 rebounds on 17% shooting- he literally has not recorded any other positive statistic.).

    This has forced Parker Van Dyke (who gets a disproportionate amount of hate and blame on twitter- its truly amazing.) into those rare back up minutes along the guardline and it has not gone well for him either. With a comparable shooting percentage to Bealer, PVD has managed to grab a couple of steals and collect some assists. As much as I am a fan, if he is not hitting from the outside, he is not playable (I am awarding myself the Ron Boone of the day award for this comment).

    Surprsingly, the guys behind them have not been good enough in non con against inferior competition to justify stealing any minutes, so the lack of depth gets exacerbated. Chris Seeley is either still getting back into shape after the injury, or he is not good enough to play. Time will tell.

    In a 'Perfect' world this year......

    -We start Bibbins, Barefield, Tillman, Rawson, and Collette with Johnson, Seeley, Caldwell and Bealer off the bench. PVD can be used as a heat check guy/10th man. If he is not hitting, he is out.

    Donnie Tillman's injury has taken him out of the game and injuries always cause somewhat of a ripple effect. I had no idea it was this big until I looked more closely.

    PVD, Bealer, and Caldwell certainly have had an opportunity to grab big minutes. None of them has really taken advantage.

    I guess we try to burn out Barefield and Bibbins. Or we go with Connor.

    Caldwell has hit shots lately, and he seems to be the best defender of the three. But he's had some awful, costly turnovers too.

  7. #97
    Quote Originally Posted by DrumNFeather View Post
    This weekend showed that Barefield and Bibbins can be a nice one-two punch on our offense with Rawson and Collette in supporting roles. Need to get something from our bench between Bealer, Johnson, Caldwell, Van Dyke, etc.
    Johnson had 5 rebounds and 2 blocks in 16 minutes. I think he did alright. He also drew a handful of the fouls that helped us out so much. I wish he had hit those two FTs late.

    But Bealer, PVD, and Caldwell's combined stat line is not pretty:

    46 minutes, 1-6 FG, 1-2 FT, 1 rebound, 1 assist, 2 steals, 0 blocks, 4 points

  8. #98
    Quote Originally Posted by sancho View Post
    Johnson had 5 rebounds and 2 blocks in 16 minutes. I think he did alright. He also drew a handful of the fouls that helped us out so much. I wish he had hit those two FTs late.

    But Bealer, PVD, and Caldwell's combined stat line is not pretty:

    46 minutes, 1-6 FG, 1-2 FT, 1 rebound, 1 assist, 2 steals, 0 blocks, 4 points
    The toughest thing with Johnson is that you (the proverbial you) to have it all click and become a big man that can get you 8-10 points and 8-10 boards off the bench.

    Agree with you on the other three guys though...you've got to get something from one of those guys if you expect to win these types of games at home.
    It only ends once. Anything that happens before that is just progress.

    Well, because he thought it was good sport. Because some men aren't looking for anything logical, like money. They can't be bought, bullied, reasoned, or negotiated with. Some men just want to watch the world burn.

  9. #99
    I thought Jayce gave the team a nice spark after Collette left with his injury early in the second half. I wish he could be stronger and hit his layups, even when he's fouled, but he's not the problem.

    It's honestly amazing that Utah was in that game given that they played 4 on 5 on offense all night. What in the world has happened to Bealer? Is he still impacted by the injury?

    Seeley didn't play a whole lot in the early games before his surgery, I just don't think he's in the rotation right now. Maybe he's a project or maybe he's just not that good. His lack of contribution along with Popoola being a complete bench warmer are the biggest disappointments of the season from a personnel perspective.

  10. #100
    Senior Member Scorcho's Avatar
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    sobering thought

    its already apparent this year will not be special, and next year (with 4 starting seniors leaving) Larry is officially rebuilding.


  11. #101
    Quote Originally Posted by Scorcho View Post
    sobering thought

    its already apparent this year will not be special, and next year (with 4 starting seniors leaving) Larry is officially rebuilding.
    Next year is all about the incoming class and Doutrive. If that class is sufficiently promising, Larry is in good shape. If that class flops, Larry is in trouble.

    But Barefield, Johnson, Tillman and the newcomers should be enough for an entertaining year.

  12. #102
    Been reported that Bealer now has a shoulder injury. Whatever, he is a 1 trick pony--can shoot from 3. Not good handling the ball & a weak defender. Caldwell can defend, but not score & should never dribble the ball unless totally out on the perimeter.

    Seeley is like the early Kuz---ton of raw talent, but does not know the defense & needs to learn how to box out instead of just thinking he can out jump everyone. He is really fun to watch in warmups --puts on dunking show--for what that is worth.

    Jayce made a huge jump from last year to this year--if he can do the same next year he could be a real player.

    PVD it is not a lack of effort, he is just not a good enough athlete. Also (not an excuse), but must be hard to not know when you are going in & to sit for a long period & then be thought of as a shooter. Jake Connor is not an option--he makes PVD look quick. ( He is a great cheer-leader on the bench).

  13. #103
    Administrator U-Ute's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Old Standing ute View Post
    PVD it is not a lack of effort, he is just not a good enough athlete. Also (not an excuse), but must be hard to not know when you are going in & to sit for a long period & then be thought of as a shooter. Jake Connor is not an option--he makes PVD look quick. ( He is a great cheer-leader on the bench).
    This made me chuckle.


  14. #104
    LOL--good one.
    trying to put a good spin on PVD--which is hard to do.

  15. #105
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    Quote Originally Posted by sancho View Post
    Next year is all about the incoming class and Doutrive. If that class is sufficiently promising, Larry is in good shape. If that class flops, Larry is in trouble.

    But Barefield, Johnson, Tillman and the newcomers should be enough for an entertaining year.
    This. Losing four starters doesn't worry me nearly as much as the next class underwhelming. By all accounts, they should be good, and maybe an improvement over this year's team.

    Assuming next year's class underwhelms, that makes 2 NCAA bids in 8 years, with a 3-year drought since the last one. Only Lynn Archibald fared worse in getting Utah to the Dance. Even if we totally flame out and finish under .500, Larry's contract makes change unlikely, as he's under one until 2023.

  16. #106
    Quote Originally Posted by SoCalPat View Post
    Assuming next year's class underwhelms, that makes 2 NCAA bids in 8 years, with a 3-year drought since the last one. Only Lynn Archibald fared worse in getting Utah to the Dance. Even if we totally flame out and finish under .500, Larry's contract makes change unlikely, as he's under one until 2023.

    On the flip-side, if next years squad exceeds expectations and we make it to the sweet 16, we will all be rejoicing and the doubt surrounding Larry will be replaced with praise.

    I also think Larry deserves the benefit of the doubt when it comes to his time on the hill. Can we hold those first couple of years against him? He inherited nothing.

  17. #107
    Quote Originally Posted by U-Ute View Post
    This happened during the post game press conference



    I haven't seen much reporting of it. I wonder what the heck that was all about.
    So, apparently it was the good Dr. Chris Hill letting someone have it. He released a statement today apologizing for the incident.

    Chris-Hill.png
    Last edited by DrumNFeather; 01-11-2018 at 02:39 PM.
    It only ends once. Anything that happens before that is just progress.

    Well, because he thought it was good sport. Because some men aren't looking for anything logical, like money. They can't be bought, bullied, reasoned, or negotiated with. Some men just want to watch the world burn.

  18. #108
    Sounds like he was yelling at Bobby Dibler, PAC-12 director of refs. That game was borderline unwatchable because of all the fouls.

  19. #109
    Quote Originally Posted by NorthwestUteFan View Post
    Sounds like he was yelling at Bobby Dibler, PAC-12 director of refs. That game was borderline unwatchable because of all the fouls.
    The review with 3.5 seconds left was also frustrating.

    The in house feed clearly showed it went off ASU, but apparently the refs use the ESPN feed and reportedly that footage didnt show it.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

  20. #110
    Its infuriating that were so talent depleted, a senior transfer our best player, and the coaches didnt even recruit McEwen or Childs. The arrogance is unbelievable. For once, I can say the recruiting should have been better, even though its Utah.

  21. #111
    Where can I read reactions to Chris Hills embarrassing misconduct. Good lord.

  22. #112
    Quote Originally Posted by SeattleUte View Post
    Where can I read reactions to Chris Hill’s embarrassing misconduct. Good lord.
    I don't know. No one on either the local or national level seemed to think it was a big deal.

  23. #113
    Quote Originally Posted by SeattleUte View Post
    Its infuriating that were so talent depleted, a senior transfer our best player, and the coaches didnt even recruit McEwen or Childs. The arrogance is unbelievable. For once, I can say the recruiting should have been better, even though its Utah.
    You're about two or three months late in your complaining. We've all been down that road. Time to move on.

  24. #114
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    Quote Originally Posted by SeattleUte View Post
    Where can I read reactions to Chris Hills embarrassing misconduct. Good lord.
    I like to see that every once in awhile out of Hill, we rarely get to see that side of him. It's clear Hill has Krysko's back which is a great characteristic from your AD, is it not?

  25. #115
    Sancho, its been in the news for a week, including front page ESPN, and he got fined $10,000. I consider that a big deal. If LA or I acted that way in court wed go to jail and probably be done.

    That does not constitute effective advocacy for Krystkowiak or the university.

  26. #116
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    Quote Originally Posted by SeattleUte View Post
    Sancho, it’s been in the news for a week, including front page ESPN, and he got fined $10,000. I consider that a big deal. If LA or I acted that way in court we’d go to jail and probably be done.

    That does not constitute effective advocacy for Krystkowiak or the university.
    you seem to be the only one outraged by this.

    well .... you and cougarboard.

  27. #117
    Sam the Sheepdog LA Ute's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SeattleUte View Post
    Sancho, its been in the news for a week, including front page ESPN, and he got fined $10,000. I consider that a big deal. If LA or I acted that way in court wed go to jail and probably be done.

    That does not constitute effective advocacy for Krystkowiak or the university.
    I was wondering when you would show up here with those sentiments.

    "It is only with the heart that one can see rightly; what is essential is invisible to the eye."
    --Antoine de Saint-Exupery

    "Things fall apart; the centre cannot hold."
    --Yeats

    True, we [lawyers] build no bridges. We raise no towers. We construct no engines. We paint no pictures - unless as amateurs for our own principal amusement. There is little of all that we do which the eye of man can see. But we smooth out difficulties; we relieve stress; we correct mistakes; we take up other men's burdens and by our efforts we make possible the peaceful life of men in a peaceful state.

    --John W. Davis, founder of Davis Polk & Wardwell

  28. #118
    Quote Originally Posted by Scorcho View Post
    you seem to be the only one outraged by this.

    well .... you and cougarboard.
    ESPN tried to make something of it during the UCLA game, but Bill Walton would have none of it.

  29. #119
    Quote Originally Posted by SeattleUte View Post
    Sancho, its been in the news for a week, including front page ESPN, and he got fined $10,000. I consider that a big deal. If LA or I acted that way in court wed go to jail and probably be done.

    That does not constitute effective advocacy for Krystkowiak or the university.
    I must have missed the part where a back room at the JMHC is a court room.


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  30. #120
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    Quote Originally Posted by sancho View Post
    ESPN tried to make something of it during the UCLA game, but Bill Walton would have none of it.
    meanwhile this Oregon vs. AZ game is excellent, Oregon leads late

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