I think if the offense does well and the defense struggles, he will have a very, very short lease.Originally Posted by U-Ute
That's why if I were Kalani, I'd move all the talent to defense. His job depends on the defense doing well. If not, Ty will be right there to take over as HC.
This is an interesting thought. In BYU's relevant era (Lavell-present), their best HCs were defense-first guys. The one strikeout they've had at HC was unquestionably an offense-first guy. But I'm not sure Detmer has his sights set on being a HC anywhere. He would've started on that career path years ago.
If BYU were a P5, Bronco would still be at BYU. Utah being in the Pac-12 not only changed how our program is perceived, but with BYU 40 miles south, our shadow looms large. Bronco left because he saw first hand BYU's dip into less-relevant status. What Bronco wasn't was a BYU alum. Kalani is. You'll never get another non-alum to stay in that job for more than 6 years -- he'll either go elsewhere or be fired.
And word out of Virginia is Bronco and his minions have been shocked at the gap between P5 and G5. They didn't realize it was as big as it was (which I imagine is amplified at BYU given their desire to get the church discount)
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I believe that. Bronco is a great coach and not dumb at all. He saw the writing on the wall. He knew that Indy's ceiling is 8 wins. He knew that he couldn't recruit to Indy and his schedule was too hard to win more than 8 games a year. He also knew that the fanbase would be screaming bloody murder after next year.
So, he left.
As far as Detmer not wanting to be the HC...allegedly Ty lost his lifetime savings to a ponzi scheme. He got back into coaching...right when he lost his money. Having no money when you previously had a lot is a great motivator to be a HC. And if Ty is making $500,000 and Kalani is closer to 1,000,000....that's a job worth trying to obtain. I'd be shocked if Ty doesn't have plans to be a HC someday.
Finally, if he wasn't serious about his coaching career, I'd doubt he take the risks he has taken, such as paying high school players to play for him.
I also agree about the stepping stone job status at BYU. The job is too hard. You recruit like a G5, you try to schedule like a P5...that will never work long term. You go to BYU to win, then leave...the only problem BYU will have is that there are a lot better jobs to go win at then leave than BYU. A lot more jobs.
I think we were all shocked at the gap. I don't think any of us thought we would struggle as much as we did. But the gap is real. The grind is real. The week in, week out is real.
I'm just glad we have depth now. I'm glad we have Whitt.
It's interesting following CB each recruiting cycle. The feeling that if they could pull in the top LDS talent, year in and year out, they'd be a annual top 10 program. They talk as if having those 3-4 top 4 and 5 star kids is going to bridge The gap. Unfortunately for them, they'd rather focus on the highly ranked guys they missed out on than the 12 2* guys they signed this year. P5 football has taught us that success depends on more than a handful of highly recruited kids.
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Good point. Bronco always brought in 3-4 four star kids. Kids I would LOVE to have. Yet, it's not those kids that held them back. It's the depth. That is what separates out class from theirs. Generally, the top of their class (4 star kids) is better than ours. BUT, we have 18 three star kids that gives us so much depth. They have 12 2 star kids. That just won't work.
Until they can fill up the bottom of their class, they have a ceiling to their success. Especially with their schedule. They just don't have the depth to compete week in week out.
Or, they need to go back to a conference (AAC or MWC). Then, their recruiting classes suddenly jump to elite level when compared to other G5 teams.
I'll just leave this here.
NickEmery.jpg
"It is only with the heart that one can see rightly; what is essential is invisible to the eye."
--Antoine de Saint-Exupery
"Things fall apart; the centre cannot hold."
--Yeats
“True, we [lawyers] build no bridges. We raise no towers. We construct no engines. We paint no pictures - unless as amateurs for our own principal amusement. There is little of all that we do which the eye of man can see. But we smooth out difficulties; we relieve stress; we correct mistakes; we take up other men's burdens and by our efforts we make possible the peaceful life of men in a peaceful state.”
--John W. Davis, founder of Davis Polk & Wardwell
Nick the Prick is actually having a really good year for a freshman. He's averaging 16 points in 30 minutes per game, on 44% shooting, with 39% from 3 point land. He has about a 2-1 assist to turnover ratio. He is also 2nd on their team in personal fouls.
He would be a fun Cougar to hate, like Robby Reid or Senoritis' favorite Nate Cooper, if only we were playing them in the next few years.
Last edited by chrisrenrut; 02-16-2016 at 10:10 AM.
“To me there is no dishonor in being wrong and learning. There is dishonor in willful ignorance and there is dishonor in disrespect.” James Hatch, former Navy Seal and current Yale student.
And 1-1 on right crosses.
He is fools gold, much like Cody Hoffman was. Look at his stats vs P5 and Gonzaga:
12 pts, 3 rebs, 1 assist, 2 TO's, 32% FG, 33% 3pt%.
He's not that amazing. He is a solid P5 player. There are about 6 players on our team that could do what he does vs that schedule.
That are true Freshman? (Well, freshman off an abbreviated BYU athlete mission)
Last edited by chrisrenrut; 02-16-2016 at 11:18 AM.
“To me there is no dishonor in being wrong and learning. There is dishonor in willful ignorance and there is dishonor in disrespect.” James Hatch, former Navy Seal and current Yale student.
That 'Freshman' is 8 months younger than Brandon Taylor.
Against Santa Clara (RPI 264) and San Francisco (RPI 222)? Yeah, I'd bet Taylor could do that as a true freshman vs those teams. I'd be Chapman could have, I know Kuzma could have, Poeltl could have, Tucker probably could, Bonham could have, Loveridge could have, Ogbe and Bealer probably could have as well.
They've played 12 games vs RPI teams ranked 200 or lower. Out of their 26 DI games, they have played 20 vs teams ranked 97 or lower.
Look at his stats vs teams with RPI in the top 100:
9 pts, 3 rebs, 0.8 assists, 3 TO's, 27% shooting, 24% from three.
He wouldn't even start for Utah and might not even be in the rotation this year.
I went and looked back at BYU vs Oregon State's talent last year:
The last 3 years, OSU has recruited about 4 spots higher than BYU according to Rivals, Scout and 247.
Over the last 5 years, OSU has recruited about 10 spots higher than BYU according to Rivals, Scout and 247.
So, it's not like Kalani is leaving a team devoid of talent and taking over some juggernaut. His defense is about as stocked at OSU's.
I mentioned this on Utefans, but Bronco's last 5 years in the MWC, he played 24 P5 teams and won 50 games.
Boise's first five years in the MWC, they played 12 P5 teams and won 52 games.
Bronco is a completely underrated football coach. So is Anae. Don't believe me? Look at what happened the last time BYU had a phenom freshman QB and they brought on their former QB genius coach to be OC.
What am I saying? It wouldn't shock me if Kalani completely FELL on his face this fall. He has no experience around him in the OC and DC positions, his schedule is just as tough if not tougher than last year (at least the first 6 games, his schedule get DRAMATICALLY weaker after that), and he is moving talent from defense to the offense.
I spotted this post on CB a couple of days ago by OxCoug. Sound logic behind this optimism.
In 2005 Kyle Whittingham was a brand new HC who had been a DC. Gary Andersen was
a guy who had been on staff at Utah, was now hitting his first year as an FBS DC, and previously spent one lame losing year at ..... Southern Utah University. Andy Ludwig had a couple of years of experience...as a pre-national Oregon OC and a Fresno State OC.
Now to clarify - I'm NOT suggesting that there is a direct parallel - this group of BYU coaches is 2x as good as that group of Ute coaches - I'm just making a laughing aside at some of the Ute fans I see posting drunk idiot stuff about how concerned they are that BYU coaches aren't more experienced.
Ty Detmer isn't Andy Ludwig. He may be a first time college OC - but how many first time college OCs come with the reverence of Steve Young and Brett Favre, the endorsements of Mike Holmgren, Andy Reid and Steve Mariucci, and 20 years growing up around coaches?
Ed Lamb has FAR more credibility right now than Gary Andersen did in 2005. Kalani has as much as Kyle did. Ty has more, on net than Ludwig did. Tuiaki himself inexperienced but has credibility.
The "experience" card is overplayed. BYU is in good shape.
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byu_pig.jpg
Couple of problems with his thoughts.
1- the only heisman winning QB to make a great OC was the old ball coach. Odds are against Ty being a good OC. Hell, odds are he won't even be an average OC.
2- Ludwig was an accomplished and successful OC. Ty is neither.
3- Whitt had been Utah's DC, he'd been recruiting to Utah and had his defense in place at Utah. It was a Whitt defense. Whitt was also the HC for the BCS game. He had already prepared for/played in/won big time games before being Utah's HC.
Kalani's success came under Whitt, Utah's defense improved after KS left, and KS was terrible as a DC away from Whitt.
KS has as much credibility as Kyle did at that point? Ha ha. That's rich. Kyle had two schools bidding for his services. Kalani was BYU's fourth choice and Gary was practically begging BYU to hire him.
Those guys are in for a reality check this fall.
Last edited by Utah; 02-19-2016 at 01:24 PM.
Also, this bit of info is overlooked:
Ty was not a good high school coach until he started paying players to play for him. So, he was only able to win with superior talent.
BYU will have less talent in a lot of their games.
Why would anyone assume Ty was going to be great? There is NOTHING that says he will be successful this fall.
I hope BYU wins every game but two each year. One loss to the Utes and the second to a team that assures the only thing they are playing for is pride and a spot in the New Mexico Pottery Bowl or its equivalent.
We're #2!
http://m.thepostgame.com/road-saturd...xas-ohio-state
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LOL. Yes, Utes fans are so obsessed with BYU that our fellow fans in the state legislature try to punish BYU for making decisions against Utah's interests. No, wait . . . .
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"It is only with the heart that one can see rightly; what is essential is invisible to the eye."
--Antoine de Saint-Exupery
"Things fall apart; the centre cannot hold."
--Yeats
“True, we [lawyers] build no bridges. We raise no towers. We construct no engines. We paint no pictures - unless as amateurs for our own principal amusement. There is little of all that we do which the eye of man can see. But we smooth out difficulties; we relieve stress; we correct mistakes; we take up other men's burdens and by our efforts we make possible the peaceful life of men in a peaceful state.”
--John W. Davis, founder of Davis Polk & Wardwell
I agree it's strange. Forget BYU.
One thing I have learned in a long life: that all our science, measured against reality, is primitive and childlike -- and yet it is the most precious thing we have.
--Albert Einstein
The fact that life evolved out of nearly nothing, some 10 billion years after the universe evolved out of literally nothing, is a fact so staggering that I would be mad to attempt words to do it justice.
--Richard Dawkins
Be kind to all, for everyone you meet is fighting a great battle.
--Philo
I was talking to my father in law about BYU's coaching staff. Here is an interesting tidbit:
Morgan Scalley has more experience coaching at the DI level than Cahoon, Mahe, Detmer, Gilford, Clark, Empey and Lamb COMBINED. If you add all the DI experience from 7 out of the 10 coaches...they have less DI experience than Scalley.
Scalley also has more experience coaching than Tuiaki. That means the only coaches with more DI experience is Sitaki and Kaufusi.
I was having lunch with an old mission friend a couple weeks ago who was visiting from the Oahu North Shore. We got talking about the BYU coaching staff, which is weird because he's not really a sports guy. Given his Hawaiian connections, he's familiar with a lot of the new staff and was scratching his head with how "familial" Sitake's picks were. He thought that the more guys from the islands you have on a staff, the more drama. Nothing too interesting.
Then a few hours later, I got a text from him that said, "Ha! Just found out my sister's husband just got hired by BYU." Turns out his BIL is Jason Ah You. I told him that his new job is to keep me up to date on all the inside drama down there. AND to get Chaz to Utah. He said Chaz wants Stanford and there's not much anyone else can do about it.
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I think Sitake has hired 4 guys' family members that he is recruiting.
A time tested strategy, and not a bad one. I hope it backfires.
Not to mention Empy (if your list doesn't include him).
“It only ends once. Anything that happens before that is just progress.”
Well, because he thought it was good sport. Because some men aren't looking for anything logical, like money. They can't be bought, bullied, reasoned, or negotiated with. Some men just want to watch the world burn.
one writers opinion and I wouldn't doubt if said writer was a zoob, LDS or had some bias in favor of BYU
You gotta fire and hire frequently to make that work.
Unless it's a Reynolds.
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