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UtahsMrSports
09-24-2013, 01:21 PM
Media day is tomorrow from noon to 3. Tony Jones shared some info via twitter just now.

-Lenz has improved to the point that he is a starting candidate, per a source.

-Several people have mentioned the Pros when it comes to Delon Wright.

Thought this would be a good place to discuss the coming season.

SoCalPat
09-24-2013, 02:00 PM
Media day is tomorrow from noon to 3. Tony Jones shared some info via twitter just now.

-Lenz has improved to the point that he is a starting candidate, per a source.

-Several people have mentioned the Pros when it comes to Delon Wright.

Thought this would be a good place to discuss the coming season.

Delon Wright is the truth. And if Lenz can undergo a Tyler Kepkay-like transformation from junior year to senior year, we can be a legitimate top 4 threat in this league.

I'm still not sold on the center position, although I'm optimistic Olsen can be that guy. If we can get 8 and 6 from him, Lenz really is that much better and Loveridge can play more on the perimeter, we're gonna be a tough out for anyone.

Senioritis
09-24-2013, 02:12 PM
Delon Wright is the truth. And if Lenz can undergo a Tyler Kepkay-like transformation from junior year to senior year, we can be a legitimate top 4 threat in this league.

I'm still not sold on the center position, although I'm optimistic Olsen can be that guy. If we can get 8 and 6 from him, Lenz really is that much better and Loveridge can play more on the perimeter, we're gonna be a tough out for anyone.

Yeah, I'm falling in like with Brandon Taylor, but a lineup of Olsen/Bach, a fully human with emotions and everything Renan Lenz, Love, Tucker, and Wright sure is long and sassy. If Love can guard on the perimeter and Wright can handle it well enough to run the point, that's a pretty sexy defensive lineup.

I'm optimistic for this team, and also fully prepared for a straight shot right to the baby maker. Or something. Until they are good, they are not good, but I'm hopeful they will be good.

Utebiquitous
09-24-2013, 02:34 PM
SoCal,
I think 8 and 6 from Olsen is a realistic expectation but I hope it's low. I think he needs to average double figures in points for us to creep into the upper third of the conference. Is 12 and 7 possible. I think Loveridge will be a 15 and 7 player. When you think about scoring for this team I just don't know who is a sure scorer other than Loveridge. Olsen and Wright, in that order, strike me as the most logical. Hence my hope of double figures for Olsen.

SeattleUte
09-24-2013, 02:47 PM
SoCal,
I think 8 and 6 from Olsen is a realistic expectation but I hope it's low. I think he needs to average double figures in points for us to creep into the upper third of the conference. Is 12 and 7 possible. I think Loveridge will be a 15 and 7 player. When you think about scoring for this team I just don't know who is a sure scorer other than Loveridge. Olsen and Wright, in that order, strike me as the most logical. Hence my hope of double figures for Olsen.

My first Ute sports love is basketball, and I always love to see Utebiquitous and Senioritis in this forum.

SeattleUte
09-24-2013, 02:49 PM
Yeah, I'm falling in like with Brandon Taylor, but a lineup of Olsen/Bach, a fully human with emotions and everything Renan Lenz, Love, Tucker, and Wright sure is long and sassy.

It would be long and sassy, but I think Taylore is a prototypical Ute point guard. Know thyself.

Senioritis
09-24-2013, 02:51 PM
SoCal,
I think 8 and 6 from Olsen is a realistic expectation but I hope it's low. I think he needs to average double figures in points for us to creep into the upper third of the conference. Is 12 and 7 possible. I think Loveridge will be a 15 and 7 player. When you think about scoring for this team I just don't know who is a sure scorer other than Loveridge. Olsen and Wright, in that order, strike me as the most logical. Hence my hope of double figures for Olsen.

Brandon Taylor averaged about 10ppg after he started getting consistent time. Also shot 42% from 3 for the year. I think he can match that if there's still any kind of low post threat. It all sort of starts with Olsen and Bach. If they can score consistently from the post, Taylor will be able to score.

What can Delon Wright average? To me, that's the question that determines how good Utah can be. Can he average 15? 18? Is there any way he can be on the level of Jahii Carson and Joseph Young from last year? Reports about him are glowing, I just wonder how high the ceiling really is. If he's really that good, Utah can be at-large bid good, methinks. If he's 12ppg, then it's NIT. If he's worse than that, I struggle to see a big step forward from last year.

Washburn's scoring was absolutely massive down the stretch. I hope Wright can exceed Wash's scoring. And I also hope he's a really loud clapper. We are going to miss that.

Senioritis
09-24-2013, 02:54 PM
It would be long and sassy, but I think Taylore is a prototypical Ute point guard. Know thyself.

Yeah, I think this is how it ends up in crunch time - Taylor, Wright, Tucker, Love, Olsen. Taylor isn't long, but he is sassy. He can also turn defensive pressure around, like he did in the road win at Washington last year. And Tony Jones says Taylor now has a college body. I'll bet that means he's pushing 150, up from 140 last year.

Rocker Ute
09-24-2013, 03:03 PM
Delon Wright is the truth. And if Lenz can undergo a Tyler Kepkay-like transformation from junior year to senior year, we can be a legitimate top 4 threat in this league.

I'm still not sold on the center position, although I'm optimistic Olsen can be that guy. If we can get 8 and 6 from him, Lenz really is that much better and Loveridge can play more on the perimeter, we're gonna be a tough out for anyone.

That's a pretty bold prediction, one I'd love to see. Being the cynical Ute fan I am though, I'm currently padding my crotch for the shot in the jimblies that Senioritis referred to. I personally think we are at least a year away from that top 4 slot. Middle of the PAC12 and a solid NIT run would be a resounding success in my mind. Top 4 in the PAC is dancing territory, and THAT would be quite a shift.

But if Wright really is 'pro material' then well that fixes a lot of problems.

SoCalPat
09-24-2013, 03:34 PM
SoCal,
I think 8 and 6 from Olsen is a realistic expectation but I hope it's low. I think he needs to average double figures in points for us to creep into the upper third of the conference. Is 12 and 7 possible. I think Loveridge will be a 15 and 7 player. When you think about scoring for this team I just don't know who is a sure scorer other than Loveridge. Olsen and Wright, in that order, strike me as the most logical. Hence my hope of double figures for Olsen.

My projection for Olsen could be construed as low because of one thing: Last year he was incapable of getting to the foul line. Your center is a massive liability on offense if he cannot create enough shot attempts (which will bring fouls) or get other opposing bigs in foul trouble. Last year, Olsen had six FTAs in 207 minutes, or one FTA per 34.5 minutes. That is beyond abysmal.

To give you an idea of how bad that is, take a look at Chris Jackson's senior year. Jackson never had a play run for him, even though he's Utah's all-time leader in FG%. You also didn't want him at the line, where he shot about 40 percent for his career. Yet he still made 56 trips to the line in 463 minutes, or one FTA every 8.2 minutes.

12 and 7 is possible for Olsen if he becomes a 100-125 FTA player for us this year. He's going to need to continue to shoot a high percentage (which he did last year) and he's going to get more rebounds with more minutes. But unlike Washburn, he will not be a focal point of our offense. This offense will go through Wright and Loveridge (whom I expect to combine for 35 PPG) although we need Olsen to be our top inside option on offense.

SoCalPat
09-24-2013, 03:42 PM
That's a pretty bold prediction, one I'd love to see. Being the cynical Ute fan I am though, I'm currently padding my crotch for the shot in the jimblies that Senioritis referred to. I personally think we are at least a year away from that top 4 slot. Middle of the PAC12 and a solid NIT run would be a resounding success in my mind. Top 4 in the PAC is dancing territory, and THAT would be quite a shift.

But if Wright really is 'pro material' then well that fixes a lot of problems.

Basketball is the one sport where teams routinely arrive a year ahead of schedule. We almost did that last year (give us Arizona, UCLA and BYU in the win column and we're that team). We can still be that team this year -- which is why I'm really pissed off about the schedule. We're still of the mindset that this program just needs wins. We need wins against quality teams and I really think we're capable of delivering there.

I totally understand your cynicism. It's been justified for several years. I think the program is at the point now where such a mindset is a bit of a crutch. We should expect this team to field a record several games on the right side of .500.

sancho
09-24-2013, 03:44 PM
My projection for Olsen could be construed as low because of one thing: Last year he was incapable of getting to the foul line.

Seems like he also picked up fouls quickly.

UtahsMrSports
09-24-2013, 04:08 PM
Looking at the players and what positions they can play, we have a lot of versatility.

Bach- 5
Fields -2,3
Kovacevic- 5
Lenz- 4,5
Loveridge- 3,4 (down to 215 pounds, per TJ)
Ogbe- 1,2,3
Olsen- 4,5
Onwas- 3,4
Taylor- 1
Tucker- 2,3
VanDyke- 1,2
Wright- 1,2,3

There is a lot you can do with a team like that.

Utebiquitous
09-24-2013, 04:55 PM
SoCal,
Revealing stat - hadn't even thought about that. I think his catches in the post go way up this year and therefore FTAs will go up naturally; but 100-125 attempts is a high number given that Loveridge will be the number one option.

SoCalPat
09-24-2013, 05:31 PM
SoCal,
Revealing stat - hadn't even thought about that. I think his catches in the post go way up this year and therefore FTAs will go up naturally; but 100-125 attempts is a high number given that Loveridge will be the number one option.

Will Loveridge be the No. 1 option? He's not going to create for Wright, but Wright will create for Loveridge. Loveridge very well might lead the team in scoring, but it won't be by much over Wright. Personally, I think Wright is an 18-20 PPG player. He would average less with more proven post threats, because he's more than willing to give up the ball. And when we need a bucket in the clutch or the shot clock is winding down, the ball is going to be in Wright's hands the majority of the time.

EDIT: Also, Olsen's 12 and 7 that you would like to see is almost identical to the 11.6/6.6 we saw from Luke Nevill as a redshirt freshman. Nevill's FTAs that year? 155, which led the team. He was also third on the team in scoring.

UtahsMrSports
09-25-2013, 08:48 AM
Will Loveridge be the No. 1 option? He's not going to create for Wright, but Wright will create for Loveridge. Loveridge very well might lead the team in scoring, but it won't be by much over Wright. Personally, I think Wright is an 18-20 PPG player. He would average less with more proven post threats, because he's more than willing to give up the ball. And when we need a bucket in the clutch or the shot clock is winding down, the ball is going to be in Wright's hands the majority of the time.

EDIT: Also, Olsen's 12 and 7 that you would like to see is almost identical to the 11.6/6.6 we saw from Luke Nevill as a redshirt freshman. Nevill's FTAs that year? 155, which led the team. He was also third on the team in scoring.

When was the last time we had a guy like that? A guy who you put the ball in his hands with the game on the line?

SheriffCreg
09-25-2013, 09:07 AM
I saw Coach Krisco at the Utah-Oregon St. football game. I had just heard about some of the recruits we had landed and felt the urge to go and give him a hug for helping our Basketball program get back on a good path. Instead, I just said "good job coach" as I walked by, and he acknowledged by saying "thanks."

I know. Cool story. But I do like that he is getting involved with the university, and going to stuff like Utah football games, without begging for attention in the process. I think it goes a long way to be involved in that stuff, and not so much as a publicity stunt the way Boynton did. I also saw Boynton at a few of the football games, but I felt he was there campaigning for the bball team moreso than actually taking an interest in the University as a whole. I feel that coach K goes to the games to be involved (And probably courting recruits), but would rather use success on the court as a way to get people to come to the game.

I am interested in seeing the attendance statistics over the past 3 years, and especially after this upcoming year. I bet that he has it on an upward trend, which would be huge.

Diehard Ute
09-25-2013, 09:18 AM
I saw Coach Krisco at the Utah-Oregon St. football game. I had just heard about some of the recruits we had landed and felt the urge to go and give him a hug for helping our Basketball program get back on a good path. Instead, I just said "good job coach" as I walked by, and he acknowledged by saying "thanks."

I know. Cool story. But I do like that he is getting involved with the university, and going to stuff like Utah football games, without begging for attention in the process. I think it goes a long way to be involved in that stuff, and not so much as a publicity stunt the way Boynton did. I also saw Boynton at a few of the football games, but I felt he was there campaigning for the bball team moreso than actually taking an interest in the University as a whole. I feel that coach K goes to the games to be involved (And probably courting recruits), but would rather use success on the court as a way to get people to come to the game.

I am interested in seeing the attendance statistics over the past 3 years, and especially after this upcoming year. I bet that he has it on an upward trend, which would be huge.

There's a pretty good relationship between our major sports coaches right now...probably better than it's ever been. Every football game you'll see gymnastics and basketball on the sidelines before the game.

Rocker Ute
09-25-2013, 11:23 AM
I saw Coach Krisco at the Utah-Oregon St. football game. I had just heard about some of the recruits we had landed and felt the urge to go and give him a hug for helping our Basketball program get back on a good path. Instead, I just said "good job coach" as I walked by, and he acknowledged by saying "thanks."

I know. Cool story. But I do like that he is getting involved with the university, and going to stuff like Utah football games, without begging for attention in the process. I think it goes a long way to be involved in that stuff, and not so much as a publicity stunt the way Boynton did. I also saw Boynton at a few of the football games, but I felt he was there campaigning for the bball team moreso than actually taking an interest in the University as a whole. I feel that coach K goes to the games to be involved (And probably courting recruits), but would rather use success on the court as a way to get people to come to the game.

I am interested in seeing the attendance statistics over the past 3 years, and especially after this upcoming year. I bet that he has it on an upward trend, which would be huge.

I can't help but feel like no one ever fully vetted Kodiak's microphone screaming skills and now here we are, making excuses as to why he just sits on the sidelines not drawing embarrassing attention to himself. Another dropped ball by Chris Hill if you ask me, and I know you did.

LA Ute
09-25-2013, 11:31 AM
I can't help but feel like no one ever fully vetted Kodiak's microphone screaming skills and now here we are, making excuses as to why he just sits on the sidelines not drawing embarrassing attention to himself. Another dropped ball by Chris Hill if you ask me, and I know you did.

:rofl:

UtahsMrSports
09-26-2013, 08:14 AM
Some interviews from Runnin' Ute media day:

http://espn.kall700sports.com/larry-krystkowiak-utah-basketball-hc-9-25-13/ (Larry K on Bill and Hans)
http://espn.kall700sports.com/parker-van-dyke-utah-basketball-9-25-13/
http://espn.kall700sports.com/delon-wright-utah-basketball-9-25-13/
http://espn.kall700sports.com/larry-krystkowiak-press-conference-9-25-13/

Enjoy!

LA Ute
09-27-2013, 05:53 PM
842

UtahsMrSports
09-28-2013, 10:59 AM
842

Second in conference. Obviously, people will leapfrog us as the big name programs start to get commitments from the top teams. But I think unless we have a decommit, we won't fall below 35, which for us would be monumental.

LA Ute
09-29-2013, 06:50 PM
Kodiak nabs a bike thief. (http://www.sltrib.com/sltrib/sports/56934908-77/krystkowiak-bike-run-basketball.html.csp)

U-Ute
09-29-2013, 07:00 PM
Kodiak nabs a bike thief. (http://www.sltrib.com/sltrib/sports/56934908-77/krystkowiak-bike-run-basketball.html.csp)

Talk about committed to defense.

SeattleUte
09-30-2013, 11:20 AM
Second in conference. Obviously, people will leapfrog us as the big name programs start to get commitments from the top teams. But I think unless we have a decommit, we won't fall below 35, which for us would be monumental.

I'm not convinced we'll drop that far. Most often what happens is the rich (i.e., those ahead of us) get richer.

LA Ute
09-30-2013, 11:31 AM
Tidbit: Kenneth Ogbe has grown an inch since he committed in the spring. He's just a hair under 6'7" now. I wonder if he will play 2 or 3?

Scratch
09-30-2013, 11:43 AM
Tidbit: Kenneth Ogbe has grown an inch since he committed in the spring. He's just a hair under 6'7" now. I wonder if he will play 2 or 3?

I'm really curious to see how PG shakes out. We have one very traditional PG on the roster, and then no one else who is even close to being what we would consider to be a classic PG. What's also interesting is that the one traditional PG is also probably the team's best shooter who could benefit from some time playing off the ball. I'm curious to see 1) how much time Taylor is getting, or if he loses any PT to any of the new guys, 2) when Taylor's out, do we change up our offensive system significantly, or do we just plug in someone else at the 1 and ask them to do the same things that we're asking of Taylor, 3) if we ask someone to run the offense the way Taylor runs it, who will it be (supposedly, Van Dyke, Wright, and Ogbe could all be that guy), and 4) if we run something different when Taylor's out, what will it look like.

Ogbe's physical growth is really interesting, because I had kind of pegged him as the most likely backup to Taylor and possibly even someone who could steal some primary PG minutes over the next few years. He was the one guy who it felt like we were bringing in as a PG. Everyone else who can play point feels like they were brought in as a wing who could also play a little point. Now, everything I read about Ogbe sounds like he won't be playing PG. Should be interesting to see how it plays out.

SeattleUte
09-30-2013, 11:47 AM
My money is on Taylor. I'm betting on that horse. I think his minutes will increase.

LA Ute
09-30-2013, 12:10 PM
My money is on Taylor. I'm betting on that horse. I think his minutes will increase.

I saw Jim Soto Friday and he said Taylor has hardened up his body quite a bit and (Jim thinks) remains the go-to guy when a three-pointer is needed. Someone else (I forget who) says that with the added muscle Taylor's more fearless than ever, and much harder to push around. I agree with you that Brandon will be the guy.

Scratch
09-30-2013, 12:27 PM
I saw Jim Soto Friday and he said Taylor has hardened up his body quite a bit and (Jim thinks) remains the go-to guy when a three-pointer is needed. Someone else (I forget who) says that with the added muscle Taylor's more fearless than ever, and much harder to push around. I agree with you that Brandon will be the guy.

I think Taylor will be the guy as well, but I still don't see him getting much more than 30-32 minutes a game. I'll be very interested to see what happens when he's not out there. Last year only 2 players averaged more than 30 mpg (Loveridge 31.7 and DuBois 30.5), so I'll be interested to see how the other 8-10 minutes shake out.

LA Ute
09-30-2013, 12:38 PM
I think Taylor will be the guy as well, but I still don't see him getting much more than 30-32 minutes a game. I'll be very interested to see what happens when he's not out there. Last year only 2 players averaged more than 30 mpg (Loveridge 31.7 and DuBois 30.5), so I'll be interested to see how the other 8-10 minutes shake out.

Right. There will be times when Kodiak needs a bigger lineup.

Scratch
09-30-2013, 02:31 PM
I saw Jim Soto Friday and he said Taylor has hardened up his body quite a bit and (Jim thinks) remains the go-to guy when a three-pointer is needed. Someone else (I forget who) says that with the added muscle Taylor's more fearless than ever, and much harder to push around. I agree with you that Brandon will be the guy.

By the way, I don't care how old he gets or what he says he wants to go by, his name will always be "Jimmy."

LA Ute
09-30-2013, 03:05 PM
By the way, I don't care how old he gets or what he says he wants to go by, his name will always be "Jimmy."

For me too, but he seems to prefer Jim these days. I think you'll be hearing from him soon if you haven't already, by the way.

UtahsMrSports
10-02-2013, 10:55 AM
http://www.tornbysports.com/utah-utes-basketball-freshman/

Grant from TornBySports takes a look at the freshman class.

LA Ute
10-02-2013, 11:56 PM
Practice is under way. A little weave drill here:

http://instagram.com/p/e5YvQLNC2t/#

UtahsMrSports
10-03-2013, 12:05 PM
In a somewhat bizzare bit of breaking news.........Kyle Kuzma will enroll this year and will redshirt. He will occupy the final scholarship. I love this!

Per @TheRecruitScoop

LA Ute
10-03-2013, 12:08 PM
In a somewhat bizzare bit of breaking news.........Kyle Kuzma will enroll this year and will redshirt. He will occupy the final scholarship. I love this!

Per @TheRecruitScoop

Hey, he gets a year to practice with the team and learn the system. Sounds great to me!

UTEopia
10-04-2013, 11:18 AM
Hey, he gets a year to practice with the team and learn the system. Sounds great to me!
Is this official. I have read on Utefans that they are still working on it.

LA Ute
10-04-2013, 11:22 AM
Is this official. I have read on Utefans that they are still working on it.

I will know more soon.

sancho
10-05-2013, 07:52 AM
On ESPN.com front page this morning:

http://espn.go.com/mens-college-basketball/story/_/id/9772083/utah-utes-coach-larry-krystkowiak-stops-two-alleged-thieves

U-Ute
10-07-2013, 12:50 PM
Someone needs to do a 'shop with K wearing superhero tights with a K on his chest.

LOL

Diehard Ute
10-09-2013, 03:35 PM
Tweet from Kyle Kuzma "Doc says 6'10"....one more inch to go"

Diehard Ute
10-09-2013, 03:37 PM
Marko is out 6 weeks with a fractured wrist per tony jones

Jarid in Cedar
10-09-2013, 03:49 PM
That one hurts. We need him to be practicing, integrating with the team so he is effective out the gate instead of sometime in December

Diehard Ute
10-09-2013, 03:54 PM
That one hurts. We need him to be practicing, integrating with the team so he is effective out the gate instead of sometime in December

On top of that, Bachynski is still out with a bum ankle and isn't expected back for another week. Jordan took the day off with a sore knee, not considered serious. Guess they had managers practicing due to lack of bodies

LA Ute
10-09-2013, 04:29 PM
That one hurts. We need him to be practicing, integrating with the team so he is effective out the gate instead of sometime in December

It might not be as bad as that. I saw him practicing last Friday with a small cast on his hand and wrist, and it looked like he was going full speed. So maybe he can at least continue to practice. I hope so.

Diehard Ute
10-09-2013, 06:56 PM
It might not be as bad as that. I saw him practicing last Friday with a small cast on his hand and wrist, and it looked like he was going full speed. So maybe he can at least continue to practice. I hope so.

Nope, the out 6 weeks with a fracture was just revealed today

SoCalPat
10-10-2013, 10:26 AM
It might not be as bad as that. I saw him practicing last Friday with a small cast on his hand and wrist, and it looked like he was going full speed. So maybe he can at least continue to practice. I hope so.

He should be able to maintain whatever stamina/conditioning he has during rehab. That's a plus. I don't know how many sets or drills we run without the ball in practice, but he should be able to participate in those as well, unless he has a history of tripping over lines painted on the court.

sancho
10-10-2013, 10:38 AM
unless he has a history of tripping over lines painted on the court.

This is unfortunately a common problem for 7 footers.

LA Ute
10-10-2013, 11:07 AM
He should be able to maintain whatever stamina/conditioning he has during rehab. That's a plus. I don't know how many sets or drills we run without the ball in practice, but he should be able to participate in those as well, unless he has a history of tripping over lines painted on the court.

At the practice I attended Bachinsky was nursing a high ankle sprain but was on the exercise bike for at least 45 minutes, then shooting free throws (yes, and walking around without a limp). Kovacevic was on the floor the entire time, shooting, rebounding and generally participating fully while wearing a light cast. That was last Friday. So I am not sure what "out for six weeks" means in terms of what he will be doing during that time. Krysko said (http://www.sltrib.com/sltrib/blogsutahsports/56979978-59/kovacevic-season-injury-junior.html.csp):


"The good thing is that it's his wrist, so the injury shouldn't affect his conditioning too much. He still has to get the range of motion back when the cast comes off. So there will be some rehab there. But he can still run and still ride the bike. So there won't be quite as bit of a comeback needed in terms of conditioning."

Diehard Ute
10-10-2013, 11:12 AM
At the practice I attended Bachinsky was nursing a high ankle sprain but was on the exercise bike for at least 45 minutes, then shooting free throws (yes, and walking around without a limp). Kovacevic was on the floor the entire time, shooting, rebounding and generally participating fully while wearing a light cast. That was last Friday. So I am not sure what "out for six weeks" means in terms of what he will be doing during that time. Krysko said (http://www.sltrib.com/sltrib/blogsutahsports/56979978-59/kovacevic-season-injury-junior.html.csp):

He'll be behind in plays etc. and while conditioning can be done, I've never talked to a player who hasn't said it takes a couple weeks of actual play to get back up to speed.

At USU the guys who were Prop48's would come play pickup in the gyms to try and stay in shape....I got dunked on a lot ;)

Mormon Red Death
10-11-2013, 11:16 AM
Is the sched published with tv?

Sent from my SGH-T999 using Tapatalk 2

LA Ute
10-11-2013, 01:47 PM
Utah basketball: Renan Lenz growing into a starting center for Utes (http://www.sltrib.com/sltrib/utes/56984796-89/lenz-practice-utah-center.html.csp)

Good news here about both Lenz and Kuzma:


He was one of Larry Krystkowiak’s first big recruiting coups. He was supposed to start at power forward last year while Jordan Loveridge acclimated himself to the college game. At the very least, Renan Lenz was supposed to be a factor.

Instead, last season was largely a nightmare for the 6-foot-10 Brazilian.

Lenz arrived to Utah out of shape and stayed that way. He never got into a groove, and found himself playing eight minutes a game of non-impact basketball.

"I just never got comfortable," Lenz said.

That narrative is on the verge of crumbling....

Almost here

Kyle Kuzma, one of Utah’s prized 2014 recruits, signed his scholarship aid agreement on Thursday, clearing a path for him to enroll in school a year early. Kuzma, a 6-foot-9 small forward from Michigan, is still waiting to be officially accepted by Utah. Once that happens, he’s expected to be a partial-qualifier. He will be allowed to do skill development with the team, but not practice. He will have four years of eligibility, beginning next season.

UTEopia
10-12-2013, 01:40 PM
I went to the public practice today and since I have not attended a basketball practice I don't have a lot to compare it with. We were allowed to watch the last few minutes of an offense/defense drill and then about 30 minutes of scrimmage time. The offense/defense drill was interesting. LK has appointed Connor as the equivalent of OC and another coach as the DC. They would run a set that it looked like was pre-scripted and after a couple of sets re group to talk about them. It was interesting for me as I have watch hundreds of Ute football practices over the years. The scrimmage was divided into three 10 minute periods with a clock, shot clock, fouls, etc. Every 3 or 4 minutes there would be timeout where the team would regroup. LK coached one team which looked to have the projected starters and Connor the other. Slocum and the other coach coached players on the floor based on what they were seeing. The team looks better physically and athletically. They are trying to push the ball at every opportunity. In general the team is longer and more athletic at every position except center. It looks like they are playing with one low post player and 4 guys floating, slashing and moving. Here is my eval of the players:

LK Team
Lenz C - Looks to be in better condition getting up and down the court. Has a good shot from 15-18 and some decent post moves. Will struggle on both ends against stronger or more athletic big men.

Love W - Totally different looking player. It will be interesting to see if the loss of weight will hurt his strength against more physical players. Love can do a lot of things. He can hit the 3, dribble penetrate to shot and pass, run and rebound.

Wright W - Very slender. Looks like he can run, jump, pass, dribble penetrate to shot and pass and might have a good outside shot. He hit 1 three and missed 1 badly.

Tucker W - Looks more physically mature and shows the ability to run, jump and shoot the spot up 3. He didn't show the ability to dribble penetrate to the shot or to pass.

Tucker PG - Looks stronger from head to toe and showed the ability to dribble penetrate to shot or pass, run, spot up 3.

Ogbe W - Taller than expected. Looks like he can dribble penetrate to pass but that his offensive game is still developing. Did not show the ability to hit the outside shot on a consistent basis.

Connor Team

Olsen C: Good inside game and shot from 12-15. Like Lenz, Olsen will struggle against stronger, more athletic centers.

Onwas W: Can run, jump and handle the ball. Showed the ability to dribble to shot or pass and was not afraid to take the 3. He is a guy who will do it all. I think he will fill a role much like that of Cedric Martin.

Fields W: Very mature looking. Can run and jump. Offensive game looks limited at this point. He can go to the glass and make some moves off dribble penetration, but he lacks a jump shot and strong ball handling skills

Van Dyke PG: Showed better than expected ball handling ability as well as the ability to penetrate to shot and pass. Has a very good outside shot.

Walkons VanBrocklin and Ricketts: Good practice players but I would not expect either to play a significant role.

Marko had a cast on his right wrist and road the bike during practice. Bach was dressed but did not participate in the portion of practice we were allowed to see.

I think this team has a significant upgrade in talent, athleticism and length. They seemed to enjoy practice and worked hard at doing what the coaches are trying to get them to do. They will be fun to watch and have the talent to compete in the second level of the PAC and to challenge the teams at the top. It would be nice to get Bach and Marko available to see if they will provide more strength and athleticism in the middle.

SeattleUte
10-12-2013, 03:49 PM
i went to the public practice today and since i have not attended a basketball practice i don't have a lot to compare it with. We were allowed to watch the last few minutes of an offense/defense drill and then about 30 minutes of scrimmage time. The offense/defense drill was interesting. Lk has appointed connor as the equivalent of oc and another coach as the dc. They would run a set that it looked like was pre-scripted and after a couple of sets re group to talk about them. It was interesting for me as i have watch hundreds of ute football practices over the years. The scrimmage was divided into three 10 minute periods with a clock, shot clock, fouls, etc. Every 3 or 4 minutes there would be timeout where the team would regroup. Lk coached one team which looked to have the projected starters and connor the other. Slocum and the other coach coached players on the floor based on what they were seeing. The team looks better physically and athletically. They are trying to push the ball at every opportunity. In general the team is longer and more athletic at every position except center. It looks like they are playing with one low post player and 4 guys floating, slashing and moving. Here is my eval of the players:

Lk team
lenz c - looks to be in better condition getting up and down the court. Has a good shot from 15-18 and some decent post moves. Will struggle on both ends against stronger or more athletic big men.

Love w - totally different looking player. It will be interesting to see if the loss of weight will hurt his strength against more physical players. Love can do a lot of things. He can hit the 3, dribble penetrate to shot and pass, run and rebound.

Wright w - very slender. Looks like he can run, jump, pass, dribble penetrate to shot and pass and might have a good outside shot. He hit 1 three and missed 1 badly.

Tucker w - looks more physically mature and shows the ability to run, jump and shoot the spot up 3. He didn't show the ability to dribble penetrate to the shot or to pass.

Tucker pg - looks stronger from head to toe and showed the ability to dribble penetrate to shot or pass, run, spot up 3.

Ogbe w - taller than expected. Looks like he can dribble penetrate to pass but that his offensive game is still developing. Did not show the ability to hit the outside shot on a consistent basis.

Connor team

olsen c: Good inside game and shot from 12-15. Like lenz, olsen will struggle against stronger, more athletic centers.

Onwas w: Can run, jump and handle the ball. Showed the ability to dribble to shot or pass and was not afraid to take the 3. He is a guy who will do it all. I think he will fill a role much like that of cedric martin.

Fields w: Very mature looking. Can run and jump. Offensive game looks limited at this point. He can go to the glass and make some moves off dribble penetration, but he lacks a jump shot and strong ball handling skills

van dyke pg: Showed better than expected ball handling ability as well as the ability to penetrate to shot and pass. Has a very good outside shot.

Walkons vanbrocklin and ricketts: Good practice players but i would not expect either to play a significant role.

Marko had a cast on his right wrist and road the bike during practice. Bach was dressed but did not participate in the portion of practice we were allowed to see.

I think this team has a significant upgrade in talent, athleticism and length. They seemed to enjoy practice and worked hard at doing what the coaches are trying to get them to do. They will be fun to watch and have the talent to compete in the second level of the pac and to challenge the teams at the top. It would be nice to get bach and marko available to see if they will provide more strength and athleticism in the middle.

thank you

UtahsMrSports
10-14-2013, 09:08 AM
I went to the public practice today and since I have not attended a basketball practice I don't have a lot to compare it with. We were allowed to watch the last few minutes of an offense/defense drill and then about 30 minutes of scrimmage time. The offense/defense drill was interesting. LK has appointed Connor as the equivalent of OC and another coach as the DC. They would run a set that it looked like was pre-scripted and after a couple of sets re group to talk about them. It was interesting for me as I have watch hundreds of Ute football practices over the years. The scrimmage was divided into three 10 minute periods with a clock, shot clock, fouls, etc. Every 3 or 4 minutes there would be timeout where the team would regroup. LK coached one team which looked to have the projected starters and Connor the other. Slocum and the other coach coached players on the floor based on what they were seeing. The team looks better physically and athletically. They are trying to push the ball at every opportunity. In general the team is longer and more athletic at every position except center. It looks like they are playing with one low post player and 4 guys floating, slashing and moving. Here is my eval of the players:

LK Team
Lenz C - Looks to be in better condition getting up and down the court. Has a good shot from 15-18 and some decent post moves. Will struggle on both ends against stronger or more athletic big men.

Love W - Totally different looking player. It will be interesting to see if the loss of weight will hurt his strength against more physical players. Love can do a lot of things. He can hit the 3, dribble penetrate to shot and pass, run and rebound.

Wright W - Very slender. Looks like he can run, jump, pass, dribble penetrate to shot and pass and might have a good outside shot. He hit 1 three and missed 1 badly.

Tucker W - Looks more physically mature and shows the ability to run, jump and shoot the spot up 3. He didn't show the ability to dribble penetrate to the shot or to pass.

Tucker PG - Looks stronger from head to toe and showed the ability to dribble penetrate to shot or pass, run, spot up 3.

Ogbe W - Taller than expected. Looks like he can dribble penetrate to pass but that his offensive game is still developing. Did not show the ability to hit the outside shot on a consistent basis.

Connor Team

Olsen C: Good inside game and shot from 12-15. Like Lenz, Olsen will struggle against stronger, more athletic centers.

Onwas W: Can run, jump and handle the ball. Showed the ability to dribble to shot or pass and was not afraid to take the 3. He is a guy who will do it all. I think he will fill a role much like that of Cedric Martin.

Fields W: Very mature looking. Can run and jump. Offensive game looks limited at this point. He can go to the glass and make some moves off dribble penetration, but he lacks a jump shot and strong ball handling skills

Van Dyke PG: Showed better than expected ball handling ability as well as the ability to penetrate to shot and pass. Has a very good outside shot.

Walkons VanBrocklin and Ricketts: Good practice players but I would not expect either to play a significant role.

Marko had a cast on his right wrist and road the bike during practice. Bach was dressed but did not participate in the portion of practice we were allowed to see.

I think this team has a significant upgrade in talent, athleticism and length. They seemed to enjoy practice and worked hard at doing what the coaches are trying to get them to do. They will be fun to watch and have the talent to compete in the second level of the PAC and to challenge the teams at the top. It would be nice to get Bach and Marko available to see if they will provide more strength and athleticism in the middle.

Thanks for the breakdown. Was not able to make it there. Excited for the upcoming year!

SeattleUte
10-14-2013, 09:18 AM
Has Delon Wright shown any possiblity of meeting SoCalPat's unusually high expectations? That's the question burning a hole in my bosom.

LA Ute
10-14-2013, 10:02 AM
Has Delon Wright shown any possiblity of meeting SoCalPat's unusually high expectations? That's the question burning a hole in my bosom.

I was told the coaching staff is thinking of starting DeLon at the point because he passes so well, and letting Taylor play the 2 because he can shoot the 3 so well. So there's that idea out there.

UTEopia
10-14-2013, 11:34 AM
Has Delon Wright shown any possiblity of meeting SoCalPat's unusually high expectations? That's the question burning a hole in my bosom.


From the little I was able to see he looks like a guy who can do everything although I am not sure on his three point ability. The thing I liked most about his game is he looked to get the ball to the open guy on penetration instead of forcing his own shot. Whether he is an 18 point 6 rebound guy I don't know, but I do like the options when he, Tucker, Taylor and Loveridge are on the perimeter.

sancho
10-17-2013, 09:03 AM
Utes picked 9th in preseason poll.

http://pac-12.com/article/2013/10/16/pac-12-mens-basketball-preseason-media-poll

There are five tiers in the poll:

Tier 1: Arizona

Tier 2: UCLA, Colorado, Oregon, Cal

Tier 3: Stanford, ASU, UW

Tier 4: Utah, OSU, USC

Tier 5: Wazzu

SoCalPat
10-17-2013, 10:15 AM
Utes picked 9th in preseason poll.

http://pac-12.com/article/2013/10/16/pac-12-mens-basketball-preseason-media-poll

There are five tiers in the poll:

Tier 1: Arizona. Easily Sweet 16, potential Final Four team

Tier 2: UCLA, Colorado, Oregon, Cal NCAA Tournament teams

Tier 3: Stanford, ASU, UW NIT

Tier 4: Utah, OSU, USC CBI or no postseason

Tier 5: Wazzu Definitely no postseason

I would like to see the league get six into the Dance, preferably with Utah being that sixth team. But our non-con SOS is atrocious and the league is too good for us to win 12 or more games. It's win it all in Vegas or make the NIT. I would be happy with either scenario. No postseason this year makes Year 4 a must-win-big season for Larry. A CBI berth is the absolute minimum in Year 3, although it would represent less progress made than there was between Years 1-2.

LA Ute
10-17-2013, 10:45 AM
I would like to see the league get six into the Dance, preferably with Utah being that sixth team. But our non-con SOS is atrocious and the league is too good for us to win 12 or more games. It's win it all in Vegas or make the NIT. I would be happy with either scenario. No postseason this year makes Year 4 a must-win-big season for Larry. A CBI berth is the absolute minimum in Year 3, although it would represent less progress made than there was between Years 1-2.

I hate to put so much on Sancho's shoulders, but I want him to be holding his lucky button during every basketball game this season. We're all depending on you, Sancho.

SeattleUte
10-17-2013, 10:49 AM
Washington as always is overrated. I'm expecting a losing season from the Huskies now that they've lost their McDonald All Americans.

sancho
10-17-2013, 10:56 AM
But our non-con SOS is atrocious and the league is too good for us to win 12 or more games.

I still think the non-conf thing is not such a big deal (though I would like to see a more interesting non-conf schedule). If we truly are a tournament worthy team, we will win enough conference games to prove it. We have enough opportunities to prove it. If we are not a tournament worthy team, we would not clean up on a tough non-conf schedule and then lose the conference games.

Applejack
10-17-2013, 11:12 AM
I'm super high on Kodiak/KrystoMeth, but I'm not high on this year's squad. Like our football team, I think we're one year away from a breakthrough.

I never thought I would say this, but it will be hard to replace last year's seniors:

Washburn - Most consistent player and best interior defender. I guess people are hoping Olsen can fill the defensive role, but I have my doubts. As for his scoring, I am not putting any money on Lenz having a breakthrough year.
C. Martin - Our best wing defender. I'm hoping that Tucker or Wright can fill this role. Tucker is a little small to guard all of the long 3s in the Pac, so hopefully Wright is up for the challenge.
Dubois - Scoring and three point shooting. I assume that the hope is that his scoring is assumed by improvement from the young guys (largely Loveridge). But who steps up as an outside threat?

Jarid in Cedar
10-17-2013, 11:24 AM
I'm super high on Kodiak/KrystoMeth, but I'm not high on this year's squad. Like our football team, I think we're one year away from a breakthrough.

I never thought I would say this, but it will be hard to replace last year's seniors:

Washburn - Most consistent player and best interior defender. I guess people are hoping Olsen can fill the defensive role, but I have my doubts. As for his scoring, I am not putting any money on Lenz having a breakthrough year.
C. Martin - Our best wing defender. I'm hoping that Tucker or Wright can fill this role. Tucker is a little small to guard all of the long 3s in the Pac, so hopefully Wright is up for the challenge.
Dubois - Scoring and three point shooting. I assume that the hope is that his scoring is assumed by improvement from the young guys (largely Loveridge). But who steps up as an outside threat?


I think Onwas is the top candidate to replace Martin. He is more athletic, so he should be able to guard/rebound as effectively. I don't know how his shooting compares, but offensively, he is probably more of a slasher.

sancho
10-17-2013, 11:31 AM
Washburn - Most consistent player and best interior defender. I guess people are hoping Olsen can fill the defensive role, but I have my doubts. As for his scoring, I am not putting any money on Lenz having a breakthrough year.


I am surprised at the hype on Lenz. I haven't seen anything from him to make me think he should be on the floor.

Olsen fouled a lot in his limited minutes last season. That obviously has to stop.

The 4/5 is the obvious hole. It's all about Olsen. Too bad that kid from the east chose Nova over us. There was a real need for him.

We have a lot of new faces, and there is always excitement and hype with new faces. There is usually some disappointment. But we do have some returning faces to be excited about.

LA Ute
10-17-2013, 12:02 PM
I am surprised at the hype on Lenz. I haven't seen anything from him to make me think he should be on the floor.

FWIW, there are a bunch of reports from the coaching staff about how Lenz has changed, lost weight, lifted weights, gotten more focused, etc. They seem to be high on him and supposedly he's a different player now. We'll see.

Senioritis
10-17-2013, 12:21 PM
I'm super high on Kodiak/KrystoMeth, but I'm not high on this year's squad. Like our football team, I think we're one year away from a breakthrough.

I never thought I would say this, but it will be hard to replace last year's seniors:

Washburn - Most consistent player and best interior defender. I guess people are hoping Olsen can fill the defensive role, but I have my doubts. As for his scoring, I am not putting any money on Lenz having a breakthrough year.
C. Martin - Our best wing defender. I'm hoping that Tucker or Wright can fill this role. Tucker is a little small to guard all of the long 3s in the Pac, so hopefully Wright is up for the challenge.
Dubois - Scoring and three point shooting. I assume that the hope is that his scoring is assumed by improvement from the young guys (largely Loveridge). But who steps up as an outside threat?

I agree with this. I feel more than a tad sheepish saying that the Runnin' Utes are going to miss Washburn, but they are.

I heard Kodiak interviewed a few weeks back, and he responded to the criticisms of the ludicrous preseason schedule. His response was that this team has better talent, certainly, but there are still six new guys and that four of the six will be counted on to contribute, a couple of them mightily. Of the six returners, three are sophomores and one is Lenz. Frontcourt depth is an issue.

Anyway, I'm giving Kodiak a pass on the schedule, provided they win, and I buy season tickets, and I have for every year of the Giac, Boylen, and Kodiak eras, and I go to more of the damn games than the freaking cheerleaders, so don't question me on this!!!

Really, a schedule like this in the future would give me not insignificant gas. I'm hoping this is the last major concession we will have to lay at the feet of Kodiak's rebuild. Excuses are soon going to be excuses.

I expect next year's Utes to be good, like NCAA or bust good. I expect this year's to make the NIT.

Applejack
10-17-2013, 12:28 PM
I expect next year's Utes to be good, like NCAA or bust good. I expect this year's to make the NIT.

I'm a notch below your pessimistic optimism: I think this year we challenge, but don't make the NIT, and next year we are a bubble team that bursts.

SoCalPat
10-17-2013, 12:51 PM
I still think the non-conf thing is not such a big deal (though I would like to see a more interesting non-conf schedule). If we truly are a tournament worthy team, we will win enough conference games to prove it. We have enough opportunities to prove it. If we are not a tournament worthy team, we would not clean up on a tough non-conf schedule and then lose the conference games.

No committee member in the last 20 years has ever had that mindset.

But I'll go ahead and say they do. Where does a Utah team that goes 9-1 non-con, 11-7 Pac-12 and 1-1 in Vegas go?

sancho
10-17-2013, 01:01 PM
No committee member in the last 20 years has ever had that mindset.

But I'll go ahead and say they do. Where does a Utah team that goes 9-1 non-con, 11-7 Pac-12 and 1-1 in Vegas go?

You are right that committee members will use non-con SOS as a tiebreaker. I overstated my case. I mostly mean to say that we will have the chance to prove ourselves with our schedule.

If we were a MWC team, this non-con schedule would make the tournament a near impossibility. In the Pac-12, the tournament is possible, we just have to beat Arizona/UCLA/CU to get there.

To answer the question, it matters who the 1 non-conf loss is and who the 12 conf wins are. The standing in the conference also matters (though standing alone cannot guarantee anything).

cald22well
10-17-2013, 01:07 PM
No committee member in the last 20 years has ever had that mindset.

But I'll go ahead and say they do. Where does a Utah team that goes 9-1 non-con, 11-7 Pac-12 and 1-1 in Vegas go?

I generally agree with you. We would probably be right at that 5th/6th spot in the Pac-12 standings. Depending on the strength of the other conferences and bubble teams, I think that we would be in the discussion of Last 4 In, First 4 Out. And in all honesty, I think that is the ceiling for this Utah team. My personal expectations are a top half seed in the NIT.

sancho
10-17-2013, 01:14 PM
I generally agree with you. We would probably be right at that 5th/6th spot in the Pac-12 standings. Depending on the strength of the other conferences and bubble teams, I think that we would be in the discussion of Last 4 In, First 4 Out. And in all honesty, I think that is the ceiling for this Utah team. My personal expectations are a top half seed in the NIT.

The silly thing about this is that the SOS ALONE counts for points, even if you lose the games. "Well Utah finished 6th and Stanford finished 7th, but I vote for Stanford because they lost to Northwestern and UConn in the preseason."

UtahsMrSports
10-17-2013, 01:15 PM
So many questions about this team.

-I have read that Lenz has improved and could start at the 4 or the 5 depending on what Larry wants the starting five to look like. I know that he was a highly touted JUCO guy, but after last season, I am taking a wait and see approach on him.
-I have read that Onwas is a major athlete and could be our starting 3. His stats from JUCO were abysmal. Again, I am taking a wait and see approach with him.
-I have read a million other things about this team and the improvements made and the impact the newcomers will have.

At the end of the day, I have no idea what to expect from this team. I could see things breaking our way and finishing 7th in conference. I could see us finishing 10th (I can't imagine finishing behind Oregon State or Wazzu.)

My hope is that we can win 20 games and go to the NIT.

LA Ute
10-17-2013, 01:26 PM
One observation about Onwas: In the 2-hour practice I attended he was invisible. He wasn't involved in running the offense, wasn't in the mix for rebounds, and generally looked young and lost. Just FWIW. We might not want to get too excited about him just yet.

UTEopia
10-17-2013, 01:58 PM
One observation about Onwas: In the 2-hour practice I attended he was invisible. He wasn't involved in running the offense, wasn't in the mix for rebounds, and generally looked young and lost. Just FWIW. We might not want to get too excited about him just yet.


In the one hour public practice last Saturday I really thought Onwas showed some ability at both ends of the court. He was playing with a team of Olsen, Van Dyke, Fields and Rickets, but he was physical, handled the ball well, rebounded and had a good looking shot from the outside. I commented last week that I think he will be like Cedric Martin. I think he is more ready to play and contribute than Ogbe and Fields. They both probably have more upside, but they both have a lot to work on to become threats on the offensive end of the court. I think Onwas will be the first off the bench for Wright, Tucker or Loveridge.

LA Ute
10-17-2013, 02:15 PM
In the one hour public practice last Saturday I really thought Onwas showed some ability at both ends of the court. He was playing with a team of Olsen, Van Dyke, Fields and Rickets, but he was physical, handled the ball well, rebounded and had a good looking shot from the outside. I commented last week that I think he will be like Cedric Martin. I think he is more ready to play and contribute than Ogbe and Fields. They both probably have more upside, but they both have a lot to work on to become threats on the offensive end of the court. I think Onwas will be the first off the bench for Wright, Tucker or Loveridge.

I hope you're right. Maybe something else was going on the day I was there. (Like me not paying close enough attention.)

Two Utes
10-17-2013, 03:31 PM
One observation about Onwas: In the 2-hour practice I attended he was invisible. He wasn't involved in running the offense, wasn't in the mix for rebounds, and generally looked young and lost. Just FWIW. We might not want to get too excited about him just yet.

It's really interesting what we see based upon our preconceived notions and biases. Tony Jones see things, I just don't see and vice versa. This is not a rip on you. Others (like Jones) are going hogwild over Onwas. You aren't. I tend to agree with you.

Diehard Ute
10-17-2013, 03:33 PM
It's really interesting what we see based upon our preconceived notions and biases. Tony Jones see things, I just don't see and vice versa. This is not a rip on you. Others (like Jones) are going hogwild over Onwas. You aren't. I tend to agree with you.

While I can't say one way or the other, I have to say judgments based off 1 or 2 hours for or against make little sense.

As others have pointed out about the playing time gripes in football, only the coaches really have the vision of everything that goes on.

I think we Fans tend to get too up or down on players based on highlight reels and sneak peaks.

SoCalPat
10-17-2013, 04:50 PM
The silly thing about this is that the SOS ALONE counts for points, even if you lose the games. "Well Utah finished 6th and Stanford finished 7th, but I vote for Stanford because they lost to Northwestern and UConn in the preseason."

It's not that you're rewarded for losing, you're rewarded for taking on quality opposition when there were 250 other teams you could have scheduled instead for an easy 'W'. And teams can always find quality opponents to fill out the schedule.

SoCalPat
10-17-2013, 05:02 PM
One observation about Onwas: In the 2-hour practice I attended he was invisible. He wasn't involved in running the offense, wasn't in the mix for rebounds, and generally looked young and lost. Just FWIW. We might not want to get too excited about him just yet.

There never was any reason to get excited about Onwas. He was an OK player on an OK team in an above-average JUCO league. If he couldn't dominate there, how could anyone expect great things from him here?

Middling-talent JUCOs will never make a bad team better, because they're counted on to do too much (think Dijon Farr, a natural 3, having to play the 4-5, or Cedric Martin having to play the point). If anything, they'll make you worse. But they can make a good team better, because you can hide their flaws and maximize their strengths. I don't think Onwas is the all-around player that Farr or Martin were, but he'll benefit more with superior talent around him.

He should be able to defend three positions, finish at the basket when given the chance and hold his own for 8-10 minutes per game. Anything more than that is a huge bonus. I also suspect that Fields or Ogbe will be able to redshirt because of this, which given our glut of wings, is not a bad thing, given how I generally view redshirting in basketball.

SeattleUte
10-18-2013, 09:16 AM
I don't have any feeling for the new guys. Pat's enthusiasm for Delon Wright is intersting with Pat's understandng of the JUCO leagues and becuase he's usually tough to please. I'm taking the 2013 recruits on faith because on paper they're not too impressive. However, I'm optimistic because I'm hoping for big strides form our sophs, as we used to expect. How many times have we seen that. A lot of times going clear back to Ticky Burden and then Judkins and Chambers.

Two Utes
10-18-2013, 09:29 AM
I don't have any feeling for the new guys. Pat's enthusiasm for Delon Wright is intersting with Pat's understandng of the JUCO leagues and becuase he's usually tough to please. I'm taking the 2013 recruits on faith because on paper they're not too impressive. However, I'm optimistic because I'm hoping for big strides form our sophs, as we used to expect. How many times have we seen that. A lot of times going clear back to Ticky Burden and then Judkins and Chambers.

Some have possibly suggested that Pat is setting Kodiak up by saying so many good things about Wright. As critical as Pat is all the time, it's perplexing as to how he could state that Wright is a pro before he plays his first game on the hill. Don't buy Pat's hype. That is unfair to the kid and to Utah.

Having said that, the schedule is so ridiculously easy that anything short of a 13-2 preseason is a huge disappointment. 13-2 would allow for a loss on the road to Boise and a loss at home to BYU. I'm not reaching in my expectations in any way. The Utes made their bed with that schedule. Now they have to lie in it.

Two Utes
10-18-2013, 09:34 AM
Some have possibly suggested that Pat is setting Kodiak up by saying so many good things about Wright. As critical as Pat is all the time, it's perplexing as to how he could state that Wright is a pro before he plays his first game on the hill. Don't buy Pat's hype. That is unfair to the kid and to Utah.

Having said that, the schedule is so ridiculously easy that anything short of a 13-2 preseason is a huge disappointment. 13-2 would allow for a loss on the road to Boise and a loss at home to BYU. I'm not reaching in my expectations in any way. The Utes made their bed with that schedule. Now they have to lie in it.

I mean 10-2, not 13-2

sancho
10-18-2013, 09:34 AM
Some have possibly suggested that Pat is setting Kodiak up by saying so many good things about Wright. As critical as Pat is all the time, it's perplexing as to how he could state that Wright is a pro before he plays his first game on the hill. Don't buy Pat's hype. That is unfair to the kid and to Utah.

Having said that, the schedule is so ridiculously easy that anything short of a 13-2 preseason is a huge disappointment. 13-2 would allow for a loss on the road to Boise and a loss at home to BYU. I'm not reaching in my expectations in any way. The Utes made their bed with that schedule. Now they have to lie in it.

Many of you clearly know more about JUCO basketball than I do, but it seems that high scoring JUCO guards often have a hard time adjusting to DI ball.

My theory: I have to assume that the quality of big men in the JUCO ranks is very low. I rarely hear of JUCO bigs making it at a higher level; big men are scarce enough that the quality guys get scholarships out of high school. So you have JUCO guards who really struggle at the higher level once there is someone with a pulse in the paint.

Does my theory have any merit?

Two Utes
10-18-2013, 09:38 AM
Many of you clearly know more about JUCO basketball than I do, but it seems that high scoring JUCO guards often have a hard time adjusting to DI ball.

My theory: I have to assume that the quality of big men in the JUCO ranks is very low. I rarely hear of JUCO bigs making it at a higher level; big men are scarce enough that the quality guys get scholarships out of high school. So you have JUCO guards who really struggle at the higher level once there is someone with a pulse in the paint.

Does my theory have any merit?


I know a little bit about JUCO. There is a lot less coaching, planning for games and help defense. Guards can get into the paint easier, opposing teams don't game plan as well and they can freelance much more than mid and high level D1. When the game slows down, high scoring JC guards (and forwards) struggle. Plus you have to actually exert a lot more energy on the defensive end in D 1

concerned
10-18-2013, 09:43 AM
I know a little bit about JUCO. There is a lot less coaching, planning for games and help defense. Guards can get into the paint easier, opposing teams don't game plan as well and they can freelance much more than mid and high level D1. When the game slows down, high scoring JC guards (and forwards) struggle. Plus you have to actually exert a lot more energy on the defensive end in D 1

sounds a lot like AAU ball.

Scratch
10-18-2013, 09:56 AM
I know a little bit about JUCO. There is a lot less coaching, planning for games and help defense. Guards can get into the paint easier, opposing teams don't game plan as well and they can freelance much more than mid and high level D1. When the game slows down, high scoring JC guards (and forwards) struggle. Plus you have to actually exert a lot more energy on the defensive end in D 1

This is exactly right, from my limited experience. And that said, Onwas didn't produce much at all offensively in that environment. That's why I have limited expectations for him on the offensive side of the ball. I can only assume he's being brought in to to fill the Cedric Martin role (good, tough D, physical presence, knock down the occasional open jumper), and I also hope that with the increased talent on the team that "the Cedric Martin role" changes from the 31 mpg Cedric played last year to 8-12 minutes in a backup role that can play 3 positions depending on matchups, and possibly be ready to play 25 minutes on occasion when the on-court matchups dictate more minutes.

SeattleUte
10-18-2013, 10:15 AM
Some have possibly suggested that Pat is setting Kodiak up by saying so many good things about Wright. As critical as Pat is all the time, it's perplexing as to how he could state that Wright is a pro before he plays his first game on the hill. Don't buy Pat's hype. That is unfair to the kid and to Utah.

Having said that, the schedule is so ridiculously easy that anything short of a 13-2 preseason is a huge disappointment. 13-2 would allow for a loss on the road to Boise and a loss at home to BYU. I'm not reaching in my expectations in any way. The Utes made their bed with that schedule. Now they have to lie in it.

With Boylen and his predecessor getting killed by what were scheduled as patsies was a regular occurrence. So if we beat all the patsies this season we'll have progressed by that much.

Two Utes
10-18-2013, 11:27 AM
This is exactly right, from my limited experience. And that said, Onwas didn't produce much at all offensively in that environment. That's why I have limited expectations for him on the offensive side of the ball. I can only assume he's being brought in to to fill the Cedric Martin role (good, tough D, physical presence, knock down the occasional open jumper), and I also hope that with the increased talent on the team that "the Cedric Martin role" changes from the 31 mpg Cedric played last year to 8-12 minutes in a backup role that can play 3 positions depending on matchups, and possibly be ready to play 25 minutes on occasion when the on-court matchups dictate more minutes.

The only thing I would add to this is Onwas played for a very good JC team. His team was loaded with talent and he didn't get a lot of minutes. You can't score if you don't get minutes. JC is a bitch. These coaches are dealing with several kids who are not very bright and they over promise about minutes--big time. Onwas probably is better than his numbers, but you can't expect that he is going to tear it up this year.

Two Utes
10-18-2013, 11:30 AM
sounds a lot like AAU ball.

Nothing is as bad as AAU. Some JC games are actually watchable.

UtahsMrSports
10-18-2013, 11:30 AM
Hows this for a potential starting 5?

PG-Wright (on offense, hed guard the 2 on D)
SG-Taylor (same thing)
SF-Tucker
PF-Loveridge
C-Lenz/Olsen

that gives you a pg who can run pick and roll (again........alegedly) and 3 guys (4 if lenz is on floor) who can knock down the spot up 3. If olsen is in, thats enough shooters to create one on one matchups inside where he can use his moves to create buckets.

Loveridge is going to be someone, IMO, who creates mismatches at either the 3 or the 4.

It's not the longest team in the world, but going 5,10, 6'5, 6'5 beats last year of 5'10, 6'2, 6'4.

UtahsMrSports
10-18-2013, 11:37 AM
The only thing I would add to this is Onwas played for a very good JC team. His team was loaded with talent and he didn't get a lot of minutes. You can't score if you don't get minutes. JC is a bitch. These coaches are dealing with several kids who are not very bright and they over promise about minutes--big time. Onwas probably is better than his numbers, but you can't expect that he is going to tear it up this year.

I am like most here......I have no idea what to expect from Princeton. One thing is undeniable: The guy is an athlete. He can flat out jump and he is ripped.

The coaches have given him rave reviews for his on ball defense. If that is the case, then on offense I'd simply want him to develop into a guy who is a threat to hit a three and can make entry passes. If he can do that and finish on the break and maybe occasionally use that athleticism to get to the basket..........then maybe we will have ourselves a steal.

Time will tell, as is the case with this whole team.

Scratch
10-18-2013, 11:54 AM
The only thing I would add to this is Onwas played for a very good JC team. His team was loaded with talent and he didn't get a lot of minutes. You can't score if you don't get minutes. JC is a bitch. These coaches are dealing with several kids who are not very bright and they over promise about minutes--big time. Onwas probably is better than his numbers, but you can't expect that he is going to tear it up this year.

Where are you getting his playing time from? All I see from his stats is that he led his team in shots taken (on his way to shooting 37% from the floor), but can't see minutes played recorded anywhere.

SeattleUte
10-18-2013, 12:14 PM
Some have possibly suggested that Pat is setting Kodiak up by saying so many good things about Wright. As critical as Pat is all the time, it's perplexing as to how he could state that Wright is a pro before he plays his first game on the hill. Don't buy Pat's hype. That is unfair to the kid and to Utah.

Spencer Dinwiddie agrees with Pat:


Colorado guard Spencer Dinwiddie, a first-team all-Pac-12 honoree last season, had good things to say about Utah newcomer Delon Wright. They grew up near each other in Southern California.
Dinwiddie said that Wright, a 6-foot-5 guard from the City College of San Francisco, is a very talented, multi-skilled player.
“Anytime you have a versatile player like that it’s definitely going to help you in this conference,” Dinwiddie said.


http://www.deseretnews.com/article/865588621/Utah-basketball-Runnin-Utes-coach-Larry-Krystkowiak-shines-at-Pac-12-media-day.html

Two Utes
10-18-2013, 12:17 PM
Where are you getting his playing time from? All I see from his stats is that he led his team in shots taken (on his way to shooting 37% from the floor), but can't see minutes played recorded anywhere.

NJCAA.org. But after looking at it again, that appears not to be accurate either. He did take a lot of shots and started. I'm just wrong on the minutes. MY bad.

Two Utes
10-18-2013, 12:19 PM
Spencer Dinwiddie agrees with Pat:



http://www.deseretnews.com/article/865588621/Utah-basketball-Runnin-Utes-coach-Larry-Krystkowiak-shines-at-Pac-12-media-day.html

I don't read that to mean Dinwiddle thinks he is going to be a pro. I think Wright is going to be a player. But saying he is a pro is over the top, IMO. And I'm curious as to how and why Pat made that determination.

SoCalPat
10-18-2013, 02:38 PM
Some have possibly suggested that Pat is setting Kodiak up by saying so many good things about Wright(1). As critical as Pat is all the time, it's perplexing as to how he could state that Wright is a pro before he plays his first game on the hill. Don't buy Pat's hype. That is unfair to the kid and to Utah(2).

Having said that, the schedule is so ridiculously easy that anything short of a 13-2 preseason is a huge disappointment. 13-2 would allow for a loss on the road to Boise and a loss at home to BYU. I'm not reaching in my expectations in any way. The Utes made their bed with that schedule. Now they have to lie in it.

1. Show me the asshats who actually wrote/believe that so I can be sure to never again take seriously anything they have to say.

2. Show me where I said Wright is/could/should be a future NBA player.

3. Not footnoted: Anyone who says I've been too critical of Utah hoops and Larry, then calls me disingenious for being excited about Utah hoops can kiss my ass. First in line is Two Utes.

LA Ute
10-18-2013, 02:45 PM
Pat's post reminded me of this pictorial guide to identifying the type of hat he's talking about:

890

Seriously, I think Pat (or any fan) being excited about Utah hoops is great.

SoCalPat
10-18-2013, 03:15 PM
Many of you clearly know more about JUCO basketball than I do, but it seems that high scoring JUCO guards often have a hard time adjusting to DI ball.

My theory: I have to assume that the quality of big men in the JUCO ranks is very low. I rarely hear of JUCO bigs making it at a higher level; big men are scarce enough that the quality guys get scholarships out of high school. So you have JUCO guards who really struggle at the higher level once there is someone with a pulse in the paint.

Does my theory have any merit?

Depends on how they go about their high-scoring ways in JUCO. If they rely heavily on the 3, they will need time to adapt playing D-1 because of crowd pressure and better perimeter defense. Think about guys like Tyler Kepkay and Tyler Wilkins (Snow, now at Ohio). But the last three JUCO points I saw "significant" minutes from were Pierre Jackson, Fabyon Harris and Jiggy. All three were bonafide scoring threats at the point from Day 1 at the D-1 level. All relied on dribble penetration first to get their points.

Jackson is easily better than Wright, but I'd take Delon ahead of the others and I don't think it's really close. From what I've seen of him on limited highlights and having an idea of the competition he faced in Cali JUCOs, he's easily better than Harris (who I thought would've unseated Jiggy as our starting point in our 5-win season). And Harris averaged 12 PPG for Texas A&M last year and shot 44 percent from 3.

Utah
10-19-2013, 09:02 AM
No committee member in the last 20 years has ever had that mindset.

But I'll go ahead and say they do. Where does a Utah team that goes 9-1 non-con, 11-7 Pac-12 and 1-1 in Vegas go?

I think it totally depends. What was their record over the last 10 games? If it is 10-0, they are in. If they finish out 2-8, out. Who did they lose to in Vegas? If it is Arizona in OT, then they would get strong consideration to be in. Who did they lose to in OOC? Was it a tourney team? Was it close?

The good news is, that even with their terrible OOC, the PAC-12 is good enough, that if they are rocking at the end of the year, they have a chance to make it in.

For example, look at Utah's "top" games this year:

Boise St
BYU
Oregon
Stanford
Wash
UCLA
Arizona

That is 12 quality games.

Now look at BYU (a tourney level team):

Iowa St
Stanford
Texas
Utah St
Utah
Oregon
St Mary's
Gonzaga

That's 10 quality games.

SDSU:

Arizona
Washington
Kansas
New Mex
Colo St
Boise
UNLV

11 quality games.

So, with all the bitching about Utah's schedule, it really isn't that much different at the top. The difference is at the bottom.

Utah is young. They are still getting used to winning. I'd rather have them have get 20 wins and miss the tourney than get 15 against tougher teams. 20 wins gives recruits something to think about. It gives fans something to get excited about. It gives you a great shot at some post season.

20 wins gives you optimism and chances to get better. 15 feels like you haven't improved.

It might be lame, but it is what it is.

LA Ute
10-24-2013, 09:22 AM
I was not present at the Night with the Running Utes but all the reports I've seen are that Ogbe is surprisingly good and will probably see lots of minutes this year. Everyone says he's smooth and fluid, moves much faster than he seems to be moving. Wright is also as good as advertised, by all accounts. Looks like there is a major uptick in the team's athleticism all around. Did anyone attend the NWTRU?

Senioritis
10-24-2013, 10:31 AM
I was not present at the Night with the Running Utes but all the reports I've seen are that Ogbe is surprisingly good and will probably see lots of minutes this year. Everyone says he's smooth and fluid, moves much faster than he seems to be moving. Wright is also as good as advertised, by all accounts. Looks like there is a major uptick in the team's athleticism all around. Did anyone attend the NWTRU?

I was unable to attend, due to the freaking Pinewood Derby, but priorities are priorities. My son made "The World's Fastest Lego," which was essentially just the brick of the pinewood derby car painted shiny red, with circles of foam pieces glued on top and a Lego guy tipping a 40 as a pilot. It was the second slowest car of the evening, and his participation award was the "Looks Least Like a Car" award. I am not making any of this up.

I also received my season tickets in the mail this morning. This is the first time in several years that I haven't felt totally dirty and taken advantage of by purchasing season tickets. I sure hope this feeling lasts! The handsome package included a coupon to Carl's Jr for a free fry and medium drink with purchase of a Six Dollar Burger, and a $10 off coupon to the Red Zone store that expired on 6/30/13.

VIP.

Two Utes
10-24-2013, 10:35 AM
http://www.tulsaworld.com/sportsextra/oru/oru-s-shawn-glover-named-preseason-all-southland/article_513391c4-3c22-11e3-ab51-0019bb30f31a.html

Shaun Glover preseason all conference pick. It's all Kodiak's fault he isn't still here. I will have a chance to watch Glover play this year live. Will let you know if his game has progressed beyond standing at the three point line and firing threes. Apparently it has.

SoCalPat
10-24-2013, 10:37 AM
I was not present at the Night with the Running Utes but all the reports I've seen are that Ogbe is surprisingly good and will probably see lots of minutes this year. Everyone says he's smooth and fluid, moves much faster than he seems to be moving. Wright is also as good as advertised, by all accounts. Looks like there is a major uptick in the team's athleticism all around. Did anyone attend the NWTRU?

Tap the brakes. Ogbe had a great NWTRU, but it took everyone by surprise, including the coaching staff. He made a case for more minutes, but not at the expense of our projected starting 5. And I'm not ready to annoint him as Wright's backup ahead of Brandon Taylor. Shoot, Renan Lenz and Justin Seymour combined for 33 points in last year's NWTRU.

SoCalPat
10-24-2013, 10:39 AM
http://www.tulsaworld.com/sportsextra/oru/oru-s-shawn-glover-named-preseason-all-southland/article_513391c4-3c22-11e3-ab51-0019bb30f31a.html

Shaun Glover preseason all conference pick. It's all Kodiak's fault he isn't still here. I will have a chance to watch Glover play this year live. Will let you know if his game has progressed beyond standing at the three point line and firing threes. Apparently it has.

Glover would have graduated last year had he stayed at Utah anyway.

LA Ute
10-24-2013, 11:12 AM
Tap the brakes. Ogbe had a great NWTRU, but it took everyone by surprise, including the coaching staff. He made a case for more minutes, but not at the expense of our projected starting 5. And I'm not ready to annoint him as Wright's backup ahead of Brandon Taylor. Shoot, Renan Lenz and Justin Seymour combined for 33 points in last year's NWTRU.

I'm just relaying what others have reported. We'll see who emerges.

UTEopia
10-24-2013, 11:24 AM
Tap the brakes. Ogbe had a great NWTRU, but it took everyone by surprise, including the coaching staff. He made a case for more minutes, but not at the expense of our projected starting 5. And I'm not ready to annoint him as Wright's backup ahead of Brandon Taylor. Shoot, Renan Lenz and Justin Seymour combined for 33 points in last year's NWTRU.

Ogbe was not all that at the open practice. He did not look confident with the ball and did not look like he had much of an outside shot. With young guys like him we will see some very good games and some where he is non-existent. I think that this is just the nature of young guys who are not going to be 1 and dones.

UTEopia
10-24-2013, 11:25 AM
http://www.tulsaworld.com/sportsextra/oru/oru-s-shawn-glover-named-preseason-all-southland/article_513391c4-3c22-11e3-ab51-0019bb30f31a.html

Shaun Glover preseason all conference pick. It's all Kodiak's fault he isn't still here. I will have a chance to watch Glover play this year live. Will let you know if his game has progressed beyond standing at the three point line and firing threes. Apparently it has.

Good for Glover. Wish he would have stayed. Looking forward not backwards at this point in time.

SoCalPat
10-24-2013, 02:21 PM
I'm just relaying what others have reported. We'll see who emerges.

I'd like to read the accounts of those who "reported" that Ogbe will see a lot of minutes. It certainly wasn't TJ or Facer.

SeattleUte
10-24-2013, 02:23 PM
And I'm not ready to annoint him as Wright's backup ahead of Brandon Taylor.

Taylor won't start? I don't think so.

concerned
10-24-2013, 02:35 PM
I'd like to read the accounts of those who "reported" that Ogbe will see a lot of minutes. It certainly wasn't TJ or Facer.




https://pbs.twimg.com/profile_images/1301125894/tjones100_normal.jpgTony Jones‏@Tjonessltrib (https://twitter.com/Tjonessltrib)

@MACatHoyos (https://twitter.com/MACatHoyos) Ogbe has bigtime potential. He's been inconsistent though. I think he will be a 15-20 min a game guy




1:30 PM - 24 Oct 13

LA Ute
10-24-2013, 02:36 PM
I'd like to read the accounts of those who "reported" that Ogbe will see a lot of minutes. It certainly wasn't TJ or Facer.

Put down your gun, you misunderstood me. All I saw were message board posts from people who attended NWTRU. When I saw Ogbe for a 2-hour practice just after the UCLA football game, he looked lost and very young. UTEopia had the same impression after watching a separate practice. I was surprised at how many people (just fans, some of whom have a history of being pretty knowledgeable) were impressed at how well he seemed to play. No one's putting him in the starting lineup yet.

All that aside, I like what I am hearing about increased athleticism generally.

Scratch
10-24-2013, 02:37 PM
Taylor won't start? I don't think so.

I think what he's saying is that Taylor will start at the 2 with Wright starting at the 1, but Taylor will also get the bulk of the PG minutes when Wright isn't on the court.

Senioritis
10-24-2013, 02:55 PM
I think Taylor, Wright, and Love are pretty well set as dudes who will get a lot of time. The question is will Love play the 3 or the 4? He'll play both, but which will he play more?

I don't love the sound of Love at 4 and Lenz at 5, but if Wright is strong on the glass and Onwas and Tucker can be rebound, it's not insurmountable against a lot of teams. With the injury stuff up front, Love probably plays more 4 than 3. However, I'd much prefer JO make some strides be the man at the 5, with Batshiznits and Lenz getting the rest. Then Love and Lenz split time at 4, and Love plays some 3.

I'm just not sure Love at 4 is a real long term win, when he's 6'6" and 215 pounds. But that may be where it ends up, especially if Lenz continues to, uh, struggle.

Seems like the rotation will be these guys (in Senioritis projected number of minutes):

Loveridge
Taylor
Wright
Olsen
Tucker
Lenz
Onwas
Batshiznits
Ogbe

Kovacevic could take some minutes when he gets healthy, but he's a Serbian who played JC ball in Nebraska, so we probably should put a damper on our already meager expectations.

I think Fields and PVD redshirt, and Van Brocklin gets the scrub minutes.

Rocker Ute
10-24-2013, 03:01 PM
For the first time in years, I'm not generally apathetic towards Utah basketball. I had to be to protect myself.

Dare I open my heart to a solid CBI run?

By the way, I've noted that they STILL don't have our elite 8 run in the CBI under Boylen hanging in the rafters at JMHC. I think I'll write a sternly worded letter.

So here are my metrics for a successful season:

1. No WTF losses.
2. Steal 2 wins we shouldn't.
3. Ability to come up with an endearing nickname for Bachynski
4. Senioritis does the Dear Head Coach Pen Pal for the basketball season.

SeattleUte
10-24-2013, 03:06 PM
For the first time in years, I'm not generally apathetic towards Utah basketball. I had to be to protect myself.

Dare I open my heart to a solid CBI run?

By the way, I've noted that they STILL don't have our elite 8 run in the CBI under Boylen hanging in the rafters at JMHC. I think I'll write a sternly worded letter.

So here are my metrics for a successful season:

1. No WTF losses.
2. Steal 2 wins we shouldn't.
3. Ability to come up with an endearing nickname for Bachynski
4. Senioritis does the Dear Head Coach Pen Pal for the basketball season.

Kodiak did the first two last season didn't he.

Senioritis
10-24-2013, 03:12 PM
For the first time in years, I'm not generally apathetic towards Utah basketball. I had to be to protect myself.

Dare I open my heart to a solid CBI run?

By the way, I've noted that they STILL don't have our elite 8 run in the CBI under Boylen hanging in the rafters at JMHC. I think I'll write a sternly worded letter.

So here are my metrics for a successful season:

1. No WTF losses.
2. Steal 2 wins we shouldn't.
3. Ability to come up with an endearing nickname for Bachynski
4. Senioritis does the Dear Head Coach Pen Pal for the basketball season.

3. Batshiznits is very good, and it's so easy to say it practically pops itself right off your tongue.
4. This could be fun, especially because one of the coaches in the league is named Dana. Bwaaahaahaaaa!!!

Senioritis
10-24-2013, 03:12 PM
For the first time in years, I'm not generally apathetic towards Utah basketball. I had to be to protect myself.

Dare I open my heart to a solid CBI run?

By the way, I've noted that they STILL don't have our elite 8 run in the CBI under Boylen hanging in the rafters at JMHC. I think I'll write a sternly worded letter.

So here are my metrics for a successful season:

1. No WTF losses.
2. Steal 2 wins we shouldn't.
3. Ability to come up with an endearing nickname for Bachynski
4. Senioritis does the Dear Head Coach Pen Pal for the basketball season.

3. Also, Thyroid.

Rocker Ute
10-24-2013, 03:15 PM
Kodiak did the first two last season didn't he.

Off the top of my head Sac St and Cal State Northridge I'd count as WTF losses. And I may be getting my seasons mixed up but didn't we lose a pre-season game to some team like the Athletes in Action/Grandview 1st ward young mens basketball squad? I seem to remember comforting myself by saying, "I remember when Big Rick would lose a game in the preseason like that but it was because he didn't look at the scoreboard once, or even listen to a referee whistle the entire game. That's what we just did... right?"

But if I'm not correct, I'll gladly revise my #1 to no blowout losses. We had a few of those. And when I'm talking about #2, I'm not talking about toppling the current #8 ranked PAC12 team, I'm talking about wins over one of the top 3.

We'll just say my expectations are going to remain a little low.

Rocker Ute
10-24-2013, 03:16 PM
3. Also, Thyroid.

We're 25% of the way to a successful season already. How many other PAC 12 teams can say that?

Senioritis
10-24-2013, 03:27 PM
Off the top of my head Sac St and Cal State Northridge I'd count as WTF losses. And I may be getting my seasons mixed up but didn't we lose a pre-season game to some team like the Athletes in Action/Grandview 1st ward young mens basketball squad? I seem to remember comforting myself by saying, "I remember when Big Rick would lose a game in the preseason like that but it was because he didn't look at the scoreboard once, or even listen to a referee whistle the entire game. That's what we just did... right?"

But if I'm not correct, I'll gladly revise my #1 to no blowout losses. We had a few of those. And when I'm talking about #2, I'm not talking about toppling the current #8 ranked PAC12 team, I'm talking about wins over one of the top 3.

We'll just say my expectations are going to remain a little low.

OK, now we are getting somewhere.

1. No blowout losses.
2. Go 1-5 against Arizona, UCLA, and Colorado
3. Thyroid
4. Dana

What constitutes a blowout loss?

Rocker Ute
10-24-2013, 03:42 PM
What constitutes a blowout loss?

20+ points and not after fouling for the final 2 minutes.

Or a game where Jimmer hangs almost 50 on you in your home court and you have to sit next to a grown man BYU fan who shrieks 'JIMMERRRRRRR!!!' like a teen-beat girl each times Jimmer touched the ball. That was a life lesson I wasn't prepared to have with my 5yo son just yet.

SoCalPat
10-24-2013, 03:49 PM
https://pbs.twimg.com/profile_images/1301125894/tjones100_normal.jpgTony Jones‏@Tjonessltrib (https://twitter.com/Tjonessltrib)

@MACatHoyos (https://twitter.com/MACatHoyos) Ogbe has bigtime potential. He's been inconsistent though. I think he will be a 15-20 min a game guy




1:30 PM - 24 Oct 13



I just don't see where the minutes are going to come from for him to get 15-20 per game, but if he plays half the time like he did last night, he'll get at least that many.

SoCalPat
10-24-2013, 03:51 PM
Put down your gun, you misunderstood me. All I saw were message board posts from people who attended NWTRU. When I saw Ogbe for a 2-hour practice just after the UCLA football game, he looked lost and very young. UTEopia had the same impression after watching a separate practice. I was surprised at how many people (just fans, some of whom have a history of being pretty knowledgeable) were impressed at how well he seemed to play. No one's putting him in the starting lineup yet.

All that aside, I like what I am hearing about increased athleticism generally.

I didn't realize "tapping the brakes" was the equivalent of a drive-by shooting.

LA Ute
10-24-2013, 03:51 PM
I didn't realize "tapping the brakes" was the equivalent of a drive-by shooting.

:D.

sancho
10-24-2013, 04:08 PM
I just don't see where the minutes are going to come from for him to get 15-20 per game, but if he plays half the time like he did last night, he'll get at least that many.

I doubt Tony busts out the calculator to find minutes before sending a tweet like that. Just take it to mean he sees Ogbe as a contributor.

Senioritis
10-24-2013, 04:31 PM
For the first time in years, I'm not generally apathetic towards Utah basketball. I had to be to protect myself.

Dare I open my heart to a solid CBI run?

By the way, I've noted that they STILL don't have our elite 8 run in the CBI under Boylen hanging in the rafters at JMHC. I think I'll write a sternly worded letter.

So here are my metrics for a successful season:

1. No WTF losses.
2. Steal 2 wins we shouldn't.
3. Ability to come up with an endearing nickname for Bachynski
4. Senioritis does the Dear Head Coach Pen Pal for the basketball season.

By the way, PROVE IT!!!

I've embarrassed myself and my family with eight strongly worded letters so far. Write your damned letter, send it to Dr. Hill, and CC: UB5.

Get it done.

Diehard Ute
10-24-2013, 04:53 PM
By the way, I've noted that they STILL don't have our elite 8 run in the CBI under Boylen hanging in the rafters at JMHC. I think I'll write a sternly worded letter.


They haven't updated any of those in years. Gymnastics has several more nationals appearances. None have been updated since 2009

SeattleUte
10-24-2013, 05:18 PM
They haven't updated any of those in years. Gymnastics has several more nationals appearances. None have been updated since 2009

I hope Rocker was being TIC. Probably if the Utes start winning again like Senioritis gets in good times he won't be nearly as funny anymore. Some comics thrive on hard times.

FountainOfUte
10-24-2013, 05:22 PM
Or a game where Jimmer hangs almost 50 on you in your home court and you have to sit next to a grown man BYU fan who shrieks 'JIMMERRRRRRR!!!' like a teen-beat girl each times Jimmer touched the ball.

Even with the painful football losses to UNLV, TCU, and CU and heartbreaking losses in hoops to Kentucky over, and over, and over again, my lowest moment as a Ute fan, ever, was the moment Fredette hit that near-half-court bomb to end the first half as the whole upper bowl of our JMHC filled with a darker shade of blue erupted in a part-roar-part-squeal. That. Moment. Right. There. That was the bottom of the trough for me.

Please, Coach Krystkowiak. Never let that happen to Ute fans again. That was the worst.

Mormon Red Death
10-24-2013, 05:38 PM
Kodiak did the first two last season didn't he.

You forgot about Sacramento st

LA Ute
10-24-2013, 06:47 PM
You forgot about Sacramento st


Cal State Northridge did it for me. I run with the dog on that campus almost every morning. I know the head hoops coach there. We were up by 20, weren't we? That was for me the epitome of a WTH loss.

Mormon Red Death
10-24-2013, 06:54 PM
Cal State Northridge did it for me. I run with the dog on that campus almost every morning. I know the head hoops coach there. We were up by 20, weren't we? That was for me the epitome of a WTH loss.

Oh yeah we were rolling in the first half

Sent from my SGH-T999 using Tapatalk 2

UBlender
10-24-2013, 08:16 PM
Even with the painful football losses to UNLV, TCU, and CU and heartbreaking losses in hoops to Kentucky over, and over, and over again, my lowest moment as a Ute fan, ever, was the moment Fredette hit that near-half-court bomb to end the first half as the whole upper bowl of our JMHC filled with a darker shade of blue erupted in a part-roar-part-squeal. That. Moment. Right. There. That was the bottom of the trough for me.

Please, Coach Krystkowiak. Never let that happen to Ute fans again. That was the worst.

Yeah, I was there. It was bad enough that there were as many, if not more, BYU fans in the Hunty that night, but the worst was that we had nothing to do but sit there and witness this horrifying event. There was no silver lining, no moral victory, nothing we could do or say. We sat and stewed in the JimmerMania having its highest moment at our expense, one for the ages and we were playing the role of the hapless Washington Generals.

That sucked in a way few things can suck.

UBlender
10-24-2013, 10:39 PM
Once upon a time, Utah fans would muddle through football season, fighting off attacks from trolls (and each other) and try not to lose control of their bowels long enough to last until hoops season. We'd spend summer and fall on utefans.net debating how soon we needed fire Mac and whether or not Martin Osimani would win the Naismith or merely be a pathetic All American. Then, Night With The Runnin' Utes would bring a solemn hush to the internets as we would all convene at the Altar of Hooplor and post very weighty discourses on the merits of Jeremy Killion's off hand, or Cameron Koford's tallness, or Jonas Langvad's muppet upbringing, or Tim the Manager's....oh, just Tim the Manager. We would sit around for a couple of weeks until the hard launch of basketball season and discuss these things in tones and terms usually reserved for hostage negotiations and fourth date DTRs. It was heavy stuff and it was the currency of internet Ute geeks for many years.

Well, it's still real to me, dammit! So here I am to honor that tradition. Behold, my first novel "I Like Utah Basketball" (and yes, I posted a version of this on utezone but reposted it here because this forum seems to go for sustained hoops discussion a little bit more than that one):

Jordan Loveridge is clearly "the guy" on this team. Utah will look to him to be the leading scorer and to get them out of a rut when things get difficult. Loveridge knows this and is looking more assertive. He was pretty aggressive for a freshman last year but it appears that he knows it's his team and there is little question about that. He did force a few shots, but that is part of his role, especially early on while the team sorts out who the other main scoring threats will be. The bigger issue is that he missed a handful of "make-able" shots near the basket. He will need to finish better, especially against the better PAC 12 teams. He is also all business, like the front of a mullet, and appears that he'd just as soon disembowel you than smile on the basketball court.

Delon Wright might well be the second option on offense. He is very smooth and has a good all around game. He's trying to embrace the point guard role and act as a distributor so he might not be as aggressive offensively as he could be right now. It could take him some time to get fully comfortable in that role and have the right feel for when to set others up and when to call his own number. I had the impression that he was capable of getting his own shot a lot more than he did last night. We'll see how that develops. Also, his brother is in the NBA and I expect him to mention that to the mean kids on opposing teams to try to win their favor, kind of like the way I used to mention to people that I am related to ColoUte (back when that was a thing) to win friends on the internet. Delon will hopefully get fewer hate re-tweets for that stunt than I did for mine.

I can't say enough about Dakarai Tucker. He was good late last season and appears a good notch better this year. He's both efficient and effective and doesn't need the ball in his hands to contribute. I'm excited about his career trajectory and think he'll mesh very well with the top dogs on this team. Ute fans, this holiday season make some room in your hearts for a little Dakarai (if you have a heart condition please consult a physician before rearranging your heart).

Brandon Taylor will continue to be a fun player to watch. He's very confident and will contribute at both guard spots this year. It will be nice to let him play off the ball more and find his scoring opportunities without worrying about being a distributor all of the time. He'll be a weapon and probably among Utah's top three scorers for the season. Still, he'll have patches where he struggles to do his thing due to the fact that he is roughly the size of an ewok or possibly a minion.

Renan Lenz did look a little bit more fleet of foot and comfortable than last season. He also played quite well at NWTRU a year ago, so I'm not getting too excited about him quite yet. Still, it looks like he rounds out the (initial) starting lineup (along with those listed above). I don't get why Renan is pronounced "Henna" and I think that might be the root of his struggles last year.

The center position seems likely to have some element of "center by committee" this year. Jeremy Olsen will either start at center or be the first big off the bench. He has touch and skill but has to prove he has the ability to protect the rim or be strong on the boards. They call him "JO", first rate nicknameification there. Utah needs its centers to be defenders and rebounders and that is where Dallin Bachynski could make his living if he gets his head on right and embraces the role without worrying about trying to be a scorer. From what I saw last night, I'm not sure we're going to see a different Bachynski than last season (after his hot start). He played hard but wasn't very impactful. If he'd adopt the same mentality as his brother he'd be a force and this team would be much better off. Also if he would just watch old tapes of Eric Leckner it would go a long way to show that he has a very limited and outdated video library. I have no idea if Marko Kovacevic is going to be able to contribute anything (aside from Eastern European techno pop--it's a terrible medium, but you'll get used to it), he's still out for several more weeks and I have not heard anything--good or bad--about his place on this team when he does return. Center is clearly a huge question on this team--they don't need to score a ton but I'm not sure Utah has the defense and rebounding it will need to hang in the PAC 12.

Princeton Onwas (or "Purple Rain" which is what we can call him because, you know....Prince....get it?....I'll show myself out) will either steal a starting spot or be the first off the bench. He's the type of athlete that the Runnin' Utes have not had much of for the last several years. He looks like a willing glue guy and has some ability to attack the rim although scoring won't be his focus. Also, can handle and provide a little help against a press. Nice utility man here. Kenneth Ogbe will also get some minutes. The upside is clear. His performance last night was a revelation and may not be repeated all season but there's too much potential to even think about a redshirt, especially for a foreign guy who reportedly already has had offers to get paid for play in Europe. Ogbe has a big grin out on the court a lot, just looks like a happy kid, makes the same gleeful face as my son when he's about to do something horrifying to his sister (my son's sister, not Kenneth's...I think). We haven't seen so many smiles on the court since "Mock Trial with J. Reinhold" went off the air.

If Ogbe is always happy, Ahmad Fields always has a look on his face like somebody deleted all of his episodes of Rizzoli and Isles off his DVR and he's pretty sure he knows who did it and that person is going to suffer. I think he is competing with Parker Van Dyke for the last spot in the rotation. (Van Dyke would play point and zone buster and server in Four Square, whereas Fields would play more as a big guard/wing and push Taylor and possibly Ogbe to the point when Wright is not in the game). Neither stood out much, though I like Fields' game as a guy who can play physical on defense and get into the lane on offense. Then again, I really liked Justin Seymour in a similar way at this time last year and he was buried on the bench by the time conference play arrived. Van Dyke looked a little overmatched but a lot of the word out of camp has had him playing well as a backup point guard, so I am willing to believe he just had a bad night. I've seen a lot of speculation about redshirting one or both of these two. I'm not sure I see it. I think the team may need Van Dyke's shooting at times and if Fields embraces a role as a tough perimeter defender there will be a place for him too.

Xan Ricketts may get an actual minute here and there due to lack of bodies at the "4" position. He'll try hard and bring a certain blondness to the court. Connor Van Brocklin is another shooter and a lefty which means he is not to be trusted (and I suppose that if he emerges then a redshirt could be put on one of the other wings) but I think the glass will only be broken in case of emergency. There was also a kid named Austin Easton/Eastman (I'm not sure which). I'm a major geek with the minutiae of this stuff and I'd never heard of him before last night and he's not even on the roster on the official site. In other words, I'm sure the Muss will enjoy it if he ever gets in a game, but probably not as much as the opposing team will enjoy it. (These guys are all walkons, by the way).

Kyle "Kuz" Kuzma was also there (let's not turn Kyle Kuz Kuzma into an acronym, thanks in advance). He stood next to Marko, who is listed at 6-11 and appeared no more than two inches shorter. Both are very skinny.

Overall, the team will be fun to watch. There is some depth, length and athleticism. There will be some highlight reel fastbreaks and dunks over the parade of cupcakes coming to the Hunty in the preseason. They should be entertaining. I think with Loveridge as the go-to guy and Taylor, Wright and Tucker as somewhat reliable scorers this team will generally hold its own on offense. I wasn't blown away with the defense on Wednesday night--too many guys were either out of position or just got beat. As I mentioned before, there's also a huge question mark in the post and any deficiencies with perimeter defense will only be magnified by the lack of a rim protector. Whether this team can rebound with the big boys of the PAC is also a question.

I think we should temper our enthusiasm, so I'm predicting Elite Eight (or Elight, as I now call it). I'm sorry, but I'm just not willing to believe this is a Final Four team until I see more from the centers.

SeattleUte
10-24-2013, 11:14 PM
Once upon a time, Utah fans would muddle through football season, fighting off attacks from trolls (and each other) and try not to lose control of their bowels long enough to last until hoops season. We'd spend summer and fall on utefans.net debating how soon we needed fire Mac and whether or not Martin Osimani would win the Naismith or merely be a pathetic All American. Then, Night With The Runnin' Utes would bring a solemn hush to the internets as we would all convene at the Altar of Hooplor and post very weighty discourses on the merits of Jeremy Killion's off hand, or Cameron Koford's tallness, or Jonas Langvad's muppet upbringing, or Tim the Manager's....oh, just Tim the Manager. We would sit around for a couple of weeks until the hard launch of basketball season and discuss these things in tones and terms usually reserved for hostage negotiations and fourth date DTRs. It was heavy stuff and it was the currency of internet Ute geeks for many years.

Well, it's still real to me, dammit! So here I am to honor that tradition. Behold, my first novel "I Like Utah Basketball" (and yes, I posted a version of this on utezone but reposted it here because this forum seems to go for sustained hoops discussion a little bit more than that one):

Jordan Loveridge is clearly "the guy" on this team. Utah will look to him to be the leading scorer and to get them out of a rut when things get difficult. Loveridge knows this and is looking more assertive. He was pretty aggressive for a freshman last year but it appears that he knows it's his team and there is little question about that. He did force a few shots, but that is part of his role, especially early on while the team sorts out who the other main scoring threats will be. The bigger issue is that he missed a handful of "make-able" shots near the basket. He will need to finish better, especially against the better PAC 12 teams. He is also all business, like the front of a mullet, and appears that he'd just as soon disembowel you than smile on the basketball court.

Delon Wright might well be the second option on offense. He is very smooth and has a good all around game. He's trying to embrace the point guard role and act as a distributor so he might not be as aggressive offensively as he could be right now. It could take him some time to get fully comfortable in that role and have the right feel for when to set others up and when to call his own number. I had the impression that he was capable of getting his own shot a lot more than he did last night. We'll see how that develops. Also, his brother is in the NBA and I expect him to mention that to the mean kids on opposing teams to try to win their favor, kind of like the way I used to mention to people that I am related to ColoUte (back when that was a thing) to win friends on the internet. Delon will hopefully get fewer hate re-tweets for that stunt than I did for mine.

I can't say enough about Dakarai Tucker. He was good late last season and appears a good notch better this year. He's both efficient and effective and doesn't need the ball in his hands to contribute. I'm excited about his career trajectory and think he'll mesh very well with the top dogs on this team. Ute fans, this holiday season make some room in your hearts for a little Dakarai (if you have a heart condition please consult a physician before rearranging your heart).

Brandon Taylor will continue to be a fun player to watch. He's very confident and will contribute at both guard spots this year. It will be nice to let him play off the ball more and find his scoring opportunities without worrying about being a distributor all of the time. He'll be a weapon and probably among Utah's top three scorers for the season. Still, he'll have patches where he struggles to do his thing due to the fact that he is roughly the size of an ewok or possibly a minion.

Renan Lenz did look a little bit more fleet of foot and comfortable than last season. He also played quite well at NWTRU a year ago, so I'm not getting too excited about him quite yet. Still, it looks like he rounds out the (initial) starting lineup (along with those listed above). I don't get why Renan is pronounced "Henna" and I think that might be the root of his struggles last year.

The center position seems likely to have some element of "center by committee" this year. Jeremy Olsen will either start at center or be the first big off the bench. He has touch and skill but has to prove he has the ability to protect the rim or be strong on the boards. They call him "JO", first rate nicknameification there. Utah needs its centers to be defenders and rebounders and that is where Dallin Bachynski could make his living if he gets his head on right and embraces the role without worrying about trying to be a scorer. From what I saw last night, I'm not sure we're going to see a different Bachynski than last season (after his hot start). He played hard but wasn't very impactful. If he'd adopt the same mentality as his brother he'd be a force and this team would be much better off. Also if he would just watch old tapes of Eric Leckner it would go a long way to show that he has a very limited and outdated video library. I have no idea if Marko Kovacevic is going to be able to contribute anything (aside from Eastern European techno pop--it's a terrible medium, but you'll get used to it), he's still out for several more weeks and I have not heard anything--good or bad--about his place on this team when he does return. Center is clearly a huge question on this team--they don't need to score a ton but I'm not sure Utah has the defense and rebounding it will need to hang in the PAC 12.

Princeton Onwas (or "Purple Rain" which is what we can call him because, you know....Prince....get it?....I'll show myself out) will either steal a starting spot or be the first off the bench. He's the type of athlete that the Runnin' Utes have not had much of for the last several years. He looks like a willing glue guy and has some ability to attack the rim although scoring won't be his focus. Also, can handle and provide a little help against a press. Nice utility man here. Kenneth Ogbe will also get some minutes. The upside is clear. His performance last night was a revelation and may not be repeated all season but there's too much potential to even think about a redshirt, especially for a foreign guy who reportedly already has had offers to get paid for play in Europe. Ogbe has a big grin out on the court a lot, just looks like a happy kid, makes the same gleeful face as my son when he's about to do something horrifying to his sister (my son's sister, not Kenneth's...I think). We haven't seen so many smiles on the court since "Mock Trial with J. Reinhold" went off the air.

If Ogbe is always happy, Ahmad Fields always has a look on his face like somebody deleted all of his episodes of Rizzoli and Isles off his DVR and he's pretty sure he knows who did it and that person is going to suffer. I think he is competing with Parker Van Dyke for the last spot in the rotation. (Van Dyke would play point and zone buster and server in Four Square, whereas Fields would play more as a big guard/wing and push Taylor and possibly Ogbe to the point when Wright is not in the game). Neither stood out much, though I like Fields' game as a guy who can play physical on defense and get into the lane on offense. Then again, I really liked Justin Seymour in a similar way at this time last year and he was buried on the bench by the time conference play arrived. Van Dyke looked a little overmatched but a lot of the word out of camp has had him playing well as a backup point guard, so I am willing to believe he just had a bad night. I've seen a lot of speculation about redshirting one or both of these two. I'm not sure I see it. I think the team may need Van Dyke's shooting at times and if Fields embraces a role as a tough perimeter defender there will be a place for him too.

Xan Ricketts may get an actual minute here and there due to lack of bodies at the "4" position. He'll try hard and bring a certain blondness to the court. Connor Van Brocklin is another shooter and a lefty which means he is not to be trusted (and I suppose that if he emerges then a redshirt could be put on one of the other wings) but I think the glass will only be broken in case of emergency. There was also a kid named Austin Easton/Eastman (I'm not sure which). I'm a major geek with the minutiae of this stuff and I'd never heard of him before last night and he's not even on the roster on the official site. In other words, I'm sure the Muss will enjoy it if he ever gets in a game, but probably not as much as the opposing team will enjoy it. (These guys are all walkons, by the way).

Kyle "Kuz" Kuzma was also there (let's not turn Kyle Kuz Kuzma into an acronym, thanks in advance). He stood next to Marko, who is listed at 6-11 and appeared no more than two inches shorter. Both are very skinny.

Overall, the team will be fun to watch. There is some depth, length and athleticism. There will be some highlight reel fastbreaks and dunks over the parade of cupcakes coming to the Hunty in the preseason. They should be entertaining. I think with Loveridge as the go-to guy and Taylor, Wright and Tucker as somewhat reliable scorers this team will generally hold its own on offense. I wasn't blown away with the defense on Wednesday night--too many guys were either out of position or just got beat. As I mentioned before, there's also a huge question mark in the post and any deficiencies with perimeter defense will only be magnified by the lack of a rim protector. Whether this team can rebound with the big boys of the PAC is also a question.

I think we should temper our enthusiasm, so I'm predicting Elite Eight (or Elight, as I now call it). I'm sorry, but I'm just not willing to believe this is a Final Four team until I see more from the centers.

It's nice to feel again that basketball can't come soon enough, and this really makes me feel that way. I'm of the view that with a great guard line you can accomplish pretty much anything in college basketball. Looks like we may have the makings of one.

UtahsMrSports
10-25-2013, 10:10 AM
Once upon a time, Utah fans would muddle through football season, fighting off attacks from trolls (and each other) and try not to lose control of their bowels long enough to last until hoops season. We'd spend summer and fall on utefans.net debating how soon we needed fire Mac and whether or not Martin Osimani would win the Naismith or merely be a pathetic All American. Then, Night With The Runnin' Utes would bring a solemn hush to the internets as we would all convene at the Altar of Hooplor and post very weighty discourses on the merits of Jeremy Killion's off hand, or Cameron Koford's tallness, or Jonas Langvad's muppet upbringing, or Tim the Manager's....oh, just Tim the Manager. We would sit around for a couple of weeks until the hard launch of basketball season and discuss these things in tones and terms usually reserved for hostage negotiations and fourth date DTRs. It was heavy stuff and it was the currency of internet Ute geeks for many years.

Well, it's still real to me, dammit! So here I am to honor that tradition. Behold, my first novel "I Like Utah Basketball" (and yes, I posted a version of this on utezone but reposted it here because this forum seems to go for sustained hoops discussion a little bit more than that one):

Jordan Loveridge is clearly "the guy" on this team. Utah will look to him to be the leading scorer and to get them out of a rut when things get difficult. Loveridge knows this and is looking more assertive. He was pretty aggressive for a freshman last year but it appears that he knows it's his team and there is little question about that. He did force a few shots, but that is part of his role, especially early on while the team sorts out who the other main scoring threats will be. The bigger issue is that he missed a handful of "make-able" shots near the basket. He will need to finish better, especially against the better PAC 12 teams. He is also all business, like the front of a mullet, and appears that he'd just as soon disembowel you than smile on the basketball court.

Delon Wright might well be the second option on offense. He is very smooth and has a good all around game. He's trying to embrace the point guard role and act as a distributor so he might not be as aggressive offensively as he could be right now. It could take him some time to get fully comfortable in that role and have the right feel for when to set others up and when to call his own number. I had the impression that he was capable of getting his own shot a lot more than he did last night. We'll see how that develops. Also, his brother is in the NBA and I expect him to mention that to the mean kids on opposing teams to try to win their favor, kind of like the way I used to mention to people that I am related to ColoUte (back when that was a thing) to win friends on the internet. Delon will hopefully get fewer hate re-tweets for that stunt than I did for mine.

I can't say enough about Dakarai Tucker. He was good late last season and appears a good notch better this year. He's both efficient and effective and doesn't need the ball in his hands to contribute. I'm excited about his career trajectory and think he'll mesh very well with the top dogs on this team. Ute fans, this holiday season make some room in your hearts for a little Dakarai (if you have a heart condition please consult a physician before rearranging your heart).

Brandon Taylor will continue to be a fun player to watch. He's very confident and will contribute at both guard spots this year. It will be nice to let him play off the ball more and find his scoring opportunities without worrying about being a distributor all of the time. He'll be a weapon and probably among Utah's top three scorers for the season. Still, he'll have patches where he struggles to do his thing due to the fact that he is roughly the size of an ewok or possibly a minion.

Renan Lenz did look a little bit more fleet of foot and comfortable than last season. He also played quite well at NWTRU a year ago, so I'm not getting too excited about him quite yet. Still, it looks like he rounds out the (initial) starting lineup (along with those listed above). I don't get why Renan is pronounced "Henna" and I think that might be the root of his struggles last year.

The center position seems likely to have some element of "center by committee" this year. Jeremy Olsen will either start at center or be the first big off the bench. He has touch and skill but has to prove he has the ability to protect the rim or be strong on the boards. They call him "JO", first rate nicknameification there. Utah needs its centers to be defenders and rebounders and that is where Dallin Bachynski could make his living if he gets his head on right and embraces the role without worrying about trying to be a scorer. From what I saw last night, I'm not sure we're going to see a different Bachynski than last season (after his hot start). He played hard but wasn't very impactful. If he'd adopt the same mentality as his brother he'd be a force and this team would be much better off. Also if he would just watch old tapes of Eric Leckner it would go a long way to show that he has a very limited and outdated video library. I have no idea if Marko Kovacevic is going to be able to contribute anything (aside from Eastern European techno pop--it's a terrible medium, but you'll get used to it), he's still out for several more weeks and I have not heard anything--good or bad--about his place on this team when he does return. Center is clearly a huge question on this team--they don't need to score a ton but I'm not sure Utah has the defense and rebounding it will need to hang in the PAC 12.

Princeton Onwas (or "Purple Rain" which is what we can call him because, you know....Prince....get it?....I'll show myself out) will either steal a starting spot or be the first off the bench. He's the type of athlete that the Runnin' Utes have not had much of for the last several years. He looks like a willing glue guy and has some ability to attack the rim although scoring won't be his focus. Also, can handle and provide a little help against a press. Nice utility man here. Kenneth Ogbe will also get some minutes. The upside is clear. His performance last night was a revelation and may not be repeated all season but there's too much potential to even think about a redshirt, especially for a foreign guy who reportedly already has had offers to get paid for play in Europe. Ogbe has a big grin out on the court a lot, just looks like a happy kid, makes the same gleeful face as my son when he's about to do something horrifying to his sister (my son's sister, not Kenneth's...I think). We haven't seen so many smiles on the court since "Mock Trial with J. Reinhold" went off the air.

If Ogbe is always happy, Ahmad Fields always has a look on his face like somebody deleted all of his episodes of Rizzoli and Isles off his DVR and he's pretty sure he knows who did it and that person is going to suffer. I think he is competing with Parker Van Dyke for the last spot in the rotation. (Van Dyke would play point and zone buster and server in Four Square, whereas Fields would play more as a big guard/wing and push Taylor and possibly Ogbe to the point when Wright is not in the game). Neither stood out much, though I like Fields' game as a guy who can play physical on defense and get into the lane on offense. Then again, I really liked Justin Seymour in a similar way at this time last year and he was buried on the bench by the time conference play arrived. Van Dyke looked a little overmatched but a lot of the word out of camp has had him playing well as a backup point guard, so I am willing to believe he just had a bad night. I've seen a lot of speculation about redshirting one or both of these two. I'm not sure I see it. I think the team may need Van Dyke's shooting at times and if Fields embraces a role as a tough perimeter defender there will be a place for him too.

Xan Ricketts may get an actual minute here and there due to lack of bodies at the "4" position. He'll try hard and bring a certain blondness to the court. Connor Van Brocklin is another shooter and a lefty which means he is not to be trusted (and I suppose that if he emerges then a redshirt could be put on one of the other wings) but I think the glass will only be broken in case of emergency. There was also a kid named Austin Easton/Eastman (I'm not sure which). I'm a major geek with the minutiae of this stuff and I'd never heard of him before last night and he's not even on the roster on the official site. In other words, I'm sure the Muss will enjoy it if he ever gets in a game, but probably not as much as the opposing team will enjoy it. (These guys are all walkons, by the way).

Kyle "Kuz" Kuzma was also there (let's not turn Kyle Kuz Kuzma into an acronym, thanks in advance). He stood next to Marko, who is listed at 6-11 and appeared no more than two inches shorter. Both are very skinny.

Overall, the team will be fun to watch. There is some depth, length and athleticism. There will be some highlight reel fastbreaks and dunks over the parade of cupcakes coming to the Hunty in the preseason. They should be entertaining. I think with Loveridge as the go-to guy and Taylor, Wright and Tucker as somewhat reliable scorers this team will generally hold its own on offense. I wasn't blown away with the defense on Wednesday night--too many guys were either out of position or just got beat. As I mentioned before, there's also a huge question mark in the post and any deficiencies with perimeter defense will only be magnified by the lack of a rim protector. Whether this team can rebound with the big boys of the PAC is also a question.

I think we should temper our enthusiasm, so I'm predicting Elite Eight (or Elight, as I now call it). I'm sorry, but I'm just not willing to believe this is a Final Four team until I see more from the centers.

Great work, though I disagree on Dallin B. He is hands down our best on ball defender in the low block. His help defense is coming along as well. His positioning when his guy had the ball was almost perfect. Also, I noticed a hesitancy to drive when he was in there. Just my opinion.

LA Ute
10-25-2013, 10:15 AM
All these comments remind me how hard it is to watch someone practice and be able to tell if he's good. Onwas and Ogbe were invisible in the Ute practice I watched, but appear to have a lot more to contribute than I saw. I'm thinking that my one year on the 9th grade all-stars and my many years of ward ball have not prepared me to judge talent. I still love basketball more than any other sport.

concerned
10-25-2013, 10:19 AM
All these comments remind me how hard it is to watch someone practice and be able to tell if he's good. Onwas and Ogbe were invisible in the Ute practice I watched, but appear to have a lot more to contribute than I saw. I'm thinking that my one year on the 9th grade all-stars and my many years of ward ball have not prepared me to judge talent. I still love basketball more than any other sport.

What? My brother made the HH bb team and you didn't at 6' 3". what's your problem?

LA Ute
10-25-2013, 10:34 AM
What? My brother made the HH bb team and you didn't at 6' 3". what's your problem?

It was a combination of Sergeant Clark not liking me and my shortage of fast-twitch muscle fibers.

Two Utes
10-25-2013, 10:56 AM
What? My brother made the HH bb team and you didn't at 6' 3". what's your problem?

And that was back in the day when basketball was the undisputed king of this town. The gyms would be packed and be rocking. They even played games at 3 or 4 in the afternoon.

Man how things have changed.

Rocker Ute
10-25-2013, 11:16 AM
Renan Lenz ... I don't get why Renan is pronounced "Henna" and I think that might be the root of his struggles last year.



Hate to hijack a fine basketball thread, but this comment reminded me of something. At the U my friend had some sort of business math course (read: dumbed down math) and KEN the course instructor was from China and struggled a bit with English. I had met Ken a few times through my friend, and bumped into him from time to time, greeting him by his name, and he by mine. I mention this for context of the story and also to note the closest time I ever came to a good mentoring relationship in my undergraduate studies at the U.

So the story goes, that my friend and some of his classmates sit down before the final of that class to study together. They pull out the syllabus and one of them takes further note of the heading on the syllabus:


KEN_____________ Business Math________________ Xia (His name, I'm making this up)
105_____________ for Idiots 3000______________ Wei To Lo

Apparently the class was held in Kendall Hall room 105, abbr. KEN 105. A student in the class assumed from careless reading of the syllabus that was his name, Ken, and so called him that during the class and then everybody else did and he never corrected it.

I'm sure this guy was thinking, "Why do all of these Americans call me Ken?"

In short, I'm sure we're mispronouncing his name, and that is probably exactly what his problem was last year. Kind of like your name, I've always thought was pronounced You-Blender, but realize now it in probably pronounced UHB-lender, which explains your performance issues too.

UtahsMrSports
10-25-2013, 11:53 AM
What? My brother made the HH bb team and you didn't at 6' 3". what's your problem?

Oh man, what does that say about me (6'7" in shoes) who never made the team?

UtahsMrSports
10-25-2013, 11:55 AM
hate to hijack a fine basketball thread, but this comment reminded me of something. At the u my friend had some sort of business math course (read: Dumbed down math) and ken the course instructor was from china and struggled a bit with english. I had met ken a few times through my friend, and bumped into him from time to time, greeting him by his name, and he by mine. I mention this for context of the story and also to note the closest time i ever came to a good mentoring relationship in my undergraduate studies at the u.

So the story goes, that my friend and some of his classmates sit down before the final of that class to study together. They pull out the syllabus and one of them takes further note of the heading on the syllabus:


ken_____________ business math________________ xia (his name, i'm making this up)
105_____________ for idiots 3000______________ wei to lo

apparently the class was held in kendall hall room 105, abbr. Ken 105. A student in the class assumed from careless reading of the syllabus that was his name, ken, and so called him that during the class and then everybody else did and he never corrected it.

I'm sure this guy was thinking, "why do all of these american's call me ken?"

in short, i'm sure we're mispronouncing his name, and that is probably exactly what his problem was last year. Kind of like your name, i've always thought was pronounced you-blender, but realize now it in probably pronounced uhb-lender, which explains your performance issues too.

lol!

Senioritis
10-25-2013, 04:28 PM
Once upon a time, Utah fans would muddle through football season, fighting off attacks from trolls (and each other) and try not to lose control of their bowels long enough to last until hoops season. We'd spend summer and fall on utefans.net debating how soon we needed fire Mac and whether or not Martin Osimani would win the Naismith or merely be a pathetic All American. Then, Night With The Runnin' Utes would bring a solemn hush to the internets as we would all convene at the Altar of Hooplor and post very weighty discourses on the merits of Jeremy Killion's off hand, or Cameron Koford's tallness, or Jonas Langvad's muppet upbringing, or Tim the Manager's....oh, just Tim the Manager. We would sit around for a couple of weeks until the hard launch of basketball season and discuss these things in tones and terms usually reserved for hostage negotiations and fourth date DTRs. It was heavy stuff and it was the currency of internet Ute geeks for many years.

Well, it's still real to me, dammit! So here I am to honor that tradition. Behold, my first novel "I Like Utah Basketball" (and yes, I posted a version of this on utezone but reposted it here because this forum seems to go for sustained hoops discussion a little bit more than that one):

Jordan Loveridge is clearly "the guy" on this team. Utah will look to him to be the leading scorer and to get them out of a rut when things get difficult. Loveridge knows this and is looking more assertive. He was pretty aggressive for a freshman last year but it appears that he knows it's his team and there is little question about that. He did force a few shots, but that is part of his role, especially early on while the team sorts out who the other main scoring threats will be. The bigger issue is that he missed a handful of "make-able" shots near the basket. He will need to finish better, especially against the better PAC 12 teams. He is also all business, like the front of a mullet, and appears that he'd just as soon disembowel you than smile on the basketball court.

Delon Wright might well be the second option on offense. He is very smooth and has a good all around game. He's trying to embrace the point guard role and act as a distributor so he might not be as aggressive offensively as he could be right now. It could take him some time to get fully comfortable in that role and have the right feel for when to set others up and when to call his own number. I had the impression that he was capable of getting his own shot a lot more than he did last night. We'll see how that develops. Also, his brother is in the NBA and I expect him to mention that to the mean kids on opposing teams to try to win their favor, kind of like the way I used to mention to people that I am related to ColoUte (back when that was a thing) to win friends on the internet. Delon will hopefully get fewer hate re-tweets for that stunt than I did for mine.

I can't say enough about Dakarai Tucker. He was good late last season and appears a good notch better this year. He's both efficient and effective and doesn't need the ball in his hands to contribute. I'm excited about his career trajectory and think he'll mesh very well with the top dogs on this team. Ute fans, this holiday season make some room in your hearts for a little Dakarai (if you have a heart condition please consult a physician before rearranging your heart).

Brandon Taylor will continue to be a fun player to watch. He's very confident and will contribute at both guard spots this year. It will be nice to let him play off the ball more and find his scoring opportunities without worrying about being a distributor all of the time. He'll be a weapon and probably among Utah's top three scorers for the season. Still, he'll have patches where he struggles to do his thing due to the fact that he is roughly the size of an ewok or possibly a minion.

Renan Lenz did look a little bit more fleet of foot and comfortable than last season. He also played quite well at NWTRU a year ago, so I'm not getting too excited about him quite yet. Still, it looks like he rounds out the (initial) starting lineup (along with those listed above). I don't get why Renan is pronounced "Henna" and I think that might be the root of his struggles last year.

The center position seems likely to have some element of "center by committee" this year. Jeremy Olsen will either start at center or be the first big off the bench. He has touch and skill but has to prove he has the ability to protect the rim or be strong on the boards. They call him "JO", first rate nicknameification there. Utah needs its centers to be defenders and rebounders and that is where Dallin Bachynski could make his living if he gets his head on right and embraces the role without worrying about trying to be a scorer. From what I saw last night, I'm not sure we're going to see a different Bachynski than last season (after his hot start). He played hard but wasn't very impactful. If he'd adopt the same mentality as his brother he'd be a force and this team would be much better off. Also if he would just watch old tapes of Eric Leckner it would go a long way to show that he has a very limited and outdated video library. I have no idea if Marko Kovacevic is going to be able to contribute anything (aside from Eastern European techno pop--it's a terrible medium, but you'll get used to it), he's still out for several more weeks and I have not heard anything--good or bad--about his place on this team when he does return. Center is clearly a huge question on this team--they don't need to score a ton but I'm not sure Utah has the defense and rebounding it will need to hang in the PAC 12.

Princeton Onwas (or "Purple Rain" which is what we can call him because, you know....Prince....get it?....I'll show myself out) will either steal a starting spot or be the first off the bench. He's the type of athlete that the Runnin' Utes have not had much of for the last several years. He looks like a willing glue guy and has some ability to attack the rim although scoring won't be his focus. Also, can handle and provide a little help against a press. Nice utility man here. Kenneth Ogbe will also get some minutes. The upside is clear. His performance last night was a revelation and may not be repeated all season but there's too much potential to even think about a redshirt, especially for a foreign guy who reportedly already has had offers to get paid for play in Europe. Ogbe has a big grin out on the court a lot, just looks like a happy kid, makes the same gleeful face as my son when he's about to do something horrifying to his sister (my son's sister, not Kenneth's...I think). We haven't seen so many smiles on the court since "Mock Trial with J. Reinhold" went off the air.

If Ogbe is always happy, Ahmad Fields always has a look on his face like somebody deleted all of his episodes of Rizzoli and Isles off his DVR and he's pretty sure he knows who did it and that person is going to suffer. I think he is competing with Parker Van Dyke for the last spot in the rotation. (Van Dyke would play point and zone buster and server in Four Square, whereas Fields would play more as a big guard/wing and push Taylor and possibly Ogbe to the point when Wright is not in the game). Neither stood out much, though I like Fields' game as a guy who can play physical on defense and get into the lane on offense. Then again, I really liked Justin Seymour in a similar way at this time last year and he was buried on the bench by the time conference play arrived. Van Dyke looked a little overmatched but a lot of the word out of camp has had him playing well as a backup point guard, so I am willing to believe he just had a bad night. I've seen a lot of speculation about redshirting one or both of these two. I'm not sure I see it. I think the team may need Van Dyke's shooting at times and if Fields embraces a role as a tough perimeter defender there will be a place for him too.

Xan Ricketts may get an actual minute here and there due to lack of bodies at the "4" position. He'll try hard and bring a certain blondness to the court. Connor Van Brocklin is another shooter and a lefty which means he is not to be trusted (and I suppose that if he emerges then a redshirt could be put on one of the other wings) but I think the glass will only be broken in case of emergency. There was also a kid named Austin Easton/Eastman (I'm not sure which). I'm a major geek with the minutiae of this stuff and I'd never heard of him before last night and he's not even on the roster on the official site. In other words, I'm sure the Muss will enjoy it if he ever gets in a game, but probably not as much as the opposing team will enjoy it. (These guys are all walkons, by the way).

Kyle "Kuz" Kuzma was also there (let's not turn Kyle Kuz Kuzma into an acronym, thanks in advance). He stood next to Marko, who is listed at 6-11 and appeared no more than two inches shorter. Both are very skinny.

Overall, the team will be fun to watch. There is some depth, length and athleticism. There will be some highlight reel fastbreaks and dunks over the parade of cupcakes coming to the Hunty in the preseason. They should be entertaining. I think with Loveridge as the go-to guy and Taylor, Wright and Tucker as somewhat reliable scorers this team will generally hold its own on offense. I wasn't blown away with the defense on Wednesday night--too many guys were either out of position or just got beat. As I mentioned before, there's also a huge question mark in the post and any deficiencies with perimeter defense will only be magnified by the lack of a rim protector. Whether this team can rebound with the big boys of the PAC is also a question.

I think we should temper our enthusiasm, so I'm predicting Elite Eight (or Elight, as I now call it). I'm sorry, but I'm just not willing to believe this is a Final Four team until I see more from the centers.

Holy cow. This was absolutely beautiful. Just total poetry.

And FYI, Bachynski's name is now Thyroid.

Scratch
10-25-2013, 04:39 PM
Holy cow. This was absolutely beautiful. Just total poetry.

And FYI, Bachynski's name is now Thyroid.

My only complaint was that he didn't use the phrase "rim protector" until about 90% of the way through the post, and that he only used it once. "Rim protector" is 2013's answer to 2002's "length" and "upside."

Ute_In_Texas
10-26-2013, 05:38 PM
Thanks UBlender. Good stuff. One quick follow-up question.

Difficult playing time decisions are often decided by free throw shooting ability. Do any players on the current team stand out as exceptionally good or exceptionally bad free throw shooters?

SoCalPat
10-28-2013, 04:45 PM
We hammered a pretty decent team from another reputable conference in our closed scrimmage. Our big guns did what they needed to, but we're still compromised in the paint. The team we went up against is a well-coached team that for two years running has been in line with what we want to accomplish this season. If Utah hoops stock existed, I'd buy all I could. We're going to surprise some people.

justaute
10-28-2013, 05:13 PM
Thanks for the update, SCP. Any additional insights as to how our 4/5 positions fared?

sancho
10-28-2013, 05:17 PM
We hammered a pretty decent team from another reputable conference in our closed scrimmage. Our big guns did what they needed to, but we're still compromised in the paint. The team we went up against is a well-coached team that for two years running has been in line with what we want to accomplish this season. If Utah hoops stock existed, I'd buy all I could. We're going to surprise some people.

Wait, is this a secret or something? We did these with Colorado the past few years, right?

SoCalPat
10-28-2013, 05:18 PM
Thanks for the update, SCP. Any additional insights as to how our 4/5 positions fared?

From what little I gathered and from what I know about the opposing player in question, their all-conference 4-5 pretty much did as expected inside. Have no idea how our guys fared offensively.

SoCalPat
10-28-2013, 05:19 PM
Wait, is this a secret or something? We did these with Colorado the past few years, right?

Not since we joined the Pac-12, although I think we had Colorado in Boylen's final season.

Under Larry, I believe we've had closed scrimmages vs. Montana State both years. We made a noticeable upgrade for this year's closed scrimmage.

UtahsMrSports
10-28-2013, 05:22 PM
Wait, is this a secret or something? We did these with Colorado the past few years, right?

Last year, we had Montana State in and we lost by 17.

I can release the name of the opponent (Wyoming) as it was tweeted out publicly by Jeff Goodman of ESPN. I'm sworn to secrecy beyond that.

LA Ute
10-28-2013, 05:36 PM
Didn't we have one with Arizona recently? I thought it was during the Larry era.

SoCalPat
10-28-2013, 05:41 PM
Didn't we have one with Arizona recently? I thought it was during the Larry era.

We might have done one with ASU or Zona under Jimmy. Definitely not under Larry.

Applejack
10-28-2013, 08:43 PM
Can we get back to Bachynski's nickname for a moment? Of Senioritis' entries, I very much prefer Batshitinski to Thyroid. I'd like to throw another into the mix: "Dallin H. Bachynski." It acknowledges the fact that only mormons (1) are named Dallin and (2) prominently use the middle initial as well as noting that Dallin has a better chance of being in the quorum of the 12 than the NBA.

LA Ute
10-28-2013, 08:46 PM
We might have done one with ASU or Zona under Jimmy. Definitely not under Larry.

I think it was Zona under Jim.

Rocker Ute
10-28-2013, 09:24 PM
Can we get back to Bachynski's nickname for a moment? Of Senioritis' entries, I very much prefer Batshitinski to Thyroid. I'd like to throw another into the mix: "Dallin H. Bachynski." It acknowledges the fact that only mormons (1) are named Dallin and (2) prominently use the middle initial as well as noting that Dallin has a better chance of being in the quorum of the 12 than the NBA.

Dallin H O'shihnski (hard H, guttural stop)

While I enjoy that, I am looking for more endearing than mocking. Keep working, we are getting there.

SoCalPat
10-28-2013, 10:31 PM
Dallin H O'shihnski (hard H, guttural stop)

While I enjoy that, I am looking for more endearing than mocking. Keep working, we are getting there.

The pretentious use of middle initials in one's name deserves to be mocked. How that became a Mormon thing, I have no idea. But I'm not gonna lie ... if doing so meant I could get my book on the shelves at Deseret Book, I'd have done it in a heartbeat.

LA Ute
10-28-2013, 10:37 PM
The pretentious use of middle initials in one's name deserves to be mocked. How that became a Mormon thing, I have no idea. But I'm not gonna lie ... if doing so meant I could get my book on the shelves at Deseret Book, I'd have done it in a heartbeat.

Cal is not your middle name??

LA Ute
10-28-2013, 10:40 PM
Dallin H O'shihnski (hard H, guttural stop)

While I enjoy that, I am looking for more endearing than mocking. Keep working, we are getting there.

Big Bach?
Frankendallin?
Bachinstein?
Moosinski?

SoCalPat
10-28-2013, 10:45 PM
Big Bach?
Frankendallin?
Bachinstein?
Moosinski?

Batshitski would be fine if we weren't in Utah. Poles are pretty good sports with regard to others' insistence that their last names are a vowel or two short. But if you can't get your SID to embrace it, that makes it DOA past this board.

U-Ute
10-30-2013, 10:33 AM
Last year, we had Montana State in and we lost by 17.

I can release the name of the opponent (Wyoming) as it was tweeted out publicly by Jeff Goodman of ESPN. I'm sworn to secrecy beyond that.

Wyoming went 4-12 in conference last year.

I'm not sure what we can take away from this...

U-Ute
10-30-2013, 10:37 AM
Dallin Bachituation.

Dude looks like an Abercrombie & Fitch model. Plays like one too.

EDIT: Ok. I added that picture then though it may be too much for some people's sensibilities. I have no idea how to remove it now... LOL

Mano
10-30-2013, 10:39 AM
Wyoming went 4-12 in conference last year.

I'm not sure what we can take away from this...

But they were in the #1 RPI conference. :rolleyes:

UtahsMrSports
10-30-2013, 03:09 PM
Wyoming went 4-12 in conference last year.

I'm not sure what we can take away from this...


I wont claim to know all the ins and outs of wyoming, but I do know that they went like 12-0 or 13-0 including a win over colorado to start last year and then lost their leading scorer after that and were pretty bad.

Scratch
10-30-2013, 03:26 PM
I wont claim to know all the ins and outs of wyoming, but I do know that they went like 12-0 or 13-0 including a win over colorado to start last year and then lost their leading scorer after that and were pretty bad.

This is correct. Luke Martinez got kicked off the team about 12 games in because he got in a bar fight where he supposedly repeatedly kicked a guy who was laying on the ground in the face. Martinez was a senior, so unfortunately we apparently beat the remnants of a team that went like 8-14 after Martinez was shown the door. Their send-best player, Leonard Washington, graduated and is also gone. Other than Martinez and Washington, they have 3 of their best 4 guys back from that team (those 6 played a huge percentage of the team's minutes last year). One of the guys who is back is Larry Nance Jr., who is a pretty skilled 6'8" forward.

sancho
10-30-2013, 06:17 PM
so unfortunately we apparently beat the remnants of a team that went like 8-14 after Martinez was shown the door.

Well, it beats losing to a the remnants of an 8-14 team. I'm at least taking it to mean we can handle Evergreen State next week.

Any idea if the exhibition game on Friday will be streamed on the Utah athletics website like it was last year? It was just the jumbotron feed, I think.

UBlender
10-30-2013, 08:18 PM
Any idea if the exhibition game on Friday will be streamed on the Utah athletics website like it was last year? It was just the jumbotron feed, I think.

Someone on another forum said that the PAC 12 site will have the jumbotron feed streaming. It's not great, but it's something.

SeattleUte
10-30-2013, 10:32 PM
I read in the Tribune that coach has been trying a combination of Taylor (g), Wright (g), Tucker (f), Onwas (f) and Loveridge (c). Does that mean he regards these his five best players?

LA Ute
10-30-2013, 11:33 PM
I read in the Tribune that coach has been trying a combination of Taylor (g), Wright (g), Tucker (f), Onwas (f) and Loveridge (c). Does that mean he regards these his five best players?

Loveridge at the 5?

sancho
10-31-2013, 07:07 AM
Loveridge at the 5?


Small ball. Sounds like fun. Swap Ogbe for Taylor, and we can have an all 6'5" through 6'7" lineup.

UBlender
10-31-2013, 08:04 AM
I read in the Tribune that coach has been trying a combination of Taylor (g), Wright (g), Tucker (f), Onwas (f) and Loveridge (c). Does that mean he regards these his five best players?

I read that. My impression was that it was experimental, like in case of emergency. However, I guess another interpretation is that our bigs aren't cutting it and Larry is either seriously looking at alternatives or is sending them a message.

UtahsMrSports
10-31-2013, 08:45 AM
I read in the Tribune that coach has been trying a combination of Taylor (g), Wright (g), Tucker (f), Onwas (f) and Loveridge (c). Does that mean he regards these his five best players?

lol, i actually think this would work pretty well against some of these podunk teams we are playing.

SeattleUte
10-31-2013, 10:41 AM
I read that. My impression was that it was experimental, like in case of emergency. However, I guess another interpretation is that our bigs aren't cutting it and Larry is either seriously looking at alternatives or is sending them a message.

The old Louisville and UNLV teams would play a lot of lineups with all guards and wings, but those guys were super talented uber athletes.

SoCalPat
10-31-2013, 01:18 PM
I read in the Tribune that coach has been trying a combination of Taylor (g), Wright (g), Tucker (f), Onwas (f) and Loveridge (c). Does that mean he regards these his five best players?

With Marko out and Olsen and Batshitski's propensity for the nickle-and-dime foul, it's probably a lineup we might see out of necessity more than anything this year.

sancho
10-31-2013, 02:23 PM
Starters tomorrow are Taylor, Wright, Tucker, Loveridge, Lenz.

So how many players see regular playing time this season? Do we have an 8 man rotation with Onwas, Olson, and Bach off the bench? Ogbe and Van Dyke for a 10 man rotation?

LA Ute
10-31-2013, 03:16 PM
Starters tomorrow are Taylor, Wright, Tucker, Loveridge, Lenz.

So how many players see regular playing time this season? Do we have an 8 man rotation with Onwas, Olson, and Bach off the bench? Ogbe and Van Dyke for a 10 man rotation?

I like that lineup better than any other I have seen for a long time.

UtahsMrSports
10-31-2013, 03:24 PM
Starters tomorrow are Taylor, Wright, Tucker, Loveridge, Lenz.

So how many players see regular playing time this season? Do we have an 8 man rotation with Onwas, Olson, and Bach off the bench? Ogbe and Van Dyke for a 10 man rotation?

I think the top 7 are without a doubt those starting 5 + Onwas and Olsen. I tend to think that Ogbe is guy #8, but I think Bach and Van Dyke will be 9 and 10. I think Fields will be a good player down the road.

Rocker Ute
10-31-2013, 03:31 PM
Dear Dr Chris Hill,

You may remember me from other tersely written letters such as, "Why give us Twizzlers when Red Vines will do?" and "The Merits of Peeing in a Trough". You may also recall some letters written by my father from a while back including the masterpiece, "10 Things About Coaching Basketball I Wish Majerus Would Learn" with the follow up, "2000 Things About Coaching Basketball I Wish Giacoletti Would Learn aka Why Did You Run Majerus?"

With that jog down memory lane, I'd like to inform you of a serious injustice that has been done in the Special Events Center (and I'll be damned if I ever call it the Jon M Huntsman Center, and I'll be damned if I ever acknowledge that chicken you parade around). I have noticed over the course of the last few years the banners noting our illustrious post-seasons of the past for Men's and Women's Basketball along with Gymnastics. While I enjoyed for a time the mock retired jerseys that also hung in the rafters that looked like they were drawn with magic marker, I have since come to accept the new retired numbers. It is a nice touch to have them curl up on the edges.

And I've seen many improvements I even agree with. I appreciate that all the lights in the cloud work, and I haven't seen a piece of it fall of and maim a cheerleader in over 5 years. I enjoyed watching a miniature Majerus sweater being raised to the rafters. However there has been a major oversight, and I believe that it has to do with your hard feelings towards the finest microphone yeller in Utah Athletics history: namely Jim Boylen.

In his first year as a coach here he lead the Runnin' Utes all the way to the Elite-8 in the inaugural year of the CBI tournament. You may recall that this grand tournament included the likes of UTEP, Valparaiso and Houston - which may or may not have included some sort of LDSSA version of Phi Slamma Jamma, which I believe was called Sigma Three Man Weava. Utah deftly made it way through a deep field of quality teams eventually upsetting UTEP and losing a heartbreaker to eventual CBI champion Tulsa. As far as moral victories go, that lost to Tulsa made us virtually the second place team of the tournament, and by virtue of that the 98th best moral victory team in the nation. No small feat.

This was the same team that (and no I am not making this up) midway through the season my brother noting Jason Washburn clapping loudly and jumping around at the end of the bench in street clothes turned to me and with tears welling in his eyes very sincerely said, "You know, I think it is really cool that Boylen lets special needs kids sit at the end of the bench during games and feel like they are part of the team." A story I haven't let him live down to this day.

So I call on you to do the right thing. Raise a banner high and proud commemorating the Elite-8 Run in the 2008 College Basketball Invitation Tournament - Where you bring the ball and they bring the orange slices - and give it the honor and respect it deserves.

Love in the gospel.

Rocker Ute and Family

Scratch
10-31-2013, 03:41 PM
Love in the gospel.

Rocker Ute and Family

(Thankfully) I don't know your family, but I'm confident that they do not want to be affiliated with that letter.

Rocker Ute
10-31-2013, 04:09 PM
(Thankfully) I don't know your family, but I'm confident that they do not want to be affiliated with that letter.

Actually we all wrote it together for FHE along with our bomb shelter manifesto. Am I the only person who uses his real name on this board?

UtahsMrSports
11-01-2013, 09:28 AM
dear dr chris hill,

you may remember me from other tersely written letters such as, "why give us twizzlers when red vines will do?" and "the merits of peeing in a trough". You may also recall some letters written by my father from a while back including the masterpiece, "10 things about coaching basketball i wish majerus would learn" with the follow up, "2000 things about coaching basketball i wish giacoletti would learn aka why did you run majerus?"

with that jog down memory lane, i'd like to inform you of a serious injustice that has been done in the special events center (and i'll be damned if i ever call it the jon m huntsman center, and i'll be damned if i ever acknowledge that chicken you parade around). I have noticed over the course of the last few years the banners noting our illustrious post-seasons of the past for men's and women's basketball along with gymnastics. While i enjoyed for a time the mock retired jerseys that also hung in the rafters that looked like they were drawn with magic marker, i have since come to accept the new retired numbers. It is a nice touch to have them curl up on the edges.

And i've seen many improvements i even agree with. I appreciate that all the lights in the cloud work, and i haven't seen a piece of it fall of and maim a cheerleader in over 5 years. I enjoyed watching a miniature majerus sweater being raised to the rafters. However there has been a major oversight, and i believe that it has to do with your hard feelings towards the finest microphone yeller in utah athletics history: Namely jim boylen.

In his first year as a coach here he lead the runnin' utes all the way to the elite-8 in the inaugural year of the cbi tournament. You may recall that this grand tournament included the likes of utep, valparaiso and houston - which may or may not have included some sort of ldssa version of phi slamma jamma, which i believe was called sigma three man weava. Utah deftly made it way through a deep field of quality teams eventually upsetting utep and losing a heartbreaker to eventual cbi champion tulsa. As far as moral victories go, that lost to tulsa made us virtually the second place team of the tournament, and by virtue of that the 98th best moral victory team in the nation. No small feat.

This was the same team that (and no i am not making this up) midway through the season my brother noting jason washburn clapping loudly and jumping around at the end of the bench in street clothes turned to me and with tears welling in his eyes very sincerely said, "you know, i think it is really cool that boylen lets special needs kids sit at the end of the bench during games and feel like they are part of the team." a story i haven't let him live down to this day.

So i call on you to do the right thing. Raise a banner high and proud commemorating the elite-8 run in the 2008 college basketball invitation tournament - where you bring the ball and they bring the orange slices - and give it the honor and respect it deserves.

Love in the gospel.

Rocker ute and family

lol!

311ute
11-01-2013, 11:28 AM
Hey guys, first post. I just discovered this board... it's good to know there are other places besides utefans (which is now a ghost town) to talk Utes. I'm loving the Runnin' Ute talk here.

With the season kicking off tonight (unofficially) I've been seeing a lot of predictions/expectations as far as wins/losses go. I think I'm in a similar boat as most.... my goals/expectations are 20-wins, NIT bid.

The question I had is how many regular season wins will it take to get us into the NCAA Tourney? Or at least "on the bubble"? Obviously it all depends on SOS, RPI, etc.

With our weak non-conf schedule, I'm guessing there's no way we get near the SOS of 55 we had last year http://espn.go.com/mens-college-basketball/rpi/_/year/2013/groupId/21. If we had won 20 games last year, we would've had a decent chance at getting an at-large bid with that SOS.

But looking at conference teams from last year, I think we might have a similar year as ASU had. With a bad non-conf schedule, they finished with a SOS of 114. I'm guessing that will be the range of ours when it's all said and done this year.

Heading into the Pac-12 Tourney ASU was 20-11, and 9-9 in league play. That's right about where I see us (hopefully) being this year. ASU went on to go 1-1 in the conf tourney (beat Stanford, lost to UCLA), and earned a home NIT game (they beat Detroit before losing at Baylor).

Oregon, who's SOS was 125, was 23-8 (12-6 in conf) heading into the Pac-12 Tourney. As we all know they went on to win the thing, got screwed with a 12 seed, but still managed to get to the sweet sixteen.


So, to get back to my initial question.... how many wins will we need to be at least a "bubble team" this year? Counting the Pac-12 Tourney, I'm willing to say that if we win 22 games we'll be squarely on the bubble. Say, for example, we go 11-1 non-conf, 10-8 in league play, then we win 1 game in Vegas. That'll leave us at 22-10, probably with a SOS in the 90-130 range. If that's the case it will come down to how good the conference is, who our wins are against, how we did the last 10 games, etc (obviously if the conference is really good, then our SOS and RPI will be higher, and going 10-8 in league will look good).

I really wish our non-conf schedule wasn't as weak as it is, because if we are better than expected and find ourselves on the bubble (again, I don't think we will be, but I think/hope there's a chance), then this schedule will come back to bite us. My guess is if Larry had a chance to do it over again, he would've ramped it up slightly this year. I think he still thought we were a year away (which we probably still are) from making any sort of a run at the big dance.

Anyway, good to be here, and Go Utes tonight!

Applejack
11-01-2013, 12:08 PM
Starters tomorrow are Taylor, Wright, Tucker, Loveridge, Lenz.

So how many players see regular playing time this season? Do we have an 8 man rotation with Onwas, Olson, and Bach off the bench? Ogbe and Van Dyke for a 10 man rotation?

This saddens me. Mostly because it means that Olsen couldn't beat out He-man Lenz.

LA Ute
11-01-2013, 12:20 PM
I really wish our non-conf schedule wasn't as weak as it is, because if we are better than expected and find ourselves on the bubble (again, I don't think we will be, but I think/hope there's a chance), then this schedule will come back to bite us. My guess is if Larry had a chance to do it over again, he would've ramped it up slightly this year. I think he still thought we were a year away (which we probably still are) from making any sort of a run at the big dance.

Anyway, good to be here, and Go Utes tonight!

First, welcome! Go to Emigration Canyon and tell us about yourself.

My guess (and that's all it is) is that you are right about Larry's expectations in terms of the schedule. I think the team is better than he thought it would be.

My only quibble with your post is that I am not too sure we end up 9-9 in conference. Still, I can see 9 wins on the schedule. Here's hoping!

Jarid in Cedar
11-01-2013, 12:34 PM
Hey guys, first post. I just discovered this board... it's good to know there are other places besides utefans (which is now a ghost town) to talk Utes. I'm loving the Runnin' Ute talk here.

With the season kicking off tonight (unofficially) I've been seeing a lot of predictions/expectations as far as wins/losses go. I think I'm in a similar boat as most.... my goals/expectations are 20-wins, NIT bid.

The question I had is how many regular season wins will it take to get us into the NCAA Tourney? Or at least "on the bubble"? Obviously it all depends on SOS, RPI, etc.

With our weak non-conf schedule, I'm guessing there's no way we get near the SOS of 55 we had last year http://espn.go.com/mens-college-basketball/rpi/_/year/2013/groupId/21. If we had won 20 games last year, we would've had a decent chance at getting an at-large bid with that SOS.

But looking at conference teams from last year, I think we might have a similar year as ASU had. With a bad non-conf schedule, they finished with a SOS of 114. I'm guessing that will be the range of ours when it's all said and done this year.

Heading into the Pac-12 Tourney ASU was 20-11, and 9-9 in league play. That's right about where I see us (hopefully) being this year. ASU went on to go 1-1 in the conf tourney (beat Stanford, lost to UCLA), and earned a home NIT game (they beat Detroit before losing at Baylor).

Oregon, who's SOS was 125, was 23-8 (12-6 in conf) heading into the Pac-12 Tourney. As we all know they went on to win the thing, got screwed with a 12 seed, but still managed to get to the sweet sixteen.


So, to get back to my initial question.... how many wins will we need to be at least a "bubble team" this year? Counting the Pac-12 Tourney, I'm willing to say that if we win 22 games we'll be squarely on the bubble. Say, for example, we go 11-1 non-conf, 10-8 in league play, then we win 1 game in Vegas. That'll leave us at 22-10, probably with a SOS in the 90-130 range. If that's the case it will come down to how good the conference is, who our wins are against, how we did the last 10 games, etc (obviously if the conference is really good, then our SOS and RPI will be higher, and going 10-8 in league will look good).

I really wish our non-conf schedule wasn't as weak as it is, because if we are better than expected and find ourselves on the bubble (again, I don't think we will be, but I think/hope there's a chance), then this schedule will come back to bite us. My guess is if Larry had a chance to do it over again, he would've ramped it up slightly this year. I think he still thought we were a year away (which we probably still are) from making any sort of a run at the big dance.

Anyway, good to be here, and Go Utes tonight!

If we go 12-6 in conference, with one or two additional wins in the conference tournament, we will be in NCAA consideration regardless of the OOC schedule. There are other mitigating scenarios that could also put us in the discussion, but that finish would probably give us solid claim to a bid.

Applejack
11-01-2013, 12:47 PM
I hate the be Debbie Downer here, but the more realistic question is what do we need to get to the NIT? I don't see a team with Lenz at the 5 going .500 in the Pac. Sorry, just being honest.

sancho
11-01-2013, 12:50 PM
I hate the be Debbie Downer here, but the more realistic question is what do we need to get to the NIT? I don't see a team with Lenz at the 5 going .500 in the Pac. Sorry, just being honest.

Teams can win with poor center play if the rest of the pieces are good enough.

All you pessimists need to celebrate the day of the dead and make an altar commemorating the death of the old Utes. We are going to spoil ASU's football season, and we are going to finish above .500 in Pac-12 basketball. I want photos of altars by the end of the day.

Jarid in Cedar
11-01-2013, 12:52 PM
Teams can win with poor center play if the rest of the pieces are good enough.

All you pessimists need to celebrate the day of the dead and make an altar commemorating the death of the old Utes. We are going to spoil ASU's football season, and we are going to finish above .500 in Pac-12 basketball. I want photos of altars by the end of the day.


No need for an altar. I already believe. :utes:

SoCalPat
11-01-2013, 01:01 PM
If we go 12-6 in conference, with one or two additional wins in the conference tournament, we will be in NCAA consideration regardless of the OOC schedule. There are other mitigating scenarios that could also put us in the discussion, but that finish would probably give us solid claim to a bid.

Hell, in some years that could be good enough to win the damn league outright.

I think this year it would rate no worse than a distant third. I would be surprised if anyone came within two games of Arizona.

SoCalPat
11-01-2013, 01:05 PM
So, to get back to my initial question.... how many wins will we need to be at least a "bubble team" this year? Counting the Pac-12 Tourney, I'm willing to say that if we win 22 games we'll be squarely on the bubble. Say, for example, we go 11-1 non-conf, 10-8 in league play, then we win 1 game in Vegas. That'll leave us at 22-10, probably with a SOS in the 90-130 range. If that's the case it will come down to how good the conference is, who our wins are against, how we did the last 10 games, etc (obviously if the conference is really good, then our SOS and RPI will be higher, and going 10-8 in league will look good).

Nailed it square. I also think this represents the top end of what we can accomplish this year. The center position is unsettled, and you've already addressed the SOS issues. If everything you listed came into play, it would probably take two more wins in Vegas and/or at least one win against Arizona (presuming it's fighting for a No. 1 seed) to get into the Dance.

Jarid in Cedar
11-01-2013, 01:44 PM
Hell, in some years that could be good enough to win the damn league outright.

I think this year it would rate no worse than a distant third. I would be surprised if anyone came within two games of Arizona.


Agreed, which is why I picked that number. That is the record that will nullify the weak OOC(for getting a bid, it would be in seeding discussion though). Anything less than that and it becomes part of the narrative for an invite.

sancho
11-01-2013, 09:32 PM
Just watched the Runnin Utes. I have decided that I like all the new guys. This is going to be another fun team to watch.

SoCalPat
11-02-2013, 01:40 AM
Tough to get real excited about the top efforts from a game like this against an inferior opponent, one of the three worst teams we'll play this year.

The Batshitski-Olsen combo went 2-4 FG, 0-2 FT with three rebounds and six fouls in 16 minutes. It was a great line to get those of us thinking big this season to tap the brakes. And Ogbe goes 1-8 from the line? Was he drunk?

Applejack
11-02-2013, 08:12 AM
Just watched the Runnin Utes. I have decided that I like all the new guys. This is going to be another fun team to watch.

I think this will be a fun team to watch and follow. They are young and poised for the future. I think our lack of any big men will keep us down this year - there will be a couple of serious beatdowns in our future when the outside shots aren't falling; but it will be a fun ride to see if we can play spoiler more than occasionally this season.

sancho
11-02-2013, 08:25 AM
The Batshitski-Olsen combo went 2-4 FG, 0-2 FT with three rebounds and six fouls in 16 minutes. It was a great line to get those of us thinking big this season to tap the brakes.

Well, good thing our hopes are not hanging on those two this season. All our unfounded optimism has been centered on Wright, and he looks great.

It is clear that the 5 is our weak spot, but we already knew that. We aren't asking for more than defense and rebounding out of that spot, and 6 boards in 16 minutes is not bad at all. Olsen had a nice hook too but once again got into foul trouble.

Van Dyke is the best shooter on the team, but where will we find minutes for him?

Did Wright take any jumpers? He was getting to the rim easily. Reminded me of Britton - slashing to the rim like there was no defense out there...and then missing the layup.

sancho
11-02-2013, 08:28 AM
[QUOTE=Applejack;24774 there will be a couple of serious beatdowns in our future when the outside shots aren't falling[/QUOTE]

Is post offense still a thing in college basketball? Our offense doesn't seem any more dependent on outside shooting than anyone else's. It's all about penetration, layups, and kick-outs these days, and we have some good tools for that.

Applejack
11-02-2013, 08:42 AM
Is post offense still a thing in college basketball? Our offense doesn't seem any more dependent on outside shooting than anyone else's. It's all about penetration, layups, and kick-outs these days, and we have some good tools for that.

We do. But most teams have a semblance of a post presence where they can get 12-20 points a game on relatively easy shots that keeps teams honest in their assignments.

Where the lack of a 5 (or a 4, really) will really kill us, however, is on defense. There will be a few layup drills run against us.

sancho
11-02-2013, 09:10 AM
Where the lack of a 5 (or a 4, really) will really kill us, however, is on defense. There will be a few layup drills run against us.

This is definitely the thing to watch this season. We may not get a full picture until we play the Lone Peak superfriends.

I don't know that we can say anything definitive right now about our post defense. Obviously, nothing from last night is any kind of indicator.

Arizona has their one and done, Stanford is the biggest team in the conference, UCLA has the twins, etc. We will need some post defense.

Rocker Ute
11-02-2013, 10:05 AM
This is definitely the thing to watch this season. We may not get a full picture until we play the Lone Peak superfriends.

I don't know that we can say anything definitive right now about our post defense. Obviously, nothing from last night is any kind of indicator.

Arizona has their one and done, Stanford is the biggest team in the conference, UCLA has the twins, etc. We will need some post defense.
Lone Peak Superfriends is part of my lexicon now. Best gift I've been given all year.

Scratch
11-02-2013, 10:46 AM
Tough to get real excited about the top efforts from a game like this against an inferior opponent, one of the three worst teams we'll play this year.

The Batshitski-Olsen combo went 2-4 FG, 0-2 FT with three rebounds and six fouls in 16 minutes. It was a great line to get those of us thinking big this season to tap the brakes. And Ogbe goes 1-8 from the line? Was he drunk?

Our bigs are definitely a concern, and will continue to be one. That said, Lenz had a nice game (9 points, 8 boards in under 20 minutes), and we at least know Olsen can score (he averaged over 11 points per 30 minutes last year, with all but 13 of his minutes last year coming against the P12). Olsen hasn't forgotten how to score, the questions will be whether he can defend the post and stay out of foul trouble. He picked up a few bad fouls yesterday, but I thought he was actually moving and reacting better defensively than he did last year. Again, still probably our weakest spot, but Lenz looked competent and we know Olsen can do some things, so it's not exactly a black hole.

LA Ute
11-02-2013, 10:52 AM
Our bigs are definitely a concern, and will continue to be one. That said, Lenz had a nice game (9 points, 8 boards in under 20 minutes), and we at least know Olsen can score (he averaged over 11 points per 30 minutes last year, with all but 13 of his minutes last year coming against the P12). Olsen hasn't forgotten how to score, the questions will be whether he can defend the post and stay out of foul trouble. He picked up a few bad fouls yesterday, but I thought he was actually moving and reacting better defensively than he did last year. Again, still probably our weakest spot, but Lenz looked competent and we know Olsen can do some things, so it's not exactly a black hole.

I think our goal for these season at the 5 position is to be adequate, or maybe to avoid being a huge liability. That's a pretty low bar. We'll see how we do. I hear that the bigs are all capable of improving. Olsen's problem is (according to former Ute players close to the program) is his defensive footwork and his footspeed. The former can be worked on, the latter just is what it is. Lenz is who is he and probably is about as good as he is going to get, although experience always improves a big who wants to work on his game, and Lenz has shown he does. Kovacevic is an unknown, and Bachinsky's problems are all in his head, according to the same insiders.

crazyute
11-02-2013, 12:44 PM
Our bigs are definitely a concern, and will continue to be one. That said, Lenz had a nice game (9 points, 8 boards in under 20 minutes), and we at least know Olsen can score (he averaged over 11 points per 30 minutes last year, with all but 13 of his minutes last year coming against the P12). Olsen hasn't forgotten how to score, the questions will be whether he can defend the post and stay out of foul trouble. He picked up a few bad fouls yesterday, but I thought he was actually moving and reacting better defensively than he did last year. Again, still probably our weakest spot, but Lenz looked competent and we know Olsen can do some things, so it's not exactly a black hole.

I thought a couple of his fouls were pretty ticky-tacky. infact the whole game was a terribly called game. no flow. amazing we scored as much as we did in it.

SoCalPat
11-02-2013, 12:59 PM
We aren't asking for more than defense and rebounding out of that spot, and 6 boards in 16 minutes is not bad at all.

Except it was six fouls and only three boards, which is brutal.

U-Ute
11-04-2013, 11:56 AM
Is post offense still a thing in college basketball? Our offense doesn't seem any more dependent on outside shooting than anyone else's. It's all about penetration, layups, and kick-outs these days, and we have some good tools for that.

Due to the relatively short 3-point line and early NBA jumping by bona-fide centers, college is less and less defined by interior post play of the Majerus era, and is more dominated by the athletic wing players who can use their height and athletecism to penetrate to the rim or rise over their defender and hit the 3. Boylen started going down that road, and I see K continuing that journey.

For the next few years, this team will go as Loveridge, Wright, Onwas, Ogbe, Fields, and Van Dyke go.

At best, Lenz can be a Kazemi-type facilitator.

SeattleUte
11-04-2013, 12:49 PM
How do we get Van Dyke not to do a mission?

LA Ute
11-04-2013, 12:51 PM
How do we get Van Dyke not to do a mission?

A long dinner with you, maybe with a few follow-up emails?

concerned
11-04-2013, 01:16 PM
A long dinner with you, may with a few follow-up emails?


SU should take this upon himself. Actually, there was some speculation/talk in the neighborhood around the start of the secondary school year, that he might not go after all. Haven't heard anything recently; I'll ask my son, who travels in a pack with Van Dyke's younger brother sometimes.

this could be an idea for a movie--"My dinner with Seattle ute." Wally Shawn or Andre Gregory could play SU.

SeattleUte
11-04-2013, 01:19 PM
SU should take this upon himself. Actually, there was some speculation/talk in the neighborhood around the start of the secondary school year, that he might not go after all. Haven't heard anything recently; I'll ask my son, who travels in a pack with Van Dyke's younger brother sometimes.

I'd be glad to talk to him. I'm always available to help youth make correct decisions.

concerned
11-04-2013, 01:22 PM
I'd be glad to talk to him. I'm always available to help youth make correct decisions.
See my edit above. You could make a movie.

U-Ute
11-04-2013, 01:27 PM
How do we get Van Dyke not to do a mission?

My guess is playing him would be the strongest incentive.

Two Utes
11-04-2013, 01:27 PM
SU should take this upon himself. Actually, there was some speculation/talk in the neighborhood around the start of the secondary school year, that he might not go after all. Haven't heard anything recently; I'll ask my son, who travels in a pack with Van Dyke's younger brother sometimes.

this could be an idea for a movie--"My dinner with Seattle ute." Wally Shawn or Andre Gregory could play SU.

I have it on good authority that he is going after this year.

U-Ute
11-04-2013, 01:28 PM
A long dinner with you, may with a few follow-up emails?

Have you met SU?

LA Ute
11-04-2013, 01:37 PM
Have you met SU?

Yes. SU and I are friends. He's the one on the left.

924

U-Ute
11-04-2013, 01:43 PM
Yes. SU and I are friends. He's the one on the left.

I must say, I never knew SU was such a fashionista. You could get some tips from that guy. Plaid and checkerboard? Puuhhhleease...

The laid back "too cool to care" dress with the trademark "playa" cigar is where its at. The ladies love that.

SeattleUte
11-04-2013, 02:17 PM
See my edit above. You could make a movie.

lol

Rocker Ute
11-04-2013, 03:01 PM
I'd be glad to talk to him. I'm always available to help youth make correct decisions.

How do we make sure he still goes? That is the better question. He hit some shots on mop-up duty but he seemed to be clearly a boy among men out there to me. He seems to be a kid who could benefit from a little maturity to be a real force. Lots of raw potential but it is very very raw.

Plus the missionaries I keep sending to SeattleUte's house never seem to get anywhere, so now we need to send the best.

sancho
11-04-2013, 03:13 PM
How do we make sure he still goes? That is the better question. He hit some shots on mop-up duty but he seemed to be clearly a boy among men out there to me. He seems to be a kid who could benefit from a little maturity to be a real force. Lots of raw potential but it is very very raw.


The mission thing works wonders for football players (especially for linemen), but two years without basketball practice leaves permanent rust.

Rocker Ute
11-04-2013, 03:28 PM
The mission thing works wonders for football players (especially for linemen), but two years without basketball practice leaves permanent rust.

Maybe we can send him on a Shawn Bradley basketball mission. Or maybe we can let him stay and play b-ball if all the apostates ( ;) ) on this board will welcome him in their house for some lessons.

SoCalPat
11-04-2013, 03:54 PM
Maybe we can send him on a Shawn Bradley basketball mission. Or maybe we can let him stay and play b-ball if all the apostates ( ;) ) on this board will welcome him in their house for some lessons.

Bradley actually served a full two years.

Rocker Ute
11-04-2013, 04:05 PM
Bradley actually served a full two years.

He did, but I have a vague recollection of him holding basketball clinics and stuff his entire time in an attempt to keep his form.

Now a Max Hall mission, if he left right as the season ended we'd probably have him back in time for the next season.

Scratch
11-04-2013, 04:12 PM
He did, but I have a vague recollection of him holding basketball clinics and stuff his entire time in an attempt to keep his form.

Now a Max Hall mission, if he left right as the season ended we'd probably have him back in time for the next season.

How would a Shawn Bradley basketball clinic work? Did he just sit there and yell at the kids to be more dedicated to growing an additional two feet?

Rocker Ute
11-04-2013, 04:25 PM
How would a Shawn Bradley basketball clinic work? Did he just sit there and yell at the kids to be more dedicated to growing an additional two feet?

All the kids got to dunk over him.

Applejack
11-04-2013, 05:24 PM
A mission did wonders for Bradley's game. Did you see him with the 76ers? Magical.

UtahsMrSports
11-04-2013, 05:41 PM
I see from the Utah press release that the mighty Evergreen State team coming to the huntsman center will likely trot out a lineup that goes 5-9, 6-0, 6-1, 6-2, 6-4.

Awesome. If our bigs do well, it means nothing. If they struggle.....

SoCalPat
11-05-2013, 07:31 AM
I see from the Utah press release that the mighty Evergreen State team coming to the huntsman center will likely trot out a lineup that goes 5-9, 6-0, 6-1, 6-2, 6-4.

Awesome. If our bigs do well, it means nothing. If they struggle.....

This is one step above a high school team we're playing. I'd love to see Larry try and justify the benefits that come from playing such a team with a straight face.

UBlender
11-05-2013, 08:04 AM
I see from the Utah press release that the mighty Evergreen State team coming to the huntsman center will likely trot out a lineup that goes 5-9, 6-0, 6-1, 6-2, 6-4.

Awesome. If our bigs do well, it means nothing. If they struggle.....

Well, it would depend on where the bigs struggle. I've seen plenty of really excellent bigs struggle when the tallest opponent is 6-5 and they have to chase them around on the perimeter. If that happens, I wouldn't worry too much about it. On the other hand, if the bigs don't rebound or can't finish near the basket that will be a problem.

sancho
11-05-2013, 08:54 AM
This is one step above a high school team we're playing. I'd love to see Larry try and justify the benefits that come from playing such a team with a straight face.

I'm sure he'd agree with you. At this point, the schedule is what it is. It was a mistake not to add more challenging games. All we can do now is make sure we take care of business and enter conference play 12-0.

LA Ute
11-05-2013, 10:17 AM
I'm sure he'd agree with you. At this point, the schedule is what it is. It was a mistake not to add more challenging games. All we can do now is make sure we take care of business and enter conference play 12-0.

Yep. We're all taking our cod liver oil for a few games.

SeattleUte
11-05-2013, 11:18 AM
The Batshitski-Olsen combo went 2-4 FG, 0-2 FT with three rebounds and six fouls in 16 minutes. It was a great line to get those of us thinking big this season to tap the brakes.

http://www.sltrib.com/sltrib/utes/57082968-89/utah-bachynski-ball-krystkowiak.html.csp

UtahsMrSports
11-05-2013, 11:43 AM
http://www.sltrib.com/sltrib/utes/57082968-89/utah-bachynski-ball-krystkowiak.html.csp

Glad they are working on this. As much wing firepower as we have, we need to keep the post as a legitimate threat. Also glad to hear that Kova is getting healthy and we can expect him back in late november. Anxious to see if he can crack the rotation.

UBlender
11-05-2013, 01:45 PM
Glad they are working on this. As much wing firepower as we have, we need to keep the post as a legitimate threat. Also glad to hear that Kova is getting healthy and we can expect him back in late november. Anxious to see if he can crack the rotation.

Based on how the exhibition went, Marko's five fouls may prove invaluable, if nothing else.

UtahsMrSports
11-05-2013, 02:38 PM
Hey SoCalPat..........

Have you seen this? http://collegebasketballtalk.nbcsports.com/2013/07/10/grand-canyon-adds-former-new-mexico-guard-demetrius-walker/

Thatll make that game a must see for me, having read "the book".

SoCalPat
11-05-2013, 04:04 PM
Hey SoCalPat..........

Have you seen this? http://collegebasketballtalk.nbcsports.com/2013/07/10/grand-canyon-adds-former-new-mexico-guard-demetrius-walker/

Thatll make that game a must see for me, having read "the book".

You want to slam AAU ball and that system, Walker's story is Exhibit A. Unbelievable.

Dan Majerle is GCU's coach, too. Honestly, past BYU that could be our most entertaining non-conference game, especially if they have some other fifth-year senior transfers on the team as well.

Two Utes
11-05-2013, 06:51 PM
You want to slam AAU ball and that system, Walker's story is Exhibit A. Unbelievable.

Dan Majerle is GCU's coach, too. Honestly, past BYU that could be our most entertaining non-conference game, especially if they have some other fifth-year senior transfers on the team as well.

To this kid, college is just an extension of AAU ball. If things don't go exactly as you want them to, you just find another team to showcase your individual skills.

UtahsMrSports
11-05-2013, 10:04 PM
To this kid, college is just an extension of AAU ball. If things don't go exactly as you want them to, you just find another team to showcase your individual skills.

I feel for the kid. He is so maladjusted to life in general because of his experiences as a kid, i hope he can make something of himself.

SoCalPat
11-05-2013, 11:05 PM
To this kid, college is just an extension of AAU ball. If things don't go exactly as you want them to, you just find another team to showcase your individual skills.

I think Walker is an extreme case. I blamed AAU ball earlier, but conveniently forgot that he was being heralded as the next LeBron by Sports Illustrated when he was still in the eighth grade (that SI piece was an excerpt from "Play Their Hearts Out," which is to AAU hoops what "Friday Night Lights" was for high school football). Justin Hawkins at UNLV was an AAU teammate of Walker's, and he had a solid career at UNLV. So was Roberto Nelson at OSU. So to put all the blame on AAU ball was probably too harsh on my end.

Walker has his degree and can make good money overseas once he can accept his game for what it is. Problem is, I'm not sure if anyone will let him. That's a pretty hefty tag he will have to carry.

UtahsMrSports
11-06-2013, 07:33 AM
I think Walker is an extreme case. I blamed AAU ball earlier, but conveniently forgot that he was being heralded as the next LeBron by Sports Illustrated when he was still in the eighth grade (that SI piece was an excerpt from "Play Their Hearts Out," which is to AAU hoops what "Friday Night Lights" was for high school football). Justin Hawkins at UNLV was an AAU teammate of Walker's, and he had a solid career at UNLV. So was Roberto Nelson at OSU. So to put all the blame on AAU ball was probably too harsh on my end.

Walker has his degree and can make good money overseas once he can accept his game for what it is. Problem is, I'm not sure if anyone will let him. That's a pretty hefty tag he will have to carry.

Joe Keller was/is an absolute clown. Disgusting that he became a millionaire using kids.

Applejack
11-06-2013, 07:54 AM
Joe Keller was/is an absolute clown. Disgusting that he became a millionaire using kids.

I loved Play Their Hearts Out - absolutely tragic story about parenting, poverty, and basketball. I'll be rooting for DeMetrius as we pound Grand Canyon into the stone age.

UtahsMrSports
11-06-2013, 08:47 AM
I loved Play Their Hearts Out - absolutely tragic story about parenting, poverty, and basketball. I'll be rooting for DeMetrius as we pound Grand Canyon into the stone age.

I went to the library last year looking for nothing specific. Saw that book on the shelf and picked it up just out of curiosity, knew nothing about it. Once I got into it, I couldn't put it down. The morphing off Joe Keller from a broken down struggling nobody to a major power in AAU and all of this built on lies, insincerity, and just generally being a jerk was fascinating to me.

U-Ute
11-08-2013, 06:56 PM
Man. If nothing else, Wright passes the eyeball test.

Mormon Red Death
11-08-2013, 07:15 PM
Man. If nothing else, Wright passes the eyeball test.

He has the same body type as Tony Harvey and Phil Dixon

Sent from my SGH-T999 using Tapatalk 2

sancho
11-08-2013, 07:25 PM
Man. If nothing else, Wright passes the eyeball test.

He also passes the genetics test. And the sancho test.

Diehard Ute
11-08-2013, 07:31 PM
Man. If nothing else, Wright passes the eyeball test.

Yes. He has 2 of them

LA Ute
11-08-2013, 07:58 PM
Yes. He has 2 of them

Clear evidence of our ongoing talent upgrade. We're getting players who have the tools!

Diehard Ute
11-08-2013, 08:27 PM
Utah set the JMHC scoring record, 3rd highest point total for any single game and the second highest margin of victory

Wright ends up with 17 points 10 rebounds 7 assists and 7 steals