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UtahsMrSports
11-30-2014, 04:03 PM
Wednesday cant get here soon enough!

#1 Utefan
11-30-2014, 04:08 PM
Wednesday cant get here soon enough!

Attendance has has been pretty poor through the cupcake portion of the schedule so far. Does that change Wednesday night?

I hope so as this year's Runnin Utes are fun to watch and need the fan support. This is by far the best non-conference home game of the year and maybe the highest ranked opponent Utah will face this year. I am hoping the students and fans turn out to support the team and help beat a very good Wichita St. team just 1 1/2 years removed from the Final Four.

sancho
11-30-2014, 04:12 PM
WSU and Kansas are "punch your ticket to the dance" type games.

Diehard Ute
11-30-2014, 04:29 PM
Attendance has has been pretty poor through the cupcake portion of the schedule so far. Does that change Wednesday night?

I hope so as this year's Runnin Utes are fun to watch and need the fan support. This is by far the best non-conference home game of the year and maybe the highest ranked opponent Utah will face this year. I am hoping the students and fans turn out to support the team and help beat a very good Wichita St. team just 1 1/2 years removed from the Final Four.

I didn't expect it to be good. You can't schedule 4 basketball games in 7 days with a home football game thrown in as well all wrapped around arguably the biggest family holiday of the year and expect great attendance. I made all the games but it was tough. My fiance skipped one game.

She's new to going to games and is much more excited to go to a football game. The atmosphere of football helps. But the number of basketball games overwhelms her as well. She also isn't a fan of blowouts and said she'd rather watch the good teams. I'm sure it will pick up this week.

LA Ute
11-30-2014, 05:00 PM
I'm betting on a sellout, or close to one.

U-Ute
11-30-2014, 05:13 PM
I'm betting on a sellout, or close to one.

I think so too. The crowds to these cupcake games have been better than I expected.

I think it will be like the Gonzaga game. Maybe a little less due to the start time.

Diehard Ute
11-30-2014, 05:15 PM
I think so too. The crowds to these cupcake games have been better than I expected.

I think it will be like the Gonzaga game. Maybe a little less due to the start time.

Yeah. A 9pm tip on a Wednesday isn't ideal

I love the money and exposure TV brings. I hate the havoc it creates with our game times

U-Ute
11-30-2014, 05:32 PM
Yeah. A 9pm tip on a Wednesday isn't ideal

I love the money and exposure TV brings. I hate the havoc it creates with our game times

Yeah. It is keeping me from going. 😢😢😢

311ute
12-01-2014, 10:30 AM
Attendance has has been pretty poor through the cupcake portion of the schedule so far. Does that change Wednesday night?


Last year's Thanksgiving Tournament attendance average: 7,201
This year's Thanksgiving Tournament attendance average: 9,734


It seems that the base attendance is up at least 2,000 from last year, a year in which we saw a 20% increase in season attendance.


My guess is the 9pm Wed night tip-off will prevent it from being a sell-out, but I think it'll be near full and a great atmosphere, similar to the BYU/Oregon/Arizona games last year.

311ute
12-01-2014, 11:41 AM
Wichita really has no size to speak of... they start: 5-10, 6-3, 6-3, 6-4, 6-7. Their tallest guy on the roster is 6-10, and he's only playing 14 mpg (averaging less than 3 ppg). It will be interesting to see how this plays out, for both sides.

We need to look to punish them inside. I have no idea how they plan on dealing with Poeltl... he could have his way down low. They are very well coached and play sound defense, but with no rim protector we should be able to pound it down low and finish at the hoop.

LA Ute
12-01-2014, 01:24 PM
Phil Cullen's e-mail today:


Coming off three wins over the break we were able to crack the AP Top 25 poll at #25. This week we host Wichita State who currently ranks #8 in the same poll. Wichita currently is on a 35 regular season win streak and has a backcourt duo rated as one of the best in the country.

Wichita State hangs their hat on the defensive end of the floor, playing tough man to man 12 court defense. At times they will extend defensive pressure to the full court and they do a great job of creating turnovers.

Offensively they look to Fred VanVleet #23 and Ron Baker #31. Both are coming off great games scoring 21 points and 19 points respectively. VanVleet is a ball in hand point who has a great change of pace to his game capable of attacking the rim and shooting the outside jumper. Baker is an all around solid player and has deep 3 point range and plays extremely hard and physical.

Their starting lineup is completed with an athletic 3 man Tekele Cotton who is a veteran senior and one of the best defenders in the country. Evan Wessel starts at the four as an undersized pick and pop guy. Down low they are anchored by Darius Carter, 67 and weighs 245 lbs., who plays extremely physical and is averaging 13 ppg.

This game is the marks the first time in over 12 years that a top ten team will come to the Huntsman Center in our Non-Conference schedule.

Tip time is scheduled for 9 pm due to the game being televised on ESPN. We are having our first Stripe the Huntsman for this game! Please click here (http://email.jumpforwardemail.com/wf/click?upn=RdsVRTDBG7C-2BF6gdsan7k-2FBnM-2FVzjuNpP6BWdykGVfUIV8Pb8ao2pPvKCmADQ6zuVq1D1TheOi BMIwTm5pOv7w-3D-3D_JpavFYnoLTX47CpO-2FXOabzjYqG6h2ymjArNh36QzXJZDcMBAuxEsJTakaHJarCcXV UfAK-2BhpZuOn1neGSc1AC9jQrYXF54qs8CQuqV-2Fr6ljvnUDSgEPGaIZP7WyHI7rZCwqhWLHrUgMG5XzQvsNvmDn bgBuwZqDdPn2kLLoPYZpKa8I42-2FohWPzSU-2BcnY9xzLJNX437-2FrlO66aU0CnsZeXdORvqAQ4ZpXp9yLBHbBrJuOtNNAVDGAOsI nDI3Qk3vF8l4yosfIIUf1AlRldyPPGTOGRlHGGfWFJQtZV2Djm s-3D) to see which color you will need to represent.
We hope you will follow our Facebook (http://email.jumpforwardemail.com/wf/click?upn=GXNETu-2FOEngg3UPeemqD-2FR03TMLAQvVo-2F8FrCItKKsthtrA7Kr8Nqgx1htnk2UPj4-2F-2BKIliXbVe7tu0nY378jg-3D-3D_JpavFYnoLTX47CpO-2FXOabzjYqG6h2ymjArNh36QzXJZDcMBAuxEsJTakaHJarCcXV UfAK-2BhpZuOn1neGSc1AC9jQrYXF54qs8CQuqV-2Fr6ljvnUDSgEPGaIZP7WyHI7rZCwqhWLHrUgMG5XzQvsNvmIt 4pjPya5VY3QB98oKL-2B1ze98DjJuxjKEBHDj8n9cSIXMe3xUnNy7SE3CHkBU6KauSMI 7sZGVv6oVi36XSALo8V0a590xigetaqYdrL9LUR61J0Cj3-2FO2Gb53jJHfQhmN7trPqPE-2F0-2Fg9eGzzLT7bQ-3D), Twitter (http://email.jumpforwardemail.com/wf/click?upn=BJnShm5cIq47yBmYA5ZINRk5Q-2Fnm2lXnGiX86jdbXVz5NSqoprEWf4McdCFYBSUn_JpavFYnoL TX47CpO-2FXOabzjYqG6h2ymjArNh36QzXJZDcMBAuxEsJTakaHJarCcXV UfAK-2BhpZuOn1neGSc1AC9jQrYXF54qs8CQuqV-2Fr6ljvnUDSgEPGaIZP7WyHI7rZCwqhWLHrUgMG5XzQvsNvmMk oSOTjxAbBye-2F0uGNOoDjp4-2BveBwfoIjPZdceW3ehsjI4ZE2uFCay453mPQxkS2Tf-2FHuWsY9xXwcv0jOYOkBR8eU-2FG7nid5dId8BZ9rA7gGaGRtjnwkmX4K8-2Fi7Xgg5PcKdRvhjAt2AHhjUiZtSA8-3D) and Instagram (http://email.jumpforwardemail.com/wf/click?upn=8bQEihWEQDnmoQAv-2F0giDPzioTYilrSqhYZ5NIK01D4R5TpsH3igzAS90waz-2BMwP_JpavFYnoLTX47CpO-2FXOabzjYqG6h2ymjArNh36QzXJZDcMBAuxEsJTakaHJarCcXV UfAK-2BhpZuOn1neGSc1AC9jQrYXF54qs8CQuqV-2Fr6ljvnUDSgEPGaIZP7WyHI7rZCwqhWLHrUgMG5XzQvsNvmNx Aon-2Biv0sNwVNnOQ-2F-2FfK1rneHHYeEg-2FOnoc-2Fo33PoUpTgXV3ipzRtEv9-2Bm0UA6Y-2F1l7bM2DbetMsMstvoZZiiSaS29YDop1k5hnmcNboX4s5H3oq 3MP-2BlcTknlfC2oPjbNODhTR1ErKgmvNej4h4s-3D) pages to help get you ready to take on the Shockers! Please use the hashtags #MUSSTERUP and #GAMEDAYU to join in on the excitement!
The Huntsman Center crowd will be at its best and we cannot wait to see you there! GO UTES!!!

SoCalPat
12-01-2014, 03:57 PM
Wichita really has no size to speak of... they start: 5-10, 6-3, 6-3, 6-4, 6-7. Their tallest guy on the roster is 6-10, and he's only playing 14 mpg (averaging less than 3 ppg). It will be interesting to see how this plays out, for both sides.

We need to look to punish them inside. I have no idea how they plan on dealing with Poeltl... he could have his way down low. They are very well coached and play sound defense, but with no rim protector we should be able to pound it down low and finish at the hoop.

We will need to exploit Poeltl inside, because a lot of the other matchups are a draw or not favorable for us. What WSU lacks in height, they have a bunch of 6-7 guys that are thick and that has been our biggest bugaboo under Larry. They have some freshmen they are excited about -- much like us, although I think we're a little more deeper and a little more talented off the bench. WSU is going to spread us out and shoot a lot of 3s, and Ron Baker and Fred Vanvleet are both 40 percent guys. I'm really worried about Baker because he will make Delon work too hard, Taylor is too short to guard him and IWright too inexperienced. He'll eat Ogbe or Tucker alive. I am counting on Delon vs. VV to be a draw. We'll have to play our best defensive game to ensure a win -- if we're late flashing out or coming off screens and WSU gets open looks, we could lose decisively.

We want to muck things up a bit. I like our chances if we can.

Old Standing ute
12-01-2014, 04:16 PM
We will need to exploit Poeltl inside, because a lot of the other matchups are a draw or not favorable for us. What WSU lacks in height, they have a bunch of 6-7 guys that are thick and that has been our biggest bugaboo under Larry. They have some freshmen they are excited about -- much like us, although I think we're a little more deeper and a little more talented off the bench. WSU is going to spread us out and shoot a lot of 3s, and Ron Baker and Fred Vanvleet are both 40 percent guys. I'm really worried about Baker because he will make Delon work too hard, Taylor is too short to guard him and IWright too inexperienced. He'll eat Ogbe or Tucker alive. I am counting on Delon vs. VV to be a draw. We'll have to play our best defensive game to ensure a win -- if we're late flashing out or coming off screens and WSU gets open looks, we could lose decisively.

We want to muck things up a bit. I like our chances if we can.

Baker will be on Delon. Assume Delon will draw him on D. They are key player for each team.
WSU is streaky from 3. VV is 3-14 to date. He drives to draw fouls & has 3+ average steals per game.
The big guy does not really score, so falls on the rest.

They play good D & like to pressure the ball.
Like our depth, especially up front at home/altitude.

Curious to see the Vegas line--my guess WSU by 2?

SoCalPat
12-01-2014, 07:37 PM
Baker will be on Delon. Assume Delon will draw him on D. They are key player for each team.
WSU is streaky from 3. VV is 3-14 to date. He drives to draw fouls & has 3+ average steals per game.
The big guy does not really score, so falls on the rest.

They play good D & like to pressure the ball.
Like our depth, especially up front at home/altitude.

Curious to see the Vegas line--my guess WSU by 2?

I couldn't even begin to guess on the line because both teams are so good at home. I think we know a little more about Utah this far. I could see either team being favored up to 6 points. That's a huge range.

311ute
12-02-2014, 10:04 AM
I couldn't even begin to guess on the line because both teams are so good at home. I think we know a little more about Utah this far. I could see either team being favored up to 6 points. That's a huge range.


Wichita St is 2-0 ATS, the Utes are 5-1. The lines we've had at home have all been quite large (all over 23 pts).

I'm going to guess and say it'll open at Utah -3.

#1 Utefan
12-02-2014, 12:50 PM
Wichita St is 2-0 ATS, the Utes are 5-1. The lines we've had at home have all been quite large (all over 23 pts).

I'm going to guess and say it'll open at Utah -3.

does anyone know if this game is or will be close to a sellout? I sure hope so. This is the first game since 1999 there has been a game at the Hunty between two nationally ranked teams.

Dwight Schr-Ute
12-02-2014, 12:56 PM
does anyone know if this game is or will be close to a sellout? I sure hope so. This is the first game since 1999 there has been a game at the Hunty between two nationally ranked teams.

Bill Riley tweeted about this yesterday:


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Just got word for @utahathletics (https://twitter.com/utahathletics) that tickets are going fast for Wed night vs. Wichita State. Will likely be sold out by game time. #Utes (https://twitter.com/hashtag/Utes?src=hash)
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311ute
12-02-2014, 01:55 PM
Looks like it opens as a Pick 'Em

http://insider.espn.go.com/insider/pickcenter/ncb/game?gameid=400586341

Old Standing ute
12-02-2014, 03:00 PM
does anyone know if this game is or will be close to a sellout? I sure hope so. This is the first game since 1999 there has been a game at the Hunty between two nationally ranked teams.

They are giving away free upper bowl tickets to certain levels of donors----tickets were free for T-day tourney with a can of food.
Good marketing, especially if we keep winning.
So it should be full if -----the lower bowl people & students finally show up.

U-Ute
12-02-2014, 03:02 PM
Not a gambler, so I don't know how to find the current lines.

My Google-fu gave me this link, which has Utah -18, which seems crazy to me, but maybe I'm reading it wrong. Maybe someone who has the chops can divine something different...

http://www.vegasinsider.com/college-basketball/odds/las-vegas/

SoCalPat
12-02-2014, 06:01 PM
Not a gambler, so I don't know how to find the current lines.

My Google-fu gave me this link, which has Utah -18, which seems crazy to me, but maybe I'm reading it wrong. Maybe someone who has the chops can divine something different...

http://www.vegasinsider.com/college-basketball/odds/las-vegas/

That's a huge mistake. The VI consensus has this game Utah -2.5, which sounds about right.

U-Ute
12-02-2014, 06:05 PM
That's a huge mistake. The VI consensus has this game Utah -2, which sounds about right.

Yeah. It looks like that page has been updated with the VI consensus. I agree that 2-4 points seems right.

1321

Old Standing ute
12-02-2014, 06:16 PM
Yeah. It looks like that page has been updated with the VI consensus. I agree that 2-4 points seems right.

1321

nice tie.

U-Ute
12-02-2014, 06:56 PM
nice tie.

I may not know what I'm doing, but I reserve the right to look swag while doing it.

chrisrenrut
12-02-2014, 10:29 PM
Yeah. It looks like that page has been updated with the VI consensus. I agree that 2-4 points seems right.

1321

Is that tooblue trying to find a Utah game to watch?

LA Ute
12-03-2014, 11:06 AM
A pretty good breakdown of the game from PAC-12 hoops -- from a Wichita State perspective this time:

http://pachoops.com/2014/12/a-wichita-state-utah-qawith-me/

Diehard Ute
12-03-2014, 11:14 AM
A pretty good breakdown of the game from PAC-12 hoops -- from a Wichita State perspective this time:

http://pachoops.com/2014/12/a-wichita-state-utah-qawith-me/

Eh I could have done without the comedic attempts

LA Ute
12-03-2014, 11:25 AM
Eh I could have done without the comedic attempts

That's just the blogger's style. I enjoy his posts, and he's always very fair to Utah.

Diehard Ute
12-03-2014, 11:35 AM
That's just the blogger's style. I enjoy his posts, and he's always very fair to Utah.

To each their own. I couldn't get through the thing.

Wichita State fans seem fairly convinced they're going to win


I found one can post odd though, saying we'll struggle with their length.

U-Ute
12-03-2014, 02:32 PM
Wichita State fans seem fairly convinced they're going to win

They have been pretty successful at winning, so I can't say I blame them.

Diehard Ute
12-03-2014, 02:40 PM
They have been pretty successful at winning, so I can't say I blame them.

To some degree yes.

It'll be interesting to see if their belief that they're just to good defensively to lose is accurate.

U-Ute
12-03-2014, 03:01 PM
To some degree yes.

It'll be interesting to see if their belief that they're just to good defensively to lose is accurate.

Great defense coupled with great guard play can win you a lot of games.

Two keys for tonight:

1. Turnovers. We have had enough problems with this that it makes me nervous.
2. Rebounding. We need to flex our size advantage.

Diehard Ute
12-03-2014, 03:16 PM
Great defense coupled with great guard play can win you a lot of games.

Two keys for tonight:

1. Turnovers. We have had enough problems with this that it makes me nervous.
2. Rebounding. We need to flex our size advantage.

I'm just not sure how good either team is yet.

We certainly need to take advantage of our length across the board.

justaute
12-03-2014, 08:58 PM
Isn't there a big BB game tonight?

Applejack
12-03-2014, 08:59 PM
Y'all are going to have to bring this one home without me. I make a lot of sacrifices for my team. But an 11:00 PM tip on a Wednesday is too much to ask. Give 'em hell, locals.

chrisrenrut
12-03-2014, 09:54 PM
Team is in gray shorts, haven't seen the tops yet.
1324

Scorcho
12-03-2014, 10:03 PM
oh no

OrangeUte
12-03-2014, 10:07 PM
Dammit lets get this game started.

Mormon Red Death
12-03-2014, 10:24 PM
Not digging the uniforms or the shitty start
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Applejack
12-03-2014, 10:24 PM
Not digging the uniforms or the shitty start
Sent from my SGH-M919 using Tapatalk 2

I couldn't stay away. Really bad start. Our offense is like our football team's.

OrangeUte
12-03-2014, 10:30 PM
Their defense is intense and relentless.

OrangeUte
12-03-2014, 10:30 PM
Gray uniforms are awesome.

OrangeUte
12-03-2014, 10:33 PM
Poetl playing everywhere. Looking good.

Mormon Red Death
12-03-2014, 10:35 PM
I wish poetl was a better rim protector

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Scratch
12-03-2014, 10:40 PM
I love me some Pertl.

LA Ute
12-03-2014, 10:41 PM
I love me some Pertl.

Yep

Mormon Red Death
12-03-2014, 10:48 PM
Loveridge still out?

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Mormon Red Death
12-03-2014, 10:54 PM
There is the second shitty ref call.

1st was delon travel and now the backcourt violation

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OrangeUte
12-03-2014, 10:54 PM
We have to rebound. Gave them that last bucket.

OrangeUte
12-03-2014, 10:55 PM
Where is loveridge?

LA Ute
12-03-2014, 10:55 PM
Baker is a weapon. I also dislike him now!

OrangeUte
12-03-2014, 10:55 PM
I love wsu's defense. So intense and aggressive.

LA Ute
12-03-2014, 10:55 PM
Where is loveridge?

Knee. Won't play.

LA Ute
12-03-2014, 10:56 PM
Delon misses two FTs. Wow.

LA Ute
12-03-2014, 10:58 PM
Do these refs like WSU?

justaute
12-03-2014, 10:59 PM
Yup...the way it should be played. Other than Poeltl, the freshmen haven't done anything, which is not unexpected.



I love wsu's defense. So intense and aggressive.

LA Ute
12-03-2014, 11:03 PM
What the H is with these refs?

OrangeUte
12-03-2014, 11:04 PM
Love the Crowd getting up

OrangeUte
12-03-2014, 11:07 PM
Need to clean up our defensive rebounding and ball movement on offense. Good first half.

LA Ute
12-03-2014, 11:08 PM
I like being down only 4 after the slow start. WS is more experienced and a little tougher than we are. We can pull this off, though.

LA Ute
12-03-2014, 11:13 PM
Shockers are in some foul trouble. Hope we can exploit that.

kccougar
12-03-2014, 11:15 PM
Do these refs like WSU?

Clearly. As evidenced by the 13-3 first half foul disparity in favor of the Utes.

LA Ute
12-03-2014, 11:16 PM
Need to clean up our defensive rebounding and ball movement on offense. Good first half.

Also free throws and turnovers.

OrangeUte
12-03-2014, 11:17 PM
True.

LA Ute
12-03-2014, 11:18 PM
Clearly. As evidenced by the 13-3 first half foul disparity in favor of the Utes.

Apart from the fouls. Don't you have somewhere else to be? Cougjunkie needs you over on your board. Go help him out.

LA Ute
12-03-2014, 11:25 PM
the airball by Ogbe was ugly

LA Ute
12-03-2014, 11:26 PM
That Baker guy is nails.

OrangeUte
12-03-2014, 11:27 PM
Offensive rebounding by wsu is killing us.

justaute
12-03-2014, 11:29 PM
We needed that 3. Other than Taylor's early 3's, no one can hit anything from outside -- partially attributed to WSU's d.

LA Ute
12-03-2014, 11:31 PM
Offensive rebounding by wsu is killing us.

If we can just watch some fundamentals like pulling the ball down we can correct that. We've lost a few rebounds that we shouldn't have.

OrangeUte
12-03-2014, 11:32 PM
If we can just watch some fundamentals like pulling the ball down we can correct that. We've lost a few rebounds that we shouldn't have.

Yes. 2 possessions that both ended up in wsu points.

OrangeUte
12-03-2014, 11:33 PM
Beautiful finger roll by Taylor! Tie game

LA Ute
12-03-2014, 11:34 PM
Poeltl playing great. Just a few freshman mistakes.

OrangeUte
12-03-2014, 11:35 PM
Utah bounce on that shot for the lead!

OrangeUte
12-03-2014, 11:38 PM
Bachynski!!!!

justaute
12-03-2014, 11:38 PM
That was a hell of a pass by Chapman.

OrangeUte
12-03-2014, 11:40 PM
That was a hell of a pass by Chapman.

For sure!!!!!

OrangeUte
12-03-2014, 11:46 PM
Time to poetl back in and finish this. Bach played well.

OrangeUte
12-03-2014, 11:47 PM
Yes!!!!!

OrangeUte
12-03-2014, 11:47 PM
Great defense

OrangeUte
12-03-2014, 11:49 PM
Our defense is playing hot right now.

justaute
12-03-2014, 11:50 PM
Bach's work on the board has been terrific tonight. And, he hits his free throws.

OrangeUte
12-03-2014, 11:54 PM
Tucker w a huge 3

OrangeUte
12-03-2014, 11:54 PM
Sweet!!!!!

OrangeUte
12-04-2014, 12:07 AM
Gotta hit free throws.

LA Ute
12-04-2014, 12:08 AM
BIG mistake to give him that open look.

justaute
12-04-2014, 12:09 AM
We started the Whittingham game management a bit too early

LA Ute
12-04-2014, 12:09 AM
Need to keep the ball in the hands of good FT shooters

OrangeUte
12-04-2014, 12:10 AM
Dumb dumb dumb.

OrangeUte
12-04-2014, 12:11 AM
Crap

LA Ute
12-04-2014, 12:11 AM
Now we are choking.

OrangeUte
12-04-2014, 12:11 AM
Sloppy ball movement there. Jeez

LA Ute
12-04-2014, 12:12 AM
Need some heroes now.

justaute
12-04-2014, 12:13 AM
Chapman still doesn't know the game. Should have let VV drive. He's got help inside.

Mormon Red Death
12-04-2014, 12:15 AM
At least we get overtime

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OrangeUte
12-04-2014, 12:17 AM
Huge errors there to put the shockers back in.

LA Ute
12-04-2014, 12:17 AM
That 11-1 run at the end was killer. Now we need to suck it up.

justaute
12-04-2014, 12:17 AM
We have to play team-ball with more help defense rotation and screens. Utah doesn't have anyone like Van Vleet, Cotton, or Baker who can all create their own shots.

LA Ute
12-04-2014, 12:20 AM
The rap on LK last year was that his teams couldn't finish. This will be a chance to get that monkey off his back.

LA Ute
12-04-2014, 12:22 AM
This is agonizing

OrangeUte
12-04-2014, 12:22 AM
2 misses in first 2 possessions is not good. Have to score here.

OrangeUte
12-04-2014, 12:23 AM
Huge 3! Delon!

justaute
12-04-2014, 12:25 AM
Reyes has not played well tonight.

OrangeUte
12-04-2014, 12:27 AM
Poor clock management

OrangeUte
12-04-2014, 12:28 AM
That's a crappy call

OrangeUte
12-04-2014, 12:29 AM
Taylor is so tiny but I love that move

Mormon Red Death
12-04-2014, 12:33 AM
Delon had position

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LA Ute
12-04-2014, 12:33 AM
Argh

OrangeUte
12-04-2014, 12:34 AM
Come on Reyes

OrangeUte
12-04-2014, 12:35 AM
Poeltl!!!!!

OrangeUte
12-04-2014, 12:36 AM
Hit your free throws!

LA Ute
12-04-2014, 12:37 AM
Whatever happens these Utes have to work on FTs. Man!!!!

OrangeUte
12-04-2014, 12:37 AM
That's for sure. This is such a great game!

LA Ute
12-04-2014, 12:38 AM
3 misses in a row. Awful.

OrangeUte
12-04-2014, 12:40 AM
What a great dramatic game!

justaute
12-04-2014, 12:41 AM
Nice. I'll take it.

Solon
12-04-2014, 12:44 AM
Nice. I'll take it.

Yowzers. Those guys were playing hard (both teams). Great win.

Jarid in Cedar
12-04-2014, 12:46 AM
Tucker was the MVP. Big shots and clutch free throws. Plus I think he played excellent defense on Baker

justaute
12-04-2014, 12:49 AM
Tucker and Poeltl. Poeltl -- how big was that last offensive rebound!


Tucker was the MVP. Big shots and clutch free throws. Plus I think he played excellent defense on Baker

sancho
12-04-2014, 12:55 AM
So that was fun.

Team effort. Big contributions from Wright, Poeltl, Tucker, Taylor, Chapman, Bach, Reyes.

OrangeUte
12-04-2014, 12:55 AM
Tucker was the MVP. Big shots and clutch free throws. Plus I think he played excellent defense on Baker

Absolutely agree. Huge in the second half.

justaute
12-04-2014, 12:56 AM
Piper's tweet..."On Delon Wright, scout said he's concerned about the athleticism and shooting. Believes he can play with anyone, but unsure about 1st round."

https://twitter.com/matthew_piper/status/540398216575852544

chrisrenrut
12-04-2014, 12:58 AM
I hate being this keyed up at midnight. What a fun game. Crowd was not quite what I hoped or was told to expect. But the game didn't disappoint. I was worried about missing Loveridge, but Poeltl and Tucker both stepped up big.

Im now a believer in our top 25 ranking and in Poeltl's potential.

OrangeUte
12-04-2014, 12:58 AM
Brandon Taylor is an awesome interview. Animated and talkative.

OrangeUte
12-04-2014, 12:59 AM
I hate being this keyed up at midnight. What a fun game. Crowd was not quite what I hoped or was told to expect. But the game didn't disappoint. I was worried about missing Loveridge, but Poeltl and Tucker both stepped up big.

Im now a believer in our top 25 ranking and in Poeltl's potential.

It looked pretty full. No?

justaute
12-04-2014, 01:00 AM
According to DN, attendance # was +14k.

chrisrenrut
12-04-2014, 01:07 AM
Clearly. As evidenced by the 13-3 first half foul disparity in favor of the Utes.

It's just sad the straws that BYU fans are grasping at for smack talk these days. Coach Whit visiting Chase Hansen, foul disparity in a half of basketball, PAC-12 Channel smack. After next week, most will have a hard time remembering what a pleasure it is to have scoreboard smack.

chrisrenrut
12-04-2014, 01:09 AM
It looked pretty full. No?

Announced was 14k, actual was probably closer to 12k.

Dwight Schr-Ute
12-04-2014, 01:12 AM
Tucker and Poeltl. Poeltl -- how big was that last offensive rebound!

Would have been a lot bigger had he hit the free throws. I can't believe that they got out of there with a W.

Lot's of youth issues, but I really like this team. Good, competitive wins like this will grow up our freshman fast.

Delon dumping the ball off to Tucker with a fading shot clock (got blocked) can't happen moving forward if he's going to captain this team. He's too talented to be bailing like that. After all the close losses last year, I was hoping that this was an area of emphasis. Now, having said all of that, he gets some moxy and hits the go ahead floater in the paint. I was thrilled with that. We just need that Delon every possession down the stretch. I wanted to travel for this game. I really should have. Can't wait to see my Wichita State coworker on Monday. (He flies out to Kansas first thing in the morning watch his Shockers try and restart their win streak his weekend!)

Here's to making the Cougars play a slow, grind it out game next week. And still beating them by 20!

chrisrenrut
12-04-2014, 01:13 AM
Did they say or show on TV what happened to the ref? He did not look good coming off the floor.

justaute
12-04-2014, 01:15 AM
Don't feed the troll -- as a practicing LDS member, I do get embarrassed by BYU fans' behavior. Given their level of preached standard, they just don't acquit themselves well.


It's just sad the straws that BYU fans are grasping at for smack talk these days. Coach Whit visiting Chase Hansen, foul disparity in a half of basketball, PAC-12 Channel smack. After next week, most will have a hard time remembering what a pleasure it is to have scoreboard smack.

justaute
12-04-2014, 01:20 AM
That's the problem -- we don't have players like Van Vleet or Ron Baker. Our players need a lot of screens and motion to create shooting lanes/space. D/Wright is a facilitator, and too much so at times. Of course, if other shooters don't screen and hit a few shots, opponent's defense pretty much pack-in the defense and make D/Wright shoot.

Also, I'm hoping the young players can step up on defense. Chapman's late-game turnovers almost single-handedly cost Utah a win; he only sees the space in front of him, not the entire floor. He/Kuzma, and other young players, need to know when to stay on the shooters (e.g. Van Vleet) and when to make them drive so the interior/help defense can help.


Would have been a lot bigger had he hit the free throws. I can't believe that they got out of there with a W.

Lot's of youth issues, but I really like this team. Good, competitive wins like this will grow up our freshman fast.

Delon dumping the ball off to Tucker with a fading shot clock (got blocked) can't happen moving forward if he's going to captain this team. He's too talented to be bailing like that. After all the close losses last year, I was hoping that this was an area of emphasis. Now, having said all of that, he gets some moxy and hits the go ahead floater in the paint. I was thrilled with that. We just need that Delon every possession down the stretch. I wanted to travel for this game. I really should have. Can't wait to see my Wichita State coworker on Monday. (He flies out to Kansas first thing in the morning watch his Shockers try and restart their win streak his weekend!)

Here's to making the Cougars play a slow, grind it out game next week. And still beating them by 20!

chrisrenrut
12-04-2014, 01:22 AM
Don't feed the troll -- as a practicing LDS member, I do get embarrassed by BYU fans' behavior. Given their level of preached standard, they just don't acquit themselves well.

Just an observation that I was thinking a of earlier during the Chase Hansen and PAC-12 network discussions. Then this, which seemed totally ridiculous.

Feeding the toll would be more like addressing subject he posted on, wouldn't it? I have no interest discussing something so inane.

justaute
12-04-2014, 01:29 AM
Agreed. I don't even address or discuss anything TDS related anymore. It's just a waste of my time.


Just an observation that I was thinking a of earlier during the Chase Hansen and PAC-12 network discussions. Then this, which seemed totally ridiculous.

Feeding the toll would be more like addressing subject he posted on, wouldn't it? I have no interest discussing something so inane.

LA Ute
12-04-2014, 01:31 AM
I will be more and more happy as this very significant win sinks in. Right now I feel mainly relieved. LK's boys have shown themselves they can tough out a close, big game and get the W. That's huge. Blowing that big lead would have made for a devastating loss. They'll also learn a lot from the film. I hope they get better at FTs. That deficiency alone made the game close and almost cost us the win.

justaute
12-04-2014, 01:32 AM
Yup...52% (12/23) from the charity stripe won't do it.

hostile
12-04-2014, 01:33 AM
Just got home. Talked my wife into letting me take my oldest and stay up late on a school night.

I was surprised at the empty seats but still a lot of energy tonight. Quite a few good things from the game. We out rebounded WSU. Several young players stepped up and contributed. The combo of Poetl and Bach in the middle is going to be key going forward-both did great tonight.

Free throws have to be better. We still get bogged down with the shot clock running down. The nine point swing in less than a minute was brutal.

Looking forward to the next game and seeing how they improve.

Old Standing ute
12-04-2014, 01:36 AM
Would have been a lot bigger had he hit the free throws. I can't believe that they got out of there with a W.

Lot's of youth issues, but I really like this team. Good, competitive wins like this will grow up our freshman fast.

Delon dumping the ball off to Tucker with a fading shot clock (got blocked) can't happen moving forward if he's going to captain this team. He's too talented to be bailing like that. After all the close losses last year, I was hoping that this was an area of emphasis. Now, having said all of that, he gets some moxy and hits the go ahead floater in the paint. I was thrilled with that. We just need that Delon every possession down the stretch. I wanted to travel for this game. I really should have. Can't wait to see my Wichita State coworker on Monday. (He flies out to Kansas first thing in the morning watch his Shockers try and restart their win streak his weekend!)

Here's to making the Cougars play a slow, grind it out game next week. And still beating them by 20!

That was really fun.

I love Larry K, but he needs to work on in-bound plays or lack thereof. We never get much off it, usually have to throw it over the top & hope the Big outjumps someone.
Mistake to have a freshmen--Chapman throwing it in at the end--although Tucker could not get it in either. Release someone long/sent picks moving toward the ball etc.

Not sure how Wich St changed, but they took away Poeltl on the pick & roll-which worked to start the game. He got banged around too, but is still tough undeneath. He really should stay 1-2 more years to grow.

Dallin was huge.
Chapman's one handed bounce pass from top of the key that he turned & slammed was the play of the game.

And all without Loveridge.
Nice.

hostile
12-04-2014, 03:01 AM
Did they say or show on TV what happened to the ref? He did not look good coming off the floor.
It looked to me like he tripped and fell. KSL reports that he was hit in the head by an inadvertent elbow right after the OT jump ball. He definitely looked woozy getting up from the floor. Hope he is OK.

Diehard Ute
12-04-2014, 04:51 AM
It looked to me like he tripped and fell. KSL reports that he was hit in the head by an inadvertent elbow right after the OT jump ball. He definitely looked woozy getting up from the floor. Hope he is OK.

He was hit in the head by the Wichita player on the jump ball. Came straight down on the top of his head. Bill Reilly tweeted Hall remembers almost none of what happened. Likely concussion I would assume

U-Ute
12-04-2014, 08:30 AM
They said in the radio this morning that Loveridge had knee surgery and is out until conference play.

What happened? I don't ever remember him going down.

I'm not going to bother to learn Poeltl's first name. He won't be around next year.

LA Ute
12-04-2014, 08:30 AM
Dakari was Cedric Martin last night. He stopped Baker in the second half. If he can be a defensive stopper AND hit those threes, we're going to be in great shape this season.

UtahsMrSports
12-04-2014, 08:41 AM
They said in the radio this morning that Loveridge had knee surgery and is out until conference play.

What happened? I don't ever remember him going down.

I'm not going to bother to learn Poeltl's first name. He won't be around next year.

I dont think it was a specific play as much as it was just wear and tear on the knee.

concerned
12-04-2014, 09:01 AM
Dakari was Cedric Martin last night. He stopped Baker in the second half. If he can be a defensive stopper AND hit those threes, we're going to be in great shape this season.

We are not going to be in great shape unless Delon becomes more active and a leader. I was very surprised how he disappeared last night. I cant imagine Andre Miller doing that on that stage. I don't see how he is a first round draft choice, IMHO.

Interesting that Poeltl score 11 of our first 15 points or something like that and then only scored on basket or a free throw after that. Did we go away from the pick and roll or did they adjust to take it away?

Tucker was big in the second half, but Taylor was big all game, especially with the drives. I thought he was our MVP.

Both Tucker and Chapman outplayed Ogbe and Reyes. Wouldnt be surpirsed to see Ogbe's minutes dwindle when JLove gets back.

LA Ute
12-04-2014, 09:07 AM
We are not going to be in great shape unless Delon becomes more active and a leader. I was very surprised how he disappeared last night. I cant imagine Andre Miller doing that on that stage. I don't see how he is a first round draft choice, IMHO.

I love Delon, but he is who he is.

U-Ute
12-04-2014, 09:19 AM
I love Delon, but he is who he is.

I agree. It isn't in his nature to be the one to stick the dagger in.

For what it is worth, however, he played 45 minutes last night and still had the gas in the tank to hit that last shot. The guy is a warrior.

Brian
12-04-2014, 09:20 AM
Great game!
I'm going to pay for it today (east coast time zone....) but it was worth it.
Aggravating that they let the lead go in regulation, but WSU is a great team.

UtahsMrSports
12-04-2014, 09:25 AM
We are not going to be in great shape unless Delon becomes more active and a leader. I was very surprised how he disappeared last night. I cant imagine Andre Miller doing that on that stage. I don't see how he is a first round draft choice, IMHO.

Interesting that Poeltl score 11 of our first 15 points or something like that and then only scored on basket or a free throw after that. Did we go away from the pick and roll or did they adjust to take it away?

Tucker was big in the second half, but Taylor was big all game, especially with the drives. I thought he was our MVP.

Both Tucker and Chapman outplayed Ogbe and Reyes. Wouldnt be surpirsed to see Ogbe's minutes dwindle when JLove gets back.

I think Delon is a borderline first/early second round pick. I think (and hope) that he will end up on a team like the Spurs where they will have him learn the art of the corner three. He will be a terrific back up point guard, IMO.

Also, IMO, the backup perimeter minutes that are being split between Ogbe, Tucker, and Kuzma are going to go to the player who hits perimeter shots consistently, and defends well. That is what we need from that position.

Rocker Ute
12-04-2014, 09:25 AM
Haven't gone back to look directly at the stats but it is interesting to see the different takes on who was great and who faded here. A couple of my thoughts:

1. I am surprised to read (here) that we outrebounded them because it sure did not feel like we did. I was amazed at the tenacity Wichita State showed for going for the ball.

2. Bachynksi had a series of scores, rebounds and great defense that really changed the tide for the team in my opinion. He got the guys fired up and that is when things were clicking the best.

3. Poeltl (Who I'm now calling Yurtle the Purtle because of how the announcer says his name) has to gain about 30-40lbs and he'll be a real force. He does get tossed around quite a bit under there, but keeps banging. The shockers were very physical.

4. Some have been critical of Delon fading in that game, I noticed how much focus WS gave him, they had an interesting defensive rotation around him which involved some switching so he always had an effectual double team. But Delon did a lot with that to create opportunities for others I thought. For his own future NBA prospect, he is too much of a team player and too willing to pass. We need the ghost of Big Rick to come down and tell him to show Mike Bibby who the premier guard int he tournament is.

5. Containing Baker as much as we did was a minor miracle because he looked primed to go off at any minute. Tucker deserves credit. My one beef with Tucker is the same as last year on the offensive side (and acknowledging he saved the game for us) but he spends a lot of time hovering around the 3pt line hoping the defense will slough off of him. I don't know that he can create his own shot, although he appeared to be at least willing to move the ball. Regardless, really happy with what he did last night.

6. I was hoping for more of a packed crowd. We were surrounded by about 20 empty seats in our group there. However, when it counted the crowd was as loud as I have ever heard in the JMHC (as spurred on by Brandon Taylor).

Great game, one that will go down as a cherished memory.

sancho
12-04-2014, 09:27 AM
We are not going to be in great shape unless Delon becomes more active and a leader. I was very surprised how he disappeared last night. I cant imagine Andre Miller doing that on that stage. I don't see how he is a first round draft choice, IMHO.

I don't understand this comment. He had 13 points, 6 rebounds, and 7 assists. I don't know how many blocks/steals. He also hit the game winning shot. I can't see how that is disappearing. He disappeared against SDSU. He had a great game last night against what is supposed to be one of the best, toughest defensive teams around.



Tucker was big in the second half, but Taylor was big all game, especially with the drives. I thought he was our MVP.


I agree. But you could also pick Tucker or Wright. Bach was making the Shockers look silly on the glass during his short, high energy run.



Both Tucker and Chapman outplayed Ogbe and Reyes. Wouldnt be surpirsed to see Ogbe's minutes dwindle when JLove gets back.


Ogbe does look like the odd man out after last night. But he was the player of the game last time out. We went through this last season with Tucker/Ogbe. They both stepped up at different times.

U-Ute
12-04-2014, 09:28 AM
Great game!
I'm going to pay for it today (east coast time zone....) but it was worth it.
Aggravating that they let the lead go in regulation, but WSU is a great team.

You have to give Wichita State some credit there. They hit some shots when they had to, and none of the players hitting the shots were named Baker.

sancho
12-04-2014, 09:30 AM
Dakari was Cedric Martin last night. He stopped Baker in the second half. If he can be a defensive stopper AND hit those threes, we're going to be in great shape this season.

That was a 1-dimensional player guarding another 1-dimensional player. Baker is a great shooter, but there is no other aspect of his game that is above average. I don't think we can expect Tucker to be a great defender or rebounder at this point. But his shooting is huge, especially while Loveridge is out.

Mormon Red Death
12-04-2014, 09:35 AM
I don't understand this comment. He had 13 points, 6 rebounds, and 7 assists. I don't know how many blocks/steals. He also hit the game winning shot. I can't see how that is disappearing. He disappeared against SDSU. He had a great game last night against what is supposed to be one of the best, toughest defensive teams around.



I agree. But you could also pick Tucker or Wright. Bach was making the Shockers look silly on the glass during his short, high energy run.



Ogbe does look like the odd man out after last night. But he was the player of the game last time out. We went through this last season with Tucker/Ogbe. They both stepped up at different times.

This is strange as I would put the odds on favorite for odd man out to be tucker.

concerned
12-04-2014, 09:36 AM
I don't understand this comment. He had 13 points, 6 rebounds, and 7 assists. I don't know how many blocks/steals. He also hit the game winning shot. I can't see how that is disappearing. He disappeared against SDSU. He had a great game last night against what is supposed to be one of the best, toughest defensive teams around.


It's not what he did, it is what he could have done and didn't do. I thought there were many situations where he had an open look from 3 and didn't take it. I thought there were many times he could have driven to the basket and didn't. Taylor is fearless going to the rim, despite his height. Delon could use a lot more of that. He didnt control the game or the offense the way you would expect an elite senior guard to do at crunch time (or earlier). I thought Delon could have broken their backs in the second half but he didn't rise to the occasion. He shrunk instead. He's content to be a role player. Just my $0.02.

sancho
12-04-2014, 09:38 AM
1. I am surprised to read (here) that we outrebounded them because it sure did not feel like we did. I was amazed at the tenacity Wichita State showed for going for the ball.

Really? I felt like Bach, Poeltl and Chapman alone outrebounded them. We definitely out hustled them on the glass.



3. Poeltl (Who I'm now calling Yurtle the Purtle because of how the announcer says his name) has to gain about 30-40lbs and he'll be a real force. He does get tossed around quite a bit under there, but keeps banging. The shockers were very physical.


I've always thought that gaining muscle was one of the worst things to happen to KVH. Seemed like he lost his quickness and agility.



My one beef with Tucker is the same as last year on the offensive side (and acknowledging he saved the game for us) but he spends a lot of time hovering around the 3pt line hoping the defense will slough off of him. I don't know that he can create his own shot, although he appeared to be at least willing to move the ball. Regardless, really happy with what he did last night.


I think hovering around the 3 point line is just what we need from him, and that's why he was so effective last night. Though the game tying free-throws came on a dribble drive. I'd love it if he could hit 3's running around screens; I don't think we have a player who can do that.

sancho
12-04-2014, 09:44 AM
It's not what he did, it is what he could have done and didn't do. I thought there were many situations where he had an open look from 3 and didn't take it. I thought there were many times he could have driven to the basket and didn't. Taylor is fearless going to the rim, despite his height. Delon could use a lot more of that. He didnt control the game or the offense the way you would expect an elite senior guard to do at crunch time (or earlier). I thought Delon could have broken their backs in the second half but he didn't rise to the occasion. He shrunk instead. Just my $0.02.

I saw him pass on many 3's. I think that's probably still a good idea for him. He started 0-3 from beyond the arc. His 4th was a huge make, though. I didn't see opportunities for him to drive that he passed on. I thought they were very serious about keeping him out. I do remember a couple of times he attacked the basket, got knocked to the ground, and had to look up at an idiot referee swallowing a whistle.

At least we can agree that this performance was night and day better than what he did vs SDSU.

SoCalPat
12-04-2014, 09:48 AM
Wichita State is my No. 2 school, but until last night, I didn't know the distance between the Shockers and Utah. After last night, I can safely say it's pretty wide. I didn't hate to see WSU get off to the 10-0 run to start the game, but I was elated to see the Utes get back in it and largely dominate the second half.

Tucker was huge for us. I thought Kuzma would take his minutes away, but Dak has responded well to the challenge. His defense on Baker is something none of us would have envisioned, and his 3s were nails. Maybe he was the missing piece vs SDSU?

Bach brings a relentlessness to the offensive glass that Poeltl doesn't yet have. Would love to see our +/- with Bach in the game.

We needed someone on WSU to have a bad game, but even for Fred VV's struggles, he was the catalyst behind the late run that sent the game to OT.

We're seeing how the rotation and minutes will look like in league play. Thinking the odd man out when Loveridge is back is Ogbe, who hasn't shown capable of being an impact starter. He's best suited for the role Dakari filled last night. Kuzma and Olsen will lead the towel waving brigade.

All in all, a great win over a very good team. In spite of blowing a sizeable lead late, we should feel a sense of satisfaction and pride over this result. It's probably how SDSU felt after beating us.

Jarid in Cedar
12-04-2014, 09:57 AM
Sorry you couldn't make it,SCP. Watching on TV made me reminisce to being at the games for the kvn, Miller era.

As far as the rotation, I think we will see Coach K go with who is getting the job done. Some nights it will be Ogbe, others Tucker, and occasionally Kuzma or Chapman. Even Olsen will probably have a game that we look back at and say he was the difference.

U-Ute
12-04-2014, 09:57 AM
Tucker was huge for us. I thought Kuzma would take his minutes away, but Dak has responded well to the challenge. His defense on Baker is something none of us would have envisioned, and his 3s were nails. Maybe he was the missing piece vs SDSU?

Kuzma is great when he can be bigger and more athletic than the opponent. He was a no show in both the SDSU and Wichita State games. He needs to learn how to play with the big boys.

Chapman may not have had huge games against the inferior opponents, but he has showed sack against the big boys.

Speaking of Chapman, I swear his shots come down slower than everyone else's. Its like they defy gravity. That kid has an incredible touch on his shots.

UtahsMrSports
12-04-2014, 10:03 AM
As far as the rotation, I think we will see Coach K go with who is getting the job done. Some nights it will be Ogbe, others Tucker, and occasionally Kuzma or Chapman. Even Olsen will probably have a game that we look back at and say he was the difference.

This is spot on, although Ill say that Chapman is closer to being a starter right now than he is to being in the "occasional" group.

SoCalPat
12-04-2014, 10:13 AM
Sorry you couldn't make it,SCP. Watching on TV made me reminisce to being at the games for the kvn, Miller era.

As far as the rotation, I think we will see Coach K go with who is getting the job done. Some nights it will be Ogbe, others Tucker, and occasionally Kuzma or Chapman. Even Olsen will probably have a game that we look back at and say he was the difference.

I think I'm gonna come down for the BYU game. It's a 7 pm start and even though it's an hour longer drive, I should have most of the drive home completed by midnight. But I gotta find a way to appease the wife!

sancho
12-04-2014, 10:16 AM
I think I'm gonna come down for the BYU game. It's a 7 pm start and even though it's an hour longer drive, I should have most of the drive home completed by midnight. But I gotta find a way to appease the wife!

I hate that the Kansas game is just a couple days after @BYU. Seems like - win or lose - it's a tough turnaround emotionally.

Diehard Ute
12-04-2014, 10:39 AM
They said in the radio this morning that Loveridge had knee surgery and is out until conference play.

What happened? I don't ever remember him going down.

I'm not going to bother to learn Poeltl's first name. He won't be around next year.

Apparently he's had some debris under his knee cap for some time and it finally just got to be too much so they cleaned it out

U-Ute
12-04-2014, 10:59 AM
I hate that the Kansas game is just a couple days after @BYU. Seems like - win or lose - it's a tough turnaround emotionally.

Good practice for the conference season.

SeattleUte
12-04-2014, 11:21 AM
When they cut it to 4 with that 3 I knew we were probably in for a wild finish. WSU has a lot of heart. It's nice to see an outsized heart on our side plus athleticism that matched or exceeded that of a very good team. I agree with what Pat said about Tucker. Pluse those two free throws were totally nails.

And we did it without Loveridge. When will he return?

sancho
12-04-2014, 11:24 AM
And we did it without Loveridge. When will he return?

January. They say for the start of conference play.

Mormon Red Death
12-04-2014, 11:24 AM
When they cut it to 4 with that 3 I knew we were probably in for a wild finish. WSU has a lot of heart. It's nice to see an outsized heart on our side plus athleticism that matched or exceeded that of a very good team. I agree with what Pat said about Tucker. Pluse those two free throws were totally nails.

And we did it without Loveridge. When will he return?

January

SeattleUte
12-04-2014, 11:27 AM
January

That sucks. Oh well. Maybe someone else will seize the day.

SeattleUte
12-04-2014, 11:29 AM
Haven't gone back to look directly at the stats but it is interesting to see the different takes on who was great and who faded here. A couple of my thoughts:

1. I am surprised to read (here) that we outrebounded them because it sure did not feel like we did. I was amazed at the tenacity Wichita State showed for going for the ball.

2. Bachynksi had a series of scores, rebounds and great defense that really changed the tide for the team in my opinion. He got the guys fired up and that is when things were clicking the best.

3. Poeltl (Who I'm now calling Yurtle the Purtle because of how the announcer says his name) has to gain about 30-40lbs and he'll be a real force. He does get tossed around quite a bit under there, but keeps banging. The shockers were very physical.

4. Some have been critical of Delon fading in that game, I noticed how much focus WS gave him, they had an interesting defensive rotation around him which involved some switching so he always had an effectual double team. But Delon did a lot with that to create opportunities for others I thought. For his own future NBA prospect, he is too much of a team player and too willing to pass. We need the ghost of Big Rick to come down and tell him to show Mike Bibby who the premier guard int he tournament is.

5. Containing Baker as much as we did was a minor miracle because he looked primed to go off at any minute. Tucker deserves credit. My one beef with Tucker is the same as last year on the offensive side (and acknowledging he saved the game for us) but he spends a lot of time hovering around the 3pt line hoping the defense will slough off of him. I don't know that he can create his own shot, although he appeared to be at least willing to move the ball. Regardless, really happy with what he did last night.

6. I was hoping for more of a packed crowd. We were surrounded by about 20 empty seats in our group there. However, when it counted the crowd was as loud as I have ever heard in the JMHC (as spurred on by Brandon Taylor).

Great game, one that will go down as a cherished memory.

I had my tablet on the stats while watching the game, so I knew we outrebounded them. But I thought it looked on TV like we were winning the boards. I thought that overall we looked bigger and more athletic. They looked more seasoned and maybe polished. I'm surprised we hung on in the overtime, especially since we're such a bad FT shooting team (Poetl must have intentionally missed that last one).

Rocker Ute
12-04-2014, 11:38 AM
Really? I felt like Bach, Poeltl and Chapman alone outrebounded them. We definitely out hustled them on the glass.



I've always thought that gaining muscle was one of the worst things to happen to KVH. Seemed like he lost his quickness and agility.



I think hovering around the 3 point line is just what we need from him, and that's why he was so effective last night. Though the game tying free-throws came on a dribble drive. I'd love it if he could hit 3's running around screens; I don't think we have a player who can do that.

My own negativity is coming out on the rebound thing.

I think you hit what I was trying to say about Tucker, specifically he'd be deadly if he could move to or create his own 3pt shot. Right now he needs to be pretty set up.

On Poeltl muscle, I think as a big man it is different than KVH. He doesn't need to be Bachynski, but he'll need some size to help him on energy against true bugs. Wichita State has some thick but shorter guys. Thick and as tall as him might catch up.

sancho
12-04-2014, 11:43 AM
I think you hit what I was trying to say about Tucker, specifically he'd be deadly if he could move to or create his own 3pt shot. Right now he needs to be pretty set up.


I seem to remember us trying Taylor off screens for 3's last year, and it didn't really work. I think all we can do right now is set people up for open 3's. But we might be able to get a lot out of that with Taylor/Wright driving and Poeltl in the post.

When will Poeltl go against a strong defensive center? Does BYU have one of those? Kansas?

Has anyone noticed that the UNLV game is looking less like a quality game with the rebels losing? If they keep losing, it will cross over into "must win" status for us.

justaute
12-04-2014, 11:46 AM
Not sure about Utah being more athletic. Collectively, as a team, maybe. As far as starting 5, I think WSU is more athletic -- 2V, Baker, Cotton, Kelly, and Carter. Carter reminded me a lot of Walter Watts, short-ish and round; he has really nice touch around the rim and knows how to use his girth against Poeltl. Good thing he was in foul trouble.

U-Ute
12-04-2014, 11:51 AM
When will Poeltl go against a strong defensive center?

Most of these types of guys are already in the NBA.


Does BYU have one of those? Kansas?

BYU has Nate Austin and Luke Worthington. Meh.

I'm personally looking forward to hearing about the Jakob Poeltl vs Sviatoslav Mykhailiuk matchup. The announcers will have their work cut out for them. Especially if we throw Bachynski in at the same time. Someone will sprain a consonant.

LA Ute
12-04-2014, 11:53 AM
I agree with what Pat said about Tucker. Plus those two free throws were totally nails.

While everyone else was missing FTs and jeopardizing the win, it was nice to see him calmly sink those two.

Plus, if you look at Baker's stats he was on fire in the first half. Tucker all but shut him down in the second. It was one of the keys to the win.

justaute
12-04-2014, 11:58 AM
Absolutely about Tucker's FT -- that was ice.



[QUOTE=SeattleUte;46436]I agree with what Pat said about Tucker. Plus those two free throws were totally nails.[QUOTE]

While everyone else was missing FTs and jeopardizing the win, it was nice to see him calmly sink those two.

Plus, if you look at Baker's stats he was on fire in the first half. Tucker all but shut him down in the second. It was one of the keys to the win.

Diehard Ute
12-04-2014, 12:00 PM
Not sure about Utah being more athletic. Collectively, as a team, maybe. As far as starting 5, I think WSU is more athletic -- 2V, Baker, Cotton, Kelly, and Carter. Carter reminded me a lot of Walter Watts, short-ish and round; he has really nice touch around the rim and knows how to use his girth against Poeltl. Good thing he was in foul trouble.

Baker didn't strike me as athletic. His one attempt at showboating his athletic ability ended up a nice brick.

SeattleUte
12-04-2014, 12:00 PM
Delon hit the game winning shot. He didn't disappear then. I love Taylor. The prototypical Ute. Jonas, Soto, etc. He's one of them.

sancho
12-04-2014, 12:03 PM
Baker didn't strike me as athletic. His one attempt at showboating his athletic ability ended up a nice brick.

You can't dunk! You can't dunk!

U-Ute
12-04-2014, 12:03 PM
Delon hit the game winning shot. He didn't disappear then. I love Taylor. The prototypical Ute. Jonas, Soto, etc. He's one of them.

This. So much this.

U-Ute
12-04-2014, 12:08 PM
A recap from our friend at PacHoops (http://pachoops.com/2014/12/utah-wins-the-changing-luck-of-the-utes/)


Perhaps I should rephrase: Utah was peeing down their leg as Wichita State was handling business as usual. “We don’t lose these games,” said the Shocker body language. “We do!” said the Utes’.

LOL It's funny because we won.

justaute
12-04-2014, 12:11 PM
Even NBA big men miss dunks -- just look at the penultimate shot Baker made around Poeltl. I think that alone speaks to his level of athleticism.

D/Wright had at least two of his dunks blocked by the rim earlier in the season.


Baker didn't strike me as athletic. His one attempt at showboating his athletic ability ended up a nice brick.

Diehard Ute
12-04-2014, 12:13 PM
Even NBA big men miss dunks -- just look at the penultimate shot Baker made around Poeltl. I think that alone speaks to his level of athleticism.

D/Wright had at least two of his dunks blocked by the rim earlier in the season.

Yes, but it was the way he missed the dunk. He tried to show off and didn't have the athletic ability to do it.

He's a good shooter when he's screened open, once Tucker started playing him and he had to try and create more he struggled. I didn't find him to be athletic.

And perhaps you missed the NBA scout questioning Delon's athletic ability on press row last night. (It was tweeted out)

sancho
12-04-2014, 12:17 PM
He's a good shooter when he's screened open, once Tucker started playing him and he had to try and create more he struggled. I didn't find him to be athletic.


Yes, this is what Baker is. Great shooter. Can get his shot off quickly. And that makes him a heck of a player, but nothing else about him is above average.

Rocker Ute
12-04-2014, 12:31 PM
I seem to remember us trying Taylor off screens for 3's last year, and it didn't really work. I think all we can do right now is set people up for open 3's. But we might be able to get a lot out of that with Taylor/Wright driving and Poeltl in the post.

When will Poeltl go against a strong defensive center? Does BYU have one of those? Kansas?

Has anyone noticed that the UNLV game is looking less like a quality game with the rebels losing? If they keep losing, it will cross over into "must win" status for us.

They are definitely working to his strengths and it works. I just have this thought of what he COULD be if he could create his own shot versus what he currently is, which is a role player. But as many have said, his critical FTs were ice cold, and his defense on Baker in the second half could not be understated. The two fouls on Baker in the first half helped us tremendously on defending him too, as he sat on the bench and we got back into the game.

We can almost say Tucker's defense was almost as good as a benched Baker.

Also, one other thing about Baker, the dude is tough and has Bronco's favorite element, grit. I have to admit that he is one of my favorite CBB players right now.

LA Ute
12-04-2014, 12:39 PM
A recap from our friend at PacHoops (http://pachoops.com/2014/12/utah-wins-the-changing-luck-of-the-utes/)



LOL It's funny because we won.

I think the entire article is excellent. Does anyone else remember Ken Pomeroy's analysis of Utah's luck last season? As I watched that nine point lead disappear, I thought, "Oh no, it's happening again." If we had been a little less lucky, and it just a little less tough, we would have lost, and we would've had a terrible narrative continue from last season: Utah chokes away close games.

One moment comes to mind: Toward the end, a Shocker player stole the ball from Delon from behind, but Utah had called a timeout a split second before the steal, and we were saved from the consequences of that lapse.

I don't mean to be critical, only to say that we came very close. I hope that the team takes great strength from the fact that it hung in there last night and got a close win against a great team. This may be the game where the Utes got that "choke monkey" off their backs.

U-Ute
12-04-2014, 12:42 PM
I think the entire article is excellent. Does anyone else remember Ken Pomeroy's analysis of Utah's luck last season? As I watched that nine point lead disappear, I thought, "Oh no, it's happening again." If we had been a little less lucky, and it just a little less tough, we would have lost, and we would've had a terrible narrative continue from last season: Utah chokes away close games.

I'd be lying if I didn't admit that I had a certain sense of deja-vu myself. :Ashamed:


One moment comes to mind: Toward the end, a Shocker player stole the ball from Delon from behind, but Utah had called a timeout a split second before the steal, and we were saved from the consequences of that lapse.

To be fair, I thought Delon pulled up because he heard the coaches calling timeout. But your point still stands: this game could've easily gone the other direction. One awry snot bubble could've had us crying this morning.

justaute
12-04-2014, 12:44 PM
I think we are almost on the same page. Don't get me wrong, Baker isn't super athletic by any means, but for a shooter, he's quite decent.

Of course, I guess it's all relative. I had a 35" standing vertical in my younger days and can dunk at 6'1" -- people thought I was super athletic. I was above-average, but nothing special.



Yes, but it was the way he missed the dunk. He tried to show off and didn't have the athletic ability to do it.

He's a good shooter when he's screened open, once Tucker started playing him and he had to try and create more he struggled. I didn't find him to be athletic.

And perhaps you missed the NBA scout questioning Delon's athletic ability on press row last night. (It was tweeted out)

UBlender
12-04-2014, 12:46 PM
While everyone else was missing FTs and jeopardizing the win, it was nice to see him calmly sink those two.

Plus, if you look at Baker's stats he was on fire in the first half. Tucker all but shut him down in the second. It was one of the keys to the win.

Absolutely! On a team that has the talent but struggles on the road and in close games, Dakarai is one guy who does not shrink in the big moment. Same with Chapman, he made some mistakes late but overall he comes into the game unafraid of the competition (he was one of the few who looked ready to compete against SDSU).

Diehard Ute
12-04-2014, 12:48 PM
I think the entire article is excellent. Does anyone else remember Ken Pomeroy's analysis of Utah's luck last season? As I watched that nine point lead disappear, I thought, "Oh no, it's happening again." If we had been a little less lucky, and it just a little less tough, we would have lost, and we would've had a terrible narrative continue from last season: Utah chokes away close games.

One moment comes to mind: Toward the end, a Shocker player stole the ball from Delon from behind, but Utah had called a timeout a split second before the steal, and we were saved from the consequences of that lapse.

I don't mean to be critical, only to say that we came very close. I hope that the team takes great strength from the fact that it hung in there last night and got a close win against a great team. This may be the game where the Utes got that "choke monkey" off their backs.

And I'd love to go back to the 5 second call. From the stand I watched Tucker signal timeout twice before the ref blew his whistle but he seemed to be looking for fouls and not watching Tucker.


It's a game of inches and seconds for sure.

UBlender
12-04-2014, 12:49 PM
I had my tablet on the stats while watching the game, so I knew we outrebounded them. But I thought it looked on TV like we were winning the boards. I thought that overall we looked bigger and more athletic. They looked more seasoned and maybe polished. I'm surprised we hung on in the overtime, especially since we're such a bad FT shooting team (Poetl must have intentionally missed that last one).

I believe so. In that situation, WSU's final shot is almost certain to be a three pointer so if you can't get the three point lead, there is little gained by going up by two. I was hollering for him to miss it and hope the rebound gets batted around and time expires. I do think he missed it on purpose but unfortunately WSU got a clean rebound and quick timeout.

WSU had one timeout left. I'm a little surprised Van Vleet didn't take it immediately on the catch at halfcourt so they could set up a play from there with about 1.0 second remaining.

UBlender
12-04-2014, 12:55 PM
Wichita State is my No. 2 school, but until last night, I didn't know the distance between the Shockers and Utah. After last night, I can safely say it's pretty wide. I didn't hate to see WSU get off to the 10-0 run to start the game, but I was elated to see the Utes get back in it and largely dominate the second half.

Tucker was huge for us. I thought Kuzma would take his minutes away, but Dak has responded well to the challenge. His defense on Baker is something none of us would have envisioned, and his 3s were nails. Maybe he was the missing piece vs SDSU?

Bach brings a relentlessness to the offensive glass that Poeltl doesn't yet have. Would love to see our +/- with Bach in the game.

We needed someone on WSU to have a bad game, but even for Fred VV's struggles, he was the catalyst behind the late run that sent the game to OT.

We're seeing how the rotation and minutes will look like in league play. Thinking the odd man out when Loveridge is back is Ogbe, who hasn't shown capable of being an impact starter. He's best suited for the role Dakari filled last night. Kuzma and Olsen will lead the towel waving brigade.

All in all, a great win over a very good team. In spite of blowing a sizeable lead late, we should feel a sense of satisfaction and pride over this result. It's probably how SDSU felt after beating us.

I think Larry will probably settle on a 9-man of DWright, Taylor, Loveridge, Reyes, Poeltl with Tucker, Ogbe, Chapman and Bach off the bench, but he will find spots for the others much like he did last year with a guy like Ahmad Fields who wasn't in the every game rotation but still played (well) in some big spots when matchups dictated it. IWright, Kuzma and Olsen may not be penciled in for consistent minutes each night but will have their opportunities. Kuzma is the real wild card because he has some talents that are otherwise lacking--if he puts things together he will demand minutes at the expense of some combination of Tucker/Ogbe/Loveridge.

One gripe, we cannot afford to have Delon go the whole way in these games. He was worn out last year and it will happen again. He appeared visibly tired most of the second half. I was surprised and impressed he was able to get his five points in OT, but making that a regular strategy in big games will burn him out, IMO.

Diehard Ute
12-04-2014, 12:57 PM
I think Larry will probably settle on a 9-man of DWright, Taylor, Loveridge, Reyes, Poeltl with Tucker, Ogbe, Chapman and Bach off the bench, but he will find spots for the others much like he did last year with a guy like Ahmad Fields who wasn't in the every game rotation but still played (well) in some big spots when matchups dictated it. IWright, Kuzma and Olsen may not be penciled in for consistent minutes each night but will have their opportunities. Kuzma is the real wild card because he has some talents that are otherwise lacking--if he puts things together he will demand minutes at the expense of some combination of Tucker/Ogbe/Loveridge.

One gripe, we cannot afford to have Delon go the whole way in these games. He was worn out last year and it will happen again. He appeared visibly tired most of the second half. I was surprised and impressed he was able to get his five points in OT, but making that a regular strategy in big games will burn him out, IMO.

Don't you think missing Jordan caused some of that? I imagine having one less scorer made the rotations different and made Delon's minutes go up.

LA Ute
12-04-2014, 01:08 PM
One gripe, we cannot afford to have Delon go the whole way in these games. He was worn out last year and it will happen again. He appeared visibly tired most of the second half. I was surprised and impressed he was able to get his five points in OT, but making that a regular strategy in big games will burn him out, IMO.

IIRC, Larry said in the post-game interview that he didn't want to play Delon that much. FWIW.

LA Ute
12-04-2014, 01:44 PM
And I'd love to go back to the 5 second call. From the stand I watched Tucker signal timeout twice before the ref blew his whistle but he seemed to be looking for fouls and not watching Tucker.


It's a game of inches and seconds for sure.

I can't remember (will probably re-watch parts of the game), but was that 5-second call one of the points when Larry went nuts?

Diehard Ute
12-04-2014, 01:48 PM
I can't remember (will probably re-watch parts of the game), but was that 5-second call one of the points when Larry went nuts?

Yup. Pretty sure he saw Tucker signaling timeout just like I did.

As for nuts Larry's jumping chest bump with Dalin was my favorite thing of the night.

The Wichita media folks are making a few comments about the locker room Wichita had saying it was small without lockers.

Guessing the women's game before the men's game affected that, but it also seems they were expecting the lap of luxury and were surprised they didn't get it.

LA Ute
12-04-2014, 01:54 PM
This was one pretty pass:

http://www.snappytv.com/snaps/precision-pass-big-slam-about-men-s-basketball-wichita-state-at-utah-on-pac-12-amv-ch-1_is/66121

sancho
12-04-2014, 01:58 PM
I can't remember (will probably re-watch parts of the game), but was that 5-second call one of the points when Larry went nuts?

I remember him going nuts after the awful backcourt violation. Every time I started feeling bad for the ref who got knocked out, I reminded myself of the backcourt violation, and I got back on track.

Diehard Ute
12-04-2014, 02:00 PM
I remember him going nuts after the awful backcourt violation. Every time I started feeling bad for the ref who got knocked out, I reminded myself of the backcourt violation, and I got back on track.

Wasn't the same ref who made that bad call.

sancho
12-04-2014, 02:05 PM
Wasn't the same ref who made that bad call.

Doesn't matter. I just had to remember what he's capable of. If you're going to sell you soul, get something decent in return. These morons just got the opportunity to get booed by thousands every night. Maybe the feeling of making a really dramatic charge call is worth it.

Applejack
12-04-2014, 02:07 PM
Great win, we needed that. Overall I thought Wichita State was a tougher, more experienced team. They got most of the 50/50 balls and they had smaller guys getting rebounds on us (especially in the first half).

This new motion offense is going to take some time to implement. It's the right offense for our personnel, but there are a lot of guys (Chapman, Delon) who still don't know where they should be when they are off the ball. It will come, I think.

Player thoughts:

- B Taylor: I love this guy. He is our best on-ball defender and always draws the toughest matchup on the other team. He is also the guy who ends up forcing shots because he's the only guy (other than Delon) who can create a shot for himself. He made a ton of huge buckets last night.

- Delon: Solid game overall. He still hasn't figured out what to do in late game situations. I think Larry could help him out more here by either running total isos if the other team is in man or creative picks and rolls (not just Poeltl at the top of the key - use some motion to bring the pick from somewhere the defense doesn't anticipate). The iso play at the end when Delon hit the little flip shot was great, but Delon still seemed surprised. They should be running tons of these end of the game plays in practice. And they all should start with Delon.

- Poeltl: The kid is amazingly athletic. He still has a lot to work on (footwork in the post is horrid, gets pushed around a lot, FREE THROWS), but I can see why Chad Ford has a boner for him. He's definitely not sticking around for four years. We might not get two. His elite skill is going to be either (a) rebounding if he can bulk up or (b) help defense - he has really nice timing so he doesn't foul very often.

- Bach: Taylor is my MVP from last night, but Bach is a close second. Poeltl's emergence allows Bach to be exactly what he always should have been - a high energy bench guy. His nine minutes of playing time felt like 20. His backcut on the Chapman bounce pass was a really intelligent move. He's always good on the defensive glass, but he really owned the offensive rebounds as well. A+ game for him.

- Tucker: Also a great game. Dakarai is going to get his minutes if only because he's the only pure shooter on the team. Chapman, Ogbe, and Taylor can all shoot, but Dakarai is the only guy who makes the defense adjust when he's in the game. Delon's job is a lot easier when Tucker is on the floor.

- Chapman: I thought this was a really nice effort from him. The kid has a great stroke and he has really great vision for a kid who was the guy in high school. He's the best passing big man we've had since Bogut. He is a perfect high post 4 and will be able to play the stretch 4 once he can get his shot fine tuned (it won't take much). He's the future.

- Reyes: Pretty much invisible last night. He hustles, but he's undersized. I'm not sure what to think about him yet.

- Kuzma/Olsen/Ogbe/I Wright: Incomplete. I think Tucker is going to get the nod at starter over Ogbe, but it might depend on matchups. Kuzma is clearly still getting up to speed.

A couple of things I'd like to see in the future:

+ Inbounds plays: I think OldStandingUte mentioned this, and I harped on it all of last year. We run the same thing on every inbounds play, two screens hoping for a layup and then the screeners fan out to half court. We need to fix this. Watch BYU - they get about 8 points a game on inbounds plays. Majerus used to own this part of the game. Inbounds plays should be weapons and for us they are turnover opportunities. We need to fix this and it is a 100% coaching thing.

+ More set plays: I like the motion, but with Delon and Poeltl, we should be running a few exotic screen looks to get Delon in mismatches or Poeltl running to the rim. I'm hoping the coaches implement some of this as the year progresses.

+ Jeremy Olsen: he's clearly the odd man out right now, but I think that it could be interesting to run him with Poeltl for 3 or 4 minutes a game. Olsen is our best post player on offense, so teams have to respect him and it would open up Poeltl for some backcuts or offensive rebounds. On defense, Olsen is kind of terrible, but Poeltl helps this as well. Teams think twice about layups when he's in.

+ Breakkott at the high post: the kid has such good vision that I'd like to see some screens between Poeltl and Chapman, with Chapman catching the ball at the foul line and either tossing to Poeltl if the screened man gets lost, shooting his soft jumper if no one helps, or putting it on the floor and dishing to someone in the corner.

+ Better screens: this is my BIGGEST complaint right now. Our high screens are terrible (mostly because our guards aren't rubbing). This is why SDSU shut us down and why Wichita seemed to be in our lap on every hand off. If we're going to set so many screens, the guards need to use them correctly. Delon is the biggest offender here, but really all of our guards do it. It must get cleaned up or 60 points will be our high score from here on out.

+ Fewer games tipping off at 11;20 PM.

UBlender
12-04-2014, 02:10 PM
Don't you think missing Jordan caused some of that? I imagine having one less scorer made the rotations different and made Delon's minutes go up.

It may have done so, but I would expect that Utah still had the man power to give Delon a couple of 2-3 minute breaks. Ogbe didn't play many minutes--he could have easily played more to have given Delon a break. But it's splitting hairs now, the point is that this hurt Utah last year and I hate to see it happen again this year.

justaute
12-04-2014, 02:14 PM
Oh...just want to echo what a few others have said. Really enjoyed watching the Shockers -- solid, smart, and never say quit. My kind of team.

Diehard Ute
12-04-2014, 02:15 PM
- B Taylor: I love this guy. We are going to miss him just as much as Delon next year. He is our best on-ball defender and always draws the toughest matchup on the other team. He is also the guy who ends up forcing shots because he's the only guy (other than Delon) who can create a shot for himself. He made a ton of huge buckets last night.

.

Is Taylor planning on leaving early? He's only a junior.

Applejack
12-04-2014, 02:16 PM
Is Taylor planning on leaving early? He's only a junior.

Holy crap, how did I not know that?!?! This is just as good as winning the game last night.

LA Ute
12-04-2014, 02:17 PM
+ Inbounds plays: I like OldStandingUte mentioned this, and I harped on it all of last year. We run the same thing on every inbounds play, two screens hoping for a layup and then the screeners fan out to half court. We need to fix this. Watch BYU - they get about 8 points a game on inbounds plays. Majerus used to own this part of the game. Inbounds plays should be weapons and for us they are turnover opportunities. We need to fix this and it is a 100% coaching thing.

Your entire post was great and interesting.

Regarding in-bounds plays, I remember in the final seconds of the Alabama game back in 2002 (I was there for that one), Utah had the ball out of bounds in an obvious fouling situation -- i.e., the game was either tied or Utah had a 1-point lead and Alabama was going to foul someone as soon as the ball came in. I told my son, "Watch, Alabama will try to deny the ball to Nick Jacobsen but Majerus will run an out-of-bounds play designed to get the ball into Nick's hands." Sure enough, that's exactly what happened. Nick was immediately fouled and made both shots, putting the game on ice. I miss that kind of precision coaching. Larry needs to do better at in-bounds plays.

LA Ute
12-04-2014, 02:19 PM
Holy crap, how did I not know that?!?! This is just as good as winning the game last night.

I've begun calling him The Little Assassin. Not a bad name for Brandon.

Applejack
12-04-2014, 02:20 PM
A great and interesting post.

Regarding in-bounds plays, I remember in the final seconds of the Alabama game back in 2002 (I was there for that one), Utah had the ball out of bounds in an obvious fouling situation -- i.e., the game was either tied or Utah had a 1-point lead and Alabama was going to foul someone as soon as the ball came in. I told my son, "Watch, Alabama will try to deny the ball to Nick Jacobsen but Majerus will run an out-of-bounds play designed to get the ball into Nick's hands." Sure enough, that's exactly what happened. Nick was immediately fouled and made both shots, putting the game on ice. I miss that kind of precision coaching. Larry needs to do better at in-bounds plays.



I too was there, but I don't remember that specific play. I have no doubt of its veracity, however, as Majerus basically invented the inbounds play.

All I remember from the 2002 Alabama game was thinking "This will probably be the last time we ever beat an Alabama team in any sport." Wrong again!

UtahsMrSports
12-04-2014, 02:26 PM
Great win, we needed that. Overall I thought Wichita State was a tougher, more experienced team. They got most of the 50/50 balls and they had smaller guys getting rebounds on us (especially in the first half).

This new motion offense is going to take some time to implement. It's the right offense for our personnel, but there are a lot of guys (Chapman, Delon) who still don't know where they should be when they are off the ball. It will come, I think.

Player thoughts:

- B Taylor: I love this guy. He is our best on-ball defender and always draws the toughest matchup on the other team. He is also the guy who ends up forcing shots because he's the only guy (other than Delon) who can create a shot for himself. He made a ton of huge buckets last night.

- Delon: Solid game overall. He still hasn't figured out what to do in late game situations. I think Larry could help him out more here by either running total isos if the other team is in man or creative picks and rolls (not just Poeltl at the top of the key - use some motion to bring the pick from somewhere the defense doesn't anticipate). The iso play at the end when Delon hit the little flip shot was great, but Delon still seemed surprised. They should be running tons of these end of the game plays in practice. And they all should start with Delon.

- Poeltl: The kid is amazingly athletic. He still has a lot to work on (footwork in the post is horrid, gets pushed around a lot, FREE THROWS), but I can see why Chad Ford has a boner for him. He's definitely not sticking around for four years. We might not get two. His elite skill is going to be either (a) rebounding if he can bulk up or (b) help defense - he has really nice timing so he doesn't foul very often.

- Bach: Taylor is my MVP from last night, but Bach is a close second. Poeltl's emergence allows Bach to be exactly what he always should have been - a high energy bench guy. His nine minutes of playing time felt like 20. His backcut on the Chapman bounce pass was a really intelligent move. He's always good on the defensive glass, but he really owned the offensive rebounds as well. A+ game for him.

- Tucker: Also a great game. Dakarai is going to get his minutes if only because he's the only pure shooter on the team. Chapman, Ogbe, and Taylor can all shoot, but Dakarai is the only guy who makes the defense adjust when he's in the game. Delon's job is a lot easier when Tucker is on the floor.

- Chapman: I thought this was a really nice effort from him. The kid has a great stroke and he has really great vision for a kid who was the guy in high school. He's the best passing big man we've had since Bogut. He is a perfect high post 4 and will be able to play the stretch 4 once he can get his shot fine tuned (it won't take much). He's the future.

- Reyes: Pretty much invisible last night. He hustles, but he's undersized. I'm not sure what to think about him yet.

- Kuzma/Olsen/Ogbe/I Wright: Incomplete. I think Tucker is going to get the nod at starter over Ogbe, but it might depend on matchups. Kuzma is clearly still getting up to speed.

A couple of things I'd like to see in the future:

+ Inbounds plays: I think OldStandingUte mentioned this, and I harped on it all of last year. We run the same thing on every inbounds play, two screens hoping for a layup and then the screeners fan out to half court. We need to fix this. Watch BYU - they get about 8 points a game on inbounds plays. Majerus used to own this part of the game. Inbounds plays should be weapons and for us they are turnover opportunities. We need to fix this and it is a 100% coaching thing.

+ More set plays: I like the motion, but with Delon and Poeltl, we should be running a few exotic screen looks to get Delon in mismatches or Poeltl running to the rim. I'm hoping the coaches implement some of this as the year progresses.

+ Jeremy Olsen: he's clearly the odd man out right now, but I think that it could be interesting to run him with Poeltl for 3 or 4 minutes a game. Olsen is our best post player on offense, so teams have to respect him and it would open up Poeltl for some backcuts or offensive rebounds. On defense, Olsen is kind of terrible, but Poeltl helps this as well. Teams think twice about layups when he's in.

+ Breakkott at the high post: the kid has such good vision that I'd like to see some screens between Poeltl and Chapman, with Chapman catching the ball at the foul line and either tossing to Poeltl if the screened man gets lost, shooting his soft jumper if no one helps, or putting it on the floor and dishing to someone in the corner.

+ Better screens: this is my BIGGEST complaint right now. Our high screens are terrible (mostly because our guards aren't rubbing). This is why SDSU shut us down and why Wichita seemed to be in our lap on every hand off. If we're going to set so many screens, the guards need to use them correctly. Delon is the biggest offender here, but really all of our guards do it. It must get cleaned up or 60 points will be our high score from here on out.

+ Fewer games tipping off at 11;20 PM.

Ive said it here and elsewhere but I truly wonder how long Larry can justify starting Reyes over Brekkott with a straight face.

U-Ute
12-04-2014, 02:28 PM
This was one pretty pass:

http://www.snappytv.com/snaps/precision-pass-big-slam-about-men-s-basketball-wichita-state-at-utah-on-pac-12-amv-ch-1_is/66121

Dat pass...

LA Ute
12-04-2014, 02:30 PM
Ive said it here and elsewhere but I truly wonder how long Larry can justify starting Reyes over Brekkott with a straight face.

Maybe I am blocking it out -- did Reyes brick two critical last-second FTs at the end or just one?

LA Ute
12-04-2014, 02:32 PM
Dat pass...

I enjoy watching JO go nuts on the sideline over Dallin's success.

hostile
12-04-2014, 02:32 PM
Maybe I am blocking it out -- did Reyes brick two critical last-second FTs at the end or just one?
Missed the front end. Never got a chance for the second.

Dwight Schr-Ute
12-04-2014, 02:33 PM
I noticed in the second half that when Delon had the ball near the top of the key, WSU show the double team with their big man, then he'd sag back towards the basket. When the big guy would sag, Delon would follow him in for a good 5-10 before pulling back out. I was hoping that with his ability to finish at the rim he'd get a bit more aggressive and either finish, or drop it of to Poeltl for the dunk. But it never happened.

sancho
12-04-2014, 02:34 PM
Ive said it here and elsewhere but I truly wonder how long Larry can justify starting Reyes over Brekkott with a straight face.

I don't care who starts, but Reyes is valuable enough to get time. He hustles. He has some post moves and experience and has hit a few jumpers.

U-Ute
12-04-2014, 02:35 PM
I don't care who starts, but Reyes is valuable enough to get time. He hustles. He has some post moves and experience and has hit a few jumpers.

He is an energy guy. Very active on the glass.

LA Ute
12-04-2014, 02:38 PM
I don't care who starts, but Reyes is valuable enough to get time. He hustles. He has some post moves and experience and has hit a few jumpers.

I think Larry wants him in for his muscle and for rebounding, but last night he had 3 boards and Brekott had 4.

Final Stats (http://www.utahutes.com/sports/m-baskbl/stats/2014-2015/4c5effa5.html)

Diehard Ute
12-04-2014, 02:40 PM
Reyes does seem to have a thumb injury that's affecting him more than he's letting on

sancho
12-04-2014, 02:42 PM
I think Larry wants him in for his muscle and for rebounding, but last night he had 3 boards and Brekott had 4.

Final Stats (http://www.utahutes.com/sports/m-baskbl/stats/2014-2015/4c5effa5.html)

Yeah, Chapman was great with those offensive rebounds.

Right now, I'd say we have two very good rebounders on the team: Poeltl and Wright.

The next tier includes Reyes, Chapman, Bachynski, and Loveridge.

Anyway, I'm a Reyes fan. I think we will not regret giving him regular minutes. He'll have some important moments for us this season.

Diehard Ute
12-04-2014, 02:45 PM
One other thing I often forget. Reyes is only a sophomore. He's still pretty young.

LA Ute
12-04-2014, 02:45 PM
How the Wichita Eagle saw the game:

Day After: No. 25 Utah 69, No. 8 Wichita State 68 (OT) (http://www.kansas.com/sports/college/wichita-state/shockwaves/article4272381.html)
Read more here: http://www.kansas.com/sports/college/wichita-state/shockwaves/article4272381.html#storylink=cpy

Some carping about the locker room there.

sancho
12-04-2014, 02:46 PM
I'd like some "advanced" stats on inbound plays. What is the success rate nationwide on inbounds plays? How many inbounds plays end up being long-ball resets? Who is the inbounds pass master among active coaches? AJ says BYU gets 8 ppg on these plays. Is that leading the nation? Sounds like a lot of points. How do they do it?

Dwight Schr-Ute
12-04-2014, 02:52 PM
I'd like some "advanced" stats on inbound plays. What is the success rate nationwide on inbounds plays? How many inbounds plays end up being long-ball resets? Who is the inbounds pass master among active coaches? AJ says BYU gets 8 ppg on these plays. Is that leading the nation? Sounds like a lot of points. How do they do it?

They throw the ball into Haws who has no problem with throwing anything at the basket.

sancho
12-04-2014, 02:53 PM
They throw the ball into Haws who has no problem with throwing anything at the basket.

So, it's 8 points on 4-15 shooting? That's a lot of inbounds plays.

Applejack
12-04-2014, 03:02 PM
I'd like some "advanced" stats on inbound plays. What is the success rate nationwide on inbounds plays? How many inbounds plays end up being long-ball resets? Who is the inbounds pass master among active coaches? AJ says BYU gets 8 ppg on these plays. Is that leading the nation? Sounds like a lot of points. How do they do it?

It is a lot of points. It's enough points to change a lot of games.

BYU does it by using Haws coming off different screen looks. Because he's such a shooter, teams are looking for him, so BYU usually gets a bucket or two by having the screeners flash to the basket for easy layups. But they also get a lot by having a second action, where Haws is just the decoy that gets everyone taking a step towards him.

But you don't need a great shooter to make it work (although it helps). Just having plays that involve more than simple backscreens would work wonders. Most coaches have a host of inbounds plays they run, but we only seem to have one.

I think a lot of our issues on inbounds plays are the same things that hold us up on offense - our screen game is poor.

LA Ute
12-04-2014, 03:15 PM
Points off of in-bounds plays are gravy. The main thing is to get the ball in bounds without a turnover and with a chance to set up a play -- or to get a foul on our opponents. When we have to call a time out because we can't get the ball in that's a sign of room for improvement.

U-Ute
12-04-2014, 03:45 PM
How the Wichita Eagle saw the game:

Day After: No. 25 Utah 69, No. 8 Wichita State 68 (OT) (http://www.kansas.com/sports/college/wichita-state/shockwaves/article4272381.html)
Read more here: http://www.kansas.com/sports/college/wichita-state/shockwaves/article4272381.html#storylink=cpy

Some carping about the locker room there.


Instead, the Shockers dressed in a tiny room with no lockers and few showers. Several had to scamper across a hallway in a towel to another locker room to shower. One member of the traveling party asked, “Do you make UCLA dress in here?”

Hell yeah. Next time the room may be pink (http://collegefootball.about.com/od/traditions/a/trad-iowapink.htm). And we'll turn the heat up to 95 degrees. You want cozy, go change at the Marriott.

sancho
12-04-2014, 03:50 PM
Hell yeah. Next time the room may be pink (http://collegefootball.about.com/od/traditions/a/trad-iowapink.htm). And we'll turn the heat up to 95 degrees. You want cozy, go change at the Marriott.

No kidding. Next round of renovations should include a dank corner room full of rats just for Wichita to use when they come to town.

SeattleUte
12-04-2014, 04:00 PM
Reyes does seem to have a thumb injury that's affecting him more than he's letting on

I have a feeling Reyes will be vauable because he sees himself as someone who can be an imortant piece that can make a big difference and is at peace with that. I think he's a good kid. He's big and strong and I predict he'll be important in filling Loveridge's absense.

justaute
12-04-2014, 04:09 PM
Saw this on Arizona's board.





KaibabKat wrote: Did you see the part, late in the game, where they had to stop the action and warn the crowd for throwing objects onto the floor toward members of the visiting team?

Believe me, that is nothing new for the classless Utah fans.
you and i have talked about this many times -- WORST fans in the nation, right there with Missouri.

LA Ute
12-04-2014, 04:10 PM
I have a feeling Reyes will be vauable because he sees himself as someone who can be an imortant piece that can make a big difference and is at peace with that. I think he's a good kid. He's big and strong and I predict he'll be important in filling Loveridge's absense.

The coaching staff must see a lot in him because they made him a starter as a sophomore fresh out of a JC. I suspect that anyone who watches the "film" and focuses on Reyes will see him doing a lot that doesn't show up in stats.

concerned
12-04-2014, 04:14 PM
The coaching staff must see a lot in him because they made him a starter as a sophomore fresh out of a JC. I suspect that anyone who watches the "film" and focuses on Reyes will see him doing a lot that doesn't show up in stats.

They also brought him back in for crunch time in regulation, which surprised me because I thought Chapman outplayed him. He was really nervous. After he got fouled at the end of overtime and was walking to the other end to shoot, Delon and some other players put their arms around him to encourage him and get him to smile. He also missed a couple of putbacks where he never got high enough and clanked the bottom of the rim. Boith he and Poeltl are gong to have to learn to go up with more strength and authority.

sancho
12-04-2014, 04:14 PM
Saw this on Arizona's board.





KaibabKat wrote: Did you see the part, late in the game, where they had to stop the action and warn the crowd for throwing objects onto the floor toward members of the visiting team?

Believe me, that is nothing new for the classless Utah fans.
you and i have talked about this many times -- WORST fans in the nation, right there with Missouri.








I'm always impressed/disappointed that there is not more stuff thrown onto the field/court of games. Tens of thousands of fans witnessing pure robbery from officials, and 99.9% of the time, they are able to take it without breaking the rule.

Does anyone else remember the time that Jazz ref got nailed in the groin with a water bottle thrown from what seemed like dozens of rows up? An underappreciated great moment in sports history.

LA Ute
12-04-2014, 04:15 PM
They also brought him back in for crunch time in regulation, which surprised me because I thought Chapman outplayed him. He was really nervous. After he got fouled at the end of overtime and was walking to the other end to shoot, Delon and some other players put their arms around him to encourage him and get him to smile. He also missed a couple of putbacks where he never got high enough and clanked the bottom of the rim. Boith he and Poeltl are gong to have to learn to go up with more strength and authority.

Probably still adjusting to the D1 level. I hope so, anyway.

sancho
12-04-2014, 04:16 PM
He also missed a couple of putbacks where he never got high enough and clanked the bottom of the rim. Both he and Poeltl are gong to have to learn to go up with more strength and authority.

I only remember one of these putbacks, and on the one I remember there was a 260 lb center holding him down with two arms and a leg. I don't even think Reyes' shot reached the bottom of the rim on that one.

SeattleUte
12-04-2014, 05:12 PM
They also brought him back in for crunch time in regulation, which surprised me because I thought Chapman outplayed him. He was really nervous. After he got fouled at the end of overtime and was walking to the other end to shoot, Delon and some other players put their arms around him to encourage him and get him to smile. He also missed a couple of putbacks where he never got high enough and clanked the bottom of the rim. Boith he and Poeltl are gong to have to learn to go up with more strength and authority.

But that was a huge rebound he got that led to that free throw. I think he's very strong. He needs to develop finesse, but he'll always be a banger. FYI & FWIW Gonzaga and St. Mary's offered him during his HS senior year.

Scratch
12-04-2014, 05:54 PM
I'm always impressed/disappointed that there is not more stuff thrown onto the field/court of games. Tens of thousands of fans witnessing pure robbery from officials, and 99.9% of the time, they are able to take it without breaking the rule.

Does anyone else remember the time that Jazz ref got nailed in the groin with a water bottle thrown from what seemed like dozens of rows up? An underappreciated great moment in sports history.

I'm always amazed that a fan of the visiting team doesn't throw something onto the court every time a warning is issued.

LA Ute
12-04-2014, 06:24 PM
I'm always amazed that a fan of the visiting team doesn't throw something onto the court every time a warning is issued.

Very few people think the way you do, I guess.

FountainOfUte
12-04-2014, 07:01 PM
I'm always amazed that a fan of the visiting team doesn't throw something onto the court every time a warning is issued.

Lol. ^^^This!^^^

sancho
12-04-2014, 07:39 PM
I'm always amazed that a fan of the visiting team doesn't throw something onto the court every time a warning is issued.

The visiting fan who costs us a game is going to be hounded by fans and media like Bartman and maybe tied up, driven to the wilderness, and left for dead.

Old Standing ute
12-04-2014, 10:38 PM
But that was a huge rebound he got that led to that free throw. I think he's very strong. He needs to develop finesse, but he'll always be a banger. FYI & FWIW Gonzaga and St. Mary's offered him during his HS senior year.

Brekkot gets pushed around underneath--Reyes came back because Brekkot missed a rebound & then fouled to make it worse.

U-Ute
12-05-2014, 09:56 AM
The visiting fan who costs us a game is going to be hounded by fans and media like Bartman and maybe tied up, driven to the wilderness, and left for dead.

Or worse. They'll post his picture and personal information on Cougarboard along with a claim he is keeping BYU out of the Big12.

Scratch
12-05-2014, 10:37 AM
Am I the only one who has noticed that, despite all the great thongs he does, Jakob is HORRIBLE at boxing out for rebounds on free throws. He has given up a ton of offensive boards on missed free throws.

Applejack
12-05-2014, 10:41 AM
Am I the only one who has noticed that, despite all the great thongs he does, Jakob is HORRIBLE at boxing out for rebounds on free throws. He has given up a ton of offensive boards on missed free throws.

:worthless_without_p

chrisrenrut
12-05-2014, 10:42 AM
. . .despite all the great thongs he does. . .

Eww, yes, I hope you are the only one that noticed.

Scratch
12-05-2014, 11:14 AM
It's a European thing. You guys are so provincial, you could never hack it over there.

Applejack
12-05-2014, 11:28 AM
Non-snarky answer - yes, Poeltl is not a great rebounder yet. There were a couple of plays were he was completely blocked out by a 6''4' guy for the defensive board, but just outjumped the guy. This won't work all year. Poeltl really needs to bulk up.

Unfortunately, that is not a good reason to stay in school. The PEDs in the NBA are just way better than they are in college. :(

FountainOfUte
12-05-2014, 12:26 PM
Non-snarky answer - yes, Poeltl is not a great rebounder yet. There were a couple of plays were he was completely blocked out by a 6''4' guy for the defensive board, but just outjumped the guy. This won't work all year. Poeltl really needs to bulk up.

Unfortunately, that is not a good reason to stay in school. The PEDs in the NBA are just way better than they are in college. :(

Agreed. As I watched Jakob it was obvious that playing college ball through his sophomore or junior season would do wonders for helping him survive his initial pro development. Nothing prepares a good player for the pros better than playing in the pros full time without the distractions of school (see Wiggins and Jabari). The question then becomes, is a kid so raw (in spite of what his ceiling might be) that he won't survive that first 1-3 years of the NBA. Countless hordes of talented players have taken the gamble and lost where a little patience before jumping might have served them better long term. There seems to be a critical mass of skill to make it through that first contract. Will Jakob have that after one year at the U? I don't know the answer.

justaute
12-05-2014, 12:47 PM
Poeltl needs to look no further than one of my favorite Utes, Andrew Bogut, as his inspiration. Bogut is a player with pretty good physical talent and very high IQ -- just my kind of player.

sancho
12-05-2014, 01:50 PM
Non-snarky answer - yes, Poeltl is not a great rebounder yet. There were a couple of plays were he was completely blocked out by a 6''4' guy for the defensive board, but just outjumped the guy. This won't work all year. Poeltl really needs to bulk up.

Unfortunately, that is not a good reason to stay in school. The PEDs in the NBA are just way better than they are in college. :(

Here is the recipe for a great rebounder:

1) Attitude
2) Instinct
3) Hustle
4) Mechanics

The 4th ingredient is really the only coachable one, and I think Jakpot already has the first three at least to some degree.

Applejack
12-05-2014, 01:54 PM
Here is the recipe for a great rebounder:

1) Attitude
2) Instinct
3) Hustle
4) Mechanics

The 4th ingredient is really the only coachable one, and I think Jakpot already has the first three at least to some degree.

I might add height.