PDA

View Full Version : Approaches to Pornography



USS Utah
02-27-2013, 07:12 PM
I found this video to be much more helpful than the video put out by the LDS Church:


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IU6AV08ozzA

LA Ute
02-27-2013, 07:19 PM
Some posts are popping up in this Institute subforum about pornography and it seemed they should have a home. Here it is.

UtahDan
02-27-2013, 08:51 PM
Some posts are popping up in this Institute subforum about pornography and it seemed they should have a home. Here it is.

Wait...did LA start a porn thread?

wuapinmon
02-27-2013, 09:24 PM
If you want an appeal to logos about pornography, read this. Otherwise, don't bother.

http://booktrotter.files.wordpress.com/2009/05/baudrillard-j.jpg

LA Ute
02-27-2013, 09:29 PM
Wait...did LA start a porn thread?

No. I moved the first post from another thread to this one. But I did have to create this one so that there would be a thread for the post. I doubt I will be back. You know how I love porn threads. (Then again, maybe the folks on this board won't make a jihad of the whole subject, as happened on another board at another time and place.)

UtahDan
02-27-2013, 09:37 PM
No. I moved the first post from another thread to this one. But I did have to create this one so that there would be a thread for the post. I doubt I will be back. You know how I love porn threads. (Then again, maybe the folks on this board won't make a jihad of the whole subject, as happened on another board at another time and place.)

That's some fine tap dancing there counselor. :D

LA Ute
02-27-2013, 10:13 PM
That's some fine tap dancing there counselor. :D

I should have known this would happen.

UtahDan
02-27-2013, 10:31 PM
I should have known this would happen.

There are some things around here you should ask me to do.

IdahoUteTroutHead
02-27-2013, 10:40 PM
Porn!

Jeromy in SLC
02-27-2013, 10:54 PM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eWEjvCRPrCo

Jarid in Cedar
02-27-2013, 10:56 PM
Porn!



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YRgNOyCnbqg

Jarid in Cedar
02-27-2013, 10:57 PM
Lol!

Jeromy in SLC
02-27-2013, 10:58 PM
Lol!

Wonder twin powers...............ACTIVATE!

Snowman
02-28-2013, 06:17 AM
I take a hands on approach to pornography.

SuperGabers
02-28-2013, 07:11 AM
I take a hands on approach to pornography.

*Like*

FN Phat
02-28-2013, 07:59 AM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YRgNOyCnbqg


Lol!


Wonder twin powers...............ACTIVATE!

Uh-oh. What else do you fellas do at the same time?

Jeromy in SLC
02-28-2013, 09:51 AM
Uh-oh. What else do you fellas do at the same time?

Not so much doing, but there is a lifetime of inside jokes that we both instantly understand and think are funny (such as this particular video). It drives our wives crazy. Anything else, I can neither confirm nor deny.

Jarid in Cedar
02-28-2013, 10:04 AM
Uh-oh. What else do you fellas do at the same time?

When you shared a room for 20 years (and a womb for 9 months), there is a certain level of common idiosyncracies that become evident if you are around both of us for any extended time.

UtahDan
12-18-2013, 05:17 AM
58: The Epic Sex Series Part 4 – A Conversation about Pornography (http://mormonexpositor.com/58-the-epic-sex-series-part-4-a-conversation-about-pornography/)


Podcast: Play in new window (http://media.blubrry.com/mormonexpositor/p/media.blubrry.com/mormonexpositorpodcast/p/mormonexpositor.com//wp-content/uploads/2013/12/mxp-episode_058.mp3) | Download (http://media.blubrry.com/mormonexpositor/p/media.blubrry.com/mormonexpositorpodcast/p/mormonexpositor.com//wp-content/uploads/2013/12/mxp-episode_058.mp3) (Duration: 1:22:27 — 56.6MB)
Heather interviews Kim and Jeremy, two professionals in the arena of sex education, regarding pornography and masturbation as well as LDS attitudes about sexuality in general.
References:
What’s the Big Deal With Pornography? A Sex-Positive Persepective (https://www.sunstonemagazine.com/slc-2013-symposium-session-251-whats-the-big-deal-with-pornography-a-sex-positive-persepective/)
Rewrite of For Strength of Youth Pamphlet (http://strengthentheyouth.wordpress.com/2012/07/30/sunstone-presentation/)
Resources:
Our Whole Lives Lifespan Sexuality Education Curricula (http://www.uua.org/re/owl/)
FLASH Lesson Plans (http://www.kingcounty.gov/healthservices/health/personal/famplan/educators/FLASH.aspx)
Advocates for Youth (http://www.advocatesforyouth.org/)
Planned Parenthood Manuals and Curricula (http://www.plannedparenthood.org/resources/curricula-manuals-23515.htm)


http://mormonexpositor.com/58-the-epic-sex-series-part-4-a-conversation-about-pornography/

I don't often share these here but Heather hits a home run with this. Very interesting and informative.

LA Ute
12-18-2013, 07:41 AM
58: The Epic Sex Series Part 4 – A Conversation about Pornography (http://mormonexpositor.com/58-the-epic-sex-series-part-4-a-conversation-about-pornography/)


Podcast: Play in new window (http://media.blubrry.com/mormonexpositor/p/media.blubrry.com/mormonexpositorpodcast/p/mormonexpositor.com//wp-content/uploads/2013/12/mxp-episode_058.mp3) | Download (http://media.blubrry.com/mormonexpositor/p/media.blubrry.com/mormonexpositorpodcast/p/mormonexpositor.com//wp-content/uploads/2013/12/mxp-episode_058.mp3) (Duration: 1:22:27 — 56.6MB)
Heather interviews Kim and Jeremy, two professionals in the arena of sex education, regarding pornography and masturbation as well as LDS attitudes about sexuality in general.
References:
What’s the Big Deal With Pornography? A Sex-Positive Persepective (https://www.sunstonemagazine.com/slc-2013-symposium-session-251-whats-the-big-deal-with-pornography-a-sex-positive-persepective/)
Rewrite of For Strength of Youth Pamphlet (http://strengthentheyouth.wordpress.com/2012/07/30/sunstone-presentation/)
Resources:
Our Whole Lives Lifespan Sexuality Education Curricula (http://www.uua.org/re/owl/)
FLASH Lesson Plans (http://www.kingcounty.gov/healthservices/health/personal/famplan/educators/FLASH.aspx)
Advocates for Youth (http://www.advocatesforyouth.org/)
Planned Parenthood Manuals and Curricula (http://www.plannedparenthood.org/resources/curricula-manuals-23515.htm)


http://mormonexpositor.com/58-the-epic-sex-series-part-4-a-conversation-about-pornography/

I don't often share these here but Heather hits a home run with this. Very interesting and informative.

I wonder if this topic will take off the way it has on...other boards. :snack:

LA Ute
07-27-2016, 07:53 AM
It’s O.K., Liberal Parents, You Can Freak Out About Porn

http://mobile.nytimes.com/2016/07/17/opinion/sunday/its-ok-liberal-parents-you-can-freak-out-about-porn.html?WT.mc_id=2016-KWP-MOBILE-AUD_DEV&WT.mc_ev=click&ad-keywords=MOBILEFULLPAGE&kwp_0=190491&_r=0&referer=http://m.facebook.com

tooblue
07-27-2016, 10:18 AM
It’s O.K., Liberal Parents, You Can Freak Out About Porn

http://mobile.nytimes.com/2016/07/17/opinion/sunday/its-ok-liberal-parents-you-can-freak-out-about-porn.html?WT.mc_id=2016-KWP-MOBILE-AUD_DEV&WT.mc_ev=click&ad-keywords=MOBILEFULLPAGE&kwp_0=190491&_r=0&referer=http://m.facebook.com

The average age of children's first exposure to hardcore pornography is between 9 - 11 years old. 70% of the exposure happens in the home, on a home computer/device (if you want the references I can provide them). Hardcore porn in this context means: images and videos of gratuitous fellatio, group sex, anal sex, submission and bondage, and even simulated rape of vulnerable women or men.

Regardless your views on whether or not porn is harmful to consenting adults and adult relationships. It is reasonable to assert that early exposure to porn is detrimental to healthy child sexual devepment. Of course, one could argue and demand there be studies to confirm or deny the detrimental effects on children. But currently, it is not ethical or legal to expose children to porn in order to facilitate such a study. But that doesn't mean there aren't studies concerning 10 to 18 year olds and exposure to porn ...


Those who report intentional exposure to pornography, irrespective of source, are significantly more likely to cross-sectionally report delinquent behavior and substance use in the previous year. Further, online seekers versus offline seekers are more likely to report clinical features associated with depression and lower levels of emotional bonding with their caregiver. Results of the current investigation raise important questions for further inquiry. Findings from these cross-sectional data provide justification for longitudinal studies aimed at parsing out temporal sequencing of psychosocial experiences.

http://www.unh.edu/ccrc/pdf/jvq/CV76.pdf

Sullyute
07-27-2016, 10:47 AM
Ok, i will be honest here...i have not spoken to my kids about porn. i have kids in that range. We have talked about sex in general and we use correct terms for genitelia but we haven't broached the porn subject specifically. I am worried that if we talk about it it will just make them curious to go out and find it. I am confident that they have not see anything yet. Am i just keeping my head in the sand here. Do i really need to talk to them at that young age? Looking for advice from others on this.

Sent from my SPH-L710 using Tapatalk

Rocker Ute
07-27-2016, 12:08 PM
Ok, i will be honest here...i have not spoken to my kids about porn. i have kids in that range. We have talked about sex in general and we use correct terms for genitelia but we haven't broached the porn subject specifically. I am worried that if we talk about it it will just make them curious to go out and find it. I am confident that they have not see anything yet. Am i just keeping my head in the sand here. Do i really need to talk to them at that young age? Looking for advice from others on this.

Sent from my SPH-L710 using Tapatalk


I don't remember who is churchy here or not, but I found that this had some good principles in it to teach all children on how to handle it. If you don't want to show it to your kids, you can repurpose it to fit your family needs.

https://www.lds.org/media-library/video/2015-08-001-what-should-i-do-when-i-see-pornography?lang=eng

Short story isn't IF they'll encounter pornography, but WHEN. I've read the average age for a kid to encounter pornography is 8. Teaching your kids how to handle that stuff is the key, and I would say do what we've done with our kids by telling them they'll never get in trouble with us if they've encountered porn, or even if they've spent some time with it, but to get help.

I'm not a scientist, I don't know how addiction works, but since I work in computers I've become the neighborhood tech guy and I get questions non-stop about this and have had some disturbing encounters. I would say however that pornography has attributes of addiction that drive 8 year old girls to spend hours a day viewing it (going far beyond mere curiosity) and spouses who want to quit and simply can not. So for I don't know if it really is a public health crisis, but we treat it like a disease.

So one story... I get a call from a client she is in tears, her 8yo daughter has viewed some porn on her laptop, which the daughter claimed was an isolated incident, with a friend at a sleep-over. She is having porn popping up on her computer and any search she enters is being auto-populated with porn sites. She asks me if I can help her clean up her computer. So I sit down and check things out and I go and look at the browsing history - months and months of hours a day of this 8yo girl looking at the most disturbing, graphic, hardcore pornography. Stuff I've never heard of, titles that would make your hair fall out. I think by just about anyone's standard that was some hard hard stuff, certainly not appropriate for an 8yo.

I had to tell her mom what was going on, it was much more deep than she had been told and that her daughter needed counseling in a big way. It has been a tough time for that family.

It occurred to me then that if an 8yo could develop a problem like that, then any of our kids could. So, check out that video, it explains in a way kids can understand while also not invoking curiosity (I don't think). BUT you should be talking to your kids about it and most importantly giving them avenues to handle it.

On another note, we purchased Circle by Disney... the features I like best about it is that it has a filter combined with accountability software. Filters almost always fail, but if you can see when and what your kids are accessing (and they can see what we do too), then we are accountable to each other. Easy to set up, highly recommended.

tooblue
07-27-2016, 01:03 PM
Ok, i will be honest here...i have not spoken to my kids about porn. i have kids in that range. We have talked about sex in general and we use correct terms for genitelia but we haven't broached the porn subject specifically. I am worried that if we talk about it it will just make them curious to go out and find it. I am confident that they have not see anything yet. Am i just keeping my head in the sand here. Do i really need to talk to them at that young age? Looking for advice from others on this.

Sent from my SPH-L710 using Tapatalk

We speak to all of our children, even the youngest who is 8, openly and honestly about sex in general, but also warn them about pornography. The most important issue for us is our desire to develop good lines of communication early and to help our children have a healthy outlook on sexuality. Porn does not promote a healthy outlook.

Rocker is correct. It is not a matter of if but when. In taking the approach we have above, our pre-teen has come to us about things he has already seen or heard talked about among his circle of friends at school. He naturally has questions. Far better he get good answers from my wife and I than from the prepubescent boys on the playground. We explain how normal an interest in sex is—how normal he is for being interested, but that he does not need to worry about sex right now at this stage of his life.

What's more, he can ask us anything about sex. For example he asked: "Do you and Mom like sex." "Absolutely!" was the best and only answer. We always come away from such conversations laughing and at ease. Which is much better than the moodiness associated with secrecy and self-loathing. And we have not noticed him more curious than what is normal. When he does see things he continues to come and talk to us. Which is a blessing.

He is setting a good pattern for his younger brother who is 8. We wish we could have been as effective with our older boys when they were younger. Regardless, we talk even more openly with them. We always come away from such conversations laughing and at ease—mostly. It's just different. I will say they a very open and honest with us, and that they have a healthy outlook on sex. For which I am very grateful.

SeattleUte
07-27-2016, 04:28 PM
I don't remember who is churchy here or not.

I'm not. Please make a note.

Rocker Ute
07-27-2016, 04:38 PM
I'm not. Please make a note.

You've hidden it well. I think we are all shocked by this.

LA Ute
07-28-2016, 05:38 AM
I'm not. Please make a note.

I thought you belonged to the church of kindness.

sancho
07-28-2016, 07:46 AM
Ok, i will be honest here...i have not spoken to my kids about porn. i have kids in that range. We have talked about sex in general and we use correct terms for genitelia but we haven't broached the porn subject specifically. I am worried that if we talk about it it will just make them curious to go out and find it. I am confident that they have not see anything yet. Am i just keeping my head in the sand here. Do i really need to talk to them at that young age? Looking for advice from others on this.

Sent from my SPH-L710 using Tapatalk

We have it in a regular rotation ever since our eight year old was shown something on a friend's phone at recess. He's our oldest; the youngest will grow up with these talks. It's a pretty easy talk to have. I would do it. I think you'll regret it if you find your children are getting their porn info from another source.

LA Ute
07-28-2016, 11:21 AM
We started with our kids at age 6 and gradually got more detailed as they grew older. At first they were bored with the subject. Over time it became clear they were more and more curious. It has produced a nice, candid atmosphere around the subject.

U-Ute
08-06-2016, 08:36 AM
I found this thread title very misleading.

1/10 -would not recommend

USS Utah
10-06-2016, 06:25 PM
If you lean left and are in favor of social justice, should you not feel at least a little bit uncomfortable with at least some aspects of the porn industry?

https://www.theguardian.com/lifeandstyle/2010/jul/02/gail-dines-pornography

Solon
10-07-2016, 04:33 AM
If you lean left and are in favor of social justice, should you not feel at least a little bit uncomfortable with at least some aspects of the porn industry?

https://www.theguardian.com/lifeandstyle/2010/jul/02/gail-dines-pornography

I have no love for the porn industry, but it is a complicated issue.

Some third-wave feminists have argued that voluntarily engaging in sex work allows women to "reclaim" their sexuality "from the male gaze." (http://serendip.brynmawr.edu/exchange/yj/towards-new-feminist-approach-pornography-0)

Obviously, no reasonable person is in favor of exploitation or sex-slavery, and this is where the waters can get muddy. How much participation in the porn industry is truly "voluntary"? And "sex work" can include a huge spectrum of possibilities - everything from webcam peep-show stripping to outright slavery.

The other problem - as Mormon Red Death has reminded me - is that defending pornography gives "doth protest too much" impression.
Personally, I'm not necessarily pro-porn; I am pro-feminism & pro-free-speech.

As stated in that 2007 write-up I linked,
I certainly wouldn’t go out of my way to promote pornography as a positive thing for feminists, but I also wouldn’t say that it is so harmful as to require its immediate eradication. There seems to be a whole host of other issues far greater in importance than pornography (at least in terms of the old debate which focused primarily on the pornographic film industry).

The connection in USS Utah's linked article between pornography and violence raises a concern, to be sure, - and I don't want to downplay that possible connection. I would suspect, though, that the causality is probably a tricky thing to pin down.

Not casting stones here, but is there a more recent development or impetus behind posting this article which dates from 2010? Just curious.

Diehard Ute
10-07-2016, 08:32 AM
Just as a curiosity aside, the only real opposition to Sean Reyes in Utah's AG race now is Andrew McCullough, Libertarian. (The democratic candidate dropped out the day of the first debate due to "health" issues and Utah law doesn't allow the Dems to replace him)

Andrew has made his living defending escorts, prostitutes, Dr John's etc etc. He's said very crude things in court to people on the stand. He's a very interesting person, who certainly would defend the porn industry. That would make an interesting AG's office.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

concerned
10-07-2016, 08:41 AM
Just as a curiosity aside, the only real opposition to Sean Reyes in Utah's AG race now is Andrew McCullough, Libertarian. (The democratic candidate dropped out the day of the first debate due to "health" issues and Utah law doesn't allow the Dems to replace him)

Andrew has made his living defending escorts, prostitutes, Dr John's etc etc. He's said very crude things in court to people on the stand. He's a very interesting person, who certainly would defend the porn industry. That would make an interesting AG's office.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Also strip club dancers and related performers on first amendment grounds

LA Ute
10-07-2016, 09:00 AM
Well, don't worry-- in California we're cleaning up the porn industry.

Most Californians support initiative to require adult-film actors to use condoms

https://www.google.com/amp/www.latimes.com/politics/la-pol-ca-condom-initiative-prop-60-poll-20160915-snap-story,amp.html?client=safari


https://ballotpedia.org/California_Proposition_60,_Condoms_in_Pornographic _Films_(2016)


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Rocker Ute
10-07-2016, 09:31 AM
Well, don't worry-- in California we're cleaning up the porn industry.

Most Californians support initiative to require adult-film actors to use condoms

https://www.google.com/amp/www.latimes.com/politics/la-pol-ca-condom-initiative-prop-60-poll-20160915-snap-story,amp.html?client=safari


https://ballotpedia.org/California_Proposition_60,_Condoms_in_Pornographic _Films_(2016)


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Thanks California!

This discussion reminds me of a funny quote from Futurama (a wholly unappreciated show): "Well, thanks to the Internet, I'm now bored with sex. Is there a place on the web that panders to my lust for violence?"

Solon
10-07-2016, 12:50 PM
Is it really that complicated? I hear variations on three arguments supporting the porn industry:

1) It doesn't hurt anyone. This is ridiculous enough to ignore.

2) People should be able to do what they want. Agree, but that's a discussion on laws and regulations once we have established the fact that the industry is harmful.

3) Finally, there's the academic, feminist argument. It's fine as far as academic, theoretical musings go, but it's completely disconnected from reality. The porn industry exists/thrives because it enslaves. Men and women. There is not one poster here or anywhere who would encourage his wife or daughter to enter the porn industry as a way to reclaim their sexuality from the patriarchy.

I think the complication emerges in the oodles of ways that "porn" can be produced. A kid goofing around with a webcam for bitcoin is really different from a sex worker in Thailand.
The porn industry thrives because there is a market for it. The contention that it enslaves is only right some of the time. Unfortunately, it's really hard to make it right none of the time.

As for the "encouraging" wife or daughter, you're right - but nor do I want my daughter to get an abortion, smoke, or attend the byu.

I really do feel that the issue is very complicated, but I'm getting close to "doth protest too much" territory.

concerned
10-07-2016, 01:16 PM
I think the complication emerges in the oodles of ways that "porn" can be produced. A kid goofing around with a webcam for bitcoin is really different from a sex worker in Thailand.
The porn industry thrives because there is a market for it. The contention that it enslaves is only right some of the time. Unfortunately, it's really hard to make it right none of the time.

As for the "encouraging" wife or daughter, you're right - but nor do I want my daughter to get an abortion, smoke, or attend the byu.

I really do feel that the issue is very complicated, but I'm getting close to "doth protest too much" territory.

I thought I read an article in the New Yorker recently that the porn "industry" is dying, because there is so much free, amateur, voluntary stuff online, that few people pay for it and there is no money in it. FWIW.

Diehard Ute
10-07-2016, 02:25 PM
Some of the time is enough. This is true of gambling and alcohol as well, which is why I also don't support those industries. I know very many people can touch very many things and be just fine. But it absolutely wrecks some lives. That's enough for me to be opposed.

But really, I was trying to say that I don't buy the academic argument about empowerment or freedom or whatever that argument is about.

So, how do you support religion?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Diehard Ute
10-07-2016, 02:30 PM
With about 10% of my income.

It was a serious question. Lots of people thrive on religion. Others murder, rape etc because of it. How is that different than your other stances?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Rocker Ute
10-07-2016, 02:32 PM
So, how do you support religion?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Nobody has every been flushed out of the bottom of religion and ended up selling real estate.

Rocker Ute
10-07-2016, 02:36 PM
It was a serious question. Lots of people thrive on religion. Others murder, rape etc because of it. How is that different than your other stances?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


That's true of everything. So I guess the real question is the 'net good' of porn (or religion) greater than the 'net bad'.

Mormon Red Death
10-07-2016, 02:37 PM
Some of the time is enough. This is true of gambling and alcohol as well, which is why I also don't support those industries. I know very many people can touch very many things and be just fine. But it absolutely wrecks some lives. That's enough for me to be opposed.

But really, I was trying to say that I don't buy the academic argument about empowerment or freedom or whatever that argument is about.

Bite your Tongue!

Diehard Ute
10-07-2016, 02:43 PM
That's true of everything. So I guess the real question is the 'net good' of porn (or religion) greater than the 'net bad'.

Which is my point. When you start making the sweeping "I won't support this because it may harm someone" stuff where do you stop?

And the "net good" often depends on the person doing the judging.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

chrisrenrut
10-07-2016, 02:58 PM
That's true of everything. So I guess the real question is the 'net good' of porn (or religion) greater than the 'net bad'.

No, just MLM's and Ponzi schemes :)

Edit: wrong quote- meant to reply to the real estate comment.

USS Utah
10-07-2016, 04:04 PM
Not casting stones here, but is there a more recent development or impetus behind posting this article which dates from 2010? Just curious.

I saw it on Facebook yesterday and didn't take note of publication date.

Scorcho
05-02-2017, 07:36 PM
new research suggests the LDS Church and its leaders needs to tone down their rhetoric about pornography


"This adds support to the idea that religious individuals either have a higher propensity for developing a pornography compulsion," the report states, "or simply misattribute their pornography use to be an addiction, due to the guilt and shame accompanying sexual expression."

http://www.sltrib.com/home/5239843-155/byu-researcher-religious-views-exaggerate-negative

LA Ute
05-02-2017, 09:12 PM
new research suggests the LDS Church and its leaders needs to tone down their rhetoric about pornography



http://www.sltrib.com/home/5239843-155/byu-researcher-religious-views-exaggerate-negative

Hmmm. Thus was buried at the end of the article:


But Willoughby said it's a step too far to say his research suggests attitudes surrounding pornography are more harmful than pornography consumption.

He testified in 2016 in favor of a Utah law labeling pornography as a "public health crisis," and said that there are nuances to pornography consumption lost in the current social and religious dialogue surrounding sexual expression and sexual health.

"What I hope a bill like that does is get this issue out for public dialogue and discussion," Willoughby said. "It's not something as simple as banning all pornography or allowing all pornography. There's a lot of things in the middle that we need to understand."

USS Utah
12-12-2017, 05:12 PM
A neurosurgeon talks about the effects of pornography on the brain:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0ADYe5w75yk

USS Utah
12-12-2017, 05:13 PM
A neurosurgeon talks about the effects of pornography on the brain:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0ADYe5w75yk

Aw, crap, I just noted the date of the video -- also from 2010.