"Thanks, I just had it Stuffed" Utes vs. Beavers 3-7-2013

[DrumNFeather]

Game is about 5 min from tip and could help send us to 10 or drop us to 12. Let's go boys!

[scottie]

I give the thread title a 7... Not bad at all, DNF.

[DrumNFeather]

Loveridge with two early threes, Utes up 8-3 16:30 to go.

[Mormon Red Death]

Loveridge has come to play!

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[DrumNFeather]

Jason Washburn scores the 1,000th point of his career. After his first two seasons at Utah, I'm not sure anyone would've thought that was possible. First since Luke Nevill and Shaun Green.

13:01 to play, Utes up 12-9.

[LA Ute]

322

[DrumNFeather]

Sloppy first half so far (not stunning when two of the bottom three teams in the league lock horns).

[DrumNFeather]

18-11 Utes with 6:57 to go in the first half.

[DrumNFeather]

Washburn leaves with a knee injury.

[DrumNFeather]

I don't know how good Jeremy Olsen will ultimately be, but that kid hustles and you can never have enough guys that do that on your squad.

Utes up 25-22 with 2:13 to go.

[DrumNFeather]

Halftime at the Huntsman Center and the Utes are up 30-26. As I mentioned above, a sloppy first half for the Utes, but overall good performances from Olsen, Washburn, and Loveridge. Here's hoping they can keep it up in the second half.

[Jarid in Cedar]

JD off to a good start.

[DrumNFeather]

10-3 run to start the second half.

[Jarid in Cedar]

Getting a little sloppy, but at least they are turning it over as much as we are.

[Mormon Red Death]

So I thought Seymour was in the dog house??? No tucker tonight

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[Jarid in Cedar]

Seymour playing well tonight. I hope he realizes that he is just a freshman, and his time will come if he keeps improving. If this was any other team or situation, he would be redshirting this year.

[Jarid in Cedar]

Up by 16. They have us right where they want us

[DrumNFeather]

5/6 from behind the arc in the second half.

[Mormon Red Death]

This game is the opposite of the one in Corvallis

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[Jarid in Cedar]

Ok. Keep the pressure on. Don't go into a shell offensively

[DrumNFeather]

Ok. Keep the pressure on. Don't go into a shell offensively

Nice seeing Loveridge drive to the hoop consistently. I can't remember us having a player that drove to the hoop without kicking it out mid-air (often leading to a turnover).

[Jarid in Cedar]

Loveridge needed to back it out after that offensive rebound

[crazyute]

At the end of the first half I liked the lineup of taylor-dubois-loveridge-olsen-washburn


that is size and length to develop. i really hope that loveridge could develop into the 3 spot.

[OrangeUte]

Double double for loveridge. I hope the Hunty is full Saturday for the Ducks.

[OrangeUte]

The family resemblance with Michelle Obama and her brother is strong.

[Jarid in Cedar]

I like that the offense hasn't backed down with the lead. Barring a disaster, we have this one in the bag.

[DrumNFeather]

Nice win tonight, way to show some fight at home.

323

[OrangeUte]

Good win over a team as desperate as we are for something to get excited about.

[Jarid in Cedar]

Nice to see us win going away. No real threat was posed over the last 12 minutes.

[LA Ute]

I'm picking up on the radio show that Jerry Sloan helped the team this week? What's up with that?

[Jarid in Cedar]

He came and talked to them after practice on Tuesday, I think

[Sheik Yerbouti]

Congrats on Wash getting to millennium mark. It's really a shame he didn't show real improvement till his last two years. Boylen was such a cluster of a coach.

[Scratch]

I'm really impressed with Olsen. The progress he's made this year is really impressive. He's improved his mobility and his reactions, but more importantly his defensive positioning has been great lately. He also has some great hands - really soft touch, can make catches when he's moving and in traffic, and uses his hands really well on defense. I think he could very well lead the team in scoring next year.

[Jarid in Cedar]

I'm really impressed with Olsen. The progress he's made this year is really impressive. He's improved his mobility and his reactions, but more importantly his defensive positioning has been great lately. He also has some great hands - really soft touch, can make catches when he's moving and in traffic, and uses his hands really well on defense. I think he could very well lead the team in scoring next year.

Yep. The mission rust is gone

[SoCalPat]

I like that the offense hasn't backed down with the lead. Barring a disaster, we have this one in the bag.

OSU loves to run a 1-3-1, with pressure and length up front at the expense of protecting the basket. Our ball movement got us good looks from the perimeter, our attacking mindset got us baskets inside. The only way we lost this game is if Nelson went off for 30-plus. Burton was worse than a non-factor and Starks was good for his usual 3-4 wild shots per game. If not for a career-best 15 by Challe Barton, we win by 20-plus. This was our most complete effort after Boise State.

[SoCalPat]

Yep. The mission rust is gone

3-for-3 from the field, 5 pulls and a block in 11 minutes. If he can stay on the floor -- his 3 fouls were his only negative -- he'll be a force for us next year. He's going to force Loveridge to learn how to play the 3, because he's our starting 4 for 2013-14.

[Scratch]

3-for-3 from the field, 5 pulls and a block in 11 minutes. If he can stay on the floor -- his 3 fouls were his only negative -- he'll be a force for us next year. He's going to force Loveridge to learn how to play the 3, because he's our starting 4 for 2013-14.

If he's our starting 4 then who's our starting 5?

[Jarid in Cedar]

3-for-3 from the field, 5 pulls and a block in 11 minutes. If he can stay on the floor -- his 3 fouls were his only negative -- he'll be a force for us next year. He's going to force Loveridge to learn how to play the 3, because he's our starting 4 for 2013-14.


This is the best case scenario for next year.

[Diehard Ute]

Yep. The mission rust is gone

More importantly he's getting healthy, his injuries really slowed him down the first half

[SoCalPat]

If he's our starting 4 then who's our starting 5?

Marko Kovacevic, a 7-0 JUCO transfer who redshirting this year at Western Nebraska to get his grades in order, with Bachinsky and Harry Whitt as the backups.

[Scratch]

Marko Kovacevic, a 7-0 JUCO transfer who redshirting this year at Western Nebraska to get his grades in order, with Bachinsky and Harry Whitt as the backups.

Kovacevic and Olsen are essentially the same height, and Olsen looks heavier than Kovacevic from what I've seen. It also seems to me like Olsen has more of a 5 game than Kovacevic. If those 2 are on the court at the same time I suspect we'll see Olsen at the 4, but I could obviously be wrong.

More than that, with all the wings we're going to have on the team next year I still think we'll see Loveridge primarily play the 4 to get more of that wing talent on the floor.

[SeattleUte]

This was a monster win. At home we had to beat the team we're tied with for tenth place just as a reality check that we're progressing. Now we have one more conference win than last year with the Pac 12 a great deal better. Won't it be great if we can spoil Oregon's championship. We've got a nice set up for that. Oregon is where it is because for the first seven games of the Pac 12 it played way over its head. Now it's slumping and it has to play us a day and a half after the whippin at Colorado. Wringing those green necks would ge a great way to end the season.

[Mormon Red Death]

Utah is now 17-9-1 ATS for the year. If you have been taking them all year you (Ok me) have made a decent a return.

[Solon]

Utah is now 17-9-1 ATS for the year. If you have been taking them all year you (Ok me) have made a decent a return.

Nice to see the Utes crash the boards. Rebounding made a huge difference IMO.

[Mormon Red Death]

the biggest surprise from last night is that whittingham won the football players dunk contest.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=yxku4IWASxg

[LA Ute]

More than that, with all the wings we're going to have on the team next year I still think we'll see Loveridge primarily play the 4 to get more of that wing talent on the floor.

In his post-game interview with Riley Krysko was talking about the future Loveridge as a 4. Interesting.

[SoCalPat]

In his post-game interview with Riley Krysko was talking about the future Loveridge as a 4. Interesting.

The more I see Loveridge at the 4, the more I hate it. Now what I'm about to say could be a result of a long season, against competition he's never faced on a consistent basis in his life. But he can't finish in traffic at the rim. Occasionally he'll get fouled. He's long in the arms, which is helpful, but he's slow in the feet. He's not explosive (He can jump, but his elevator takes a while to get to the top). He'll always be an above-average rebounder because of his length, but I fear his offensive game will suffer if he's forced to play inside.

Those are my observations from limited viewing. But the facts don't lie -- if you projected Olsen's minutes to match Loveridge's 31.0 MPG, he would score more and rebound more, and do it more efficiently -- he's shooting exactly 60 percent to JL's 40 percent. My biggest concern right now is Olsen's inability to get to the line -- only six attempts all year. Can't sugarcoat that -- that's a pathetic number for a big. Put Loveridge where you need to put him, but it should never come at the expense of Olsen's minutes.

[Jeromy in SLC]

In his post-game interview with Riley Krysko was talking about the future Loveridge as a 4. Interesting.

Maybe I am in the minority, but I think Loveridge can be a very effective four-man IF: 1. He can continue to play with a big motor. JL looked like he wore down as the season progressed. Another full year of conditioning will help. 2. He can continue to extend his game and force a bigger guy to come out to guard him. This includes the ability to put the ball on the floor if his man presses too far out. 3. His defense continues to improve. In HS, it was probably pretty rare that he had to guard a guy that was bigger than him.

The history of college basketball is full of guys whom were great power forwards without ideal size. Guys like Byron Houston come to mind. Due to a lack of size on the guard line and small forward, this version of the Runnin' Utes has been frustrating to watch guarding the bigger teams in the PAC12. I can see the desire of fans to want a bigger guy at power forward, allowing Jordan to move to the three to compensate for this lack of size at guard.

But, I can see Coach K's vision on defense where anyone will guard anybody. To do it effectively against good teams, you need a bunch of guys in the 6'4" to 6'7" range that can act as interchangeable parts offensively and defensively. Think of a team like the 1989 Illinois team that had Kendall Gill, Steve Bardo, Nick Anderson, and Kenny Battle. They played great defense because the 1 through 4 could guard any of the other teams 1 through 4.

[concerned]

In his post-game interview with Riley Krysko was talking about the future Loveridge as a 4. Interesting.

That surprises me, because up until now all the talk has been about how Loveridge has played out of position this year, that he is more of a 3, and that they have been playing hims at the 3 recently to make the transition for next year. The question has been whether he is too slow to play defense at the 3, maybe they have decided that he is.

[LA Ute]

That surprises me, because up until now all the talk has been about how Loveridge has played out of position this year, that he is more of a 3, and that they have been playing hims at the 3 recently to make the transition for next year. The question has been whether he is too slow to play defense at the 3, maybe they have decided that he is.

I was surprised too. Krysko also criticized Loveridge (mildly) for becoming too "enamored" of the three-point shot and trying to spread the floor too much, but said Jordan had corrected that tendency now. Here's the interview:

http://espn.kall700sports.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/03/Larry-Krystkowiak-Postgame.mp3

[SoCalPat]

Maybe I am in the minority, but I think Loveridge can be a very effective four-man IF: 1. He can continue to play with a big motor. JL looked like he wore down as the season progressed. Another full year of conditioning will help. 2. He can continue to extend his game and force a bigger guy to come out to guard him. This includes the ability to put the ball on the floor if his man presses too far out. 3. His defense continues to improve. In HS, it was probably pretty rare that he had to guard a guy that was bigger than him.

The history of college basketball is full of guys whom were great power forwards without ideal size. Guys like Byron Houston come to mind. Due to a lack of size on the guard line and small forward, this version of the Runnin' Utes has been frustrating to watch guarding the bigger teams in the PAC12. I can see the desire of fans to want a bigger guy at power forward, allowing Jordan to move to the three to compensate for this lack of size at guard.

But, I can see Coach K's vision on defense where anyone will guard anybody. To do it effectively against good teams, you need a bunch of guys in the 6'4" to 6'7" range that can act as interchangeable parts offensively and defensively. Think of a team like the 1989 Illinois team that had Kendall Gill, Steve Bardo, Nick Anderson, and Kenny Battle. They played great defense because the 1 through 4 could guard any of the other teams 1 through 4.

Now this is some good shit. Nothing gets my motor running like talk of late 1980s-early 1990s college hoops.

See, Houston is a lot of things I don't think Loveridge is (we should quickly clarify that this comparison is limited to hoops-only debate). The Houston I remember had a Concorde when it came to leaping ability. Very quick off his feet, and could reach peak elevation regardless of how many guys were standing around him. He was also about 50 pounds heavier than JL. And only eight players in NCAA history from a major conference went to the line more than Houston did in his career.

Your Illinois comparison is very good. But remember, what kept Illinois from winning the national championship that year? A big forward who could put the ball on the floor and drain it from the perimeter. That forward was Glen Rice, and I think there is the potential for JL to mold himself into that kind of player much more than there is for him to be a 4 where more of his game is back-to-the-basket.

[UBlender]

3-for-3 from the field, 5 pulls and a block in 11 minutes. If he can stay on the floor -- his 3 fouls were his only negative -- he'll be a force for us next year. He's going to force Loveridge to learn how to play the 3, because he's our starting 4 for 2013-14.

I think the biggest issue with both Loveridge at the 3 and Olsen at the 4 is whether they can defend those positions consistently. In particular, I don't see Olsen being able to step out and guard a 4 who is a threat to shoot or put the ball on the floor. I think Loveridge can get there with some work.

[Jeromy in SLC]

Your Illinois comparison is very good. But remember, what kept Illinois from winning the national championship that year? A big forward who could put the ball on the floor and drain it from the perimeter. That forward was Glen Rice, and I think there is the potential for JL to mold himself into that kind of player much more than there is for him to be a 4 where more of his game is back-to-the-basket.

The only quibble I have with this is that the Illini beat Michigan twice that year. I thought for that whole season that Illinois was the best team in the country. The best team just doesn't win the tourney every year. Solid thoughts on Houston BTW. I couldn't' think of a better example of the top of my head. UMass had another undersized guy a few years later, but his name escapes me.

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[UBlender]

The only quibble I have with this is that the Illini beat Michigan twice that year. I thought for that whole season that Illinois was the best team in the country. The best team just does win the tourney every year. Solid thoughts on Houston BTW. I couldn't' think of a better example of the top of my head. UMass had another undersized guy a few years later, but his name escapes me.

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Lou Roe?

[SoCalPat]

I think the biggest issue with both Loveridge at the 3 and Olsen at the 4 is whether they can defend those positions consistently. In particular, I don't see Olsen being able to step out and guard a 4 who is a threat to shoot or put the ball on the floor. I think Loveridge can get there with some work.

Then the question is, do you sacrifice a little defense for the potential of much more offense? We're pretty good at the latter, so why mess with it? At the same time, we need more scoring punch.

Let's see what the Kovacevic kid provides. A stout, shot-blocking 5 can erase a lot of mistakes in front of him. Put it this way -- if we had a David Foster-like center in the middle, then this debate is settled.

[LA Ute]

Then the question is, do you sacrifice a little defense for the potential of much more offense? We're pretty good at the latter, so why mess with it? At the same time, we need more scoring punch.

Let's see what the Kovacevic kid provides. A stout, shot-blocking 5 can erase a lot of mistakes in front of him. Put it this way -- if we had a David Foster-like center in the middle, then this debate is settled.

He's 6'11", 230 lbs. He needs a few more sandwiches before we can call him "stout." But I agree, he could be important next year, especially if Bachinsky doesn't develop.

[Scratch]

The more I see Loveridge at the 4, the more I hate it. Now what I'm about to say could be a result of a long season, against competition he's never faced on a consistent basis in his life. But he can't finish in traffic at the rim. Occasionally he'll get fouled. He's long in the arms, which is helpful, but he's slow in the feet. He's not explosive (He can jump, but his elevator takes a while to get to the top). He'll always be an above-average rebounder because of his length, but I fear his offensive game will suffer if he's forced to play inside.

Those are my observations from limited viewing. But the facts don't lie -- if you projected Olsen's minutes to match Loveridge's 31.0 MPG, he would score more and rebound more, and do it more efficiently -- he's shooting exactly 60 percent to JL's 40 percent. My biggest concern right now is Olsen's inability to get to the line -- only six attempts all year. Can't sugarcoat that -- that's a pathetic number for a big. Put Loveridge where you need to put him, but it should never come at the expense of Olsen's minutes.

I agree with this, although I'm not quite as opposed to Loveridge as a 4 as you are, but I think I'm less confident in his ability to play the 3. It seems like every P12 game there are 3-4 plays where JL's lack of height is completely exposed. While I think JL is going to have a great career at the U, I think his lack of about 2 inches and his inability to effectively guard a 3 or take an opposing 3 off the dribble will mean he tops out as a 15 ppg, 8 rpg game guy, instead of turning into someone who can score 18-20 ppg. Obviously he's still enormously valuable, but that's the difference between enormously valuable and superstar.


Maybe I am in the minority, but I think Loveridge can be a very effective four-man IF: 1. He can continue to play with a big motor. JL looked like he wore down as the season progressed. Another full year of conditioning will help. 2. He can continue to extend his game and force a bigger guy to come out to guard him. This includes the ability to put the ball on the floor if his man presses too far out. 3. His defense continues to improve. In HS, it was probably pretty rare that he had to guard a guy that was bigger than him.

The history of college basketball is full of guys whom were great power forwards without ideal size. Guys like Byron Houston come to mind. Due to a lack of size on the guard line and small forward, this version of the Runnin' Utes has been frustrating to watch guarding the bigger teams in the PAC12. I can see the desire of fans to want a bigger guy at power forward, allowing Jordan to move to the three to compensate for this lack of size at guard.

But, I can see Coach K's vision on defense where anyone will guard anybody. To do it effectively against good teams, you need a bunch of guys in the 6'4" to 6'7" range that can act as interchangeable parts offensively and defensively. Think of a team like the 1989 Illinois team that had Kendall Gill, Steve Bardo, Nick Anderson, and Kenny Battle. They played great defense because the 1 through 4 could guard any of the other teams 1 through 4.

Great, great post and insights. Thanks.

[Jarid in Cedar]

The only quibble I have with this is that the Illini beat Michigan twice that year. I thought for that whole season that Illinois was the best team in the country. The best team just does win the tourney every year. Solid thoughts on Houston BTW. I couldn't' think of a better example of the top of my head. UMass had another undersized guy a few years later, but his name escapes me.

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Fizer from Iowa State was the example I was thinking of.

[Jeromy in SLC]

Lou Roe?

That was the guy. 6 ft 6 inch-ish PF. He did have the advantage of having Marcus Camby next to him.

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[UtahsMrSports]

The discussion of loveridge and olsen has been fascinating to me. One of the big reasons that landing Chapman would be huge for our program is that it takes away a lot of these issues. With loveridge and chapman playing side by side, there isn't really a defined 3 and 4. they just play and take turns matching up against other teams forwards.

[crazyute]

Fizer from Iowa State was the example I was thinking of.

fizer was 6'8" not 6'5"

[U-Ute]

Now this is some good shit. Nothing gets my motor running like talk of late 1980s-early 1990s college hoops.

See, Houston is a lot of things I don't think Loveridge is (we should quickly clarify that this comparison is limited to hoops-only debate). The Houston I remember had a Concorde when it came to leaping ability. Very quick off his feet, and could reach peak elevation regardless of how many guys were standing around him. He was also about 50 pounds heavier than JL. And only eight players in NCAA history from a major conference went to the line more than Houston did in his career.

Your Illinois comparison is very good. But remember, what kept Illinois from winning the national championship that year? A big forward who could put the ball on the floor and drain it from the perimeter. That forward was Glen Rice, and I think there is the potential for JL to mold himself into that kind of player much more than there is for him to be a 4 where more of his game is back-to-the-basket.

This.