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Thread: A Believer Thread

  1. #241
    Living in the past ... FMCoug's Avatar
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    Your Ute educations are showing.

    That was clearly not shot at Lone Peak HS so I googled Lone Peak Stake and found a DesNews article about the video. Turns out this stake is in Sandy.

    Funny thing about mountains. There are multiple sides.



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  2. #242
    Living in the past ... FMCoug's Avatar
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    Also, since you hate kids from LP so much, we'll be happy to welcome Chase Hansen back to the fold.

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  3. #243
    I stand corrected. JL owes no explanation.

    Why is sandy so weird?

  4. #244
    Quote Originally Posted by FMCoug View Post
    Your Ute educations are showing.

    That was clearly not shot at Lone Peak HS so I googled Lone Peak Stake and found a DesNews article about the video. Turns out this stake is in Sandy.

    Funny thing about mountains. There are multiple sides.



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    I take it you hate the video so much, that you came here to ensure that everyone understood that it was not filmed with kids from your neck of the woods?

  5. #245
    Sam the Sheepdog LA Ute's Avatar
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    It doesn't matter where the video was made, it is the content that matters, and my daughter loved it so I don't care if you guys don't like it. (Insert here smiley sticking tongue out.)

    "It is only with the heart that one can see rightly; what is essential is invisible to the eye."
    --Antoine de Saint-Exupery

    "Things fall apart; the centre cannot hold."
    --Yeats

    “True, we [lawyers] build no bridges. We raise no towers. We construct no engines. We paint no pictures - unless as amateurs for our own principal amusement. There is little of all that we do which the eye of man can see. But we smooth out difficulties; we relieve stress; we correct mistakes; we take up other men's burdens and by our efforts we make possible the peaceful life of men in a peaceful state.”

    --John W. Davis, founder of Davis Polk & Wardwell

  6. #246
    Quote Originally Posted by LA Ute View Post
    It doesn't matter where the video was made, it is the content that matters, and my daughter loved it so I don't care if you guys don't like it. (Insert here smiley sticking tongue out.)
    My devout, super orthodox Mormon teenage daughter thinks it is "lame".

    Different strokes for different folks

  7. #247
    Living in the past ... FMCoug's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by chrisrenrut View Post
    I take it you hate the video so much, that you came here to ensure that everyone understood that it was not filmed with kids from your neck of the woods?
    I am indifferent about the video. Although I live in Utah County at the moment, I am not "from" Utah at all. My observations on Utah culture are well documented on various boards. I was just cracking up at the fact that you all jumped on this as being a Utah County thing. The fact that folks in the Salt Lake Valley consider Utah County "the bubble" is highly amusing to me and other Mormons not from here. The whole state (and most of Idaho) are a bubble.

  8. #248
    Sam the Sheepdog LA Ute's Avatar
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    So who here is in favor of modesty in dress, regardless of your feelings about regions of Utah?

    "It is only with the heart that one can see rightly; what is essential is invisible to the eye."
    --Antoine de Saint-Exupery

    "Things fall apart; the centre cannot hold."
    --Yeats

    “True, we [lawyers] build no bridges. We raise no towers. We construct no engines. We paint no pictures - unless as amateurs for our own principal amusement. There is little of all that we do which the eye of man can see. But we smooth out difficulties; we relieve stress; we correct mistakes; we take up other men's burdens and by our efforts we make possible the peaceful life of men in a peaceful state.”

    --John W. Davis, founder of Davis Polk & Wardwell

  9. #249
    Quote Originally Posted by LA Ute View Post
    So who here is in favor of modesty in dress, regardless of your feelings about regions of Utah?
    I think the problem I have with the video is making "virtue" synonymous with conforming to traditional LDS dress/grooming.

    My idea of virtue is for my kids to be nice to and reach out to all the other kids and especially those that don't conform to the stereotypes.

    I think this video makes more sense for LDS kids outside of Utah. Here in Utah they should be singing a song about the virtue of LDS kids being nice to non-LDS kids, gay kids, etc., not pressuring other kids to dress exactly like a stereotypical Mormon.

  10. #250
    Sam the Sheepdog LA Ute's Avatar
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    The Believer Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by CardiacCoug View Post
    I think the problem I have with the video is making "virtue" synonymous with conforming to traditional LDS dress/grooming.

    My idea of virtue is for my kids to be nice to and reach out to all the other kids and especially those that don't conform to the stereotypes.

    I think this video makes more sense for LDS kids outside of Utah. Here in Utah they should be singing a song about the virtue of LDS kids being nice to non-LDS kids, gay kids, etc., not pressuring other kids to dress exactly like a stereotypical Mormon.
    I just saw it as a whimsical video that made me laugh while sending a very positive message - that young men can see beauty in modestly dressed young women, and actually admire that. I don't see anything about stereotypical dress, just some guys having fun talking about a valid principle.
    Last edited by LA Ute; 10-27-2013 at 11:45 AM.

    "It is only with the heart that one can see rightly; what is essential is invisible to the eye."
    --Antoine de Saint-Exupery

    "Things fall apart; the centre cannot hold."
    --Yeats

    “True, we [lawyers] build no bridges. We raise no towers. We construct no engines. We paint no pictures - unless as amateurs for our own principal amusement. There is little of all that we do which the eye of man can see. But we smooth out difficulties; we relieve stress; we correct mistakes; we take up other men's burdens and by our efforts we make possible the peaceful life of men in a peaceful state.”

    --John W. Davis, founder of Davis Polk & Wardwell

  11. #251
    Quote Originally Posted by LA Ute View Post
    I just saw it as a whimsical video that made me laugh while sending a very positive message - that young men can see beauty in modestly dressed young women, and actually admire that. I don't see anything about stereotypical dress, just some guys having fun talking about a valid principle.
    I'm not a fan of the "Girls with integrity are hard to find these days" line.

  12. #252
    Sam the Sheepdog LA Ute's Avatar
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    The Believer Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by scottie View Post
    I'm not a fan of the "Girls with integrity are hard to find these days" line.
    I agree, that was not artfully worded. That's what happens when amateurs put out uncorrelated material, I guess.
    Last edited by LA Ute; 10-27-2013 at 12:58 PM.

    "It is only with the heart that one can see rightly; what is essential is invisible to the eye."
    --Antoine de Saint-Exupery

    "Things fall apart; the centre cannot hold."
    --Yeats

    “True, we [lawyers] build no bridges. We raise no towers. We construct no engines. We paint no pictures - unless as amateurs for our own principal amusement. There is little of all that we do which the eye of man can see. But we smooth out difficulties; we relieve stress; we correct mistakes; we take up other men's burdens and by our efforts we make possible the peaceful life of men in a peaceful state.”

    --John W. Davis, founder of Davis Polk & Wardwell

  13. #253
    Sam the Sheepdog LA Ute's Avatar
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    I'm often leery of this type of work, but this piece taught me a lot and answered a (minor) question I've had for years:

    Once Again: Joseph Smith, Richard Dawkins, and the Language of Translation

    http://www.mormoninterpreter.com/onc...f-translation/

    I still wonder why Joseph and those who helped him didn't use completely correct English grammar (lots of the "ye's" are wrong, for example), but that's a niggling concern for me.

    "It is only with the heart that one can see rightly; what is essential is invisible to the eye."
    --Antoine de Saint-Exupery

    "Things fall apart; the centre cannot hold."
    --Yeats

    “True, we [lawyers] build no bridges. We raise no towers. We construct no engines. We paint no pictures - unless as amateurs for our own principal amusement. There is little of all that we do which the eye of man can see. But we smooth out difficulties; we relieve stress; we correct mistakes; we take up other men's burdens and by our efforts we make possible the peaceful life of men in a peaceful state.”

    --John W. Davis, founder of Davis Polk & Wardwell

  14. #254
    Sam the Sheepdog LA Ute's Avatar
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    Highly recommended. I can't watch this without thinking of Moses, Chapter 1 (one of my favorite chapters in all the LDS scriptures):

    The Known Universe, by the American Museum of Natural History




    It also makes me think of this Dieter Uchtdorf line: "This is a paradox of man: compared to God, man is nothing; yet we are everything to God."

    "It is only with the heart that one can see rightly; what is essential is invisible to the eye."
    --Antoine de Saint-Exupery

    "Things fall apart; the centre cannot hold."
    --Yeats

    “True, we [lawyers] build no bridges. We raise no towers. We construct no engines. We paint no pictures - unless as amateurs for our own principal amusement. There is little of all that we do which the eye of man can see. But we smooth out difficulties; we relieve stress; we correct mistakes; we take up other men's burdens and by our efforts we make possible the peaceful life of men in a peaceful state.”

    --John W. Davis, founder of Davis Polk & Wardwell

  15. #255

    Kirby: Stick to the basics when it comes to Mormon beliefs

    http://www.sltrib.com/sltrib/lifesty...comes.html.csp

    If you’re one of those people who thinks the precise color of the donkey Jesus rode into Jerusalem is a deal-breaking factoid, I have a hard time not suspecting that you’re an obsessive dumb ass, never mind actually loving you.

    That was rude, I know. But it does aptly illustrate my struggle. When it comes to definitive proof of any religious text, I’m more of a skeptical anthropologist. I don’t completely trust anything involving human beings, including scripture.

    Actually, make that especially scripture. It doesn’t take much reading of any religious tome to start wondering if there isn’t sometimes a line between being a prophet of God and just plain nuts.
    I'm not a huge fan of Kirby but I found his recent offering fun.
    Last edited by tooblue; 02-06-2014 at 03:21 PM.

  16. #256
    Sam the Sheepdog LA Ute's Avatar
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    "Never be frightened at your own faint-heartedness in attaining love. Don’t be frightened overmuch even at your evil actions. I am sorry I can say nothing more consoling to you, for love in action is a harsh and dreadful thing compared with love in dreams. Love in dreams is greedy for immediate action, rapidly performed and in the sight of all. Men will even give their lives if only the ordeal does not last long but is soon over, with all looking on and applauding as though on the stage. But active love is labour and fortitude, and for some people too, perhaps, a complete science. But I predict that just when you see with horror that in spite of all your efforts you are getting farther from your goal instead of nearer to it- at that very moment I predict that you will reach it and behold clearly the miraculous power of the Lord who has been all the time loving and mysteriously guiding you."

    --Father Zossima in The Brothers Karamazov.
    Last edited by LA Ute; 03-23-2014 at 11:43 AM.

    "It is only with the heart that one can see rightly; what is essential is invisible to the eye."
    --Antoine de Saint-Exupery

    "Things fall apart; the centre cannot hold."
    --Yeats

    “True, we [lawyers] build no bridges. We raise no towers. We construct no engines. We paint no pictures - unless as amateurs for our own principal amusement. There is little of all that we do which the eye of man can see. But we smooth out difficulties; we relieve stress; we correct mistakes; we take up other men's burdens and by our efforts we make possible the peaceful life of men in a peaceful state.”

    --John W. Davis, founder of Davis Polk & Wardwell

  17. #257
    Senior Member Scorcho's Avatar
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    http://www.npr.org/blogs/thetwo-way/...y-harvard-says

    well of course Jesus was married, we learned this when he noted that he suffered all manor of afflicitions.


  18. #258
    Sam the Sheepdog LA Ute's Avatar
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    "It is only with the heart that one can see rightly; what is essential is invisible to the eye."
    --Antoine de Saint-Exupery

    "Things fall apart; the centre cannot hold."
    --Yeats

    “True, we [lawyers] build no bridges. We raise no towers. We construct no engines. We paint no pictures - unless as amateurs for our own principal amusement. There is little of all that we do which the eye of man can see. But we smooth out difficulties; we relieve stress; we correct mistakes; we take up other men's burdens and by our efforts we make possible the peaceful life of men in a peaceful state.”

    --John W. Davis, founder of Davis Polk & Wardwell

  19. #259
    Senior Member Scorcho's Avatar
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    about 11 P.M. last night I had the realization that last night was the anniversary of Christ in the Garden of Gethsemane (at least I think that is correct in the timeline). It was kind of a peaceful/cool moment for me to think about that for a moment. It reminded me that Gethsemane means Olive Press or wine press and just as all of the juices is squeezed out of a grape or olive in a press, Christ was essentially squeezed to the point of blood coming out of his pores.

    “I have trodden the winepress alone; and of the people there was none with me” (Isaiah 63:3).

  20. #260
    Sam the Sheepdog LA Ute's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Scorcho View Post
    about 11 P.M. last night I had the realization that last night was the anniversary of Christ in the Garden of Gethsemane (at least I think that is correct in the timeline). It was kind of a peaceful/cool moment for me to think about that for a moment. It reminded me that Gethsemane means Olive Press or wine press and just as all of the juices is squeezed out of a grape or olive in a press, Christ was essentially squeezed to the point of blood coming out of his pores.

    “I have trodden the winepress alone; and of the people there was none with me” (Isaiah 63:3).
    Love that Isaiah verse. I love thinking about the Atonement too, and had some of the same moments myself last night.

    "It is only with the heart that one can see rightly; what is essential is invisible to the eye."
    --Antoine de Saint-Exupery

    "Things fall apart; the centre cannot hold."
    --Yeats

    “True, we [lawyers] build no bridges. We raise no towers. We construct no engines. We paint no pictures - unless as amateurs for our own principal amusement. There is little of all that we do which the eye of man can see. But we smooth out difficulties; we relieve stress; we correct mistakes; we take up other men's burdens and by our efforts we make possible the peaceful life of men in a peaceful state.”

    --John W. Davis, founder of Davis Polk & Wardwell

  21. #261
    Sam the Sheepdog LA Ute's Avatar
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    "It is only with the heart that one can see rightly; what is essential is invisible to the eye."
    --Antoine de Saint-Exupery

    "Things fall apart; the centre cannot hold."
    --Yeats

    “True, we [lawyers] build no bridges. We raise no towers. We construct no engines. We paint no pictures - unless as amateurs for our own principal amusement. There is little of all that we do which the eye of man can see. But we smooth out difficulties; we relieve stress; we correct mistakes; we take up other men's burdens and by our efforts we make possible the peaceful life of men in a peaceful state.”

    --John W. Davis, founder of Davis Polk & Wardwell

  22. #262

  23. #263
    Sam the Sheepdog LA Ute's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Applejack View Post
    Is 2010 new?
    You got me. I saw that on Facebook and just dropped it here without checking the date. D'oh.

    "It is only with the heart that one can see rightly; what is essential is invisible to the eye."
    --Antoine de Saint-Exupery

    "Things fall apart; the centre cannot hold."
    --Yeats

    “True, we [lawyers] build no bridges. We raise no towers. We construct no engines. We paint no pictures - unless as amateurs for our own principal amusement. There is little of all that we do which the eye of man can see. But we smooth out difficulties; we relieve stress; we correct mistakes; we take up other men's burdens and by our efforts we make possible the peaceful life of men in a peaceful state.”

    --John W. Davis, founder of Davis Polk & Wardwell

  24. #264
    Sam the Sheepdog LA Ute's Avatar
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    Last edited by LA Ute; 05-31-2014 at 08:18 PM.

    "It is only with the heart that one can see rightly; what is essential is invisible to the eye."
    --Antoine de Saint-Exupery

    "Things fall apart; the centre cannot hold."
    --Yeats

    “True, we [lawyers] build no bridges. We raise no towers. We construct no engines. We paint no pictures - unless as amateurs for our own principal amusement. There is little of all that we do which the eye of man can see. But we smooth out difficulties; we relieve stress; we correct mistakes; we take up other men's burdens and by our efforts we make possible the peaceful life of men in a peaceful state.”

    --John W. Davis, founder of Davis Polk & Wardwell

  25. #265
    I found this post to be very good: http://timesandseasons.org/index.php...d-fence-holes/

    That there are holes in his argument, I have no doubt, but nevertheless the post resonated with me.
    “It only ends once. Anything that happens before that is just progress.”

    Well, because he thought it was good sport. Because some men aren't looking for anything logical, like money. They can't be bought, bullied, reasoned, or negotiated with. Some men just want to watch the world burn.

  26. #266
    Sam the Sheepdog LA Ute's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DrumNFeather View Post
    I found this post to be very good: http://timesandseasons.org/index.php...d-fence-holes/

    That there are holes in his argument, I have no doubt, but nevertheless the post resonated with me.
    With me too.

    "It is only with the heart that one can see rightly; what is essential is invisible to the eye."
    --Antoine de Saint-Exupery

    "Things fall apart; the centre cannot hold."
    --Yeats

    “True, we [lawyers] build no bridges. We raise no towers. We construct no engines. We paint no pictures - unless as amateurs for our own principal amusement. There is little of all that we do which the eye of man can see. But we smooth out difficulties; we relieve stress; we correct mistakes; we take up other men's burdens and by our efforts we make possible the peaceful life of men in a peaceful state.”

    --John W. Davis, founder of Davis Polk & Wardwell

  27. #267
    Sam the Sheepdog LA Ute's Avatar
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    Interesting perspective here:

    “Cosmos” and Christianity (or any religion, for that matter)
    Read more: http://www.patheos.com/blogs/peteren...#ixzz34MwBhxJA

    "It is only with the heart that one can see rightly; what is essential is invisible to the eye."
    --Antoine de Saint-Exupery

    "Things fall apart; the centre cannot hold."
    --Yeats

    “True, we [lawyers] build no bridges. We raise no towers. We construct no engines. We paint no pictures - unless as amateurs for our own principal amusement. There is little of all that we do which the eye of man can see. But we smooth out difficulties; we relieve stress; we correct mistakes; we take up other men's burdens and by our efforts we make possible the peaceful life of men in a peaceful state.”

    --John W. Davis, founder of Davis Polk & Wardwell

  28. #268
    Sam the Sheepdog LA Ute's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sancho View Post
    So, did you watch cosmos? I didn't even know it was on. Ever since I got cable a year ago, I have no idea what's on tv. I just click the guide to see if there are interesting sports or moves. I used to occasionally watch pbs; now I don't know what channel pbs is.

    Anyway, I feel guilty that astronomy is not more interesting to me. Such a grand science, full of abstract ideas and theories, but I just can't get into it.
    I am like you. I didn't even know it was on. I would like to see it, however.

    "It is only with the heart that one can see rightly; what is essential is invisible to the eye."
    --Antoine de Saint-Exupery

    "Things fall apart; the centre cannot hold."
    --Yeats

    “True, we [lawyers] build no bridges. We raise no towers. We construct no engines. We paint no pictures - unless as amateurs for our own principal amusement. There is little of all that we do which the eye of man can see. But we smooth out difficulties; we relieve stress; we correct mistakes; we take up other men's burdens and by our efforts we make possible the peaceful life of men in a peaceful state.”

    --John W. Davis, founder of Davis Polk & Wardwell

  29. #269
    Five-O Diehard Ute's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by LA Ute View Post
    I am like you. I didn't even know it was on. I would like to see it, however.
    It's on Bluray now

  30. #270
    Quote Originally Posted by sancho View Post
    So, did you watch cosmos? I didn't even know it was on. Ever since I got cable a year ago, I have no idea what's on tv. I just click the guide to see if there are interesting sports or moves. I used to occasionally watch pbs; now I don't know what channel pbs is.

    Anyway, I feel guilty that astronomy is not more interesting to me. Such a grand science, full of abstract ideas and theories, but I just can't get into it.
    Cosmos is fabulous. I highly recommend it. Disregard the fact that it was on Fox and was produced by Seth 'Family Guy' McFarlane. It was written by Steven Soter and Ann Druyan (Carl Sagan's wife), and narrated by Neil DeGrasse-Tyson, who is engaging and informative and pulls off the sexy-ass mustache look like nobody's business. I felt the Spirit while watching every episode.

    Every other show on TV is Stanford*, while Cosmos is awesomeness defined.

    (* or should that be Duke? One never can tell)

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