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Thread: Life in the Trump Era, Part 2

  1. #1621
    Sam the Sheepdog LA Ute's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by concerned View Post
    If only Obama has agreed to everything the Tea Party wanted, we would have had bipartisan working government . . . .
    You're beginning to see it now!

    (I'm not a Tea Party guy but they didn't just arise out of nowhere. They were a reaction to the Dems wildly overplaying their winning hand after the 2008 landslide.)

    "It is only with the heart that one can see rightly; what is essential is invisible to the eye."
    --Antoine de Saint-Exupery

    "Things fall apart; the centre cannot hold."
    --Yeats

    “True, we [lawyers] build no bridges. We raise no towers. We construct no engines. We paint no pictures - unless as amateurs for our own principal amusement. There is little of all that we do which the eye of man can see. But we smooth out difficulties; we relieve stress; we correct mistakes; we take up other men's burdens and by our efforts we make possible the peaceful life of men in a peaceful state.”

    --John W. Davis, founder of Davis Polk & Wardwell

  2. #1622
    Quote Originally Posted by LA Ute View Post
    Yes, we can agree to disagree. I did say the Republicans were (and are) the gang that couldn't shoot straight. They were idiots about cooperating with the Obama White House. The Freedom Caucus is a bunch of people more beholden to their donors -- or more charitably, to their base -- than to their constituents or to the country. (This malady is not confined to Republicans!) They regularly gum up the works of Congress.

    But President Obama doesn't get a pass. When Republicans did try to reach out to him, he infamously reminded them that elections have consequences: "I won." Well, that's one way of looking at our system of checks and balances. It probably works better in Chicago than in Washington. He's also the guy who said "I have a phone and a pen" and often tried to rule by executive order. (Not the only president to do that. Doesn't make it right.) That he was slaughtered in both midterm congressional elections during his two terms suggests that the electorate was unhappy with his approach.

    Look, when Medicare was enacted it was a huge change in the country's approach to how health care works. Over half the Republicans in the House voted for it. Almost half the Republicans in the Senate did too. Lyndon Johnson knew how to work compromises and bipartisan legislation. And...those laws have endured. I don't think Republicans were simply more reasonable in those days.
    You'll have to remind me what issue Obama was speaking to when he said "I won."
    Incidently, when McConnell blocked moderate Merricl Garlands nomination, he essentially said "I'm betting that I'll be able to say "I won."

  3. #1623
    Sam the Sheepdog LA Ute's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Irving Washington View Post
    You'll have to remind me what issue Obama was speaking to when he said "I won."
    Incidently, when McConnell blocked moderate Merricl Garlands nomination, he essentially said "I'm betting that I'll be able to say "I won."
    The first "I won" I know of:

    https://www.politico.com/story/2009/...p-i-won-017862

    Maybe Cocaine Mitch was just bitterly playing neener-neener.

    I've been thinking a bit about our earlier discussion. My poli sci degree is pretty useless except for political discussions (and there's some doubt about its usefulness even there), but as I try to understand what's really going on I am pretty depressed. I think our political class -- across the ideological spectrum -- is really sub-par these days. I wish I could sit down with J.D. Williams, Jim Mayfield, and R.J. Snow and talk about it with them.

    "It is only with the heart that one can see rightly; what is essential is invisible to the eye."
    --Antoine de Saint-Exupery

    "Things fall apart; the centre cannot hold."
    --Yeats

    “True, we [lawyers] build no bridges. We raise no towers. We construct no engines. We paint no pictures - unless as amateurs for our own principal amusement. There is little of all that we do which the eye of man can see. But we smooth out difficulties; we relieve stress; we correct mistakes; we take up other men's burdens and by our efforts we make possible the peaceful life of men in a peaceful state.”

    --John W. Davis, founder of Davis Polk & Wardwell

  4. #1624
    Quote Originally Posted by LA Ute View Post
    The first "I won" I know of:

    https://www.politico.com/story/2009/...p-i-won-017862

    Maybe Cocaine Mitch was just bitterly playing neener-neener.

    I've been thinking a bit about our earlier discussion. My poli sci degree is pretty useless except for political discussions (and there's some doubt about its usefulness even there), but as I try to understand what's really going on I am pretty depressed. I think our political class -- across the ideological spectrum -- is really sub-par these days. I wish I could sit down with J.D. Williams, Jim Mayfield, and R.J. Snow and talk about it with them.
    The hardest part of that discussion would be how the problem is mostly the electorate. "We have met the enemy, and they are us."

  5. #1625
    Quote Originally Posted by LA Ute View Post
    The first "I won" I know of:

    https://www.politico.com/story/2009/...p-i-won-017862

    Maybe Cocaine Mitch was just bitterly playing neener-neener.

    I've been thinking a bit about our earlier discussion. My poli sci degree is pretty useless except for political discussions (and there's some doubt about its usefulness even there), but as I try to understand what's really going on I am pretty depressed. I think our political class -- across the ideological spectrum -- is really sub-par these days. I wish I could sit down with J.D. Williams, Jim Mayfield, and R.J. Snow and talk about it with them.
    To me, the real problem today is that nobody has any incentive to compromise, and has just the opposite incentive to avoid a primary from a more extreme idealogue. There are so few competitive districts or states, no one has any incentive to move to the middle. And because of Citizens United and the rise of superpacs, pols have as much allegiance to the Kochs or Adelson (for example) as to the party or to leadership. Sam Rayburn, Lyndon Johnson, Tip O'Neil, Bob Dole, etc. could twist arms. Much harder now. The tail (freedom caucus) now wags the dog (leadership).
    Last edited by concerned; 04-17-2019 at 10:07 AM.

  6. #1626
    Quote Originally Posted by concerned View Post
    To me, the real problem today is that nobody has any incentive to compromise, and has just the opposite incentive to avoid a primary from a more extreme idealogue. There are so few competitive districts or states, no one has any incentive to move to the middle. And because of Citizens United and the rise of superpacs, pols have as much allegiance to the Kochs or Adelson (for example) as to the party or to leadership. Sam Rayburn, Lyndon Johnson, Tip O'Neil, Bob Dole, etc. could twist arms. Much harder now. The tail (freedom caucus) now wags the dog (leadership).
    Very true. Not only that but if you DO for some reason compromise you are going to get nailed by the extremists in the electorate at the next primary. Let us not forget that Bob Bennett, despite overwhelming popularity among Utahns, didn't make it out of primaries as an incumbent because he was 'too liberal' based off of some of the compromises he had made.

  7. #1627
    https://www.justice.gov/storage/report.pdf


    The report we've all been waiting for. Looking forward to the DOJ OIG FISA report as well -- May or June.
    “Children and dogs are as necessary to the welfare of the country as Wall Street and the railroads.” -- Harry S. Truman

    "You never soar so high as when you stoop down to help a child or an animal." -- Jewish Proverb

    "Three-time Pro Bowler Eric Weddle the most versatile, and maybe most intelligent, safety in the game." -- SI, 9/7/15, p. 107.

  8. #1628
    Sam the Sheepdog LA Ute's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mUUser View Post
    https://www.justice.gov/storage/report.pdf


    The report we've all been waiting for. Looking forward to the DOJ OIG FISA report as well -- May or June.
    The legal question is going to be whether it's possible to commit obstruction of justice when there is no underlying crime. Barr doesn't think so. Maybe the legal fight over that issue will give CNN and MSNBC, along with countless lawyer talking heads, something to talk about up through the 2020 election and beyond.

    "It is only with the heart that one can see rightly; what is essential is invisible to the eye."
    --Antoine de Saint-Exupery

    "Things fall apart; the centre cannot hold."
    --Yeats

    “True, we [lawyers] build no bridges. We raise no towers. We construct no engines. We paint no pictures - unless as amateurs for our own principal amusement. There is little of all that we do which the eye of man can see. But we smooth out difficulties; we relieve stress; we correct mistakes; we take up other men's burdens and by our efforts we make possible the peaceful life of men in a peaceful state.”

    --John W. Davis, founder of Davis Polk & Wardwell

  9. #1629
    Sam the Sheepdog LA Ute's Avatar
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    Analysis: True.

    The obstruction case against Trump is not conclusive. In fact, his indiscretion and ineptness could be seen as evidence that he did not think he was breaking the law. But at the same time, he recklessly created the appearance that he was guilty of something, disregarding sound legal advice from people who knew better. If arrogant stupidity were a crime, Trump would be guilty beyond a reasonable doubt.
    https://reason.com/2019/04/18/trump-...ant-stupidity/

    "It is only with the heart that one can see rightly; what is essential is invisible to the eye."
    --Antoine de Saint-Exupery

    "Things fall apart; the centre cannot hold."
    --Yeats

    “True, we [lawyers] build no bridges. We raise no towers. We construct no engines. We paint no pictures - unless as amateurs for our own principal amusement. There is little of all that we do which the eye of man can see. But we smooth out difficulties; we relieve stress; we correct mistakes; we take up other men's burdens and by our efforts we make possible the peaceful life of men in a peaceful state.”

    --John W. Davis, founder of Davis Polk & Wardwell

  10. #1630
    Quote Originally Posted by LA Ute View Post
    The legal question is going to be whether it's possible to commit obstruction of justice when there is no underlying crime. Barr doesn't think so. Maybe the legal fight over that issue will give CNN and MSNBC, along with countless lawyer talking heads, something to talk about up through the 2020 election and beyond.


    Going exactly how one might imagine. No minds were changed. Cherry picking and extreme tribalism at its finest. This won't stop -- not in 2 years, not in 6 years. We are a nation past healing.

    I am, however, amused the Mueller Report called out CNN and Buzzfeed specifically. Zero credibility left for those two organizations.
    “Children and dogs are as necessary to the welfare of the country as Wall Street and the railroads.” -- Harry S. Truman

    "You never soar so high as when you stoop down to help a child or an animal." -- Jewish Proverb

    "Three-time Pro Bowler Eric Weddle the most versatile, and maybe most intelligent, safety in the game." -- SI, 9/7/15, p. 107.

  11. #1631
    Quote Originally Posted by LA Ute View Post
    The legal question is going to be whether it's possible to commit obstruction of justice when there is no underlying crime. Barr doesn't think so.
    How broadly could this view be applied? To any of us regular citizens? "Unless you already have absolute proof of me committing a crime, I'm instructing all my employees to disregard your investigation, destroy all our backups, shred the financial records. Catch me if you can... but you won't be able to. Catch-22, in my favor!"

    Maybe this could get DUI laws thrown out - the part about forcing people to complete a breathelyzer, or it's assumed they're intoxicated. (I'm likely mangling this law and interpretation, since I don't drink and don't really care about DUIs unless somebody gets hurt)

    Or was Barr's point that it's impossible for the President to obstruct justice, because he's the President? Didn't he write a memo to that effect?

  12. #1632
    Sam the Sheepdog LA Ute's Avatar
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    Life in the Trump Era, Part 2

    Quote Originally Posted by Ma'ake View Post
    How broadly could this view be applied? To any of us regular citizens? "Unless you already have absolute proof of me committing a crime, I'm instructing all my employees to disregard your investigation, destroy all our backups, shred the financial records. Catch me if you can... but you won't be able to. Catch-22, in my favor!"

    Maybe this could get DUI laws thrown out - the part about forcing people to complete a breathelyzer, or it's assumed they're intoxicated. (I'm likely mangling this law and interpretation, since I don't drink and don't really care about DUIs unless somebody gets hurt)

    Or was Barr's point that it's impossible for the President to obstruct justice, because he's the President? Didn't he write a memo to that effect?
    A person can be guilty of obstruction of justice without an underlying crime if the person has a "corrupt motive." That's discussed here:

    https://www.axios.com/mueller-report...bd2031f35.html

    Excerpt:

    Any case for "obstruction of justice" has to demonstrate that said obstruction was driven by corrupt motives. Barr said on Thursday that Mueller's special counsel found 10 episodes of the president potentially obstructing justice, but that it's important to "bear in mind the context."
    "President Trump faced an unprecedented situation. As he entered into office, and sought to perform his responsibilities as President, federal agents and prosecutors were scrutinizing his conduct before and after taking office, and the conduct of some of his associates. At the same time, there was relentless speculation in the news media about the President’s personal culpability. Yet, as he said from the beginning, there was in fact no collusion. And as the Special Counsel’s report acknowledges, there is substantial evidence to show that the President was frustrated and angered by a sincere belief that the investigation was undermining his presidency, propelled by his political opponents, and fueled by illegal leaks.

    Nonetheless, the White House fully cooperated with the Special Counsel’s investigation, providing unfettered access to campaign and White House documents, directing senior aides to testify freely, and asserting no privilege claims. And at the same time, the President took no act that in fact deprived the Special Counsel of the documents and witnesses necessary to complete his investigation. Apart from whether the acts were obstructive, this evidence of non-corrupt motives weighs heavily against any allegation that the President had a corrupt intent to obstruct the investigation."


    The debate going forward will break down along party lines. Dems will say his intent was corrupt, Repubs will say the opposite. I think the Dems have the more uphill task, because that element (corrupt intent) must be proved beyond a reasonable doubt.
    Last edited by LA Ute; 04-21-2019 at 07:04 PM.

    "It is only with the heart that one can see rightly; what is essential is invisible to the eye."
    --Antoine de Saint-Exupery

    "Things fall apart; the centre cannot hold."
    --Yeats

    “True, we [lawyers] build no bridges. We raise no towers. We construct no engines. We paint no pictures - unless as amateurs for our own principal amusement. There is little of all that we do which the eye of man can see. But we smooth out difficulties; we relieve stress; we correct mistakes; we take up other men's burdens and by our efforts we make possible the peaceful life of men in a peaceful state.”

    --John W. Davis, founder of Davis Polk & Wardwell

  13. #1633
    Sam the Sheepdog LA Ute's Avatar
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    Matt Taibibi in Rolling Stone:

    The Press Will Learn Nothing From the Russiagate Fiasco

    https://www.rollingstone.com/politic...ia-826246/amp/

    I was active in trying to stop Trump during the 2016 primaries. Maybe Taibibi’s right about why that effort failed.

    "It is only with the heart that one can see rightly; what is essential is invisible to the eye."
    --Antoine de Saint-Exupery

    "Things fall apart; the centre cannot hold."
    --Yeats

    “True, we [lawyers] build no bridges. We raise no towers. We construct no engines. We paint no pictures - unless as amateurs for our own principal amusement. There is little of all that we do which the eye of man can see. But we smooth out difficulties; we relieve stress; we correct mistakes; we take up other men's burdens and by our efforts we make possible the peaceful life of men in a peaceful state.”

    --John W. Davis, founder of Davis Polk & Wardwell

  14. #1634
    Sam the Sheepdog LA Ute's Avatar
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    Romney was never Christian enough for some Republicans. Somehow, Trump is.

    https://www.washingtonpost.com/outlo...=.c57b03f028cb

    "It is only with the heart that one can see rightly; what is essential is invisible to the eye."
    --Antoine de Saint-Exupery

    "Things fall apart; the centre cannot hold."
    --Yeats

    “True, we [lawyers] build no bridges. We raise no towers. We construct no engines. We paint no pictures - unless as amateurs for our own principal amusement. There is little of all that we do which the eye of man can see. But we smooth out difficulties; we relieve stress; we correct mistakes; we take up other men's burdens and by our efforts we make possible the peaceful life of men in a peaceful state.”

    --John W. Davis, founder of Davis Polk & Wardwell

  15. #1635
    Quote Originally Posted by LA Ute View Post
    Romney was never Christian enough for some Republicans. Somehow, Trump is.

    https://www.washingtonpost.com/outlo...=.c57b03f028cb

    Nancy's husband has a really good column about Franklin Graham and evangelicalism in the Trump era

    https://www.nationalreview.com/2019/...lical-witness/
    Last edited by U-Ute; 04-26-2019 at 11:30 AM.

  16. #1636
    Quote Originally Posted by LA Ute View Post
    Romney was never Christian enough for some Republicans. Somehow, Trump is.

    https://www.washingtonpost.com/outlo...=.c57b03f028cb
    We all knew Mitt & Mormonism were going to take a beating in 2012 from the Evangelicals, though it was fairly quiet. Several years later, the beating looks far worse, as maybe the most immoral man to take the office is praised by Evangelicals as being delivered by God himself.

    Yet within the very broad tent of Protestantism, Mayor Pete can pre-emptively defend himself from Pence by telling him to take up any objection with Pete's nature with "my creator". There's always been a "we'll agree to disagree" respect inside the Protestant tent, even though Pete is certainly pushing this unspoken pact, manifested by Franklin Graham calling for him to repent.

    (Then again Franklin Graham calls on everyone to repent and come unto Jesus... including Mormons. Overt Evangelism was the underlying problem at Santa Fe Springs HS in Texas where the ACLU had to protect the Mormon and Catholic kids from Evangelism run amok, with student leaders praying to Jesus over the loudspeaker to soften the hearts of their "non-Christian" classmates.)

  17. #1637
    Sam the Sheepdog LA Ute's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by concerned View Post
    Nancy's husband has a really good column about Franklin Graham and evangelicalism in the Trump era


    https://www.nationalreview.com/2019/04/franklin-graham-and-the-high-cost-of-the-lost-evangelical-witness/

    I saw that. I know both the Frenches and they are good, principled people. You’d like them. Much easier to be around than I am.

    "It is only with the heart that one can see rightly; what is essential is invisible to the eye."
    --Antoine de Saint-Exupery

    "Things fall apart; the centre cannot hold."
    --Yeats

    “True, we [lawyers] build no bridges. We raise no towers. We construct no engines. We paint no pictures - unless as amateurs for our own principal amusement. There is little of all that we do which the eye of man can see. But we smooth out difficulties; we relieve stress; we correct mistakes; we take up other men's burdens and by our efforts we make possible the peaceful life of men in a peaceful state.”

    --John W. Davis, founder of Davis Polk & Wardwell

  18. #1638
    Administrator U-Ute's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by LA Ute View Post
    Matt Taibibi in Rolling Stone:

    The Press Will Learn Nothing From the Russiagate Fiasco

    https://www.rollingstone.com/politic...ia-826246/amp/

    I was active in trying to stop Trump during the 2016 primaries. Maybe Taibibi’s right about why that effort failed.
    I'm still struggling with this conclusion:

    You know what was fake news? Most of the Russiagate story. There was no Trump-Russia conspiracy, that thing we just spent three years chasing. The Mueller Report is crystal clear on this.
    He didn’t just “fail to establish” evidence of crime. His report is full of incredibly damning passages, like one about Russian officialdom’s efforts to reach the Trump campaign after the election: “They appeared not to have preexisting contacts and struggled to connect with senior officials around the President-Elect.”


    Not only was there no “collusion,” the two camps didn’t even have each others’ phone numbers!
    The question I have is this: if this is true, and why was everyone lying about their connections?

  19. #1639
    Quote Originally Posted by LA Ute View Post
    I saw that. I know both the Frenches and they are good, principled people. You’d like them. Much easier to be around than I am.
    I suspect I would like them too. I follow David on twitter, and read most of the stuff he links too. He is very thoughtful and principled. They are both right about evangelicals and Trump. I am constantly surprised that they appear to be in the minority among evangelicals on that score.

  20. #1640
    Here's a fascinating article about a PR strategy used by Trump/Barr to deal with the Mueller Report called "Reflexive Control", which is a way to frame the narrative so that your audience naturally comes to the conclusion you sought them to. https://www.nytimes.com/2019/04/19/o...gtype=Homepage

    It worked like this:


    1. We heard early claims that "collusion is not illegal" from people like Giuliani and even Trump. Not heavy repetition, but enough to plant the seed. (Collusion is not even a legal term, outside of narrow definitions in anti-trust law.)

    2. The actual term, "conspiracy", is a legal term, and it's very hard to prove.

    3. Barr then conflated the two, used the terms interchangeably, and the public is led to either consider "collusion" which isn't illegal, or "conspiracy", which is an extremely high bar to clear.

    It's actually a pretty impressive strategy.

    An example: Let's say we Ute fans have a serious axe to grind with Kalani Sitake, and want him out.

    1. Plant the seed - "BYU is a private university, they have flexibility public schools don't". Repeat it enough that it's in people's minds. Countervailing factors like the HC aren't even that important.

    2. Bring in the idea that as a private school sponsored by a financially strong church, BYU has nearly unlimited resources. (Again, that BYU doesn't use tithing money or general church funds for BYU football isn't important, as much as laying the subliminal thought, "we have plenty of money")

    3. When Utah wins again, or even if BYU does not dominate (as a private school with deep pockets should), Ute fans can sit back and watch pressure mount within the BYU ecosystem that Sitake is underperforming.

    The reflexive control exerted from outside that eco-system lays the groundwork, with the simplistic rationale being private schools have flexibility that should result in more success, and/or the deep pockets of the LDS church should be brought to bear to make BYU truly great again. This clearly hasn't happened, and somebody needs to go, and it might as well be Sitake - who was hired on the cheap - (and maybe Tom Holmoe).

    At the very least it makes BYU fans angry and dissatisfied with results, even narrow wins.

    (Sitake's a great guy whom I admire, so this scenario isn't serious, but hopefully this describes the Reflexive Control technique)
    Last edited by Ma'ake; 04-28-2019 at 10:06 AM.

  21. #1641
    Sam the Sheepdog LA Ute's Avatar
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    Life in the Trump Era, Part 2

    If the Democratic leadership council still existed, Joel Kotkin would be a leading member of it.

    It’s far too early to predict which party will win next year’s election, but not too early to announce the national media as a clear loser in terms of national influence and prestige.

    Pew reports that millennials have become as negative about major media as older generations, with their rate of approval dropping from 40% in 2010 to 27% today. Gallup tracks a similar pattern, finding 70% losing trust in the media, including nearly half of Democrats.

    As Trump backers never cease to point out, the Mueller report undermined the supposedly rock solid case for “collusion.” Whatever the truth, a solid majority of Americans believe the Russiagate brouhaha was politically motivated. Some progressives, like Rolling Stone’s contributing editor Matt Taibbi, believe Mueller represents “a death-blow for the reputation of the American news media.”

    Ironically, Trump, the man the media wanted to bring down, was largely their creation. At a party in 2016, my wife and I were regaled by a CNN account executive crowing about the company’s strategy of using Trump rallies, at the exclusion of others, to boost ratings. Once having created President Frankenstein, CNN then tried to keep up the ratings by chronicling his disposal — this worked for MSNBC which, unlike CNN, never much pretended to be an objective network. Today, CNN’s audience share has fallen below not only leader Fox, but MSNBC, Home and Garden, Discovery and Food networks.
    http://www.newgeography.com/content/...a-s-mega-media
    Last edited by LA Ute; 05-08-2019 at 04:15 AM.

    "It is only with the heart that one can see rightly; what is essential is invisible to the eye."
    --Antoine de Saint-Exupery

    "Things fall apart; the centre cannot hold."
    --Yeats

    “True, we [lawyers] build no bridges. We raise no towers. We construct no engines. We paint no pictures - unless as amateurs for our own principal amusement. There is little of all that we do which the eye of man can see. But we smooth out difficulties; we relieve stress; we correct mistakes; we take up other men's burdens and by our efforts we make possible the peaceful life of men in a peaceful state.”

    --John W. Davis, founder of Davis Polk & Wardwell

  22. #1642
    I'm guessing someone could come up with a bunch of former federal prosecutors who would disagree with these guys, but interesting none the less.

    https://medium.com/@dojalumni/statem...s-8ab7691c2aa1

  23. #1643
    Quote Originally Posted by LA Ute View Post
    If the Democratic leadership council still existed, Joel Kotkin would be a leading member of it.


    What would be the equivalent Republican organization?

  24. #1644
    Quote Originally Posted by UTEopia View Post
    I'm guessing someone could come up with a bunch of former federal prosecutors who would disagree with these guys, but interesting none the less.

    https://medium.com/@dojalumni/statem...s-8ab7691c2aa1

    I'll start: Rudy Guillani.

  25. #1645
    I'm certainly no expert on Executive Privilege, but Trump claiming it as to the entirety of the Mueller Report and the underlying evidence troubles me. Add that to his tweeting that his term should be extended, I'm starting to seriously wonder what will happen if he loses in 2020. The US can survive Trump the liar, Trump the clown, Trump the thief, Trump's tax plan, Trump's tariffs, and his legitimate exercise of Presidential authority (even though I disagree with most of what he does in that regard). Can it survive Trump the man who wants to be king?

    https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/polit...2Xv?li=BBnb7Kz

  26. #1646
    Quote Originally Posted by concerned View Post
    I'll start: Rudy Guillani.
    I kind of meant guys not paid by Trump, but good start.

  27. #1647
    Quote Originally Posted by UTEopia View Post
    I kind of meant guys not paid by Trump, but good start.
    You are making it a lot harder

  28. #1648
    Administrator U-Ute's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by concerned View Post
    What would be the equivalent Republican organization?
    Fox News

  29. #1649
    Sam the Sheepdog LA Ute's Avatar
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    This has less to do with Trump than with prosecutorial overreach, which I have seen in the lives of my own clients. I am not a white-collar lawyer, but I am surrounded by partners who are, and I work with them on these cases. The power of federal prosecutors is truly awesome, and needs to be watched carefully.

    https://thefederalist.com/2017/06/12...ruction-cases/

    "It is only with the heart that one can see rightly; what is essential is invisible to the eye."
    --Antoine de Saint-Exupery

    "Things fall apart; the centre cannot hold."
    --Yeats

    “True, we [lawyers] build no bridges. We raise no towers. We construct no engines. We paint no pictures - unless as amateurs for our own principal amusement. There is little of all that we do which the eye of man can see. But we smooth out difficulties; we relieve stress; we correct mistakes; we take up other men's burdens and by our efforts we make possible the peaceful life of men in a peaceful state.”

    --John W. Davis, founder of Davis Polk & Wardwell

  30. #1650
    Sam the Sheepdog LA Ute's Avatar
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    I’m trolling you all with this:

    Trump Will Be the First President to Support Gay Marriage from the Beginning

    https://web.archive.org/web/20170322...age-beginning/

    But is it really trolling if it’s true?

    "It is only with the heart that one can see rightly; what is essential is invisible to the eye."
    --Antoine de Saint-Exupery

    "Things fall apart; the centre cannot hold."
    --Yeats

    “True, we [lawyers] build no bridges. We raise no towers. We construct no engines. We paint no pictures - unless as amateurs for our own principal amusement. There is little of all that we do which the eye of man can see. But we smooth out difficulties; we relieve stress; we correct mistakes; we take up other men's burdens and by our efforts we make possible the peaceful life of men in a peaceful state.”

    --John W. Davis, founder of Davis Polk & Wardwell

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