Jim Treacher:
Good point.In six short years, [Democrats have] all gone from “Hurr hurr, Romney is stuck in ’80s” to “OMG, my phone charger is missing, Putin stole it!” It’s just odd to me that they think Obama took care of this guy, and yet he stole an election right from under Obama’s nose.
Doublethink is your best entertainment value.
https://pjmedia.com/trending/vladimi...his-blog-post/
"It is only with the heart that one can see rightly; what is essential is invisible to the eye."
--Antoine de Saint-Exupery
"Things fall apart; the centre cannot hold."
--Yeats
“True, we [lawyers] build no bridges. We raise no towers. We construct no engines. We paint no pictures - unless as amateurs for our own principal amusement. There is little of all that we do which the eye of man can see. But we smooth out difficulties; we relieve stress; we correct mistakes; we take up other men's burdens and by our efforts we make possible the peaceful life of men in a peaceful state.”
--John W. Davis, founder of Davis Polk & Wardwell
Trump’s claim of poor California forest management rings true — to a degree
https://www.sfchronicle.com/bayarea/...t-13400503.php“A century of mismanaging Sierra Nevada forests has brought an unprecedented environmental catastrophe that impacts all Californians.” That’s not a tweet from President Trump, but the opening line of a February report by California’s Little Hoover Commission investigating fire danger in the state.
“The immediate crisis is visible to anyone who has traveled recently in the Sierra Nevada, especially in its southern range where mountainsides are brown with dying and dead forests,” Commission Chairman Pedro Nava wrote in the cover letter for “Fire on the Mountain,” an 82-page report on the tinderbox nature of the state’s forests....
"It is only with the heart that one can see rightly; what is essential is invisible to the eye."
--Antoine de Saint-Exupery
"Things fall apart; the centre cannot hold."
--Yeats
“True, we [lawyers] build no bridges. We raise no towers. We construct no engines. We paint no pictures - unless as amateurs for our own principal amusement. There is little of all that we do which the eye of man can see. But we smooth out difficulties; we relieve stress; we correct mistakes; we take up other men's burdens and by our efforts we make possible the peaceful life of men in a peaceful state.”
--John W. Davis, founder of Davis Polk & Wardwell
Cards Against Humanity bought a chunk of land adjacent to where the infamous wall would go, and then anyone who donated $15 was deeded a chunk of the land making eminent domain claims excruciatingly time consuming.
https://www.wkrn.com/news/cards-agai...all/1605903901
https://cardsagainsthumanitystopsthewall.com/
Super funny until we realize politicians don’t care about spending money, and it just means less services for more important areas.Originally Posted by U-Ute
Have you read Bob Woodward's latest book? I stand by my first sentence. As for the second, it is not applied to every Republican -- that would be the fallacy of composition (or division, I have trouble keeping those straight) -- but rather to those who embraced him so quickly and happily.
"It'd be nice to please everyone but I thought it would be more interesting to have a point of view." -- Oscar Levant
I rarely step into this forum. But this is patently false. It's a lie so big, not even Trump has tried spreading it.
I may be wrong but it’s no lie. It’s based on what I’ve seen while living there for the last 36+ years, having followed districting closely because of my work. Tell me where I’m wrong.
Last edited by LA Ute; 11-21-2018 at 07:34 PM.
"It is only with the heart that one can see rightly; what is essential is invisible to the eye."
--Antoine de Saint-Exupery
"Things fall apart; the centre cannot hold."
--Yeats
“True, we [lawyers] build no bridges. We raise no towers. We construct no engines. We paint no pictures - unless as amateurs for our own principal amusement. There is little of all that we do which the eye of man can see. But we smooth out difficulties; we relieve stress; we correct mistakes; we take up other men's burdens and by our efforts we make possible the peaceful life of men in a peaceful state.”
--John W. Davis, founder of Davis Polk & Wardwell
I don't know whether it is true or not. I guess I would ask whether there is a Republican stronghold similar in size to SLC that is divided into 3 separate house districts in order to dilute the Republican stronghold.
It’s pretty widely known that the Dems in CA were in a position to obliterate the GOP after the 2010 census. The two parties made a deal: The redistricting would create a permanent Democratic majority but there would be.a few safe Republican districts. Now, in our state legislature, the only question is whether the Democrats will have a super-majority that enables them to pass tax increases without any opposition party votes. (They have that now.)
One result of this is a deeply divided legislature. All any candidate must do is get their party’s nomination. Voters in primaries are always more extreme than general election voters. Thus we now have a legislature composed of a permanent minority of very conservative Republicans and a permanent majority of very liberal Democrats. They can’t agree on anything and the very liberal Democrats can do whatever they want. I haven’t followed Utah politics closely for many years but it seems like the situation there is kind of the reverse of California’s.
That’s why I supported Prop 4 in the most recent election. I don’t like it when people lack a voice in their government.
"It is only with the heart that one can see rightly; what is essential is invisible to the eye."
--Antoine de Saint-Exupery
"Things fall apart; the centre cannot hold."
--Yeats
“True, we [lawyers] build no bridges. We raise no towers. We construct no engines. We paint no pictures - unless as amateurs for our own principal amusement. There is little of all that we do which the eye of man can see. But we smooth out difficulties; we relieve stress; we correct mistakes; we take up other men's burdens and by our efforts we make possible the peaceful life of men in a peaceful state.”
--John W. Davis, founder of Davis Polk & Wardwell
In Utah we've seen the insularity of the Legislature result in not just opposition to Democrats (who aren't seriously considered) but opposition to the Governor and repeated willingness to defy public polling on issues, such as the prison move (so real estate developers can make a mint on the land where the current prison is).
Now that Mia Love lost, and voters approved multiple initiatives (which are very tough to get on the ballot), it will be interesting to see if the Utah GOP insularity is affected. Utah is getting more diverse, younger voters reject orthodox positions, women are finding power.
Regarding districting creating "safe" districts to ensure roughly representative numbers in the Legislature / Assembly / Congress and the ensuing extremes that leads to no cooperation, I hope the nation is getting tired of endless strife.
The Founders taught us that compromise is an essential value. The Constitution, even the 3/5 compromise, were impressive displays of the power of compromise, but the Civil War ensued less than 80 years later.
The big question is whether we're smart enough now to mitigate strife leading to political violence and perhaps even another Civil War, or if we can find leadership who will seriously extend an open hand across the aisle, looking for enough unity to head off far worse hostilities.
Not to get off on a tangent here but I actually think it was the right thing to do to move the prison despite public polling (which is why we have elected representatives in the first place). Yes the land the prison occupies is valuable, but that whole area will be key to the economic development of SL and Utah County and the state as a whole. Work as of late has taken me back and forth to Utah County and that whole corridor is exploding with tech businesses and I can honestly seeing it being more of a commercial hub than downtown SLC in the next 20-30 years. Having a prison in the middle of that makes zero sense and would just get more costly to displace in the future.
A friend and neighbor was heavily involved in that process as a representative of the prison system. The current prison is woefully out of date and frankly quite cruel to prisoners under current standards. To fix or retrofit in place would have been incredibly costly and it is just a matter of time before serious criticisms and issues would be leveled at the local prison system.
I was an opponent to the light rail system at the time, and so was much of the public. However, fortunately some foresight had the lawmakers push ahead and I think we are all glad for the mass commuting infrastructure we have in place now... in fact it is arguable it is far too little. But massive congestion on I-15 at 3pm most weekdays now indicates that we need to be thinking of the future, and I think the prison decision was no different.
This is the last time you'll likely here me say the clowns who run the state legislature got something right, and I agree with the essence of what you posted, just my 2 cents on the prison move.
I think you are right about the economic value of moving the prison to another location. My main problem with the way it was done is that those who will benefit economically from the move are being subsidized by the taxpayers who in my opinion are not getting fair compensation for the value of the land and who will be paying the tab for the new prison.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Califo...ing_Commission
Wow, that Wikipedia post makes it seem like everything is sunshine and puppies in CA. The redistricting commission was created by ballot initiative in 2010 to correct outrageous gerrymandering in the state. It was a lot like Prop 4 in Utah, which just passed in response to the same problem, which I think was even worse in Utah. The fact is that there is a permanent Democratic majority in the California Legislature and that not a single statewide office is held by a Republican. That's the way in which CA is the reverse image of Utah.
"It is only with the heart that one can see rightly; what is essential is invisible to the eye."
--Antoine de Saint-Exupery
"Things fall apart; the centre cannot hold."
--Yeats
“True, we [lawyers] build no bridges. We raise no towers. We construct no engines. We paint no pictures - unless as amateurs for our own principal amusement. There is little of all that we do which the eye of man can see. But we smooth out difficulties; we relieve stress; we correct mistakes; we take up other men's burdens and by our efforts we make possible the peaceful life of men in a peaceful state.”
--John W. Davis, founder of Davis Polk & Wardwell
I'll admit, that wikipedia entry read like an entry created by the CA Redistricting Commission themselves. I have no dog in this fight, just saying.
Also, virtually everyone I know who lives in CA wants to get out of CA. Park City is a major benefactor of that current flight.
Didnt Yogi Berra say that? Nobody lives there any more-- its too crowded?
Make no mistake, my wife and I love California and will go there as often as we can. We just don’t want to retire there.
"It is only with the heart that one can see rightly; what is essential is invisible to the eye."
--Antoine de Saint-Exupery
"Things fall apart; the centre cannot hold."
--Yeats
“True, we [lawyers] build no bridges. We raise no towers. We construct no engines. We paint no pictures - unless as amateurs for our own principal amusement. There is little of all that we do which the eye of man can see. But we smooth out difficulties; we relieve stress; we correct mistakes; we take up other men's burdens and by our efforts we make possible the peaceful life of men in a peaceful state.”
--John W. Davis, founder of Davis Polk & Wardwell
I agree (although I might say just coastal Cali) but I think it is one of those places that is great to visit... not to live for a variety of reasons.
My wife and I just bought a place in San Diego and we split time between Park City and San Diego. My daughter and her husband and his two brothers all moved from Utah back to California in the past several years. They are all self-employed and can pretty much live where they want. The same has been true for several of my son-in-law's friends who were raised in California. While I know we are in the minority, I believe that the majority of those leaving California are those who are retiring and looking for a place where they can get more bang for their buck, which is pretty much everywhere. My other daughter's in-laws, who lived in the East Bay their entire lives moved to Springville a couple of years ago when they retired. While the wife loves it because she is close to grandkids, he hates it and wants to move back.
It really depends on what definition you use for "gerrymandered".
Goofy looking districts? Competitive races?
Is there really a way to measure it?
FiveThirtyEight did a nice series on gerrymandering this summer where they looked into these ideas. You should listen to it. I think you may come away with a different perspective on how California is split up.
EDIT: Oops. That was meant to be for LA Ute.
The problem is demographic voter registration, frankly. There are many more Democrats than Republicans. That’s all there is to it. When people here brag about how competitive districts are, they’re smoking something. That’s why I’m sympathetic to Utah Democrats. It’s no fun to have no one to vote for that you truly support. (If you’re outside McAdams’ districts. And even if you’re there you have only a conservative Democrat to vote for.) I feel your pain, as a famous Dem once said.
"It is only with the heart that one can see rightly; what is essential is invisible to the eye."
--Antoine de Saint-Exupery
"Things fall apart; the centre cannot hold."
--Yeats
“True, we [lawyers] build no bridges. We raise no towers. We construct no engines. We paint no pictures - unless as amateurs for our own principal amusement. There is little of all that we do which the eye of man can see. But we smooth out difficulties; we relieve stress; we correct mistakes; we take up other men's burdens and by our efforts we make possible the peaceful life of men in a peaceful state.”
--John W. Davis, founder of Davis Polk & Wardwell
The funny thing is, SL county dominates McAdams district. the sliver of utah county doesnt want to be part of it, nor does Juab or Sanpete. they want to be part of a more rural, conservative district where the representative will listen to them. I poll watched on election day for McAdams in Midvale. I got a text asking about turnout, and I reported that a lot of people who showed up to vote looked like refugees from a Grateful Dead concert. No question Prop 2 and same day registration pulled him over the fnish line.
the only reason that district is drawn as it is, is to keep a seat out of the Dems hands. Next time around, they could move the boundaries 5 blocks in one direction and 4 blocks in another to make it very very difficult for McAdams to win. But the smaller counties would like to be out of the district altogether.
The real problem with gerrymandering is the problem in Ohio and Wisconsin (and NC too, I think), where democrats win 55% of the vote for the state legislatures, but win only 33% of the seats.
I think we should use this as a way of measuring "how gerrymandered" a district is.
https://newrepublic.com/article/1185...gerrymandering
Based on Trump's tweetstorm yesterday, I fully expect something to happen today.
Donald Trump’s Syria Policy Is Strategically Wise — and Thoroughly Unconstitutional
On Friday, the Washington Post published a much-needed, comprehensive analysis of the American military campaign in Syria. Far removed from the headlines, American forces have now established the dominant military presence in one-third of Syria, and the Trump administration has now committed to keeping them there indefinitely, pending a satisfactory and stable peace agreement between the warring parties.Make no mistake: This is a wise course, and it is to Trump’s credit that he backed away from previous pledges to leave Syria.
An American retreat would have been a serious error. We would have created a yawning power vacuum in northeastern Syria — one that the Assad regime, Russia, and Iran would have been eager to fill. We would have signaled to our allies that we are fickle and faithless, encouraging them to cut deals with our enemies. In other words, an American retreat would have led to a hostile advance — and we would have unlearned the harsh lessons of America’s reckless abandonment of Iraq in 2011.
Moreover, we are achieving significant strategic gains at a quite reasonable expense. According to the Post, American forces maintain the dominant military position in the region despite a deployment that numbers — depending on the month — roughly 4,000 soldiers. That represents a force slightly smaller than a single brigade combat team.
But there’s a problem — a serious problem. Trump’s wise policy is blatantly unconstitutional. He is engaged in the invasion and continued occupation of a hostile foreign state. Even under his administration’s quite expansive definition of its military powers, that’s an act of war that requires congressional consent.
To be clear, the sin is not Trump’s alone. The American military incursion into Syria began under Barack Obama, and it began without congressional approval. The military authorizations of 2001 and 2002 — authorizing the use of force against al Qaeda and its allies and Saddam’s regime in Iraq — plainly do not apply. Consider, for example, the language of the 2001 resolution....
"It is only with the heart that one can see rightly; what is essential is invisible to the eye."
--Antoine de Saint-Exupery
"Things fall apart; the centre cannot hold."
--Yeats
“True, we [lawyers] build no bridges. We raise no towers. We construct no engines. We paint no pictures - unless as amateurs for our own principal amusement. There is little of all that we do which the eye of man can see. But we smooth out difficulties; we relieve stress; we correct mistakes; we take up other men's burdens and by our efforts we make possible the peaceful life of men in a peaceful state.”
--John W. Davis, founder of Davis Polk & Wardwell
Dang. This judge means serious business.
https://www.thedailybeast.com/judge-...d-with-treasonJudge Emmet Sullivan first asked if Flynn’s conduct “rises to the level of treasonous activity?” When Brandon Van Grack, a representative for the special counsel, said prosecutors did not consider a treason charge, Sullivan repeated his question: “Could he have been charged with treason?”The judge also reprimanded Flynn directly for his crimes. “All along, you were an unregistered agent of a foreign country while serving as the national security adviser to the president of the United States,” the judge said, according to a tweet from The Washington Post’s Spencer Hu. “That undermines everything this flag over here stands for. Arguably you sold your country out.”
Former Trump campaign adviser Roger Stone required to publicly admit he spread lies on InfoWars.
https://www.marketwatch.com/story/ro...cly-2018-12-17
As questions swirl about his credibility, former Trump campaign adviser Roger Stone settled a defamation suit seeking $100 million in damages on Monday for publishing false and misleading statements on InfoWars.com, a far-right website known for promoting conspiracy theories.
The agreement requires Stone to run ads in national newspapers, including The Wall Street Journal, apologizing for making defamatory statements about a Chinese businessman who is a vocal critic of Beijing. It also requires Stone to publish a retraction of the false statements on social media. Doing so exempts him from paying any of the damages.
[QUOTE=LA Ute;118185]Here are two fascinating opposing views from National Review:
Donald Trump’s Hush Money Did Not Violate Campaign-Finance Law
https://www.nationalreview.com/2018/...law-violation/
Written by a former Chair of the Federal Election Commission.
Yes, Donald Trump Is in Real Legal Jeopardy for Campaign-Finance Violations
https://www.nationalreview.com/corne...ce-violations/
By David French, who’s very clear-eyed about Trump.
Last edited by LA Ute; 12-19-2018 at 09:16 AM.
"It is only with the heart that one can see rightly; what is essential is invisible to the eye."
--Antoine de Saint-Exupery
"Things fall apart; the centre cannot hold."
--Yeats
“True, we [lawyers] build no bridges. We raise no towers. We construct no engines. We paint no pictures - unless as amateurs for our own principal amusement. There is little of all that we do which the eye of man can see. But we smooth out difficulties; we relieve stress; we correct mistakes; we take up other men's burdens and by our efforts we make possible the peaceful life of men in a peaceful state.”
--John W. Davis, founder of Davis Polk & Wardwell
The fairly common rightwing position of dismissing campaign finance laws is interesting - kind of a "Citizens United was just the veneer, folks - wherever campaign money comes from is nobody's business, and it's OK to lie about it" mindset.
My hunch is the Cohen-Stormy Daniels campaign finance law aspect is pretty minor, in the bigger ecosystem of Trump's issues.
The other events yesterday were much bigger. The judge really going after Flynn was fascinating.
Was the judge just having a really, really bad day? (I'm expecting him to be attacked by the Trump PR machine as it relies less on an unwinnable legal strategy and more on PR campaign to discredit the rule of law and derail a Senate removal vote.)
I think there's much more to the story: the judge had access to the unredacted memos and filings. It was unwise for him to ask the prosecutors if Flynn would be tried for treason, but my sense is his reaction yesterday was because he knows much more than everyone on the outside, and maybe sees the "Flynn was ambushed by the FBI" PR campaign as another step in undermining the rule of law.
The other event yesterday was the Trump foundation being dissolved and Trump being prohibited from serving on charitable boards for 10 years. (A US President prohibited from serving on charitable boards. Let that sink in.)
I think more & more people are seeing that Trump and his cadre are fundamentally dishonest, deeply corrupt, to the point they didn't even think about about using the Foundation as a piggy bank. It's just a way of life... one they're struggling more & more in trying to conceal.
As things unravel, Trump is looking less like the brash businessman, just what the country needed to overhaul DC, and more like a man who is feeling persecuted because his "normal" way of approaching life is widely viewed as intrinsically illegal. He's a mob boss, lashing out.
Looks like we're pulling out of Syria. ("Looks like...")
https://www.reuters.com/article/us-u...-idUSKBN1OI1JC
One of the things I remember Pompeo pushing when he was at the CIA was building a network of contractors to replace actual US government employees, in covert, pseudo-military operations.
(Putin does something similar in the Ukraine, where Russian army regulars moonlight as Russian speaking separatists, mistakenly shooting down civilian airliners, etc, and the Crimea takeover was done by "unmarked soldiers speaking Russian".)
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