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Thread: Life in the Trump Era, Part 2

  1. #1501
    I don't see any problem with taking a wait-and-see approach (particularly when your opinion has zero bearing on the matter). The article rightfully points out that there have been soooooo many "This.Is.Big." moments that aren't actually big it's hard to take much credence in them. Chris Cilliza's life seems devoted to that and making those "24 shocking things the president said..." 23 of which aren't actually shocking.

    I'm done with the noise on the investigation until the report comes out. Little doubt Mueller will be thorough and detailed.


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  2. #1502
    Quote Originally Posted by LA Ute View Post
    But, my friend, you have “known” from the beginning that all allegations against Trump were true, or were just about to be proven. I can’t stand Trump, and I expect something bad to happen to him because of his misbehavior, but I’m not as convinced as you and others here are that he’s guilty guilty guilty. Whether or not someone is convinced of the allegations against Trump clearly depends on their political outlook, in almost all cases. There are exceptions on both sides of the aisle, of course. But what I have said is generally true.
    I certainly saw smoke, early. (I'm agnostic on the pee-tape, and Cohen's trip to Prague may not have occurred. But the Dossier's general theme is being generally manifested through what's emerged so far.)

    Trump supporters have knocked Mueller's work and the SDNY / State of NY actions as not being Russia related, or not being linked to the President directly, only to advisors who are now gone (Manafort, Cohen, Flynn), etc. The NYT reporting this week the FBI (post Comey firing) opened an inquiry into whether Trump's actions were undermining US national security is a key opening into the notion that the President himself may be acting at the behest of a foreign adversary.

    The cabinet meeting last week where Trump asserted the Soviets invaded Afghanistan only to fight terrorists is another small piece of a larger puzzle that makes sense... in one direction. (What are the chances that Trump came up with the same explanation for Afghanistan history in 1979 that only exists within Putin's political party in Russia... completely independently?)

    Trump has impressively transformed the GOP away from many of their core values. (Remember when deficit reduction and free-trade were hallmarks of Republican thinking?)

    There are threats of provoked Constitutional crisis from different angles: Declaring a State of Emergency on the border wall, Guiliani claiming Trump has the right to "correct" Mueller's report before it goes to Congress, etc.

    Based on what has been revealed so far, the work of Mueller suggests more serious allegations are coming. (I also sense that removal from office is increasingly unlikely, given how malleable Republicans have proven to be. "Better to be Russian than a Democrat", right?)

    Rocker said it best - Trump has no interest in a wall. (He once said that walls divide us. How ironic.) He just wants the *fight*, the primary objective is to disrupt & divide. If the Dems gave him the $5.6B, we would soon find a new issue to fight about, to be viewed as something so serious that a state of emergency may need to be considered.

    Noticing the water around you has little bubbles forming on the bottom of the pot? Or that's just the latest, adjusting equilibrium?

    Let's jump up 20,000 feet to help me make my point: the UK is teetering toward a very, very rough landing, a no-deal Brexit, or a deal that half the Tories think is a horrendous sell out.

    (What would be so wrong about a re-vote? … given the revelations that social media was used to sow discord & amplify the "Leave" campaign's position, from the same Oligarch's troll farm... while assassinations have been attempted on English soil, from the Oligarch's nation? The conditions have changed quite a bit, more knowledge has come out, right?)

    A UK in turmoil, separated from Europe, as the American tribes fight each other and leave their values in the rearview mirror benefits what global entity? (Are we still looking at trees? Or does every tree need to be studied before we declare the existence of a forest?)
    Last edited by Ma'ake; 01-12-2019 at 09:52 AM.

  3. #1503
    Back down to an altitude where we can realistically address what is in front of us:

    - I think the Dems & Republicans should provide the $5.6B, to be allocated for border security on the recommendations of a board of experts. Let Trump spin a win, get the government re-opened. [I personally think the Commerce Department's inability to provide economic data is far more serious than most realize.]

    - Pelosi should steer away from Impeachment and instead look at multiple, narrow votes of censure, based on specific instances of presidential malpractice. This will help bring some Republicans onboard, help them recover their values as they face re-election.

    We need reason and movement back toward consensus.

    We'll always have plenty of policy issues to debate and differ on, but now more than ever "united we stand, divided we fall".
    Last edited by Ma'ake; 01-12-2019 at 04:23 PM.

  4. #1504
    Sam the Sheepdog LA Ute's Avatar
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    Frank Bruni:

    Will the Media Be Trump's Accomplice Again in 2020?



    https://www.nytimes.com/2019/01/11/o...020-media.html

    "It is only with the heart that one can see rightly; what is essential is invisible to the eye."
    --Antoine de Saint-Exupery

    "Things fall apart; the centre cannot hold."
    --Yeats

    “True, we [lawyers] build no bridges. We raise no towers. We construct no engines. We paint no pictures - unless as amateurs for our own principal amusement. There is little of all that we do which the eye of man can see. But we smooth out difficulties; we relieve stress; we correct mistakes; we take up other men's burdens and by our efforts we make possible the peaceful life of men in a peaceful state.”

    --John W. Davis, founder of Davis Polk & Wardwell

  5. #1505
    Sam the Sheepdog LA Ute's Avatar
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    From conservative Trump critic John Podhoretz at Commentary:


    Special prosecutor Robert Mueller took the extraordinary step of publicly discrediting the article in BuzzFeed claiming Donald Trump told his lawyer, Michael Cohen, to lie to Congress about the Trump Tower Moscow project. As it happens, I was one of the first people on cable television to comment on the original story because it came out at 11 pm on Thursday night and I was on “Morning Joe” at 6 am Friday. As the article’s details warranted, I went immediately to Defcon 1.


    “If the story is true, we are not at another level,” I said. “We are at impeachment.” I am a confirmed skeptic about Trump-Russia-collusion narrative. What was different here was (as Jonah Goldberg pointed out) that it is perfectly believable Trump would ask Cohen to lie about something, since Trump himself lies several times a day, even about things he has no reason to lie about.


    I thank God I had the common sense to say “if this story is true,” because it almost certainly isn’t. The Washington Post offers this shocking refutation: “Inside the Justice Department, the [Mueller] statement was viewed as a huge step, and one that would have been taken only if the special counsel’s office viewed the story as almost entirely incorrect. The special counsel’s office seemed to be disputing every aspect of the story that addressed comments or evidence given to its investigators.”


    The Trump-Russia story in all its permutations (including the ones regarding FBI misbehavior in pursuit of it) is easily the most important going right now. It should go without saying that editors and reporters must exercise extraordinary prudence when advancing a narrative that implies the president of the United States is either the pawn of a foreign power or engaged in an impeachable effort to cover stuff up. But it doesn’t go without saying.


    Trump is viewed as such a threat to the American present and future that many of his most determined foes are working along the lines of the instructions delivered to Chicago’s police in The Blues Brothers:“Use of unnecessary violence in the apprehension of the Blues Brothers has been approved.” Trump is reckless with the truth. That doesn’t give his pursuers license to be reckless with it as well. Quite the opposite, in fact. The discredited BuzzFeed story advances the dreadful case that there is no truth—that there are only agendas.




    "It is only with the heart that one can see rightly; what is essential is invisible to the eye."
    --Antoine de Saint-Exupery

    "Things fall apart; the centre cannot hold."
    --Yeats

    “True, we [lawyers] build no bridges. We raise no towers. We construct no engines. We paint no pictures - unless as amateurs for our own principal amusement. There is little of all that we do which the eye of man can see. But we smooth out difficulties; we relieve stress; we correct mistakes; we take up other men's burdens and by our efforts we make possible the peaceful life of men in a peaceful state.”

    --John W. Davis, founder of Davis Polk & Wardwell

  6. #1506
    Is it possible that Gulliani's bizarre change of messaging that the Trump organization was talking about a project in Moscow throughout the election is because he knows that evidence of communication between Trump himself and Russians exists? Is this so they can later claim, "These were just talks about building a building, nothing to do with politics whatsoever?"

    It seems it is either that or Gulliani is losing his mind.

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