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Thread: Rocky Mountain High - Utah vs. Colorado 2018

  1. #31
    This team is so maddeningly up and down. At times we have looked like not only a tournament team but a team that could make some noise. At other times, we look like a team that will have no postseason opportunities.

    An at large bid is all but gone (I think at this point it would take 7-0 and some luck and that ain't happening) .

  2. #32
    Quote Originally Posted by UtahsMrSports View Post
    This team is so maddeningly up and down. At times we have looked like not only a tournament team but a team that could make some noise. At other times, we look like a team that will have no postseason opportunities.

    An at large bid is all but gone (I think at this point it would take 7-0 and some luck and that ain't happening) .
    I think that probably all depends on how soft the bubble is. Let's assume for a second that the Utes can finish 6-2 (dropping one to either StanFord, one of the SoCal Schools, or Washington - I know, we're leaping here).

    That would put them at 11-7 in the league and 19-10 overall. They may still be very much in play for a first round bye, and if not, would probably be the 5th seed, which would give them a shot at winning 2 games in Vegas, and playing Arizona for a shot to go to the Pac 12 title game. So that then potentially gives them 3 wins in Vegas (22-10) and almost certainly an RPI top 25 win, plus the win earlier in the year over Missouri, which continues to look good (current RPI of 33). Again, we're stretching, but it isn't impossible.

    Look at what everyone else around us in the standings has as well:

    USC (@UCLA, @Arizona, @ASU, vs. OSU, vs. Oregon, @Utah, @Colorado, vs. UCLA)
    UCLA (vs. USC, @ASU, @Arizona, vs. Oregon, vs. OSU, @Colorado, @Utah, @USC)
    Wash (vs. Arizona, @Oregon, @ OSU, vs. Utah, vs. Colorado, @Stanford, @Cal, vs. OSU, vs. Oregon)
    Stanford (vs. Oregon, @Utah @Colorado, @Cala, vs. Wash, vs. Wazzu, @Arizona, @ASU)
    Oregon (@Stanford, vs. Wash, vs. Wazzu, @UCLA, @USC, vs. ASU, vs. Arizona, @ Wazzu, @Wash)
    ASU (@Wazzu, vs. USC, vs. UCLA, vs. Arizona, @Oregon, @OSU, vs. Cal, Vs. Stanford)
    Colorado (vs. Cal, vs. Stanford, @Wazzu, @Washington, vs. USC, vs. UCLA, @Utah)

    All of this is a long way of saying that pretty much everyone we're bunched up with has a challenging path down the stretch. Arizona is the only lock. Even USC, who looks good right now has 3 games they could drop on the road. Even so, they'll probably be the 2 seed unless they fall apart. If they were to only lose their remaining road games, they too would finish 11-7.

    Keep hope alive!
    “It only ends once. Anything that happens before that is just progress.”

    Well, because he thought it was good sport. Because some men aren't looking for anything logical, like money. They can't be bought, bullied, reasoned, or negotiated with. Some men just want to watch the world burn.

  3. #33
    Quote Originally Posted by DrumNFeather View Post
    I think that probably all depends on how soft the bubble is. Let's assume for a second that the Utes can finish 6-2 (dropping one to either StanFord, one of the SoCal Schools, or Washington - I know, we're leaping here).
    At this point, it's more likely we get lucky and win 3-4 in a row in Vegas.

    We have 7 games left. Three are against teams that have already routed us. Two others are against teams ahead of us in the standings. We'll be lucky to finish 4-3.

  4. #34
    Quote Originally Posted by sancho View Post
    At this point, it's more likely we get lucky and win 3-4 in a row in Vegas.

    We have 7 games left. Three are against teams that have already routed us. Two others are against teams ahead of us in the standings. We'll be lucky to finish 4-3.
    so we really have to win 6 of 7 if we want the first round bye. Thankfully 5 of the 7 are at go home and the road games are 2 teams we have beaten. Yeah we were routed by 3 teams but they were all on the road.

    Sent from my SM-G930T using Tapatalk
    "Be a philosopher. A man can compromise to gain a point. It has become apparent that a man can, within limits, follow his inclinations within the arms of the Church if he does so discreetly." - The Walking Drum

    "And here’s what life comes down to—not how many years you live, but how many of those years are filled with bullshit that doesn’t amount to anything to satisfy the requirements of some dickhead you’ll never get the pleasure of punching in the face." – Adam Carolla

  5. #35
    Quote Originally Posted by Mormon Red Death View Post
    so we really have to win 6 of 7 if we want the first round bye. Thankfully 5 of the 7 are at go home and the road games are 2 teams we have beaten. Yeah we were routed by 3 teams but they were all on the road.

    Sent from my SM-G930T using Tapatalk
    I think (hope) it will be to our benefit to get Stanford first, coming off their big win and us having to sit on our poor shooting performance in Boulder. That game will be very telling as to where this team is at mentally. They have to know they've got an opportunity here.

    Sent from my SM-N950U using Tapatalk
    “It only ends once. Anything that happens before that is just progress.”

    Well, because he thought it was good sport. Because some men aren't looking for anything logical, like money. They can't be bought, bullied, reasoned, or negotiated with. Some men just want to watch the world burn.

  6. #36
    Quote Originally Posted by DrumNFeather View Post
    That game will be very telling as to where this team is at mentally. They have to know they've got an opportunity here.
    I don't know how much is mental and how much is just the fact that our offensive identity (if we have one) is about generating three point shots for streaky shooters. When the shots go down, we are in the game. When they don't, we have no chance.

    Also, our defensive identity is about allowing the other team to get open looks from three. If they hit their shots, we are out.

    The good news is that we shoot better at home, and other teams shoot worse on the road. UCLA and USC clobbered us in CA. I still think we have a shot against them - but luck will play as large a role as anything else.

  7. #37
    Looks like the Pac 12 hasn't announced what channel the games will be on this weekend outside of USC/UCLA. I would imagine this goes on the Pac 12 network given the timing, etc., but who knows.
    “It only ends once. Anything that happens before that is just progress.”

    Well, because he thought it was good sport. Because some men aren't looking for anything logical, like money. They can't be bought, bullied, reasoned, or negotiated with. Some men just want to watch the world burn.

  8. #38
    Quote Originally Posted by DrumNFeather View Post
    Looks like the Pac 12 hasn't announced what channel the games will be on this weekend outside of USC/UCLA. I would imagine this goes on the Pac 12 network given the timing, etc., but who knows.
    I saw over the weekend that game time is 5 pm. Is that an actual time or a placeholder?

  9. #39
    Quote Originally Posted by concerned View Post
    I saw over the weekend that game time is 5 pm. Is that an actual time or a placeholder?
    I think the game time is accurate, we just don't have a tv network yet.
    “It only ends once. Anything that happens before that is just progress.”

    Well, because he thought it was good sport. Because some men aren't looking for anything logical, like money. They can't be bought, bullied, reasoned, or negotiated with. Some men just want to watch the world burn.

  10. #40
    Quote Originally Posted by DrumNFeather View Post
    I think the game time is accurate, we just don't have a tv network yet.
    utahutes.com and espn have it as Pac-12 Network, FWIW.

  11. #41
    Quote Originally Posted by UtahsMrSports View Post
    utahutes.com and espn have it as Pac-12 Network, FWIW.
    Looks like it is on Pac 12 Mountain...

    There is a triple header on the Pac 12 Networks, and then Utah/CU shows as Pac 12 Mountain.
    “It only ends once. Anything that happens before that is just progress.”

    Well, because he thought it was good sport. Because some men aren't looking for anything logical, like money. They can't be bought, bullied, reasoned, or negotiated with. Some men just want to watch the world burn.

  12. #42
    Quote Originally Posted by DrumNFeather View Post
    Looks like it is on Pac 12 Mountain...

    There is a triple header on the Pac 12 Networks, and then Utah/CU shows as Pac 12 Mountain.
    In other words, neither ESPN nor Fox want any Pac 12 games.

    Here is an interesting tweet

    If Utah had not played Northwestern State (345) or Mississippi Valley State (349) in non-conference play, the Utes' RPI would be at 39 instead of 57 right now. Shows how much scheduling the dregs of the Southland and SWAC can hurt as you approach March. #Utes#Pac12Hoops
    Last edited by concerned; 02-27-2018 at 10:47 AM.

  13. #43
    Quote Originally Posted by concerned View Post
    In other words, neither ESPN nor Fox want any Pac 12 games.

    Here is an interesting tweet

    If Utah had not played Northwestern State (345) or Mississippi Valley State (349) in non-conference play, the Utes' RPI would be at 39 instead of 57 right now. Shows how much scheduling the dregs of the Southland and SWAC can hurt as you approach March. #Utes#Pac12Hoops
    This is probably my biggest, and maybe only real frustration with the coaching staff. I understand that with new faces you want to have opportunities to let the players grow with a very minimal threat of losing a game. But these games where from teh SWAC where the team plays in provo one night, in logan another and in our house another are pointless. We can accomplish what we need to by scheduling mid tier big west/big sky/wcc teams who would probably come here. The top of our non con was pretty good this year. Not great, but it was pretty good, certainly good enough if it wasn't being weighed down by some of the worst teams in Div-I.

  14. #44
    Quote Originally Posted by DrumNFeather View Post
    Looks like it is on Pac 12 Mountain...

    There is a triple header on the Pac 12 Networks, and then Utah/CU shows as Pac 12 Mountain.
    Or something that I've begun calling, Pac-12 iPad.

  15. #45
    Quote Originally Posted by concerned View Post
    If Utah had not played Northwestern State (345) or Mississippi Valley State (349) in non-conference play, the Utes' RPI would be at 39 instead of 57 right now. Shows how much scheduling the dregs of the Southland and SWAC can hurt as you approach March. #Utes#Pac12Hoops
    Just mind blowing how dumb selection criteria can be. Meaningful games mean less than throwaway games.

    There is no material difference between between the #350 team and the #200 team, but it makes a huge difference in RPI.

  16. #46
    Quote Originally Posted by UtahsMrSports View Post
    This is probably my biggest, and maybe only real frustration with the coaching staff. I understand that with new faces you want to have opportunities to let the players grow with a very minimal threat of losing a game. But these games where from teh SWAC where the team plays in provo one night, in logan another and in our house another are pointless. We can accomplish what we need to by scheduling mid tier big west/big sky/wcc teams who would probably come here. The top of our non con was pretty good this year. Not great, but it was pretty good, certainly good enough if it wasn't being weighed down by some of the worst teams in Div-I.
    Larry is pretty unapologetic about this as well. Which, on the one hand, I love that aspect of his personality...and on the other hand, it's like...dude, all you have to do is get some marginally better games and this will be fine. And again, I know I'm beating a dead horse here, but there had to be another decent game out there that they could've added to the schedule to fill that last spot so that, you know, we'd be chasing 20 wins this weekend.
    “It only ends once. Anything that happens before that is just progress.”

    Well, because he thought it was good sport. Because some men aren't looking for anything logical, like money. They can't be bought, bullied, reasoned, or negotiated with. Some men just want to watch the world burn.

  17. #47
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    Quote Originally Posted by UtahsMrSports View Post
    This is probably my biggest, and maybe only real frustration with the coaching staff. I understand that with new faces you want to have opportunities to let the players grow with a very minimal threat of losing a game. But these games where from teh SWAC where the team plays in provo one night, in logan another and in our house another are pointless. We can accomplish what we need to by scheduling mid tier big west/big sky/wcc teams who would probably come here. The top of our non con was pretty good this year. Not great, but it was pretty good, certainly good enough if it wasn't being weighed down by some of the worst teams in Div-I.
    Growth in basketball is impossible where the outcome is 99.999 percent in your favor.

  18. #48
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    Quote Originally Posted by sancho View Post
    Just mind blowing how dumb selection criteria can be. Meaningful games mean less than throwaway games.

    There is no material difference between between the #350 team and the #200 team, but it makes a huge difference in RPI.
    You gotta explain your definition of "material difference" here.

  19. #49
    Quote Originally Posted by SoCalPat View Post
    Growth in basketball is impossible where the outcome is 99.999 percent in your favor.
    I dont disagree but I am not sure coaches always understand that.

  20. #50
    Quote Originally Posted by UtahsMrSports View Post
    I dont disagree but I am not sure coaches always understand that.
    Next year will be interesting, because you'll have a pretty solid core coming back (assuming no transfers) Of Tillman, Barefield, Johnson, Seeley, etc. And an influx of young guys as well. Will we see another dumbing down of the schedule? I hope not, but who knows.

    Not to jump ahead, but we know we play @Missouri and a neutral site game vs. BYU. I thought I saw somewhere that we are in the field for next year's Phil Knight classic, which will probably have some decent teams.
    “It only ends once. Anything that happens before that is just progress.”

    Well, because he thought it was good sport. Because some men aren't looking for anything logical, like money. They can't be bought, bullied, reasoned, or negotiated with. Some men just want to watch the world burn.

  21. #51
    Quote Originally Posted by DrumNFeather View Post
    Next year will be interesting, because you'll have a pretty solid core coming back (assuming no transfers) Of Tillman, Barefield, Johnson, Seeley, etc. And an influx of young guys as well. Will we see another dumbing down of the schedule? I hope not, but who knows.

    Not to jump ahead, but we know we play @Missouri and a neutral site game vs. BYU. I thought I saw somewhere that we are in the field for next year's Phil Knight classic, which will probably have some decent teams.
    The PK classic was loaded this year. That would be great.

    When we say "dumbing down the schedule" we are talking about just two games, right? How many schools don't have a couple of really bad teams on the schedule? The tweet that suggested that we would be 15 places higher in RPI if not for two games - does that tweet apply to just about everyone?

    One thing that should help is expanding the conference schedule to 20 or 22 games. Seems like all the big conferences are doing this. There should be more opportunities to add decent OOC mid-major opponents.

    I do think coaches will always want 1-2 games where they don't have to stress at all. They want an opener against a bad team, and they want a bad team during finals week - the kind of team that requires 0 prep or film study. I think this is fine, and the selection committee should stop the silliness of penalizing teams for it. Until they grow up, though, teams like us should work schedules to game the system.

  22. #52
    Quote Originally Posted by DrumNFeather View Post
    Next year will be interesting, because you'll have a pretty solid core coming back (assuming no transfers) Of Tillman, Barefield, Johnson, Seeley, etc. And an influx of young guys as well. Will we see another dumbing down of the schedule? I hope not, but who knows.

    Not to jump ahead, but we know we play @Missouri and a neutral site game vs. BYU. I thought I saw somewhere that we are in the field for next year's Phil Knight classic, which will probably have some decent teams.
    Utah is in the Wooden Legacy

    Utah
    Fresno State
    Hawaii
    La Salle
    Miami
    Northwestern
    Seton Hall
    And one team to still be announced.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

  23. #53
    Quote Originally Posted by Diehard Ute View Post
    Utah is in the Wooden Legacy

    Utah
    Fresno State
    Hawaii
    La Salle
    Miami
    Northwestern
    Seton Hall
    And one team to still be announced.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
    Could be worse. Utah, Seton Hall, Miami, and Northwestern are potential tournament teams.

  24. #54
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    Quote Originally Posted by sancho View Post
    Could be worse. Utah, Seton Hall, Miami, and Northwestern are potential tournament teams.
    Northwestern has an RPI in the 160s and has made the Dance once in school history. They don't deserve to be lumped in with the other three teams.

    Another top 50 team makes this a respectable tournament, maybe even underrated.

  25. #55
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    Quote Originally Posted by UtahsMrSports View Post
    I dont disagree but I am not sure coaches always understand that.
    If coaches don't understand that, then they're serving interests that are solely their own (ie, fattening up the W-L for job security purposes).

  26. #56
    If I missed this already discussed I apologize but I think sancho made a cromulent point a bit back, in that if you really are a top 75 RPI team, which the Utes should be from now on without exception, that beating a team in the 200s should be just as probable as beating the 300s, but has a dramatic effect on your overall rating. So at least when they are scheduling they should consider that and pass on the Geoducks or whatever.


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  27. #57
    That injury looked bad

    Sent from my SM-G930T using Tapatalk
    "Be a philosopher. A man can compromise to gain a point. It has become apparent that a man can, within limits, follow his inclinations within the arms of the Church if he does so discreetly." - The Walking Drum

    "And here’s what life comes down to—not how many years you live, but how many of those years are filled with bullshit that doesn’t amount to anything to satisfy the requirements of some dickhead you’ll never get the pleasure of punching in the face." – Adam Carolla

  28. #58
    any update on Collette?

    Sent from my SM-G930T using Tapatalk
    "Be a philosopher. A man can compromise to gain a point. It has become apparent that a man can, within limits, follow his inclinations within the arms of the Church if he does so discreetly." - The Walking Drum

    "And here’s what life comes down to—not how many years you live, but how many of those years are filled with bullshit that doesn’t amount to anything to satisfy the requirements of some dickhead you’ll never get the pleasure of punching in the face." – Adam Carolla

  29. #59
    Jayce get reinjured?

    Sent from my SM-G930T using Tapatalk
    "Be a philosopher. A man can compromise to gain a point. It has become apparent that a man can, within limits, follow his inclinations within the arms of the Church if he does so discreetly." - The Walking Drum

    "And here’s what life comes down to—not how many years you live, but how many of those years are filled with bullshit that doesn’t amount to anything to satisfy the requirements of some dickhead you’ll never get the pleasure of punching in the face." – Adam Carolla

  30. #60
    Tillman making the leap. Monster on both sides of the ball

    Sent from my SM-G930T using Tapatalk
    "Be a philosopher. A man can compromise to gain a point. It has become apparent that a man can, within limits, follow his inclinations within the arms of the Church if he does so discreetly." - The Walking Drum

    "And here’s what life comes down to—not how many years you live, but how many of those years are filled with bullshit that doesn’t amount to anything to satisfy the requirements of some dickhead you’ll never get the pleasure of punching in the face." – Adam Carolla

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