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Thread: Political/Cultural Chit-Chat

  1. #241
    Quote Originally Posted by LA Ute View Post
    If you were a conservative during the 2016 election, you were very worried about a 5-4 liberal majority on the Supreme Court. I don’t think liberals have quite the same level of worry. Roe v. Wade is safe, I think, and so major changes in the American way of life are not likely to occur with a conservative 5-4 majority. A liberal Supreme Court is, on the other hand, willing to make changes in the American way of life by virtue of a vote by single justice. I realize others may disagree strongly with me on this. Agree or not, that is the way the world looks to someone from a principled conservative point of view.
    Roe v. Wade is safe? If someone like Kavenaugh succeeds RBG, it is likely gone, based on Kavenaugh's recent dissent. Safe until after the 2020 election, anyway, so that a reversal doesn't tip over the electoral apple cart.

    What is the principled conservative viewpoint on the national emergency declaration?

    of course, if RBG were to die next year, McConnell would apply the same conservative principle he applied to Scalia/Garland, and not entertain nominations so that the people could have a voice in the selection through the 2020 election.
    Last edited by concerned; 02-19-2019 at 10:46 AM.

  2. #242
    Quote Originally Posted by LA Ute View Post
    If you were a conservative during the 2016 election, you were very worried about a 5-4 liberal majority on the Supreme Court. I don’t think liberals have quite the same level of worry. Roe v. Wade is safe, I think, and so major changes in the American way of life are not likely to occur with a conservative 5-4 majority. A liberal Supreme Court is, on the other hand, willing to make changes in the American way of life by virtue of a vote by single justice. I realize others may disagree strongly with me on this. Agree or not, that is the way the world looks to someone from a principled conservative point of view.
    LOL. "Principled conservative point of view."

    This a great post.

  3. #243
    Quote Originally Posted by LA Ute View Post
    A liberal Supreme Court is, on the other hand, willing to make changes in the American way of life by virtue of a vote by single justice.
    Your are right. A conservative majority would never make changes to the American way of life like Citizens United or Shelby.

  4. #244
    Quote Originally Posted by LA Ute View Post
    If you were a conservative during the 2016 election, you were very worried about a 5-4 liberal majority on the Supreme Court.
    There is always some kind of national emergency that justifies our bad politics (in both parties). The Trump presidency shows just how far people are willing to go to deny the other party a chance a leadership. We claim we'll just set aside our principles until we weather the "crisis," but I don't think principles can be easily picked up after being cast off.

  5. #245
    Quote Originally Posted by sancho View Post
    There is always some kind of national emergency that justifies our bad politics (in both parties). The Trump presidency shows just how far people are willing to go to deny the other party a chance a leadership. We claim we'll just set aside our principles until we weather the "crisis," but I don't think principles can be easily picked up after being cast off.
    You are right, because if they are cast off, they are no longer principles.

  6. #246
    Sam the Sheepdog LA Ute's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by concerned View Post
    Roe v. Wade is safe? If someone like Kavenaugh succeeds RBG, it is likely gone, based on Kavenaugh's recent dissent. Safe until after the 2020 election, anyway, so that a reversal doesn't tip over the electoral apple cart.

    What is the principled conservative viewpoint on the national emergency declaration?
    I don't think Roe v. Wade will be overturned. I think it might be chipped away at, and we'd end up with abortion laws like those of Western Europe, a region of the world which many American progressives think represents wise progressive thinking on just about every other issue. Legislatures, from Congress to the states, would then have to reach into their gut bags and actually make policy on the issue.

    IMO, in terms of impact on the lives of everyday Americans and their deeply held beliefs about what is important in life, Citizens United and Shelby pale in comparison to Roe v. Wade and Obergefell.

    I think principled conservatives largely think the national emergency declaration on the border is a horrible presidential action. I certianly do. See the Wall Street Journal editorial board position, for example. End runs around Congress are unacceptable and unconstitutional. (Obama did his share of those, but progressives were somehow able to contain their horror. )

    Quote Originally Posted by Applejack View Post
    LOL. "Principled conservative point of view."

    This a great post.
    I'm always happy to earn one of your LOLs. But you need to get out more. Instead of simply ridiculing the concept of conservative principles, read some Russell Kirk or William F. Buckley. Maybe some of the Federalist Papers. There's good stuff there by really smart people. They might still earn some LOLs from you, but you might gain some perspective on opposing points of view.
    Last edited by LA Ute; 02-19-2019 at 12:38 PM.

    "It is only with the heart that one can see rightly; what is essential is invisible to the eye."
    --Antoine de Saint-Exupery

    "Things fall apart; the centre cannot hold."
    --Yeats

    “True, we [lawyers] build no bridges. We raise no towers. We construct no engines. We paint no pictures - unless as amateurs for our own principal amusement. There is little of all that we do which the eye of man can see. But we smooth out difficulties; we relieve stress; we correct mistakes; we take up other men's burdens and by our efforts we make possible the peaceful life of men in a peaceful state.”

    --John W. Davis, founder of Davis Polk & Wardwell

  7. #247
    Quote Originally Posted by LA Ute View Post

    IMO, in terms of impact on the lives of everyday Americans and their deeply held beliefs about what is important in life, Citizens United and Shelby pale in comparison to Roe v. Wade and Obergefell.
    Citizens United and Shelby County dramatically affected every single person in this country, including you and me, because they affect the outcome as to how elections are conducted, who gets elected, and who has influence. Roe and Obergefell did not affect you or me at all. They directly affect gays who want to get married or women who want to abort. You think Roe and Obergefell are more significant, because you don't like their result, and I suspect you like the effect of Citizens and Shelby on elections and the electorate.

  8. #248
    Quote Originally Posted by concerned View Post
    Roe and Obergefell did not affect you or me at all.
    I don't agree with this. All these cases have their impact on the nation. Moral issues in particular affect us all.

    In addition to the general impact of a case involving a moral issue, Roe has had a huge negative impact by becoming the driving issue in every election of the past 50 years.

  9. #249
    Quote Originally Posted by sancho View Post
    I don't agree with this. All these cases have their impact on the nation. Moral issues in particular affect us all.

    In addition to the general impact of a case involving a moral issue, Roe has had a huge negative impact by becoming the driving issue in every election of the past 50 years.
    I recognize that Roe and Obergefell affect many religious and moral beliefs; I said they directly affect persons in those two groups. Cititizens United and Shelby affect every single person on every single issue, including abortion and gay marriage, and many many more.

  10. #250
    Quote Originally Posted by LA Ute View Post
    I'm always happy to earn one of your LOLs. But you need to get out more. Instead of simply ridiculing the concept of conservative principles, read some Russell Kirk or William F. Buckley. Maybe some of the Federalist Papers. There's good stuff there by really smart people. They might still earn some LOLs from you, but you might gain some perspective on opposing points of view.
    I don't remember the federalist papers stating that republicans should worry about losing the Court but democrats have nothing to fear if they lose the Court. Admittedly, it's been awhile since I read it so it might be there.

  11. #251
    Sam the Sheepdog LA Ute's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by concerned View Post
    Citizens United and Shelby County dramatically affected every single person in this country, including you and me, because they affect the outcome as to how elections are conducted, who gets elected, and who has influence. Roe and Obergefell did not affect you or me at all. They directly affect gays who want to get married or women who want to abort. You think Roe and Obergefell are more significant, because you don't like their result, and I suspect you like the effect of Citizens and Shelby on elections and the electorate.
    This is why America is a great country. We can agree to disagree. Political impact, to me, is remediable and quote different from cultural impact. Millions of babies/fetuses (choose your preferred term) have been aborted because of Roe. What "marriage" means has been changed forever because of Obergefell. I think those changes would have come anyway, with time, but they should have come via our democratic processes, for many reasons. But I get your point.

    "It is only with the heart that one can see rightly; what is essential is invisible to the eye."
    --Antoine de Saint-Exupery

    "Things fall apart; the centre cannot hold."
    --Yeats

    “True, we [lawyers] build no bridges. We raise no towers. We construct no engines. We paint no pictures - unless as amateurs for our own principal amusement. There is little of all that we do which the eye of man can see. But we smooth out difficulties; we relieve stress; we correct mistakes; we take up other men's burdens and by our efforts we make possible the peaceful life of men in a peaceful state.”

    --John W. Davis, founder of Davis Polk & Wardwell

  12. #252
    Sam the Sheepdog LA Ute's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Applejack View Post
    I don't remember the federalist papers stating that republicans should worry about losing the Court but democrats have nothing to fear if they lose the Court. Admittedly, it's been awhile since I read it so it might be there.
    Oh, yeah? Well, I don't think progressives have any principles at all. So there!

    I have a hunch neither of us is going to convince the other.

    "It is only with the heart that one can see rightly; what is essential is invisible to the eye."
    --Antoine de Saint-Exupery

    "Things fall apart; the centre cannot hold."
    --Yeats

    “True, we [lawyers] build no bridges. We raise no towers. We construct no engines. We paint no pictures - unless as amateurs for our own principal amusement. There is little of all that we do which the eye of man can see. But we smooth out difficulties; we relieve stress; we correct mistakes; we take up other men's burdens and by our efforts we make possible the peaceful life of men in a peaceful state.”

    --John W. Davis, founder of Davis Polk & Wardwell

  13. #253
    Quote Originally Posted by LA Ute View Post
    This is why America is a great country. We can agree to disagree. Political impact, to me, is remediable and quote different from cultural impact. Millions of babies/fetuses (choose your preferred term) have been aborted because of Roe. What "marriage" means has been changed forever because of Obergefell. I think those changes would have come anyway, with time, but they should have come via our democratic processes, for many reasons. But I get your point.
    And I get yours. I undervalued the importance of Roe and Obergefell to many many people. Kumbayah.

  14. #254
    Quote Originally Posted by LA Ute View Post
    If you were a conservative during the 2016 election, you were very worried about a 5-4 liberal majority on the Supreme Court. I don’t think liberals have quite the same level of worry. Roe v. Wade is safe, I think, and so major changes in the American way of life are not likely to occur with a conservative 5-4 majority. A liberal Supreme Court is, on the other hand, willing to make changes in the American way of life by virtue of a vote by single justice. I realize others may disagree strongly with me on this. Agree or not, that is the way the world looks to someone from a principled conservative point of view.
    I think you don't appreciate how much liberals fear a conservative majority's ability to frustrate or neuter civil rights and what I'll call "public interest" laws. But at what point does either side have to say the USSC is not worth voting for X. I'll never face that question because I live in Utah.

  15. #255
    Quote Originally Posted by LA Ute View Post
    Oh, yeah? Well, I don't think progressives have any principles at all. So there!

    I have a hunch neither of us is going to convince the other.
    I'm not trying to convince you of anything. I'm just pointing our the hilarity in your posting that only conservatives need worry about the supreme Court

  16. #256
    Sam the Sheepdog LA Ute's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Applejack View Post
    I'm not trying to convince you of anything. I'm just pointing our the hilarity in your posting that only conservatives need worry about the supreme Court
    Nope. You misread me. I was explaining why conservatives worry about the Supreme Court, and why that motivated many of them to vote for Trump despite his Trumpiness. I can see why you LOL'd. Try to keep up, young man!

    Looking back, I did say I don't think liberals have the same level of worry. I did not say "only conservatives need worry about the Supreme Court." Even so, what I did say was too much of a throw-away and could've used some elaboration. I do see that libs are very worried about Roe v. Wade, and I did not mean to minimize that. But it is not the conservatives on the SCOTUS who are making rulings based on emanations and penumbras. That's my point. I realize that liberals/progressives think emanations and penumbras are just fine as bases for constitutional law. Conservatives worry about where the Court will go with that line of jurisprudence. That's the root of the ongoing controversy about SCOTUS's role.
    Last edited by LA Ute; 02-19-2019 at 11:12 PM.

    "It is only with the heart that one can see rightly; what is essential is invisible to the eye."
    --Antoine de Saint-Exupery

    "Things fall apart; the centre cannot hold."
    --Yeats

    “True, we [lawyers] build no bridges. We raise no towers. We construct no engines. We paint no pictures - unless as amateurs for our own principal amusement. There is little of all that we do which the eye of man can see. But we smooth out difficulties; we relieve stress; we correct mistakes; we take up other men's burdens and by our efforts we make possible the peaceful life of men in a peaceful state.”

    --John W. Davis, founder of Davis Polk & Wardwell

  17. #257
    Sam the Sheepdog LA Ute's Avatar
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    "It is only with the heart that one can see rightly; what is essential is invisible to the eye."
    --Antoine de Saint-Exupery

    "Things fall apart; the centre cannot hold."
    --Yeats

    “True, we [lawyers] build no bridges. We raise no towers. We construct no engines. We paint no pictures - unless as amateurs for our own principal amusement. There is little of all that we do which the eye of man can see. But we smooth out difficulties; we relieve stress; we correct mistakes; we take up other men's burdens and by our efforts we make possible the peaceful life of men in a peaceful state.”

    --John W. Davis, founder of Davis Polk & Wardwell

  18. #258
    Sam the Sheepdog LA Ute's Avatar
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    Follow-up to concerned’s question about the principled conservative position on the border wall emergency order:

    BBF250F8-6390-4C35-8CE6-FE3CFC83E56B.jpg

    "It is only with the heart that one can see rightly; what is essential is invisible to the eye."
    --Antoine de Saint-Exupery

    "Things fall apart; the centre cannot hold."
    --Yeats

    “True, we [lawyers] build no bridges. We raise no towers. We construct no engines. We paint no pictures - unless as amateurs for our own principal amusement. There is little of all that we do which the eye of man can see. But we smooth out difficulties; we relieve stress; we correct mistakes; we take up other men's burdens and by our efforts we make possible the peaceful life of men in a peaceful state.”

    --John W. Davis, founder of Davis Polk & Wardwell

  19. #259
    This whole Jussie Smollett debacle is a real setback, in my opinion, to race issues on the US. Every legitimate hate crime will now be met with skepticism.

    This is also the second time in a matter of weeks that the media has ended up with massive egg on their face. First the Nick Sandmann thing and now this. Many news sources were all too happy to pounce on these things and wag their fingers instead of doing their jobs and finding out the actual facts.

    The speed of information is a real disservice to accurate reporting and the truth. News sources are all too willing to offer a retraction in an article that is only accessible through archive searches.

    Basically every news source is guilty of this too.

    I honestly would favor a news source that practiced legitimate journalism, even if the info was a day or two old. Knowing what I was reading the truth is far better than what we have today.




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  20. #260
    Quote Originally Posted by Rocker Ute View Post
    This whole Jussie Smollett debacle is a real setback, in my opinion, to race issues on the US. Every legitimate hate crime will now be met with skepticism.

    This is also the second time in a matter of weeks that the media has ended up with massive egg on their face. First the Nick Sandmann thing and now this. Many news sources were all too happy to pounce on these things and wag their fingers instead of doing their jobs and finding out the actual facts.

    The speed of information is a real disservice to accurate reporting and the truth. News sources are all too willing to offer a retraction in an article that is only accessible through archive searches.

    Basically every news source is guilty of this too.

    I honestly would favor a news source that practiced legitimate journalism, even if the info was a day or two old. Knowing what I was reading the truth is far better than what we have today.
    There was an episode of Newsroom that dealt with this. A potentially big political story was breaking, and they were debating on running an unconfirmed story or waiting for confirmation. There was a lot of pressure from above to run with it, but the protagonist characters argued for the principled position to wait for secondary confirmation, and it ended up being the right decision as the story turned out to be incorrect.

    I wish more news sources had those kind of principles, but the pressure for viewer ratings or article clicks for advertising dollars is proving to be too powerful.
    People who wear glasses/contacts are not allowed to celbrqte the rear 2020. Go eat some carrots or get LASIK.

  21. #261
    Quote Originally Posted by chrisrenrut View Post
    pressure for viewer ratings or article clicks
    And glory. For some reason, newsy people still get excited about "breaking" the story, even if it's a story that is going to naturally break anyway. We see this all the time in sports twitter. Someone will congratulate a reporter for breaking news of a trade, news that was going to be public two hours later anyway.

  22. #262
    Thought provoking article in the D-News about teaching morals in schools: https://www.deseretnews.com/article/...to-change.html

    At a time where the nation is fracturing along numerous fronts, many parents increasingly view religions as highly imperfect institutions to be avoided - take your pick of reasons why religious participation is declining. Many parents are disillusioned, worn down, alienated from more & more of our social institutions and the people who run them.

    Maybe its time to teach morals in schools, which doesn't have to include religious orientations.

    A related article in the WSJ - "Kant in Kindergarten could ease the civility crisis". https://www.wsj.com/articles/kant-in...is-11546039225

  23. #263
    Quote Originally Posted by Ma'ake View Post
    Thought provoking article in the D-News about teaching morals in schools: https://www.deseretnews.com/article/...to-change.html

    At a time where the nation is fracturing along numerous fronts, many parents increasingly view religions as highly imperfect institutions to be avoided - take your pick of reasons why religious participation is declining. Many parents are disillusioned, worn down, alienated from more & more of our social institutions and the people who run them.

    Maybe its time to teach morals in schools, which doesn't have to include religious orientations.

    A related article in the WSJ - "Kant in Kindergarten could ease the civility crisis". https://www.wsj.com/articles/kant-in...is-11546039225
    That's fine but I think the core of morals needs to be taught to children by someone they love and respect, so I think in most cases school is a less than adequate substitute.

    My observation with the youth in my area when it comes to religion is they are either all-in or all-out, and there is little to no fence sitting, which was pretty prevalent when I was the same age. It seems like the kids I know who are all-in are far more convicted in their beliefs than I was at the time and they've done a lot to put in the effort to figure out what they believe. Of course things can change with time etc, this is just comparing points in time.

    For the kids who are all out that I have friendships with or talking to their parents a lot of them really struggle with their moorings in life and along this path. Many of them who leave the faith of their parents abandon it all, even a belief in God And it is a challenging thing for them to reestablish a foundation that governs their morality.

    Now I know what I've said will trigger SU, so I want to say I am not passing judgment, nor am I claiming this is true for all youth, just an observation of teenagers I know well.

    My guess is that the percentage of people who were "hardcore" in their religion has remained the same and many of the people who are now "nones" where probably not deeply convicted.

    On another aside, but while many of the LDS congregations in SLC proper have shrunk and wards have been combined, my ward has actually grown and its activity rate as a percentage has gone up. This is an old and established area and so it can't be attributed to new construction of higher density (in fact the trend has been to take some of the duplexes in the are and demolishing them to make way for single family homes).

    I can't say why that is and is directly opposite of my brother's ward just a few miles away.


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  24. #264
    Quote Originally Posted by Rocker Ute View Post
    That's fine but I think the core of morals needs to be taught to children by someone they love and respect, so I think in most cases school is a less than adequate substitute.

    My observation with the youth in my area when it comes to religion is they are either all-in or all-out, and there is little to no fence sitting, which was pretty prevalent when I was the same age. It seems like the kids I know who are all-in are far more convicted in their beliefs than I was at the time and they've done a lot to put in the effort to figure out what they believe. Of course things can change with time etc, this is just comparing points in time.

    For the kids who are all out that I have friendships with or talking to their parents a lot of them really struggle with their moorings in life and along this path. Many of them who leave the faith of their parents abandon it all, even a belief in God And it is a challenging thing for them to reestablish a foundation that governs their morality.

    Now I know what I've said will trigger SU, so I want to say I am not passing judgment, nor am I claiming this is true for all youth, just an observation of teenagers I know well.

    My guess is that the percentage of people who were "hardcore" in their religion has remained the same and many of the people who are now "nones" where probably not deeply convicted.

    On another aside, but while many of the LDS congregations in SLC proper have shrunk and wards have been combined, my ward has actually grown and its activity rate as a percentage has gone up. This is an old and established area and so it can't be attributed to new construction of higher density (in fact the trend has been to take some of the duplexes in the are and demolishing them to make way for single family homes).

    I can't say why that is and is directly opposite of my brother's ward just a few miles away.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
    I teach design and art at the college level. One of the challenges we face is offering project work that approximates what design and art students can reasonably expect to encounter in industry. The project work must also permit the students to develop creative content that does not contravene copyright.

    The ethics of responsible behavior for visual artists with regards to copyright are easy to teach and easily learned. There is no ambiguity—what is not only lawful but ethical behavior is clearly and concisely defined.

    In contrast, each year I offer a project where the subject focus is a fable by Aesop called “The Fox and the Crow.” It is a great subject matter for design and art related project work. The fable text is in the public domain, plus design and art students can imagine an endless variety of visual interpretations of the story. The problem is the student’s inability to comprehend or discern the moral of the tale (a fable is a moral tale after all).

    Here is the translation of the fable I give them:

    An industrious Crow, with a wedge of cheese in her beak, perched in a tree to snack on the tasty treat good fortune had brought her way. A clever Fox, from the edge of the forest, spied the Crow and set his wits on getting the delicious morsel for himself.

    Coming and standing near the tree he looked up and said: “what a noble bird I see perched above me. Her beauty is unquestionably without equal—the hue and sheen of her plumage is exquisite. If only here voice were as sweet as her looks are fair. She ought, without doubt, be a queen!”

    The Crow, hugely flattered, and just to show the Fox that she could sing, cawed loudly. Down fell the cheese and the Fox snatched it up, remarking as he fled: “You have quite a voice, madam bird, but what you want is modesty!”
    When quizzed as to what moral 'truth' is being taught in the fable, the most common answer is: “If I am clever like a fox I can trick people and steal their stuff.”

    There are of course one or two exceptions among the seventy or so queried. Students who are religious and either Christian, Muslim or Sikh answer differently, offering responses closely aligned with the actual moral of the tale:

    “Beware the flatterer: he can be a secret enemy.”

    This used to alarm me greatly. Now I just accept it as reality.
    Last edited by tooblue; 02-22-2019 at 11:20 AM.

  25. #265
    Sam the Sheepdog LA Ute's Avatar
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    Posted without comment.

    https://youtu.be/j2RsE5k7zL0

    "It is only with the heart that one can see rightly; what is essential is invisible to the eye."
    --Antoine de Saint-Exupery

    "Things fall apart; the centre cannot hold."
    --Yeats

    “True, we [lawyers] build no bridges. We raise no towers. We construct no engines. We paint no pictures - unless as amateurs for our own principal amusement. There is little of all that we do which the eye of man can see. But we smooth out difficulties; we relieve stress; we correct mistakes; we take up other men's burdens and by our efforts we make possible the peaceful life of men in a peaceful state.”

    --John W. Davis, founder of Davis Polk & Wardwell

  26. #266
    Sam the Sheepdog LA Ute's Avatar
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    But the gap is narrowing.

    Gallup: Liberals outnumber conservatives in only 6 states, down from 9


    https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/w...es-down-from-9
    Last edited by LA Ute; 02-23-2019 at 08:41 AM.

    "It is only with the heart that one can see rightly; what is essential is invisible to the eye."
    --Antoine de Saint-Exupery

    "Things fall apart; the centre cannot hold."
    --Yeats

    “True, we [lawyers] build no bridges. We raise no towers. We construct no engines. We paint no pictures - unless as amateurs for our own principal amusement. There is little of all that we do which the eye of man can see. But we smooth out difficulties; we relieve stress; we correct mistakes; we take up other men's burdens and by our efforts we make possible the peaceful life of men in a peaceful state.”

    --John W. Davis, founder of Davis Polk & Wardwell

  27. #267
    Quote Originally Posted by LA Ute View Post
    Posted without comment.

    https://youtu.be/j2RsE5k7zL0
    I've never heard of this "Jussie" character until this news. If he did this and the evidence supports conviction, justice needs to be administered.

    Contrast: https://www.businessinsider.com/frie...is-week-2019-2

    "A federal judge on Thursday ruled that the Justice Department violated the rights of victims in a non-prosecution agreement with Epstein when he faced charges of abusing dozens of young girls.


    "The 2008 deal with Epstein was facilitated by Alexander Acosta, the Miami US attorney at the time who now serves as the secretary of the Department of Labor under Trump."

    There are many prisms by which people look at the world. My guess is the Smollet case will get the lion's share of the attention by many, and those same folks will have no idea who Epstein, Acosta and maybe even Kraft are, nor will they care.

    "But that Jussie Smollet…!"

  28. #268
    Sam the Sheepdog LA Ute's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ma'ake View Post
    I've never heard of this "Jussie" character until this news. If he did this and the evidence supports conviction, justice needs to be administered.

    Contrast: https://www.businessinsider.com/frie...is-week-2019-2

    "A federal judge on Thursday ruled that the Justice Department violated the rights of victims in a non-prosecution agreement with Epstein when he faced charges of abusing dozens of young girls.


    "The 2008 deal with Epstein was facilitated by Alexander Acosta, the Miami US attorney at the time who now serves as the secretary of the Department of Labor under Trump."

    There are many prisms by which people look at the world. My guess is the Smollet case will get the lion's share of the attention by many, and those same folks will have no idea who Epstein, Acosta and maybe even Kraft are, nor will they care.

    "But that Jussie Smollet…!"
    I had never heard of him until this story arose.

    "It is only with the heart that one can see rightly; what is essential is invisible to the eye."
    --Antoine de Saint-Exupery

    "Things fall apart; the centre cannot hold."
    --Yeats

    “True, we [lawyers] build no bridges. We raise no towers. We construct no engines. We paint no pictures - unless as amateurs for our own principal amusement. There is little of all that we do which the eye of man can see. But we smooth out difficulties; we relieve stress; we correct mistakes; we take up other men's burdens and by our efforts we make possible the peaceful life of men in a peaceful state.”

    --John W. Davis, founder of Davis Polk & Wardwell

  29. #269
    Sam the Sheepdog LA Ute's Avatar
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    Open Letter From New York State Budget Director Robert Mujica Regarding Amazon

    https://www.governor.ny.gov/news/ope...garding-amazon

    "It is only with the heart that one can see rightly; what is essential is invisible to the eye."
    --Antoine de Saint-Exupery

    "Things fall apart; the centre cannot hold."
    --Yeats

    “True, we [lawyers] build no bridges. We raise no towers. We construct no engines. We paint no pictures - unless as amateurs for our own principal amusement. There is little of all that we do which the eye of man can see. But we smooth out difficulties; we relieve stress; we correct mistakes; we take up other men's burdens and by our efforts we make possible the peaceful life of men in a peaceful state.”

    --John W. Davis, founder of Davis Polk & Wardwell

  30. #270
    Administrator U-Ute's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Location
    Salt Lake City
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    5,511
    I wonder which Jobs Creator Network billionaire wrote that for him.

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