Apparently there has been no limitation on who the FBI can investigate, just Avenatti concocting news in this case (hey, he would be a worthy opponent to Trump in 2020!)Originally Posted by Ma'ake
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Apparently there has been no limitation on who the FBI can investigate, just Avenatti concocting news in this case (hey, he would be a worthy opponent to Trump in 2020!)
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
A down the middle analysis by Andrew Sullivan. There’s stuff in here that everyone will agree and disagree with.
Everyone Lost at the Ford-Kavanaugh Hearings
http://nymag.com/daily/intelligencer...-sullivan.html
"It is only with the heart that one can see rightly; what is essential is invisible to the eye."
--Antoine de Saint-Exupery
"Things fall apart; the centre cannot hold."
--Yeats
“True, we [lawyers] build no bridges. We raise no towers. We construct no engines. We paint no pictures - unless as amateurs for our own principal amusement. There is little of all that we do which the eye of man can see. But we smooth out difficulties; we relieve stress; we correct mistakes; we take up other men's burdens and by our efforts we make possible the peaceful life of men in a peaceful state.”
--John W. Davis, founder of Davis Polk & Wardwell
I didn't say he would be a desirable candidate, only that in the circus we live in, he would be in the same mold as Trump, just from the left...or wherever it is he comes from (kind of like Trump).
The anti-circus candidate I would prefer seems to be picking up momentum, even drew an apology from Kavanaugh. It would be nice to migrate back toward being a civil society: https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/polit...cid=spartanntp
Hearkening back to an earlier discussion about females as leaders, maybe the nation is ready for somebody like Klobuchar, letting the fossils who led us into this ongoing low intensity civil war fade into the history books. Detoxify the environment a bit, coax people to work together. Sounds intriguing, right?
DC is setup for confrontational zero-sum battles, but there was a time when a "growing pie" compromise mindset was more prevalent, even with all the political drama. My co-worker's father was the GOP counsel for the Commerce Committee, said there's no way he could do his job in the environment that has predominated the past 20 years.
Last edited by Ma'ake; 09-30-2018 at 01:11 PM.
diehard--you have a private message that is time sensitive
I don't think his family has been destroyed, but like Dr. Ford, his family has been subject to threats of violence.
Ok, I know this will set off a lot of people here, but earlier this week my daughter wrote about this stuff for Vox, and yesterday Kamala Harris retweeted it.
“Our country is telling [boys] not only that sexual assault as a teenager is forgivable, but that if the allegations are true, it would not even disqualify a person from the highest court in America. As a teenage girl, it terrifies me.”
Kamala Harris added,
VoxVerified account @voxdotcom
To those dismissing the Kavanaugh allegations: Teen girls like me are listening https://www.vox.com/first-person/201...source=twitter …
7:26 PM - 29 Sep 2018
Last edited by concerned; 09-30-2018 at 02:29 PM.
Far from it - I'll speak for everyone and say, Good for your daughter! Being retweeted by a senator probably feels good to someone who tweets.
What makes you think that she, or any current senator, is likely to detoxify the environment?
Someone at church today was telling me how qualified Kavanaugh is while we were setting up chairs, and it occurred to me just how unqualified most of our congress representatives are. I mean, we've done it to ourselves by voting these people in, but there aren't a lot of amazing resumes out there.
It feels good to an 18 year old, that is for sure. It wasn't just a tweet; Harris retweeted her article.
It's a big deal. Good for her. I could focus the rest of my life on nothing more than writing an article worthy of a senator retweet, and I would never make it.
Very cool, concerned. You are justly proud of her.
"It is only with the heart that one can see rightly; what is essential is invisible to the eye."
--Antoine de Saint-Exupery
"Things fall apart; the centre cannot hold."
--Yeats
“True, we [lawyers] build no bridges. We raise no towers. We construct no engines. We paint no pictures - unless as amateurs for our own principal amusement. There is little of all that we do which the eye of man can see. But we smooth out difficulties; we relieve stress; we correct mistakes; we take up other men's burdens and by our efforts we make possible the peaceful life of men in a peaceful state.”
--John W. Davis, founder of Davis Polk & Wardwell
Yes, I confess.
This appeared in the Illinois Times:
The lack of decency should appall everyone here.
https://www.theamericanconservative....d-chris-britt/
Last edited by LA Ute; 09-30-2018 at 09:51 PM.
"It is only with the heart that one can see rightly; what is essential is invisible to the eye."
--Antoine de Saint-Exupery
"Things fall apart; the centre cannot hold."
--Yeats
“True, we [lawyers] build no bridges. We raise no towers. We construct no engines. We paint no pictures - unless as amateurs for our own principal amusement. There is little of all that we do which the eye of man can see. But we smooth out difficulties; we relieve stress; we correct mistakes; we take up other men's burdens and by our efforts we make possible the peaceful life of men in a peaceful state.”
--John W. Davis, founder of Davis Polk & Wardwell
This is not necessarily a knock on your daughter. My high school son has virtually no interest in politics. Doesn’t bother me at all. I like that he’s into sports at this point in his life and not politics. But good for your civically minded daughter.
45 million Americans voted for Bill Clinton in 1992 when rumors of sexual misconduct swirled about, but I don’t hunk any allegations had emerged at that point. He received 47 million votes in 1996 after credible allegations of groping by Paula Jones. 63 million voted for Donald Trump despite plenty of allegations and evidence that he’s groped/assaulted women all his adult life. Another 66 million voted for Hillary Clinton despite the fact she’s enabled her husband, who turned out to be another prolific predator, as well as attacking the women who came forward with credible allegations. Cory Booker, wrote an article as a student at Stanford about how he groped a drunk girl just a few years earlier. Yet he was elected to local and national positions by his constituents who don’t seem too concerned with his actions as a 17 year old high school student.
My point is that the dye was cast long before Kavanaugh entered the scene. For many decades Democrats and Republicans alike are guilty of accepting this behavior from its government officials.
The difference between those I’ve mentioned and Kavanaugh is there is ample evidence they were sexual predators. To date, there’s one credible allegation and zero credible evidence that he actually did what he is accused. Let’s see if the FBI comes up with something before labeling him a sexual predator. That’s my opinion anyway.
I dont disagree with anything you said. Neither would my daughter. She is appalled by trump and Clinton too. One quibble: Fords testimony is evidence. Lots of criminal defendants are convicted on similar first person testimony. It's just not corroborated by an eyewitness, and may be contradicted by one.it may be indirectly corroborated by circumstantial evidence.
That’s what makes many sexual assault cases so difficult to try. There is little physical evidence, or that physical evidence can be “explained away”
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They were just following the example of our own POTUS who publicly outed Lindsay Graham's cell phone number.
Sorry, but it won't happen.
The rumors on Twitter is that Trump is using his powers over the Executive to control who the FBI talks to and who they don't.
https://www.cnn.com/2018/09/30/polit...ion/index.html
So the left can continue to direct their ire at Trump.
Well, if that’s what the Twitter rumors say.... 😉
"It is only with the heart that one can see rightly; what is essential is invisible to the eye."
--Antoine de Saint-Exupery
"Things fall apart; the centre cannot hold."
--Yeats
“True, we [lawyers] build no bridges. We raise no towers. We construct no engines. We paint no pictures - unless as amateurs for our own principal amusement. There is little of all that we do which the eye of man can see. But we smooth out difficulties; we relieve stress; we correct mistakes; we take up other men's burdens and by our efforts we make possible the peaceful life of men in a peaceful state.”
--John W. Davis, founder of Davis Polk & Wardwell
There was an interesting conversation on Facebook started by a friend of mine who investigates sex crimes that started out with him saying, "Unless you are a victim of sexual assault or work in sex crimes shut the f*** up."
He went on to explain that silence on sexual assault and even people around them not knowing it happened is very common and victims often don't come forward for years. He also noted the very low rate of false accusations of sexual assault and that people's memory tends to be fuzzy around details even immediately around the trauma. He also noted that almost all assault accusations are unsubstantiated when first reported and it require an investigation to corroborate facts. Finally, a lot of seeming great upstanding guys are guilty of sexual assault.
I think most of us knew that already. But then he was pretty emphatic about how politicians on both sides have behaved poorly and interfered with a fair investigation and the last people on earth who should be asking these two people questions are politicians. He said at this point it will be very hard to do a proper investigation.
And I think that is what has been troubling to me about this. Nothing about this is fair to either individual involved and the public spectacle of it all is unfair and further victimizes people. It is particularly troubling that all of this could have been investigated in a more fair way in private where the real facts could hopefully come out.
Now I'm reading a report, "Kavanaugh threw ice at someone in a bar in college..." which of course means that he is guilty of sexual assault. Or photos of Ford being circulated when she was young, "Look she was homely, no way he'd assault her." That's about as low humanity can get on this subject.
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I don't know whether Kavenaugh is guilty of sexual assault or not. Frankly, without any evidence, I don't think he would ever be convicted or should be.
What he is guilty of, however, is a pattern of bad behavior that brings into question as to whether or not he should serve on the Supreme Court.
I've never thought that her not telling anyone was significant from a proof standpoint. What troubles me about this is the lack of evidence and the many inconsistencies and missing pieces in her story. I'm sympathetic to the "believe women" idea but we need more than an allegation.
"It is only with the heart that one can see rightly; what is essential is invisible to the eye."
--Antoine de Saint-Exupery
"Things fall apart; the centre cannot hold."
--Yeats
“True, we [lawyers] build no bridges. We raise no towers. We construct no engines. We paint no pictures - unless as amateurs for our own principal amusement. There is little of all that we do which the eye of man can see. But we smooth out difficulties; we relieve stress; we correct mistakes; we take up other men's burdens and by our efforts we make possible the peaceful life of men in a peaceful state.”
--John W. Davis, founder of Davis Polk & Wardwell
Agreed, but the conduct of the senate committee didn't afford either person that option.
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There’s often a lack of evidence.
Sadly Hollywood has conditioned people to think there is hard physical evidence most of the time. Reality is in most crimes physical evidence is hard to come by.
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What? You don't think a group of preening politicians seeking to maintain or obtain power is likely to get at the facts of a politically-charged controversy?
"It is only with the heart that one can see rightly; what is essential is invisible to the eye."
--Antoine de Saint-Exupery
"Things fall apart; the centre cannot hold."
--Yeats
“True, we [lawyers] build no bridges. We raise no towers. We construct no engines. We paint no pictures - unless as amateurs for our own principal amusement. There is little of all that we do which the eye of man can see. But we smooth out difficulties; we relieve stress; we correct mistakes; we take up other men's burdens and by our efforts we make possible the peaceful life of men in a peaceful state.”
--John W. Davis, founder of Davis Polk & Wardwell
No doubt. I'm not talking about the DNA evidence that always solves the case on TV or in movies, just good old-fashioned corroboration and a version of events that makes sense. Both are missing here.
"It is only with the heart that one can see rightly; what is essential is invisible to the eye."
--Antoine de Saint-Exupery
"Things fall apart; the centre cannot hold."
--Yeats
“True, we [lawyers] build no bridges. We raise no towers. We construct no engines. We paint no pictures - unless as amateurs for our own principal amusement. There is little of all that we do which the eye of man can see. But we smooth out difficulties; we relieve stress; we correct mistakes; we take up other men's burdens and by our efforts we make possible the peaceful life of men in a peaceful state.”
--John W. Davis, founder of Davis Polk & Wardwell
The appropriate step would have been to pull the nomination back and do a thorough investigation, but we all know that wouldn't happen.
The real problem is that the nomination couldn't be considered in an appropriate fashion. The Republicans wanted to quickly push through a very conservative candidate before the elections or the end of the year, when the Democrats may take control the Senate. The Democrats tried to manipulate the process to slow it down.
We now have a serious issue that demands thorough investigation. The Republicans are still trying to push it through and the serious issue will not be adequately considered. Isn't that the bottom line?
Would you feel good about how this is playing out if it was May 1, 2017 and there was a decision to investigate for one week?
You're just as incorrigible as you were in high school.
"It is only with the heart that one can see rightly; what is essential is invisible to the eye."
--Antoine de Saint-Exupery
"Things fall apart; the centre cannot hold."
--Yeats
“True, we [lawyers] build no bridges. We raise no towers. We construct no engines. We paint no pictures - unless as amateurs for our own principal amusement. There is little of all that we do which the eye of man can see. But we smooth out difficulties; we relieve stress; we correct mistakes; we take up other men's burdens and by our efforts we make possible the peaceful life of men in a peaceful state.”
--John W. Davis, founder of Davis Polk & Wardwell
What complicates Kavanaugh's nomination in this existential political war for both sides, is his past in an era when behavior which was perhaps "borderline" is today absolutely disqualifyingly toxic, now.
The standards of interaction between men & women have changed. Ask Al Franken.
We all remember some of the "locker room talk" some engaged in. I turned away, disgusted. This was part of what drove me out of the church of my upbringing, listening to little old ladies in church praising our neighborhood's new generation of young priesthood leaders by name who would lead us as a people to the Millennium... after I'd heard the same guys talking about girls in truly disgusting ways just the night before.
(It wasn't all of them, but the mismatch in deeds and perceived righteousness was too much for me to take. It was nauseating, it was wrong, but the adults lavished praise on young men I knew were minor league immoral monsters, bragging about getting to different "bases" with different girls, and how certain "smells" differed between them. "Tuna!" was some slang I remember being bantered around in the hallways in HS, referring to specific girls.)
Ahh... but that was just "boys being boys", right?
Kavanaugh as the rowdy, beer drinking Yale frat boy "man's man" leader doesn't square with the wholesome image he portrays today as the righteous anti-abortion evangelical.
I've seen this movie before. When Kavanaugh was first nominated, my wife immediately reacted - "there's something about him that's just not right." A woman's intuition? Or just another hysterical anti-Trump liberal?
Trump could sidestep all this with a different candidate, but it's turned into a duel of honor.
As GOP Senators are being harassed in airports and other public places, “This is really not even about the Senate,” Bob Corker said. “It’s about where the country right now and we as a nation have to figure out a way to unite. Right now there are just so many issues that separate us.”
This is pretty depressing, but it does give us a snapshot of what we have sunk to as a nation. And I’m not excusing those on the other side who do similar things.
Georgetown University responds amid backlash to prof's 'white men' tweet, Twitter suspends account
https://www.campusreform.org/?ID=11374
"It is only with the heart that one can see rightly; what is essential is invisible to the eye."
--Antoine de Saint-Exupery
"Things fall apart; the centre cannot hold."
--Yeats
“True, we [lawyers] build no bridges. We raise no towers. We construct no engines. We paint no pictures - unless as amateurs for our own principal amusement. There is little of all that we do which the eye of man can see. But we smooth out difficulties; we relieve stress; we correct mistakes; we take up other men's burdens and by our efforts we make possible the peaceful life of men in a peaceful state.”
--John W. Davis, founder of Davis Polk & Wardwell
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