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Thread: Brett Kavenaugh Supreme Court Nomination

  1. #61
    Quote Originally Posted by LA Ute View Post
    If you keep this up you’re buying lunch next time at an expensive restaurant.


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    Did we make a bet, or something?

  2. #62
    Sam the Sheepdog LA Ute's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Irving Washington View Post
    Did we make a bet, or something?
    No, l’ll simply accept that lunch as your penance.

    "It is only with the heart that one can see rightly; what is essential is invisible to the eye."
    --Antoine de Saint-Exupery

    "Things fall apart; the centre cannot hold."
    --Yeats

    “True, we [lawyers] build no bridges. We raise no towers. We construct no engines. We paint no pictures - unless as amateurs for our own principal amusement. There is little of all that we do which the eye of man can see. But we smooth out difficulties; we relieve stress; we correct mistakes; we take up other men's burdens and by our efforts we make possible the peaceful life of men in a peaceful state.”

    --John W. Davis, founder of Davis Polk & Wardwell

  3. #63
    Hawaiian Senator Hirano expressing her frustration on sexual harassment and assault:

    "Guess who is perpetuating all of these kinds of actions? It's the men in this country. And I just want to say to the men in this country: just shut up and step up, do the right thing for a change."

    You're all guilty now.

    I'm all for the #metoo movement but these kind of statements don't help.

    https://www-m.cnn.com/2018/09/20/pol...www.cnn.com%2F




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  4. #64
    And then Trump steps in like the idiot he is and claims that if what happened was as bad as she says it was she would have called police.

    False and so ignorant of the facts around sexual assault and a harmful statement to all who have been sexually assaulted.

    We had a week of our president acting like a president - wasn't that nice?


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  5. #65
    Quote Originally Posted by Rocker Ute View Post
    And then Trump steps in like the idiot he is and claims that if what happened was as bad as she says it was she would have called police.
    I've heard some "Sure, he was a drunken, spoiled, frat boy at an elitist private school, but we don't know if he attempted to rape her." I just hate that drunken, spoiled, rich, elitist is still a prereq for politics. I don't think those things disqualify him because those things describe almost everyone in public office. But they sure don't make me enthusiastic about him.

  6. #66
    Sam the Sheepdog LA Ute's Avatar
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    Reports are in that both the accuser and Kavanaugh’s wife have received death threats.

    "It is only with the heart that one can see rightly; what is essential is invisible to the eye."
    --Antoine de Saint-Exupery

    "Things fall apart; the centre cannot hold."
    --Yeats

    “True, we [lawyers] build no bridges. We raise no towers. We construct no engines. We paint no pictures - unless as amateurs for our own principal amusement. There is little of all that we do which the eye of man can see. But we smooth out difficulties; we relieve stress; we correct mistakes; we take up other men's burdens and by our efforts we make possible the peaceful life of men in a peaceful state.”

    --John W. Davis, founder of Davis Polk & Wardwell

  7. #67
    Quote Originally Posted by LA Ute View Post
    Reports are in that both the accuser and Kavanaugh’s wife have received death threats.
    Does this surprise you?

    Death threats are common place

    You’d be amazed how many death threat reports are made.


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  8. #68
    Quote Originally Posted by Rocker Ute View Post
    And then Trump steps in like the idiot he is and claims that if what happened was as bad as she says it was she would have called police.

    False and so ignorant of the facts around sexual assault and a harmful statement to all who have been sexually assaulted.

    We had a week of our president acting like a president - wasn't that nice?


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    Gotta love the Onion


    The OnionVerified account @TheOnion 2m2 minutes agoMore

    Trump Asks Why Kavanaugh Accuser Didn’t Just Immediately Request Hush Money https://trib.al/5p0hVQX

  9. #69
    Quote Originally Posted by Diehard Ute View Post
    Does this surprise you?

    Death threats are common place

    You’d be amazed how many death threat reports are made.


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  10. #70
    Sam the Sheepdog LA Ute's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Diehard Ute View Post
    Does this surprise you?
    Of course not. It does dismay me.

    "It is only with the heart that one can see rightly; what is essential is invisible to the eye."
    --Antoine de Saint-Exupery

    "Things fall apart; the centre cannot hold."
    --Yeats

    “True, we [lawyers] build no bridges. We raise no towers. We construct no engines. We paint no pictures - unless as amateurs for our own principal amusement. There is little of all that we do which the eye of man can see. But we smooth out difficulties; we relieve stress; we correct mistakes; we take up other men's burdens and by our efforts we make possible the peaceful life of men in a peaceful state.”

    --John W. Davis, founder of Davis Polk & Wardwell

  11. #71
    Sam the Sheepdog LA Ute's Avatar
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    “Travesty” doesn’t come close to describing what is happening now.

    10 Serious Problems With New Accusations Against Kavanaugh

    https://www.dailywire.com/news/36229...-ryan-saavedra

    "It is only with the heart that one can see rightly; what is essential is invisible to the eye."
    --Antoine de Saint-Exupery

    "Things fall apart; the centre cannot hold."
    --Yeats

    “True, we [lawyers] build no bridges. We raise no towers. We construct no engines. We paint no pictures - unless as amateurs for our own principal amusement. There is little of all that we do which the eye of man can see. But we smooth out difficulties; we relieve stress; we correct mistakes; we take up other men's burdens and by our efforts we make possible the peaceful life of men in a peaceful state.”

    --John W. Davis, founder of Davis Polk & Wardwell

  12. #72
    And then there is the Avenatti angle: https://www.vox.com/policy-and-polit...evils-triangle

    The range on Avenatti is pretty vast. He could either be just an adrenaline junkie / former race car driver who has a little Saul Goodman in him with some TV charisma... or he could be the next POTUS. (The bar is pretty low, nowadays.)

  13. #73
    Sam the Sheepdog LA Ute's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ma'ake View Post
    And then there is the Avenatti angle: https://www.vox.com/policy-and-polit...evils-triangle

    The range on Avenatti is pretty vast. He could either be just an adrenaline junkie / former race car driver who has a little Saul Goodman in him with some TV charisma... or he could be the next POTUS. (The bar is pretty low, nowadays.)
    Here’s a right of center publication’s take on Mr. Avenatti:

    Stormy Daniels' Lawyer Claims He Has Evidence Kavanaugh Ran A 'Gang Rape' Ring

    https://www.dailywire.com/news/36232...-prestigiacomo

    I expect him to have his own show on MSNBC or CNN before too long.

    "It is only with the heart that one can see rightly; what is essential is invisible to the eye."
    --Antoine de Saint-Exupery

    "Things fall apart; the centre cannot hold."
    --Yeats

    “True, we [lawyers] build no bridges. We raise no towers. We construct no engines. We paint no pictures - unless as amateurs for our own principal amusement. There is little of all that we do which the eye of man can see. But we smooth out difficulties; we relieve stress; we correct mistakes; we take up other men's burdens and by our efforts we make possible the peaceful life of men in a peaceful state.”

    --John W. Davis, founder of Davis Polk & Wardwell

  14. #74
    Quote Originally Posted by LA Ute View Post
    Here’s a right of center publication’s take on Mr. Avenatti:

    Stormy Daniels' Lawyer Claims He Has Evidence Kavanaugh Ran A 'Gang Rape' Ring

    https://www.dailywire.com/news/36232...-prestigiacomo

    I expect him to have his own show on MSNBC or CNN before too long.
    Questions #5 and #6 certainly fall into the category of loaded question. There is no way to answer them directly without implying involvement. "Did you stop beating your wife?"

  15. #75
    My favorite line by far:

    The book is dedicated to her daughter.

  16. #76
    Quote Originally Posted by sancho View Post
    I've heard some "Sure, he was a drunken, spoiled, frat boy at an elitist private school, but we don't know if he attempted to rape her." I just hate that drunken, spoiled, rich, elitist is still a prereq for politics. I don't think those things disqualify him because those things describe almost everyone in public office. But they sure don't make me enthusiastic about him.
    Follow up to my thought from the Times:

    https://www.nytimes.com/2018/09/24/o...nion&smtyp=cur

  17. #77
    Sam the Sheepdog LA Ute's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sancho View Post
    Follow up to my thought from the Times:

    https://www.nytimes.com/2018/09/24/o...nion&smtyp=cur
    I don't think we know that Kavanaugh was a "drunken, spoiled, frat boy." That's been a big part of the character assassination, but the majority of the evidence is that he's been a Boy Scout.

    "It is only with the heart that one can see rightly; what is essential is invisible to the eye."
    --Antoine de Saint-Exupery

    "Things fall apart; the centre cannot hold."
    --Yeats

    “True, we [lawyers] build no bridges. We raise no towers. We construct no engines. We paint no pictures - unless as amateurs for our own principal amusement. There is little of all that we do which the eye of man can see. But we smooth out difficulties; we relieve stress; we correct mistakes; we take up other men's burdens and by our efforts we make possible the peaceful life of men in a peaceful state.”

    --John W. Davis, founder of Davis Polk & Wardwell

  18. #78
    Quote Originally Posted by LA Ute View Post
    I don't think we know that Kavanaugh was a "drunken, spoiled, frat boy." That's been a big part of the character assassination, but the majority of the evidence is that he's been a Boy Scout.
    Well, we know he drank before being of legal age, right? We know he went to a high school for spoiled people. And we know he belonged to a fraternity. So...drunken, spoiled, frat boy. Maybe he was the nicest drunken, spoiled, frat boy at Yale, though.

    Like I said, none of that disqualifies him. Plenty of drunken, spoiled, frat boys turn out to be wonderful people. He may be a really great guy and an excellent judge. He's qualified and would do well. I just think that, in a world of millions of good people, we don't need every political figure to have a Yale/Harvard background. A little diversity would be a good thing.

  19. #79
    I love how none of the Republican committee members want to be the one questioning Ford. I guess none feels like he can appear neutral and fair

  20. #80
    Sam the Sheepdog LA Ute's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Irving Washington View Post
    I love how none of the Republican committee members want to be the one questioning Ford. I guess none feels like he can appear neutral and fair
    I think they know what will happen with whatever they say.

    "It is only with the heart that one can see rightly; what is essential is invisible to the eye."
    --Antoine de Saint-Exupery

    "Things fall apart; the centre cannot hold."
    --Yeats

    “True, we [lawyers] build no bridges. We raise no towers. We construct no engines. We paint no pictures - unless as amateurs for our own principal amusement. There is little of all that we do which the eye of man can see. But we smooth out difficulties; we relieve stress; we correct mistakes; we take up other men's burdens and by our efforts we make possible the peaceful life of men in a peaceful state.”

    --John W. Davis, founder of Davis Polk & Wardwell

  21. #81
    Quote Originally Posted by LA Ute View Post
    I think they know what will happen with whatever they say.
    Yeah, there's no way to come out of that looking good.

  22. #82
    Quote Originally Posted by LA Ute View Post
    I don't think we know that Kavanaugh was a "drunken, spoiled, frat boy." That's been a big part of the character assassination, but the majority of the evidence is that he's been a Boy Scout.
    Your scout troop must have been a lot different than mine.


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  23. #83
    Sam the Sheepdog LA Ute's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Diehard Ute View Post
    Your scout troop must have been a lot different than mine.
    In my troops character assassination wasn’t a point of the Scout Law.

    "It is only with the heart that one can see rightly; what is essential is invisible to the eye."
    --Antoine de Saint-Exupery

    "Things fall apart; the centre cannot hold."
    --Yeats

    “True, we [lawyers] build no bridges. We raise no towers. We construct no engines. We paint no pictures - unless as amateurs for our own principal amusement. There is little of all that we do which the eye of man can see. But we smooth out difficulties; we relieve stress; we correct mistakes; we take up other men's burdens and by our efforts we make possible the peaceful life of men in a peaceful state.”

    --John W. Davis, founder of Davis Polk & Wardwell

  24. #84
    Sam the Sheepdog LA Ute's Avatar
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    Well, he’s teed up some specific claims that can be damaged by fact witnesses:

    On Fox, Brett Kavanaugh Mounts an Aggressive, Specific Defense

    https://www.nationalreview.com/corne...cific-defense/

    "It is only with the heart that one can see rightly; what is essential is invisible to the eye."
    --Antoine de Saint-Exupery

    "Things fall apart; the centre cannot hold."
    --Yeats

    “True, we [lawyers] build no bridges. We raise no towers. We construct no engines. We paint no pictures - unless as amateurs for our own principal amusement. There is little of all that we do which the eye of man can see. But we smooth out difficulties; we relieve stress; we correct mistakes; we take up other men's burdens and by our efforts we make possible the peaceful life of men in a peaceful state.”

    --John W. Davis, founder of Davis Polk & Wardwell

  25. #85
    Quote Originally Posted by LA Ute View Post
    In my troops character assassination wasn’t a point of the Scout Law.
    Who knows if the accusation is true or not.

    But it’s obvious from his own yearbook writings characterizing him as a Boy Scout was a poor choice on your part.


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  26. #86
    Quote Originally Posted by sancho View Post
    Yeah, there's no way to come out of that looking good.
    No one is capable of questioning both witnesses like an appellate judge would, letting them talk, questioning weaknesses of both, and appearing neutral and fair?

  27. #87
    Quote Originally Posted by LA Ute View Post
    I don't think we know that Kavanaugh was a "drunken, spoiled, frat boy." That's been a big part of the character assassination, but the majority of the evidence is that he's been a Boy Scout.
    Do the Boy Scout reports come from peers of the same system?

  28. #88
    I despise Ted Cruz but this stuff needs to stop:

    https://www-m.cnn.com/2018/09/25/pol...www.cnn.com%2F

    At this point I have no idea who to believe, but for what it is worth when I was in high school a rumor was floating around that at a party I was blackout drunk. It spread around like crazy because it was out of character for me. Problem was, I wasn't even at the party, but people throughout my senior year and probably to this day thought I was a partier.

    Knowing the nature of high school and college and stories that build into legend it is interesting to me that there haven't seemed to be a lot of corroboration of him even being wild at parties.

    The National Review viewed his interview with Fox as a driving a stake in to defend his good name, CNN characterized it as a disturbing political ploy by him, they also omitted key comments. You can chart who believes whom by political affiliation on this and the court of public opinion has decided without hearing any testimony or seeing a shred of evidence.

    I'll tell you that if I was innocent I would likely do the same thing with my primary motivation being to clear my name before being nominated. It does seem he has presented some items that can be corroborated now. If he really wasn't at the parties that is the biggest deal. If people who knew him can say they never saw him blackout drunk that is less reliable, but important. I don't know how you prove his virginity, but it does seem less likely that he'd be waiving it around at parties... although life in Utah has taught me that often those same people in that point of their life can also be overly aggressive too, but those are typically kids struggling to balance their hormones to fit into their religious standards versus being shy about it or whatever.

    If Kavanaugh did this I believe it is a disqualifier, but right now I am disturbed by how all of this is proceeding.


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  29. #89
    Quote Originally Posted by Irving Washington View Post
    No one is capable of questioning both witnesses like an appellate judge would, letting them talk, questioning weaknesses of both, and appearing neutral and fair?
    It doesn't matter if someone questions both witnesses in a neutral and fair manner. I think you know that, right? Whoever does the questioning will be the object of ridicule, possibly for decades to come.

  30. #90
    Quote Originally Posted by Rocker Ute View Post
    I despise Ted Cruz but this stuff needs to stop:

    https://www-m.cnn.com/2018/09/25/pol...www.cnn.com%2F

    At this point I have no idea who to believe, but for what it is worth when I was in high school a rumor was floating around that at a party I was blackout drunk. It spread around like crazy because it was out of character for me. Problem was, I wasn't even at the party, but people throughout my senior year and probably to this day thought I was a partier.

    Knowing the nature of high school and college and stories that build into legend it is interesting to me that there haven't seemed to be a lot of corroboration of him even being wild at parties.

    The National Review viewed his interview with Fox as a driving a stake in to defend his good name, CNN characterized it as a disturbing political ploy by him, they also omitted key comments. You can chart who believes whom by political affiliation on this and the court of public opinion has decided without hearing any testimony or seeing a shred of evidence.

    I'll tell you that if I was innocent I would likely do the same thing with my primary motivation being to clear my name before being nominated. It does seem he has presented some items that can be corroborated now. If he really wasn't at the parties that is the biggest deal. If people who knew him can say they never saw him blackout drunk that is less reliable, but important. I don't know how you prove his virginity, but it does seem less likely that he'd be waiving it around at parties... although life in Utah has taught me that often those same people in that point of their life can also be overly aggressive too, but those are typically kids struggling to balance their hormones to fit into their religious standards versus being shy about it or whatever.

    If Kavanaugh did this I believe it is a disqualifier, but right now I am disturbed by how all of this is proceeding.


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    Given his writings about alcohol, and now a girl, in yearbooks, coupled with his speech saying “What happens at Georgetown Prep stays at Georgetown Prep”...and how well that’s served he and his classmates to this day....he’s no “Boy Scout”


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