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Thread: I left my basketball in San Francisco (the no cal road games)

  1. #1

    I left my basketball in San Francisco (the no cal road games)

    Thursday at Stanford
    And 10 pm be st game on Saturday in Berkeley.

    Both winnable games

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    "Be a philosopher. A man can compromise to gain a point. It has become apparent that a man can, within limits, follow his inclinations within the arms of the Church if he does so discreetly." - The Walking Drum

    "And here’s what life comes down to—not how many years you live, but how many of those years are filled with bullshit that doesn’t amount to anything to satisfy the requirements of some dickhead you’ll never get the pleasure of punching in the face." – Adam Carolla

  2. #2
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    Quote Originally Posted by sancho View Post
    If there's such a thing as a "must win" game for a team that is not going to the tournament, the game @ Cal is "must win" for us.
    Totally agree. Which is why this weekend has me nervous as hell. We're 0-5 at Stanford in the Pac-12 era, and twice under Larry, we've been the '1' in someone's 1-17 league record. Maybe we'll get lucky and the Bears will throw everything they have against Colorado and get that one win before we come in and put them in their place. Cal does host Wazzu at the end of the season, so there's that possibility as well.

    Very scant evidence exists that Cal will give us a game, but their two best efforts this year (a win vs. SDSU and a three-point loss to St. John's) both came at home. I suspect we win by 15-plus, or that it goes down to the wire, with a bad bounce, some untimely missed FTs or an official's whistle deciding the outcome either way.

  3. #3
    We are right on the edge of the top 100 in the NET rankings. Stanford is below us but close. Cal is terrible. A sweep would be wonderful.

  4. #4
    Quote Originally Posted by UtahsMrSports View Post
    We are right on the edge of the top 100 in the NET rankings. Stanford is below us but close. Cal is terrible. A sweep would be wonderful.
    Also, given the logjam of 3-2 teams at the moment and the other games being played, it would be a great opportunity to get to +2 before hosting the Oregon schools to round out the first half of conference play. We're big fans of the top of the league this week.
    “It only ends once. Anything that happens before that is just progress.”

    Well, because he thought it was good sport. Because some men aren't looking for anything logical, like money. They can't be bought, bullied, reasoned, or negotiated with. Some men just want to watch the world burn.

  5. #5
    How in the world did PAC-12 basketball become so terrible? UW won their 1000th home game this season, and that is about the most exciting thing in the entire league all year. Luckily we are playing slightly better and may actually play into a good spot in the conference tournament.

    Go Utes, sweep the Bay.

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    Quote Originally Posted by NorthwestUteFan View Post
    How in the world did PAC-12 basketball become so terrible? UW won their 1000th home game this season, and that is about the most exciting thing in the entire league all year. Luckily we are playing slightly better and may actually play into a good spot in the conference tournament.

    Go Utes, sweep the Bay.
    At its best, the Pac-12 was always closer to where we're at now than we were the ACC or Big 10.

    Put it this way, outside of UCLA under Wooden and Arizona under Olsen, what Pac-12 school has the longest run of continued success? Utah under Majerus -- and we weren't part of the league then.

    Take the top 10 programs in the West over the last 40-50 years. How many non-Pac 12 teams make that list? I submit UTEP, UNM, UNLV, BYU and Gonzaga as shoo-ins. UCLA, Arizona and Utah are locks, and Oregon has been good for the last 20 years. Stanford was dominant under Mike Montgomery, but average to horrible everywhere else.

    That said, in the expanded bracket era and with all the media/TV advantages we have, there's no excuse for the league to underachieve like it has.

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    Quote Originally Posted by SoCalPat View Post
    At its best, the Pac-12 was always closer to where we're at now than we were the ACC or Big 10.

    Put it this way, outside of UCLA under Wooden and Arizona under Olsen, what Pac-12 school has the longest run of continued success? Utah under Majerus -- and we weren't part of the league then.

    Take the top 10 programs in the West over the last 40-50 years. How many non-Pac 12 teams make that list? I submit UTEP, UNM, UNLV, BYU and Gonzaga as shoo-ins. UCLA, Arizona and Utah are locks, and Oregon has been good for the last 20 years. Stanford was dominant under Mike Montgomery, but average to horrible everywhere else.

    That said, in the expanded bracket era and with all the media/TV advantages we have, there's no excuse for the league to underachieve like it has.
    also when you consider 80% of the NBA comes from (ACC, SEC, B1G, Big East, PAC-12 and Big XII) and the PAC-12 has the 2nd most players represented, its baffling how bad this conference has been.

    CONFERENCE NBA PLAYERS
    ACC 82
    Pac-12 69
    SEC 63
    Big 12 41
    Big Ten 39
    Big East 31

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    Quote Originally Posted by Scorcho View Post
    also when you consider 80% of the NBA comes from (ACC, SEC, B1G, Big East, PAC-12 and Big XII) and the PAC-12 has the 2nd most players represented, its baffling how bad this conference has been.

    CONFERENCE NBA PLAYERS
    ACC 82
    Pac-12 69
    SEC 63
    Big 12 41
    Big Ten 39
    Big East 31
    That's an excellent point. The Pac-12 hasn't been bad because of the players. It is an often overlooked league, and coupled with underwhelming results as of late, it's a spiral that's worse than it should be. We should pull out of it sooner rather than later.

  9. #9
    We are 2 point dogs tonight. What about Stanford says they should be favored? Of course what about Utah says the should be favored either?

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  10. #10
    So Tillman can get swatted across the head and it's a no call??

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    "Be a philosopher. A man can compromise to gain a point. It has become apparent that a man can, within limits, follow his inclinations within the arms of the Church if he does so discreetly." - The Walking Drum

    "And here’s what life comes down to—not how many years you live, but how many of those years are filled with bullshit that doesn’t amount to anything to satisfy the requirements of some dickhead you’ll never get the pleasure of punching in the face." – Adam Carolla

  11. #11
    When barefield is feeling it watch out

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    "Be a philosopher. A man can compromise to gain a point. It has become apparent that a man can, within limits, follow his inclinations within the arms of the Church if he does so discreetly." - The Walking Drum

    "And here’s what life comes down to—not how many years you live, but how many of those years are filled with bullshit that doesn’t amount to anything to satisfy the requirements of some dickhead you’ll never get the pleasure of punching in the face." – Adam Carolla

  12. #12
    Sam the Sheepdog LA Ute's Avatar
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    I left my basketball in San Francisco (the no cal road games)

    Not thrilled about Barefield’s shot selection under 2:00, with a 3-point lead and plenty of time on the shot clock.

    "It is only with the heart that one can see rightly; what is essential is invisible to the eye."
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    “True, we [lawyers] build no bridges. We raise no towers. We construct no engines. We paint no pictures - unless as amateurs for our own principal amusement. There is little of all that we do which the eye of man can see. But we smooth out difficulties; we relieve stress; we correct mistakes; we take up other men's burdens and by our efforts we make possible the peaceful life of men in a peaceful state.”

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  13. #13
    Okpala shoots his 3s as a set shot. It's like watching Black hoosiers

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    "Be a philosopher. A man can compromise to gain a point. It has become apparent that a man can, within limits, follow his inclinations within the arms of the Church if he does so discreetly." - The Walking Drum

    "And here’s what life comes down to—not how many years you live, but how many of those years are filled with bullshit that doesn’t amount to anything to satisfy the requirements of some dickhead you’ll never get the pleasure of punching in the face." – Adam Carolla

  14. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by sancho View Post
    4-2. Nice.
    Yep! And a +1 for a road win. Arizona getting run by USC right now, so they will drop to 5-2 and SC will be 4-2 facing the Devils on Saturday.

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    “It only ends once. Anything that happens before that is just progress.”

    Well, because he thought it was good sport. Because some men aren't looking for anything logical, like money. They can't be bought, bullied, reasoned, or negotiated with. Some men just want to watch the world burn.

  15. #15
    I believe Utah has now won at every PAC 12 arena except for McKale...and we really should have had that one each of the last two years.

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    Quote Originally Posted by UBlender View Post
    I believe Utah has now won at every PAC 12 arena except for McKale...and we really should have had that one each of the last two years.
    Not only that, but if we beat Cal, we'll have swept every road trip in the league at least once except for the Arizona trip.

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    This is the damndest team I've ever seen from 3. We're shooting 38 percent from behind the arc as a team. This is a far cry from any meaningful mark in program history -- the school record is 44 percent (in an obviously lesser-volume 1987-88 season, which I believe was only the 2nd year the 3-point shot existed in college ball). At least six teams have shot better than 40 percent, and based on the media guide, the fifth-best mark of 40.4 percent was set by two different teams.

    It's quite likely only the six teams listed in the media guide have shot better than 40 percent for a season. If I left it at that, the only conclusion is we're a very good 3-point shooting team, but not a great 3-point shooting team.

    And then we get the stats that turn everything on their collective heads: We've played 18 games. We've shot at or better than our season mark 8 times. But we've crushed our season average in all three of our league road games, shooting 55 percent! Quite frankly, we should never lose when we're that hot. (That our combined point differential in those three games is only 11 points is another topic altogether, and a tap-the-brakes moment when thinking about this team's potential.).

    Individually, nobody is a threat to crack the record book from a percentage standpoint. Three players are tied for 10th all-time at 44.3 percent. Sedrick Barefield is the team leader this year at 41.6 percent. But PVD is at 40.2 percent, and I'm gonna guess that it's been very rare at Utah to have two 40-plus 3 PT shooters.

    We're dangerous because of our depth of shooters (and nobody had that pegged as a team strength this year). Donnie Tillman is shooting 38.8 percent -- in fact, if he had but one more make, he'd be over 40 percent as well. Both Gach is right at 38 percent, and like Tillman, is at 40 percent on the nose with one more make. On a lesser note, Riley Battin is at 34.1 percent. With three more makes, he too is above 40 percent. Charles Jones is at 32 percent, and with three more makes, he too would be above 40 percent.

    In effect, we've got six guys who largely should (or do) have a green light to shoot any time they're open. LA brought up a moment from last night's game where he tsk-tsk'ed Sed for shooting a 3 early in the shot clock with 2 minutes to go and Utah up 3. Given this team's lack of inside game, and that Sed is our best shooter, I'm not sure I would qualify this as a bad shot. In fact, it's probably as good of a shot as we'll get at any time in any possession.

    I'll say PVD is the wild-card here. When he shoots well, we can win any game in this league, in any venue. Heavy reliance on the 3 isn't something great Utah teams have had as part of their arsenal, and I don't think this team is great by a long shot. But it's a high-wire act that's fun to watch and doesn't put us in many games where we're totally out of it.

  18. #18
    Sam the Sheepdog LA Ute's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SoCalPat View Post
    This is the damndest team I've ever seen from 3. We're shooting 38 percent from behind the arc as a team. This is a far cry from any meaningful mark in program history -- the school record is 44 percent (in an obviously lesser-volume 1987-88 season, which I believe was only the 2nd year the 3-point shot existed in college ball). At least six teams have shot better than 40 percent, and based on the media guide, the fifth-best mark of 40.4 percent was set by two different teams.

    It's quite likely only the six teams listed in the media guide have shot better than 40 percent for a season. If I left it at that, the only conclusion is we're a very good 3-point shooting team, but not a great 3-point shooting team.

    And then we get the stats that turn everything on their collective heads: We've played 18 games. We've shot at or better than our season mark 8 times. But we've crushed our season average in all three of our league road games, shooting 55 percent! Quite frankly, we should never lose when we're that hot. (That our combined point differential in those three games is only 11 points is another topic altogether, and a tap-the-brakes moment when thinking about this team's potential.).

    Individually, nobody is a threat to crack the record book from a percentage standpoint. Three players are tied for 10th all-time at 44.3 percent. Sedrick Barefield is the team leader this year at 41.6 percent. But PVD is at 40.2 percent, and I'm gonna guess that it's been very rare at Utah to have two 40-plus 3 PT shooters.

    We're dangerous because of our depth of shooters (and nobody had that pegged as a team strength this year). Donnie Tillman is shooting 38.8 percent -- in fact, if he had but one more make, he'd be over 40 percent as well. Both Gach is right at 38 percent, and like Tillman, is at 40 percent on the nose with one more make. On a lesser note, Riley Battin is at 34.1 percent. With three more makes, he too is above 40 percent. Charles Jones is at 32 percent, and with three more makes, he too would be above 40 percent.

    In effect, we've got six guys who largely should (or do) have a green light to shoot any time they're open. LA brought up a moment from last night's game where he tsk-tsk'ed Sed for shooting a 3 early in the shot clock with 2 minutes to go and Utah up 3. Given this team's lack of inside game, and that Sed is our best shooter, I'm not sure I would qualify this as a bad shot. In fact, it's probably as good of a shot as we'll get at any time in any possession.

    I'll say PVD is the wild-card here. When he shoots well, we can win any game in this league, in any venue. Heavy reliance on the 3 isn't something great Utah teams have had as part of their arsenal, and I don't think this team is great by a long shot. But it's a high-wire act that's fun to watch and doesn't put us in many games where we're totally out of it.
    I was just worried in the moment because Stanford came right back after that shot and tied the game up. I hadn't realized how well we’re shooting the three.

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  19. #19
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    say what you want about the Sultan of Shelby, MT but I'll be damned if halfway through the season Larry's teams mold together and play pretty good hoops.

    I may have to switch my avatar to a pic of Larry?


  20. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by LA Ute View Post
    I was just worried in the moment because Stanford came right back after that shot and tied the game up. I hadn't realized how well we’re shooting the three.
    Quickie (yet imperfect/flawed?) math suggests there are only two shots/players more valuable than a wide-open 3 from Sed ...

    Anything by Timmy Allen within 5 feet of the basket. Only Jayce shoots a better percentage from the field, but Allen's volume and make rate from the line crushes Jayce. (it's Jayce's FT make rate, or lack thereof, that makes him one of the worst offensive options on the team, if not the worst).

    Both Gach, from anywhere. He's tantalizingly close to being a 50-40-90 player as a true (actual is 52-38-87), and if you've read anything I've written in the past on that figure, it's very obscene company that he's keeping. I tip-toed around the doorway of his hype train when we signed him, but I'm crashing that door down now. He might be better than even his most ardent supporters insisted early on.

  21. #21
    Quote Originally Posted by sancho View Post
    Great stuff, but I think historical comparisons involving 3 point shooting are skewed by how much the game has changed. PVD or Sed may very well have shot 45% on a Majerus team, where the offenses were more selective on when to shoot the three. The team percentages would have differed as well.

    What does the data on volume of three point shots look like?
    At the risk of enabling SeattleUte, did anybody hear Mike Montgomery say on tv last night that LK drove Vonte Hendrix out because he was a bad influence? I didn't watch, but was told that. If true and given their history and relationship, I would assume that LK was the source of MM's info. I heard elsewhere (not from anyone on staff) that Hendrix presented lots of discipline issues. LK much stricter with newcomers/underclassmen than he is with seniors. Creates some tension.

    Anyway, it is completely at odds with the official explanation that Hendrix left on his own and would be welcomed back.

  22. #22
    Quote Originally Posted by sancho View Post
    I watched, but I was distracted. I heard him talking about Hendrix, but I don't recall hearing that. MM did have high praise for PVD, though. Said he needs the ball in his hands more because he's a playmaker.
    It is interesting to me that PVD gets so much love from coaches, but can't seem to convert that to production on the floor. Must be a heck of a practice time player.

  23. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rocker Ute View Post
    It is interesting to me that PVD gets so much love from coaches, but can't seem to convert that to production on the floor. Must be a heck of a practice time player.
    He's on the very short list of Krysko players that made it all the way from Freshman to Senior (I'd be curious to see all the players on that list?). I view it as sort of a lifetime achievement award. When you're not quite good enough to win an Oscar, but you've spent decades in Hollywood doing average work and you're time is short you get some love.

  24. #24
    Quote Originally Posted by Scorcho View Post
    He's on the very short list of Krysko players that made it all the way from Freshman to Senior (I'd be curious to see all the players on that list?). I view it as sort of a lifetime achievement award. When you're not quite good enough to win an Oscar, but you've spent decades in Hollywood doing average work and you're time is short you get some love.
    All 4........Ill take a stab.

    Taylor
    Tucker
    Loveridge
    Van Dyke

    I believe that is it.

  25. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by UtahsMrSports View Post
    All 4........Ill take a stab.

    Taylor
    Tucker
    Loveridge
    Van Dyke

    I believe that is it.
    I'm confident Yacob Poetl, Delon Wright, Kyle Kuzma and a few others are guys would have stayed 4-5 years had their circumstances allowed it.

  26. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rocker Ute View Post
    It is interesting to me that PVD gets so much love from coaches, but can't seem to convert that to production on the floor. Must be a heck of a practice time player.
    PVD is our whipping boy, but it might be time to reassess that opinion. Anyone who shoots 40 percent from 3 can be on the floor any time for me.

  27. #27
    PVD is this year’s Tyler Rawson in terms of on court performance vs fan hand twisting.


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    Quote Originally Posted by Dwight Schr-Ute View Post
    PVD is this year’s Tyler Rawson in terms of on court performance vs fan hand twisting.


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    My comparison was Tyler Kepkay, but Rawson fits as well.

  29. #29
    Quote Originally Posted by SoCalPat View Post
    PVD is our whipping boy, but it might be time to reassess that opinion. Anyone who shoots 40 percent from 3 can be on the floor any time for me.
    I've got no issue with PVD, particularly because he always plays hard. But I remember Tommy Conner lauding him last year before the season started. Can't remember what exactly he said, but it was kind of one of those, "Most improved... watch out this kid is legit..." sort of things.


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  30. #30
    MM also said Both Gach has not played many minutes under pressure—-like his 22 points against KY??

    Is PAC-12 saving money by finding a local to call games? Or do they get a 1 game tryout without pay & then P-12 says goodbye?

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