College. You thought harold bloom taught in the law school?Originally Posted by SeattleUte
And its Yalie. Boola Boola.
College. You thought harold bloom taught in the law school?
And its Yalie. Boola Boola.
Last edited by concerned; 03-31-2019 at 08:03 PM.
Pat Forde on the lack of 1-and-done players (again):
https://sports.yahoo.com/one-for-the...025419225.html
Utah's NCAA tournament appearances following the championship game run.
1999: Second round
2000: Second round
2001: NIT (Majerus didn't coach)
2002: First round
2003: Second round
2004: First round (Majerus retired midseason)
Don't you hate it when you get all condescending about other people become "addled and forgetting" that you do the same?
This makes me so happy.
One thing I have learned in a long life: that all our science, measured against reality, is primitive and childlike -- and yet it is the most precious thing we have.
--Albert Einstein
The fact that life evolved out of nearly nothing, some 10 billion years after the universe evolved out of literally nothing, is a fact so staggering that I would be mad to attempt words to do it justice.
--Richard Dawkins
Be kind to all, for everyone you meet is fighting a great battle.
--Philo
The Purdue/UVA game has to be one of the most entertaining games I've seen at any level in a long time.
I still can't get over that pass at the end of regulation. 99/100 players rush a half court shot in that situation. Best play I've seen in a long time. UVa is now the favorite to win this thing, and if they do, that play goes down in history as the greatest of all time for the Cavs.
There's been enough Larry talk that I feel it's OK to put this here. I have tried to be nice and patient regarding Larry's long-term future at Utah. As a reminder, I've been insistent that he gets next year as well as 2020-21 to right the ship. No more. It's NCAAs or hit the road next year.
Too many programs with far lesser histories and accomplishments are in the Final Four this year to make me realize that we're stagnating and/or regressing at Utah. Four years without an NCAA bid at Utah is simply unacceptable, and keeping Larry around to potentially make it five straight years is lowering the standards at Utah, which is also unacceptable.
Are you saying that if Kentucky beat Auburn in OT and if Gonzaga beat Texas Tech, you would be okay with giving Larry that extra year? I don't see how the results of this year's single elimination tournament should determine Larry's fate. I say fire him next year if it's clear we can do better with someone else, and keep him otherwise. I would take recruiting into account as well as team performance.
I would still give him the extra year. We are young next year with an upward trajectory (hopefully). If no tourney by 2020-21, then hit the road. And the buyout will be less.
Tech beating Gonzaga put me over the edge on Larry. Auburn beating Kentucky just solidified my point. My feelings toward Larry have always been on the margins, and I don't pay as much attention to the CBB world as I once did, but my eyes have been opened this week, especially with what Texas Tech has done -- E8 and FF in successive years, and with huge production losses in between years. Amazing.
Again, not only are teams with lesser reps in the Final Four, they beat our biggest regional and national nemeses to get there. We couldn't even make the NIT this year, and the only rankings Utah would crack is one of "Most Money Spent With Least Return on Investment." Harlan doesn't have the obligation to Larry that Chris Hill did, and it doesn't take a savant to look at the record book and Utah's history to know Larry ain't cutting it -- especially at his salary. Keeping him for a fifth year not to make the tournament would be overly generous, and our generosity has been extended enough.
BYU just bought out Dave Rose's last two years, Utah can certainly afford a three-year buyout of Larry.
Since the greatest title game ever, Villanova vs. NC in 2016.
One thing I have learned in a long life: that all our science, measured against reality, is primitive and childlike -- and yet it is the most precious thing we have.
--Albert Einstein
The fact that life evolved out of nearly nothing, some 10 billion years after the universe evolved out of literally nothing, is a fact so staggering that I would be mad to attempt words to do it justice.
--Richard Dawkins
Be kind to all, for everyone you meet is fighting a great battle.
--Philo
Penny wise and pound foolish. Donors would fund the buyout and a new coach. Meanwhile, the university is getting annihilated at the box office and probably because of dampened donor enthusiasm.
One thing I have learned in a long life: that all our science, measured against reality, is primitive and childlike -- and yet it is the most precious thing we have.
--Albert Einstein
The fact that life evolved out of nearly nothing, some 10 billion years after the universe evolved out of literally nothing, is a fact so staggering that I would be mad to attempt words to do it justice.
--Richard Dawkins
Be kind to all, for everyone you meet is fighting a great battle.
--Philo
If we are on an upward trajectory and there is enthusiasm for the future, then I would give it to him. If we crash and burn next year with little optimism and the donors and season ticket holders head for the exits, then you are right. I sit in a group of about 8 season ticket holders, and i was almost ready to throw it in after this year. One of us is going to throw it in and not renew next year.
This is where I stand. Barring a complete falling off the rails, he should have until 2021 to right the ship and get us into the dance, based on the buyout amount. If no appearance by 2021, fan support (much different than the fun house mirror that is twitter) will have sagged to the point that admins probably don't have a choice. 2022 will provide an interesting case. Larry will need an extension by then and will have had to have done enough to merit a raise/same salary, or takes a paycut (hard to see anyone agreeing to do the same job for less, unless their job is on the line).
Facts matter, and this is not really accurate.
Average attendance:
2003-2004 10,901
2004-2005 10,777
2005-2006 10,481
2006-2007 9,522
2007-2008 9,979
2008-2009 9,916
2009-2010 9,202
2010-2011 8,422
2011-2012 8,394
2012-2013 8,611
2013-2014 10,355
2014-2015 12,101
2015-2016 13,053
2016-2017 12,051
2017-2018 11,710
2018-2019 11,393
Certainly not a good trend, but we are right there with end of Majerus era.
How the Final Four teams were built
http://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketball/story/_/id/26411800/how-2019-final-four-teams-were-built
Spoilers:
Auburn: 5 top 100 recruits with a couple transfers thrown in
Michigan State: 7 top 100 recruits, no transfers, and 1 unknown who made it big (Goins)
Texas Tech: 0 top 100 recruits, mix of transfers and non-heralded recruits.
UVa; 5 top 100 recruits, couple of less coveted recruits
Texas Tech is the clear outlier, as the other three teams are all primarily built on top recruits.
I agree with this. Money is not (or should not) be a big factor in our decisions with Larry. We just have to answer the question of whether we are better with or without him, and move on from there.
I think it's unrealistic to look at the absolute miracle of Texas Tech and think that we should be doing the same thing. Chris Beards don't grow on trees.
Our recruiting numbers have been as good as they've ever been, which is a pretty good reason to keep Larry.
The current team is set up for a 2021 run. Tillman will be a senior, Allen and Gach will be juniors. Rylan Jones and co. will be sophomores. I suspect that if we show clear improvement and promise next season even without making the tournament - if it's clear that 2021 is going to be a special year - Larry will keep his job, and almost everyone on here will support that decision.
On the flip side, if we regress next season (certainly possible without PVD and Barefield), and if 2021 looks like more rebuilding - or if we lose a key player to transfer this offseason - Larry will lose his job, and almost everyone on here will support that decision.
utah should be able to recruit top 100 recruits. Loveridge was one, so was Childs. Most top 100 recruits are four stars and many turn out to be not as good as players not so identified.
Nevertheless, Texas Tech looks like the old Utes, and it is a good and probably the most appropriate model, even though Utah certainly could recruit better than Texas Tech. Gonzaga was not built on top 100 recruits.
Last edited by SeattleUte; 04-01-2019 at 11:30 AM.
One thing I have learned in a long life: that all our science, measured against reality, is primitive and childlike -- and yet it is the most precious thing we have.
--Albert Einstein
The fact that life evolved out of nearly nothing, some 10 billion years after the universe evolved out of literally nothing, is a fact so staggering that I would be mad to attempt words to do it justice.
--Richard Dawkins
Be kind to all, for everyone you meet is fighting a great battle.
--Philo
Question: official word is that Rose retired voluntarily and was not pushed (which is hard to believe). If that is true, why is there a buyout?
True. I think they will begin to rely more on top 100 recruits now though. They have 4 top 100 recruits in their current class.
If we're going off ESPN (which, I'm told, is the worst of the basketball recruiting ranking lists), Brekkot Chapman was a top 100 as well.
We heard the same when Gary Crowton got the axe. Don't believe a word of it.
Number of people wanting to fire Larry because he didn't go E8/FF in his most recent two years: Zero. It will be because he's gone four years without making the tournament.
We're set up for a 2021 run? WTF does that even mean? Finishing in the top 4 of the league and actually making it to the tournament?
I don't know, but 2021 is the power spike year with this personnel. We always finish top 4 of the league, so that isn't enough. It's silly to set accomplishment bars years in advance. You continually watch and evaluate, and you fire the guy if you think you can do better.
You're proving my point, counselor.
One thing I have learned in a long life: that all our science, measured against reality, is primitive and childlike -- and yet it is the most precious thing we have.
--Albert Einstein
The fact that life evolved out of nearly nothing, some 10 billion years after the universe evolved out of literally nothing, is a fact so staggering that I would be mad to attempt words to do it justice.
--Richard Dawkins
Be kind to all, for everyone you meet is fighting a great battle.
--Philo
are we seeing a trend of "non-1 and done programs" doing better than "1 and done type programs" in the tournament?
I think we are, TTU, Auburn, Virginia and Michigan St are certainly not programs where kids make an immediate jump to the NBA after their freshman year. Same is true of Villanova over the past 3 seasons.
That's good for the sport.
Well, yes and no. The 1 and done type programs are doing pretty well each year too. They just haven't won it since Duke in 2015. I think Duke and Kentucky are the only two programs that have been running entirely on 1 and done's lately, and they were both in the elite 8, losing in games that went to the wire.
I said it at the beginning of the tournament - the 1 seeds consisted of 1 and done programs (Duke and UNC), an experienced team of upperclassmen built through recruiting (UVa), and an experienced team built from transfers and foreign players (Gonzaga). There are a lot of different ways to win in college basketball.
Uh yeah, that's why I posted it. Did you think I was trying to argue with you?
This is not new. Ones and drones are toxic and wreck programs for a lot of reasons. They have ruined the two other programs I follow, Georgetown and UW, who are now on a long road back with just low top 100s and three stars.
I actually respect the few coaches like the real Coach K, Roy Williams, and Calipari (are there any others?) who can effectively manage a one and done program. It’s not easy.
One thing I have learned in a long life: that all our science, measured against reality, is primitive and childlike -- and yet it is the most precious thing we have.
--Albert Einstein
The fact that life evolved out of nearly nothing, some 10 billion years after the universe evolved out of literally nothing, is a fact so staggering that I would be mad to attempt words to do it justice.
--Richard Dawkins
Be kind to all, for everyone you meet is fighting a great battle.
--Philo
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