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Thread: KSL falls on its face.

  1. 03-04-2013, 09:13 AM #1
    UtahDan
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    KSL falls on its face.



    Many who know both stations well say the blame for KSL’s long fall rests on the shoulders of one man: Mark Willes, the hard-charging, self-assured nephew of former LDS President Gordon B. Hinckley.Willes, something of a media enfant terrible in the 1990s when he ran the Los Angeles Times and its parent, Times Mirror Co., accepted a call four years ago from the First Presidency of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints to take the reins of Deseret Management Corp., putting him in charge of KSL and the church’s other media properties.He moved quickly to make his mark, launching a values-based news strategy that was opposite the magisterial, hard-news approach favored by Hinckley and which had garnered huge audiences for KSL, burnished the stature of the church and earned it big profits.
    http://www.sltrib.com/sltrib/money/5...illes.html.csp
    Last edited by UtahDan; 03-04-2013 at 10:39 AM.
    “The world is so exquisite with so much love and moral depth, that there is no reason to deceive ourselves with pretty stories for which there's little good evidence. Far better it seems to me, in our vulnerability, is to look death in the eye and to be grateful every day for the brief but magnificent opportunity that life provides.”
    ― Carl Sagan
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  2. 03-04-2013, 09:32 AM #2
    Sullyute
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    Wow, that is a pretty hard nose dive. Losing almost half your audience share in 3 years takes a lot of talent. Apparently the great people of Utah don't want values based news, who would have known.
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  3. 03-04-2013, 09:44 AM #3
    Scratch
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    You know those rating systems are flawed. They don't take into account houses that have more than two television sets and other things of that nature.
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  4. 03-04-2013, 09:54 AM #4
    concerned
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    Quote Originally Posted by Scratch View Post
    You know those rating systems are flawed. They don't take into account houses that have more than two television sets and other things of that nature.
    How does that skew the analysis? KSL has been in freefall for several years; that is why they pushed Bruce Lindsey into retirement. But they hired the wrong guy to replace him--McCann is just Bruce Lindsey 2.0, without the charm.
    Last edited by concerned; 03-04-2013 at 09:57 AM.
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  5. 03-04-2013, 09:59 AM #5
    Mormon Red Death
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    Quote Originally Posted by concerned View Post
    How does that skew the analysis? KSL has been in freefall for several years; that is why they pushed Bruce Lindsey into retirement. But they hired the wrong guy to replace him--McCann is just Bruce Lindsey 2.0, without the charm.
    he was quoting anchorman

    "Be a philosopher. A man can compromise to gain a point. It has become apparent that a man can, within limits, follow his inclinations within the arms of the Church if he does so discreetly." - The Walking Drum

    "And here’s what life comes down to—not how many years you live, but how many of those years are filled with bullshit that doesn’t amount to anything to satisfy the requirements of some dickhead you’ll never get the pleasure of punching in the face." – Adam Carolla
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  6. 03-04-2013, 10:06 AM #6
    concerned
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mormon Red Death View Post
    he was quoting anchorman


    My bad. Have never seen the movie. At least I wasn't ripping some sportswriter for claiming the Germans bombed Pearl Harbor, oblivious to the Animal House reference, as some editorial writer did late last year.
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  7. 03-04-2013, 10:08 AM #7
    chrisrenrut
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    I wonder how much the success of ksl.com has affected their viewership. I rarely watch any 10:00 pm news anymore, because I am staying updated throughout the day on ksl.com and other news sources.

    That said, i have been disappointed in a lot of stories and articles that KSL considers news these days. They are pretty darn fluffy.
    “To me there is no dishonor in being wrong and learning. There is dishonor in willful ignorance and there is dishonor in disrespect.” James Hatch, former Navy Seal and current Yale student.
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  8. 03-04-2013, 10:08 AM #8
    Mormon Red Death
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    Quote Originally Posted by concerned View Post
    My bad. Have never seen the movie. At least I wasn't ripping some sportswriter for claiming the Germans bombed Pearl Harbor, oblivious to the Animal House reference, as some editorial writer did late last year.
    admittedly the movie is 10+ years old so its a dated reference.
    "Be a philosopher. A man can compromise to gain a point. It has become apparent that a man can, within limits, follow his inclinations within the arms of the Church if he does so discreetly." - The Walking Drum

    "And here’s what life comes down to—not how many years you live, but how many of those years are filled with bullshit that doesn’t amount to anything to satisfy the requirements of some dickhead you’ll never get the pleasure of punching in the face." – Adam Carolla
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  9. 03-04-2013, 10:29 AM #9
    Scratch
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    Quote Originally Posted by concerned View Post
    How does that skew the analysis? KSL has been in freefall for several years; that is why they pushed Bruce Lindsey into retirement. But they hired the wrong guy to replace him--McCann is just Bruce Lindsey 2.0, without the charm.
    Sorry, it was a pretty obscure reference, but I love that movie and just couldn't resist.
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  10. 03-04-2013, 10:33 AM #10
    concerned
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    Quote Originally Posted by Scratch View Post
    Sorry, it was a pretty obscure reference, but I love that movie and just couldn't resist.
    Brilliant, actually. I fell for it hook line and sinker.
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  11. 03-04-2013, 10:36 AM #11
    UtahDan
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    Quote Originally Posted by chrisrenrut View Post
    I wonder how much the success of ksl.com has affected their viewership. I rarely watch any 10:00 pm news anymore, because I am staying updated throughout the day on ksl.com and other news sources.

    That said, i have been disappointed in a lot of stories and articles that KSL considers news these days. They are pretty darn fluffy.
    Values based in the phrase you are searching for. I never watch or listen to KSL so I'm curious, what have the changes looked like? When I saw the quote about "values based" I wondered whether that was just cover for "do it my way" or if it actually represented what the term seems to imply.
    Last edited by UtahDan; 03-04-2013 at 10:47 AM.
    “The world is so exquisite with so much love and moral depth, that there is no reason to deceive ourselves with pretty stories for which there's little good evidence. Far better it seems to me, in our vulnerability, is to look death in the eye and to be grateful every day for the brief but magnificent opportunity that life provides.”
    ― Carl Sagan
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  12. 03-04-2013, 10:45 AM #12
    Mano
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    The News in general sucks, pretty much across the board. When I watch the news, I want to hear about the News. I am sick to death of feel good stories, fluff pieces, spinning stories and editorializing masked as reporting. Deliver the damn news accurately and concisely. If you want other programming that does the other crap, fine, but during the programming labeled as "the News", that is all I want. Back in the day, broadcasting the News was thought of as a public service, letting the populous know what was happening in the world around them. Nowadays, it is about delivering ratings through sensationalising, spinning, politicising and reporting on selacious details about celebrities personal lives. Makes me sad.
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  13. 03-04-2013, 10:51 AM #13
    Clark Addison
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mano View Post
    The News in general sucks, pretty much across the board. When I watch the news, I want to hear about the News. I am sick to death of feel good stories, fluff pieces, spinning stories and editorializing masked as reporting. Deliver the damn news accurately and concisely. If you want other programming that does the other crap, fine, but during the programming labeled as "the News", that is all I want. Back in the day, broadcasting the News was thought of as a public service, letting the populous know what was happening in the world around them. Nowadays, it is about delivering ratings through sensationalising, spinning, politicising and reporting on selacious details about celebrities personal lives. Makes me sad.

    This is basically what I was thinking. I am not in Utah, so I have no idea what KSL's news looks like these days, but if it is so bad that is sucks a lot worse than all other local news, that is really saying something. I can't stand to watch local news, unless I am arrested or do something else newsworthy.
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  14. 03-04-2013, 11:28 AM #14
    macktruck32
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    Those stupid KSL commercials they show before the movies at the Megaplex Theatres in Utah aren't helping any. What a suckfest.
    Those shoes are definitely bi-curious.
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  15. 03-04-2013, 11:38 AM #15
    macktruck32
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mano View Post
    The News in general sucks, pretty much across the board. When I watch the news, I want to hear about the News. I am sick to death of feel good stories, fluff pieces, spinning stories and editorializing masked as reporting. Deliver the damn news accurately and concisely. If you want other programming that does the other crap, fine, but during the programming labeled as "the News", that is all I want. Back in the day, broadcasting the News was thought of as a public service, letting the populous know what was happening in the world around them. Nowadays, it is about delivering ratings through sensationalising, spinning, politicising and reporting on selacious details about celebrities personal lives. Makes me sad.
    My favorite on KSL is the "Tonight on Eyewitness News: 2nd cousin of woman who once dated a man that used to live in Utah was involved in [fill in recent major/minor national news story] [Recent BYU Communications Grad called up from NBC affiliate in Pocatello] reports".
    Those shoes are definitely bi-curious.
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  16. 03-04-2013, 12:03 PM #16
    norm
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    It's interesting to compare the Tribune article to this one. Does that mean the "values based" approach is working for the newspaper but not TV?
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  17. 03-04-2013, 12:15 PM #17
    UtahDan
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    Quote Originally Posted by norm View Post
    It's interesting to compare the Tribune article to this one. Does that mean the "values based" approach is working for the newspaper but not TV?
    Probably. My hunch is that there is probably an nice overlap between who still reads newsprint, the people who eat that stuff up and gray hair (no offense SU). They are probably making those identical people very happy with their TV strategy but TV viewership is vastly larger and they can't survive on the interest of that group alone.
    “The world is so exquisite with so much love and moral depth, that there is no reason to deceive ourselves with pretty stories for which there's little good evidence. Far better it seems to me, in our vulnerability, is to look death in the eye and to be grateful every day for the brief but magnificent opportunity that life provides.”
    ― Carl Sagan
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  18. 03-04-2013, 12:17 PM #18
    Scratch
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    As a minor tangent, I grew up thinking the local SLC news was ridiculous and worthless because of its focus on local human interest type stories. I always assumed that this was a function of Utah and/or smaller market provincialism, and that in the bigger markets local news would be more like real news. After graduation, I moved to Connecticut for law school and got the NYC affiliates. After law school, I moved to Orange County and got the LA affiliates. The local news on the NYC and LA stations are just as bad, if not worse, than what you get in Utah. I was shocked; it's all about human interest stuff, stuff that looks interesting on camera (high speed chases, fires, etc.), and stuff going on in the media (it seems like every promo for the local LA news involves an interview with a contestant on American Idol or the Bachelor).
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  19. 03-04-2013, 12:37 PM #19
    Applejack
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    Dick Nourse and Carole Mikita are rolling over in their as-yet-nonexistent graves.
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  20. 03-04-2013, 12:40 PM #20
    Randal Graves
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    Quote Originally Posted by chrisrenrut View Post
    I wonder how much the success of ksl.com has affected their viewership. I rarely watch any 10:00 pm news anymore, because I am staying updated throughout the day on ksl.com and other news sources.

    That said, i have been disappointed in a lot of stories and articles that KSL considers news these days. They are pretty darn fluffy.
    Most of the stories on ksl.com now are reprinted blog posts and gawker.com ripoffs. Ever since they fired most of their writers and replaced them with independent contractors submitting stories, it has sucked.
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  21. 03-04-2013, 01:09 PM #21
    Jeff Lebowski
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    I can't believe anyone wastes time watching traditional tv news anymore.
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  22. 03-04-2013, 01:17 PM #22
    wuapinmon
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jeff Lebowski View Post
    I can't believe anyone wastes time watching traditional tv news anymore.
    Only to see your kids on tv.
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  23. 03-04-2013, 01:25 PM #23
    SeattleUte
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    Mark Willes didn't do much better with the LA Times and Times Mirror. It was kind of like if Lone Peak had hired Jim Boylen after Utah fired him.
    One thing I have learned in a long life: that all our science, measured against reality, is primitive and childlike -- and yet it is the most precious thing we have.

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  24. 03-16-2013, 09:10 PM #24
    UteBeliever aka Port
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    Saturday Night Live airing on KSLTV. At 9 o'clock, no less...

    *edit* So, I watched. To see what they would air. This was an edited, hour-long version of last weeks episode. I guess they still air first on CW and then the next week on KSL? Anyway, I was actually very surprised at some of the things that made it past the KSL edit and aired in prime time.

    They had one of their "Fauxmercials" at the end called "Nuvabling." It was about a fake, bejeweled women's birth control device. It used the word vagina several times, heavy sexual innuendo and lots of eupehmisms.

    I guess "values" are negotiable if the bottom line is hemorraging red ink. Even for the Corporation of the POTC.
    Last edited by UteBeliever aka Port; 03-16-2013 at 10:21 PM.
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  25. 03-30-2013, 03:24 PM #25
    CardiacCoug
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    So KSL refuses to air The New Normal -- because it portrays gay characters.

    But they have no problem showing Hannibal, described as "unbelievably gory."

    http://www.sltrib.com/sltrib/enterta...unday.html.csp
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  26. 03-30-2013, 10:59 PM #26
    UteBeliever aka Port
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    Quote Originally Posted by CardiacCoug View Post
    So KSL refuses to air The New Normal -- because it portrays gay characters.

    But they have no problem showing Hannibal, described as "unbelievably gory."

    http://www.sltrib.com/sltrib/enterta...unday.html.csp
    It's very hard to know why KSL airs some things and not others.
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  27. 03-30-2013, 11:05 PM #27
    SoonerCoug
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    I think what is happening with KSL is a reflection of what could easily happen with the Church in general. It's the result of sticking to unworthy principles.
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  28. 04-29-2013, 09:21 PM #28
    CardiacCoug
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    Quote Originally Posted by CardiacCoug View Post
    So KSL refuses to air The New Normal -- because it portrays gay characters.

    But they have no problem showing Hannibal, described as "unbelievably gory."

    http://www.sltrib.com/sltrib/enterta...unday.html.csp
    Looks like Hannibal will no longer air on KSL now.
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  29. 07-31-2013, 07:53 AM #29
    Scorcho
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    hmmmm .... recently KSL announced that it will begin airing Saturday Night Live again after a long hiatus.

    http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/06/27/snl-returning-to-salt-lake-city_n_3512023.html
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  30. 07-31-2013, 08:28 AM #30
    Diehard Ute
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    Quote Originally Posted by Scorcho View Post
    hmmmm .... recently KSL announced that it will begin airing Saturday Night Live again after a long hiatus.

    http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/06/27/snl-returning-to-salt-lake-city_n_3512023.html
    As someone who can't stand KSL's stupidity I must be fair.

    KSL chose not to air SNL due to money, not content. Sportsbeat hammered SNL in the ratings here and drew more advertising revenue

    That's changed. KUTV is destroying Sportsbeat with Talkin Sports so KSL is bringing SNL in.

    Now their dealings with Hannibal, The Playboy Club and The New Normal are a different story
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