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Thread: The 2020 Conference Play Thread

  1. #31
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    We knew this team had some deficiencies coming into the year. But are they really that bad that we can't find a way to hide them and at least be remotely competitive? And our defense ... ugh.

    How this team beat BYU is a mystery. Yeah, it was Childs' first game back. But they played SDSU to a 6-point game without him. At full strength, they've blown out Nevada and Weber by 30-plus -- two teams we really weren't dominant at all in for large stretches.

  2. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by sancho View Post
    I think Brenchley or Plummer could do that. Or Gach (though he was awful last night). I think the problem offensively is that we have no way to get the ball inside. Allen/Gach can drive at times (and when they can, there is a night and day difference in our offense), but we have no post threats at all to keep a defense honest. Even if we had your 2-guard, I don't think we can get shots for him.

    We are now 2-4 in our 8 game murderer's row. Three of the losses were blowouts. Those three teams (SDSU, CU, and Zona) have something in common - they all have big men who can score. We have no interior defense at all. Zona killed us with three pointers last night, but it was inside out. They started by having Nnaji abuse Carlson in the post. Any team with a scoring big man is going to be licking their chops when they see Utah film. (The fourth loss came against a guard oriented team without much inside scoring, Oregon).

    It is disheartening that we never made a run in any of those three blowout losses.

    ASU has Romelo White averaging 11 pnts and 10 rebounds per game. I don't know how we deal with that tomorrow.
    I want the members of the crowd that insisted we wouldn't miss Jayce Johnson to stand up and be counted. Right now.

  3. #33
    Quote Originally Posted by SoCalPat View Post
    I want the members of the crowd that insisted we wouldn't miss Jayce Johnson to stand up and be counted. Right now.
    I'll stand up. I don't think I was jumping for joy when Jayce left, but I don't think we miss him that much.

    You seriously think Jayce would make a difference? As the only center listed for Marquette, he is averaging 12 minutes a game, 3 points, 5 rebounds, and .4 blocks. How is that any sort of significant improvement over the 17 minutes, 5 points, 3.5 rebounds, and .8 blocks per game, and Lahat at 2 points, 3 rebounds, and .5 blocks?
    Last edited by chrisrenrut; 01-17-2020 at 11:35 AM.
    “To me there is no dishonor in being wrong and learning. There is dishonor in willful ignorance and there is dishonor in disrespect.” James Hatch, former Navy Seal and current Yale student.

  4. #34
    Quote Originally Posted by chrisrenrut View Post
    I'll stand up. I don't think I was jumping for joy when Jayce left, but I don't think we miss him that much.

    You seriously think Jayce would make a difference? As the only center listed for Marquette, he is averaging 12 minutes a game, 3 points, 5 rebounds, and .4 blocks. How is that any sort of significant improvement over the 17 minutes, 5 points, 3.5 rebounds, and .8 blocks per game, and Lahat at 2 points, 3 rebounds, and .5 blocks?
    I guess he's not being used at Marquette (although 5 rebounds in 12 minutes is pretty good), but he was 7 ppg, 8 rpg for us last season in about 20 mpg. And, more importantly, he didn't get pushed around by guys like Nnaji. If we still had him, he'd be getting the most minutes at the 5.

    I like Carlson, Thione, and MVK, but I like their potential more than their ability. Carlson in particular seems capable of being a good offensive and defensive center.

  5. #35
    I really miss Jayce. I'd take his averages from last season right now. I'm really optimistic about Carlson - but he's a year away from putting up some numbers for us. My optimism that he'd make an impact early disippated quickly as we played the stronger teams. He'll get there but I wish we had Jayce as a bridge. I'll bet he may think the same thing. I sure wish this team - this staff - would recommit to defense. They should be staying in games better. I get one - maybe two - blowouts; but four games and counting where you're done at halftime is tough to see. We have the bodies to commit to defense. A few players have their shortcomings offensively but defense can come along quicker if coaching makes it a priority. It still mystifies me that defense is not the priority it once was. It seemed like the calling card for Larry the first few years. I certainly share the optimism for the next few years but I'd love it if this team could get a little tougher this season and finish at .500 or higher in league play.

  6. #36
    Quote Originally Posted by sancho View Post
    I think Brenchley or Plummer could do that. Or Gach (though he was awful last night). I think the problem offensively is that we have no way to get the ball inside. Allen/Gach can drive at times (and when they can, there is a night and day difference in our offense), but we have no post threats at all to keep a defense honest. Even if we had your 2-guard, I don't think we can get shots for him.

    We are now 2-4 in our 8 game murderer's row. Three of the losses were blowouts. Those three teams (SDSU, CU, and Zona) have something in common - they all have big men who can score. We have no interior defense at all. Zona killed us with three pointers last night, but it was inside out. They started by having Nnaji abuse Carlson in the post. Any team with a scoring big man is going to be licking their chops when they see Utah film. (The fourth loss came against a guard oriented team without much inside scoring, Oregon).

    It is disheartening that we never made a run in any of those three blowout losses.

    ASU has Romelo White averaging 11 pnts and 10 rebounds per game. I don't know how we deal with that tomorrow.
    I would be shocked if Plummer sees any meaningful minutes after not fouling against Oregon. My guess is that he will not be here next year.

  7. #37
    I'm not expecting many minutes out of him either, but I don't think that will be the reason. I don't think Larry would hold that against him for long.

  8. #38
    Quote Originally Posted by UTEopia View Post
    I would be shocked if Plummer sees any meaningful minutes after not fouling against Oregon. My guess is that he will not be here next year.
    I was clearly wrong.

  9. #39
    Quote Originally Posted by UTEopia View Post
    I was clearly wrong.
    I guess Larry liked that Plummer shot well in garbage time against Zona. It is nice to have someone who will pull the trigger.

    I'm bummed. I had very little hope going into the CU and Zona games, but I thought we had a chance tonight. We were awful. Watching Gach was painful. Unlike the last two losses, we didn't give up. We played hard all game, and we still got whooped. And by a bad team.

    This might be the first time Larry's team doesn't exceed expectations.

    Hurley is an embarrassment to Duke basketball.

  10. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by Utebiquitous View Post
    I really miss Jayce. I'd take his averages from last season right now. I'm really optimistic about Carlson - but he's a year away from putting up some numbers for us. My optimism that he'd make an impact early disippated quickly as we played the stronger teams. He'll get there but I wish we had Jayce as a bridge. I'll bet he may think the same thing. I sure wish this team - this staff - would recommit to defense. They should be staying in games better. I get one - maybe two - blowouts; but four games and counting where you're done at halftime is tough to see. We have the bodies to commit to defense. A few players have their shortcomings offensively but defense can come along quicker if coaching makes it a priority. It still mystifies me that defense is not the priority it once was. It seemed like the calling card for Larry the first few years. I certainly share the optimism for the next few years but I'd love it if this team could get a little tougher this season and finish at .500 or higher in league play.
    We're not finishing .500 in league play. Wazzu blowing our doors off next week ain't out of the question.

    Agreed on your sentiments on defense. It's a near 180 from Larry's first 4 years.

  11. #41
    If we didn't know better, we'd have a lot of reason to be optimistic for the future and regard this team as a foundation and enjoy the ride. This team is not unlike 1993-94 (I think), Van Horn's freshman year. That team finished .500 and lost to BYU by 40 in the Wac tournament, the day that Van Horn learned his father had died. In retrospect, that game was the beginning of the end for Roger Reid. But I will believe that this coach can keep this team together and move it forward when I see it. So I feel only despair about this program. Actually, not despair, more apathy. I have a rule that I don't let my teams' problems become my own. I'm happy to share in the wins and the good times.
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  12. #42
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    the game this Thursday will be interesting. I've watched UW a little bit. At times they look like they could be a sweet 16 team, and then other times they look horrible. They're incredibly long and athletic and that zone limits three pointers. Their freshman center should be a top 5 lottery pick next year. He'll dominate us. The rest of their team looks a little lost since they lost their starting guard (Quade). I don't know who are best mid range shooter/passer is, but he'll have to play right around the foul line and knock down some easy jumpers for Utah to have a shot.

  13. #43
    Quote Originally Posted by Scorcho View Post
    the game this Thursday will be interesting. I've watched UW a little bit. At times they look like they could be a sweet 16 team, and then other times they look horrible. They're incredibly long and athletic and that zone limits three pointers. Their freshman center should be a top 5 lottery pick next year. He'll dominate us. The rest of their team looks a little lost since they lost their starting guard (Quade). I don't know who are best mid range shooter/passer is, but he'll have to play right around the foul line and knock down some easy jumpers for Utah to have a shot.
    This is a bad match up for us. Allen will have a hard time against their length, and we don't have anyone who can stop Isaiah Stewart. He's averaging 18/9 with 2 bpg.

  14. #44
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    Quote Originally Posted by SeattleUte View Post
    If we didn't know better, we'd have a lot of reason to be optimistic for the future and regard this team as a foundation and enjoy the ride. This team is not unlike 1993-94 (I think), Van Horn's freshman year. That team finished .500 and lost to BYU by 40 in the Wac tournament, the day that Van Horn learned his father had died. In retrospect, that game was the beginning of the end for Roger Reid. But I will believe that this coach can keep this team together and move it forward when I see it. So I feel only despair about this program. Actually, not despair, more apathy. I have a rule that I don't let my teams' problems become my own. I'm happy to share in the wins and the good times.
    The 1993-94 team lost seven games by 3 points or less, and didn't lose by 20-plus to anyone until the aforementioned BYU game -- its largest MOD was 16 points, at Hawaii (which won the WAC Tournament that year). I'll go ahead and say this year's team is trending nowhere near to the 1993-94 team.

    Also, your timeline on KVH is off -- he missed a game earlier that year because of his pops' death, but it didn't happen around the BYU game. It was several weeks prior.

  15. #45
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    Quote Originally Posted by sancho View Post
    This is a bad match up for us. Allen will have a hard time against their length, and we don't have anyone who can stop Isaiah Stewart. He's averaging 18/9 with 2 bpg.
    Yep. Our two lowest-scoring games last year came against Washington (98 total points). A team like Utah is the perfect pick-me-up for a team like UW, whose individual parts are probably greater than their sum right now. I'd be thrilled if we kept the MOD under 10 points.

  16. #46
    It'd be nice if the hat could catch the ball
    "Be a philosopher. A man can compromise to gain a point. It has become apparent that a man can, within limits, follow his inclinations within the arms of the Church if he does so discreetly." - The Walking Drum

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  17. #47
    Allen Needs to make a 10 footer
    "Be a philosopher. A man can compromise to gain a point. It has become apparent that a man can, within limits, follow his inclinations within the arms of the Church if he does so discreetly." - The Walking Drum

    "And here’s what life comes down to—not how many years you live, but how many of those years are filled with bullshit that doesn’t amount to anything to satisfy the requirements of some dickhead you’ll never get the pleasure of punching in the face." – Adam Carolla

  18. #48
    Quote Originally Posted by Mormon Red Death View Post
    Allen Needs to make a 10 footer
    Why not take the unguarded shot one step in from the free throw line??
    "Be a philosopher. A man can compromise to gain a point. It has become apparent that a man can, within limits, follow his inclinations within the arms of the Church if he does so discreetly." - The Walking Drum

    "And here’s what life comes down to—not how many years you live, but how many of those years are filled with bullshit that doesn’t amount to anything to satisfy the requirements of some dickhead you’ll never get the pleasure of punching in the face." – Adam Carolla

  19. #49
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mormon Red Death View Post
    Why not take the unguarded shot one step in from the free throw line??
    Rylan Gach and Allen were awful tonight

  20. #50
    Well how about that?
    "Be a philosopher. A man can compromise to gain a point. It has become apparent that a man can, within limits, follow his inclinations within the arms of the Church if he does so discreetly." - The Walking Drum

    "And here’s what life comes down to—not how many years you live, but how many of those years are filled with bullshit that doesn’t amount to anything to satisfy the requirements of some dickhead you’ll never get the pleasure of punching in the face." – Adam Carolla

  21. #51
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mormon Red Death View Post
    Well how about that?
    What I meant to say is Rylan is having a great game

  22. #52
    We rebounded offensively the best we have in probably 3 years

    Sent from my ONEPLUS A6013 using Tapatalk
    "Be a philosopher. A man can compromise to gain a point. It has become apparent that a man can, within limits, follow his inclinations within the arms of the Church if he does so discreetly." - The Walking Drum

    "And here’s what life comes down to—not how many years you live, but how many of those years are filled with bullshit that doesn’t amount to anything to satisfy the requirements of some dickhead you’ll never get the pleasure of punching in the face." – Adam Carolla

  23. #53
    I was shocked how soft UW's bigs are. Must be that fancy pants zone that takes the man out of them.

    Battin MVP. Rylan MVP of the last 5 minutes.

    Awful shooting. Awful FTs until the end. Great fight. Never gave up. Some great passing too. Carlson was great in the first half - I think his best game as a Ute.

    So we end our 8 game murderer's row with a 3-5 record. I said 3-5 would be enough for me to keep hoping, so I'm still hoping. Go Utes!

  24. #54
    Fantastic game to attend in a really ugly sort of way. The Utes shooting was ugly and the officiating was ugly for a good part of the game. Somehow, the boys hung around and just kept competing. They defended the middle/paint well, got their hands on a lot of balls, really fought for rebounds and somehow did enough offensively to hang around. Jones' impact on this team is enormous. Even though his shot was awful tonight, he is so good in the half court handling the ball. While I wanted him to be a little more aggressive throughout the game (like he was late) and it was frustrating to watch them pass up the easy 10-12 footer so much, Jones really kept his composure and, as a result, kept the team composed. He was similar in the Oregon game.

    Anyway, lots to work on but a good win. I can't imagine beating WSU if they shoot anywhere near as bad. If they get that one my hopes for .500 may not be far off.

  25. #55
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    Quote Originally Posted by Utebiquitous View Post
    Fantastic game to attend in a really ugly sort of way. The Utes shooting was ugly and the officiating was ugly for a good part of the game. Somehow, the boys hung around and just kept competing. They defended the middle/paint well, got their hands on a lot of balls, really fought for rebounds and somehow did enough offensively to hang around. Jones' impact on this team is enormous. Even though his shot was awful tonight, he is so good in the half court handling the ball. While I wanted him to be a little more aggressive throughout the game (like he was late) and it was frustrating to watch them pass up the easy 10-12 footer so much, Jones really kept his composure and, as a result, kept the team composed. He was similar in the Oregon game.

    Anyway, lots to work on but a good win. I can't imagine beating WSU if they shoot anywhere near as bad. If they get that one my hopes for .500 may not be far off.
    I am still surprised that the refs called that last charge on UW. It felt like that type of contact had been called a block (both ways) all night.

    The head-smack flagrant turned the game.
    7 straight FTs without UW getting the ball.
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  26. #56
    Quote Originally Posted by Solon View Post
    I am still surprised that the refs called that last charge on UW. It felt like that type of contact had been called a block (both ways) all night.

    The head-smack flagrant turned the game.
    7 straight FTs without UW getting the ball.
    McDaniels really cost them the game--the stupid flagrant and then a few seconds later fouling Jones on the 3. Both completely unnecessary. Thy had a total loss of composure.

    On the postgame, Larry said he used a coach's challenge to ask them to look at the flagrant foul. Was told he would lose a timeout if he lost the challenge. He said the risk was worth it. Could be the smartest end of game decision Larry has ever made. Kudos on that.

    When Jatunen got called for the block where he was set for half an hour, his left foot was partly inside the circle. Maybe that was the difference.
    Last edited by concerned; 01-24-2020 at 09:15 AM.

  27. #57
    Quote Originally Posted by concerned View Post
    McDaniels really cost them the game--the stupid flagrant and then a few seconds later fouling Jones on the 3. Both completely unnecessary. Thy had a total loss of composure.
    Yeah, they completely fell apart. The foul on a three was bad, but even worse was the later foul on Jones outside the three point line when Jones wasn't even shooting. That was two free points on a possession that was likely going nowhere. I wonder if Hopkins is getting blasted for his late game management on UW message boards.

  28. #58
    Quote Originally Posted by concerned View Post
    McDaniels really cost them the game--the stupid flagrant and then a few seconds later fouling Jones on the 3. Both completely unnecessary. Thy had a total loss of composure.

    On the postgame, Larry said he used a coach's challenge to ask them to look at the flagrant foul. Was told he would lose a timeout if he lost the challenge. He said the risk was worth it. Could be the smartest end of game decision Larry has ever made. Kudos on that.

    When Jatunen got called for the block where he was set for half an hour, his left foot was partly inside the circle. Maybe that was the difference.
    had that Januten play been reviewable it would have been a charge because he lifted up his left heel and was thus outside of the zone.
    "Be a philosopher. A man can compromise to gain a point. It has become apparent that a man can, within limits, follow his inclinations within the arms of the Church if he does so discreetly." - The Walking Drum

    "And here’s what life comes down to—not how many years you live, but how many of those years are filled with bullshit that doesn’t amount to anything to satisfy the requirements of some dickhead you’ll never get the pleasure of punching in the face." – Adam Carolla

  29. #59
    If we can get Carlson to play like he did in the first half last night, we will not have any more 20+ point blowout losses. I'm so optimistic on this guy. He needs muscle and moves, but he has the tools.

    We need someone to perform a basketball exorcism on Both Gach. I hoped his dunk last night might wake him up, but I don't think it did. Something is wrong with his game, and we need him back.

  30. #60
    Quote Originally Posted by SoCalPat View Post
    We're not finishing .500 in league play. Wazzu blowing our doors off next week ain't out of the question.

    Agreed on your sentiments on defense. It's a near 180 from Larry's first 4 years.
    Both games they played great defense
    "Be a philosopher. A man can compromise to gain a point. It has become apparent that a man can, within limits, follow his inclinations within the arms of the Church if he does so discreetly." - The Walking Drum

    "And here’s what life comes down to—not how many years you live, but how many of those years are filled with bullshit that doesn’t amount to anything to satisfy the requirements of some dickhead you’ll never get the pleasure of punching in the face." – Adam Carolla

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