I taught in Church today

[Sullyute]

We have a place to share what we learned in church, so we probably need a place to share what we taught or spoke on in church. So here we go...


I have the opportunity of teaching Elders Quorum every couple of months. I try to mix things up a bit to talk about Church related topics but with a different spin. I have talked about Mormonism in the Media (during the election), and Mormon Doctrine vs. Mormon culture. This week my focus was on a small section of the handbook of instruction:

"Parents have the primary responsibility for the sex education of their children."

I also quoted from the Church's A Parent's Guide about child development.

We have a very diverse group with never married older guys, divorced, recently married, married with young kids, married with teenagers, empty nesters, and young elders getting ready for missions.

I asked how many received the birds and bees talk when they were teenagers and less than half had. We then discussed why that was and how it can be embarrassing for the kids and parents to discuss it.

It got a bit heated when I quoted the teen pregnancy rate for Utah and then asked if it is ok to teach kids abstinence, abstinence, abstinence... but just in case here is a condom for your wallet? A couple older guys said no that the prophet has never taught that so we shouldn't either but a couple younger elders thought that it was a good idea to do that as some LDS kids are still having sex despite being taught differently and they need to protect against disease and pregnancy. I had to finally end all the comments because we ran out of time. I ended by stating no matter how you as a parent feel about the subject we should follow the Church's advice and be the ones to teach our children about it.

I had several people come talk to me afterwards about the subject. One older guy told me that he had to bite his tongue on a couple occasion to keep himself from laughing. He said that he grew up on a farm and his little sister was artificially inseminating cows at age 12 so he found it funny that city kids and their parents were so reluctant to talk about such things.

Lastly, since we hold our class in the chapel I would suspect that it was the first time that the words p_nis, v_gina, and chl_mydia were uttered there, but then again teenage boys prepare the sacrament so I am probably way off on that one.

[Rocker Ute]

Wondering what teen pregnancy rate you referenced? There was a discussion on UF.N the other day, and Utah teen pregnancy rate is #42 in the nation (meaning one of the lowest).

BTW, I think you can teach kids about your values and also about safe sex without handing them a condom for the wallet, they aren't notions that have to be mutually exclusive.

This is how I plan to teach my kids about the subject:

Fuzzy Bunny's Guide to You-Know-What

[Sullyute]

Wondering what teen pregnancy rate you referenced? There was a discussion on UF.N the other day, and Utah teen pregnancy rate is #42 in the nation (meaning one of the lowest).

BTW, I think you can teach kids about your values and also about safe sex without handing them a condom for the wallet, they aren't notions that have to be mutually exclusive.

This is how I plan to teach my kids about the subject:

Fuzzy Bunny's Guide to You-Know-What

I used the numbers from the Federal Health and Human Services site here. It is for 2010 and has Utah at 37 out of 51 states and D.C. This shows total teen pregnacies but of those only 76% were out of wedlock (who know how many were shotgun weddings). So a strict unwed teen pregnancy rate would make Utah look much better.

I agree that there are many difference ways to teach teenagers about age appropriate intimacy and the potential consquences that can follow. I didn't advocate one way or the other. My goal was to simply get our quorum thinking and talking about an important subject that many find taboo.

[Rocker Ute]

I used the numbers from the Federal Health and Human Services site here. It is for 2010 and has Utah at 37 out of 51 states and D.C. This shows total teen pregnacies but of those only 76% were out of wedlock (who know how many were shotgun weddings). So a strict unwed teen pregnancy rate would make Utah look much better.

I agree that there are many difference ways to teach teenagers about age appropriate intimacy and the potential consquences that can follow. I didn't advocate one way or the other. My goal was to simply get our quorum thinking and talking about an important subject that many find taboo.

I got that sense from you about wanting to spark conversation, I was just adding my 2 cents. One day I'll share the 'maturation' talk I had with my dad, it was equally uncomfortable for both of us, and now a cherished memory, ironically. He probably has no idea that I've chuckled about it these years later, maybe he has too. I can't wait to scar my children in similar fashion.

[Scorcho]

I've always been under the impression that a good percentage (20%) of married LDS adults have never used birth control (maybe I'm wrong in that assumption). To that orthodox group, a single LDS Teen or Adult carrying a condom would clearly be controversial. You are braver than I am, I don't think our EQ could handle that topic. Minds would be blown.

On the other hand, we all know LDS teens and adults who've had children out of wedlock. While heart-breaking and tragic in the short term, in many of those cases, those new fathers and mothers excel in life and the gospel long term. Things have a way of working out and it almost seems like it was part of their individual plan, and a poor choice ends up being a life-long beneficial turning point.

[Scorcho]

Just a guess/feeling, but I would think that 20% is an order of magnitude high.

fair enough, it was just a guess.

speaking of what I taught in church, we are discussing prophets and revelation in Sunday School, I mentioned the Holy of Holies in the Salt Lake Temple and none of my 14 year old class had ever heard of that room before? I was surprised these are bright kids that know the gospel pretty well. It seems like there a number of gospel subjects that were referred to 25 years ago that we don't reference any longer. Holy of Holies, and calling and election made sure are just a couple of those?

[LA Ute]

I taught that the news story about the young woman who joined the church after seeing the Book of Mormon musical was awesome.

(I didn't teach this part, but I also think it's awesome that she is moving to Utah to finish college school at the University of Utah. She is a theater and performing arts major.)

[San Diego Ute Fan]

I taught (yesterday) from President Uchtdorf's "Four Titles" talk. It was my unashamed appeal for better home teaching.

I figure if anything can move the needle, it is the popular German pilot (and Ute Football fan).

[mUUser]

...asked if it is ok to teach kids abstinence, abstinence, abstinence... but just in case here is a condom for your wallet?....

We've taught abstinence as well, and my oldest daughter heads off to college next fall. I've invited her to get birth control if she'd like. In my mind there's no sense in compounding poor judgment at the moment, with a child that she won't be able to support. When the boy heads off to college I'll be sure he has access to a condom or three.

[LA Ute]

I taught our high priests group yesterday. It was Chapter 8 in the Joseph Fielding Smith book, The Church and Kingdom of God. Suffice it to say that very few people posting in this thread so far would have enjoyed the lesson. But it was a fun discussion from a believer's point of view. (Hint: the Poelman talk didn't come up.)

[UBlender]

I taught our high priests group yesterday. It was Chapter 8 in the Joseph Fielding Smith book, The Church and Kingdom of God. Suffice it to say that very few people posting in this thread so far would have enjoyed the lesson. But it was a fun discussion from a believer's point of view. (Hint: the Poelman talk didn't come up.)

Taught that one in EQ last week....and also thought a lot about some of the discussion on this thread/board in my preparation.

[LA Ute]

Taught that one in EQ last week....and also thought a lot about some of the discussion on this thread/board in my preparation.

I did too. I may seem to be making light of the concerns expressed here -- I'm not. It's just that a lesson about that subject, taught to a room full of believers by a believe, is a different type of discussion than we tend to have here.

[DrumNFeather]

So, in two weeks I'm teaching on the most recent conference talk on Joseph Smith. I'm trying to decide what kind of approach I want to take to this lesson in general. I try to keep my lessons light on the fluff and try to be very real and realistic about the subject matter. For this particular topic, I'll be channeling Bushman quite a bit, but I also want to give people an idea of the world and circumstances that he was born into and lived in. My plan for this is to dive a little into the circumstances.

The question then becomes about Joseph and what should be covered there and how much is too much to share/discuss in a church setting where some might not know some of the more controversial information regarding him.

I'd love to hear some feedback/suggestions on the best approach here.

[DrumNFeather]

I'm not sure why anything controversial needs to be included in a church lesson. Is it to challenge members of the class? Stir up discussion? To appear well read? Prepare people for attacks that they might hear?

With Joseph Smith, there's so much good stuff to talk about and only 30 minutes. I'd make sure there's a really good reason before brining in anything extraneous. If you start with what you want the class to get out of the lesson, it will be easier to decide what is in and what is out.

Yeah, I think that is a fair point, and one that I agree with. Sometimes I get in the habit (not for apperances) to just throw comments out there off-hand that aren't intended to be inflamatory, but end up being that way. I really don't like to troll my ward, because fundamentally I disagree with that approach in a church setting.

[LA Ute]

I'm not sure why anything controversial needs to be included in a church lesson. Is it to challenge members of the class? Stir up discussion? To appear well read? Prepare people for attacks that they might hear?

With Joseph Smith, there's so much good stuff to talk about and only 30 minutes. I'd make sure there's a really good reason before brining in anything extraneous. If you start with what you want the class to get out of the lesson, it will be easier to decide what is in and what is out.

^^^^^^^^^^
Yes.

[LA Ute]

We are certainly hearing a lot about pornography these days. That really bothers some people, but whatever you think of the message it is significant that we are hearing so much about it.

[Dwight Schr-Ute]

I would say that Oaks' talk in priesthood addressing the Ordain Women was one of the more direct talks given in some time.

I'm also teaching on Sunday. I got Epder Ballard's talk titled "Following Up." Such a boring talk.


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[DrumNFeather]

I taught my daughter's sunbeam class today, what a hoot those kids are.

[DrumNFeather]

Based on something Wally posted over on CS, I dug up BKP's "The Candle of The Lord" from 1982 and taught on that in EQ on Sunday. I very much enjoyed getting to read the talk and work through it in my lesson. We spent about 10 minutes alone discussing the concept of whether or not religion is a crutch and whether or not it is ok to use religion as a crutch.

All in all, it was a very enjoyable experience...it was nice to be able to teach Packer without it being any of his more controversial content of the past several years.

Thanks Wally!

[UtahsMrSports]

My lesson in the Teacher's quorum was about how adversity can make us stronger. As the basis of my lesson, I used the 1980 US Olympic Men's Hockey Team. In comparing the US-Soviet battle, I mentioned that the upset was on par with UVU beating Duke in basketball. One of the boys in the class then added........"or Like BYU beating Utah at anything!" I had to stop the lesson, walk over to him, and give him a fist bump. Best comment ive ever had in a lesson.

[NorthwestUteFan]

It's funny, but that is the story of the 'Rivalry' over the course of their lives (since 2000-2002). In a couple of more years, when those kids start college, they will certainly wonder what all the fuss is about.

[Dwight Schr-Ute]

Activity tools for today's primary lesson on Samuel the Lamanite. Take home message: the Nephites just needed more practice.



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[Brian]

Activity tools for today's primary lesson on Samuel the Lamanite. Take home message: the Nephites just needed more practice.



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Nice!
Primary is the best.

[Brian]

A couple of weeks ago I got two new callings.
1. Teach sharing time in Primary once a month. SCORE!!!!
2. Teach GD every other week.

Here's the first draft of my outline for lesson 33, 'a firm foundation' Hel 1-5
Suggestions, comments and ideas are always appreciated.


I like to write on the board an outline of the material to be covered, but then spend the lesson talking about 2 or 3 themes.
Outline:

• 1:1-13: Conflict over judgment seat, beginning of Gadianton Robbers
• 1:14-34: Initial victory by Lamanites and their eventual defeat at a high cost
• 2: Detailed account and commentary regarding the beginning of the Gadianton Robbers
• 3:1-17 Nephite migrations northward, Mormon’s commentary on number of Nephite records
• 3:18-37 Mormon’s commentary on righteous leaders and pride of the people
• 4:1-10 Gains and losses by Lamanites
• 4:11-26 Mormon’s commentary on the decline of the Nephites
• 5:1-4, 14-52: Miraculous ministry of Nephi and Lehi
• 5:5-13: Lessons from Helaman

Theme 1: War and Peace
Hel 4:8. Lamanites (and dissenting Nephites) take all of southern lands.
Hel 4:9-10: Moronihah wins half back through wars.
Why did all this happen?
Hel 4:11 Wickedness and abominations (which are defined in vs 12)

• Pride. (Source of them all)
• Treatment of the poor (first one listed!) Plug for the muslim refugee meeting on 9/9
• Spirituality
• Murder, stealing, lying, infidelity

Is the order of this list relevant?

War doesn’t fully work.
Hel 4:15-16 Preached to the Nephites, repented, continued battle regained ½ of the lands.
Hel 4:18-19 No more. Spent energies on maintaining the status quo.

But something else does work.
Hel 5:45-52
Hel 5:52. Lamanites gave all the land back. Why?
Hel 5:51 Gave up their hatred and weapons. Why?
Hel 5:50 The evidence had convinced them. Why?
Hel 5:45 Nephi and Lehi gave up the seats and taught them, and it changed them.
When people learn to lay down their hate, they lay down their weapons.
What changed them? Evidence convinced them. What evidence?

• Leaders taking time to minister to other people, people who hated them.

War is sometimes required, but let’s not forget the power of love.


Theme 2: Lessons from the Gadianton Robbers
​Movies about things not being what they appear

• Fight Club, Shutter Island, Planet of the Apes, Psycho
• Why do we not see reality? How is reality hidden from us?
  
  • Need some examples….

Helaman is a pretty dark book. It’s the beginning of the end.
The people sin, there are wars, they lose their land, and struggle to regain and maintain ½ of it.
What is the natural human tendency? Natural man. And it's hard to be un-natural.

Hel 2:8 Purpose of Gadianton was get power, by any means necessary (sounds like base human nature)
What if we could be natural, and sin and plunder and murder, but not suffer the consequences?

Or more subtle: What if:

• We could pretend that everything was ok?
• We pretend that our life was a Pinterest page?
• Or that facebook was accurate portrayal of reality?
• That our children were perfect?
• That we didn’t have any problems?
• That we have no doubts?
• That all was well in Zion?
• Or we believe all the pretending people around us?

How different is this from what Gadianton was trying to do?

• Hel 6:22-24. Elaborate system of agreements and oaths so that none of the “dirt” would be made public.

Do we have an internal system to maintain this appearance?
Are there systems in place around us? (families, work, ward, church, etc)?

Hemingway: “We are all broken. That’s how the light gets in”

[DrumNFeather]

I nearly got through my entire GD lesson yesterday without an election comment, but someone finally mentioned the protests, I pivoted away from that as quickly as I could.

[UtahsMrSports]

I nearly got through my entire GD lesson yesterday without an election comment, but someone finally mentioned the protests, I pivoted away from that as quickly as I could.

Hahahaha! Im glad you were able to get out of it.

Every ward seems to have at least one of those folks who assume that everyone else shares their political views and bringing politics into a sunday school lesson is just the same as if you used Noah or Alma the Younger in a comment.

Ill never forget one guy just going off one time about the liberals and how they wanted to 'kill off all the old people'. He was almost in tears he was so upset. Thankfully, the teacher was able to make him feel important and appreciated and at the same time say that rant was the end of the political discussion for that day and it was time to move on.

[Dwight Schr-Ute]

I've been asked to speak in Sacrament meeting a week from tomorrow. My "topic" is "The Righteous Judge" talk by Elder Robbins from last conference. As of now, I think my focus is going to be with the "Visitors Welcome" sign in front of every LDS chapel and if we implement that invitation in our own lives. Do we use judgement to advocate for people or ostracize them. I'd like to spend some time on the refugee movement. Now building a collection of interesting examples and anecdotes. Feel free to contribute.


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[chrisrenrut]

I've been asked to speak in Sacrament meeting a week from tomorrow. My "topic" is "The Righteous Judge" talk by Elder Robbins from last conference. As of now, I think my focus is going to be with the "Visitors Welcome" sign in front of every LDS chapel and if we implement that invitation in our own lives. Do we use judgement to advocate for people or ostracize them. I'd like to spend some time on the refugee movement. Now building a collection of interesting examples and anecdotes. Feel free to contribute.


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My wife and I had a brief conversation about judgement today. I doubt any of it will be helpful, but it has been bouncing around in my head today, so writing it out feels a bit cathartic.

We were reading about the shooter in the Ft Lauderdale airport, including his background and apparent battles with mental illness. She asked, "can he ever be forgiven for what he has done"?

We discussed that when we see something happen (or a person), we have a limited perspective. The amount of information we don't have far outweighs the information we do have. But that doesn't stop us from making an initial judgement. For instance, she texted me about the shooting when it first hit the news, and my first question was, do they think it was a terrorist, or someone with mental illness? My experience tells me that it is likely one of those two things. Others from different perspectives may have had different thoughts on the cause or motive.

My wife had a brother who committed suicide a few years back due to depression. I mentioned to her that if she felt that he could be forgiven for taking his own life due to mental illness issues, then wouldn't that apply to this shooter as well? It's not an apples to apples comparison, but it is similar in that in both cases, we assume the person was not fully in control of their decision making or actions. But her emotions differ between her brother and this mass killer, so it was difficult for her to see the similarity.

I guess we are all guilty of judging others in similar ways as well. We see their appearance, or hear of something they said or did, and ascribe the quality of person they are based on what little we see or know about them. Our emotions about the situation can magnify the judgement as well (if we feel threatened, injury, flattered, superior, etc.). I think it is natural to do this. It takes a higher level of emotional and intellectual control to reserve judgement until more information is available.

I like the quote in SeattleUte's signature- "Be kind to all, for everyone you meet is fighting a great battle". We can't see the battles that most people are fighting, we usually only see the scars they have incurred.

[Utebiquitous]

Chrisrenrut and Dwight,
Chrisrenrut's post on judgement brought to mind a description Dostoevsky writes in "The Brothers Karamazov" of Alyosha. He writes, "...throughout his life he seemed to believe in people and trust them, and yet no one ever thought him simple-minded or naive. There was something in him that made people realize that he refused to sit in judgement on others, that he felt he had no right to, and that, whatever happened, he would never condemn anyone. He gave the impression that he could witness anything without feeling in the least outraged, although he might be deeply saddened.

That struck me. I find myself aspiring to that kind of description - refraining from judgement, seeking understanding, practicing empathy and love for all.

[Dwight Schr-Ute]

My wife and I had a brief conversation about judgement today. I doubt any of it will be helpful, but it has been bouncing around in my head today, so writing it out feels a bit cathartic.

We were reading about the shooter in the Ft Lauderdale airport, including his background and apparent battles with mental illness. She asked, "can he ever be forgiven for what he has done"?

We discussed that when we see something happen (or a person), we have a limited perspective. The amount of information we don't have far outweighs the information we do have. But that doesn't stop us from making an initial judgement. For instance, she texted me about the shooting when it first hit the news, and my first question was, do they think it was a terrorist, or someone with mental illness? My experience tells me that it is likely one of those two things. Others from different perspectives may have had different thoughts on the cause or motive.

My wife had a brother who committed suicide a few years back due to depression. I mentioned to her that if she felt that he could be forgiven for taking his own life due to mental illness issues, then wouldn't that apply to this shooter as well? It's not an apples to apples comparison, but it is similar in that in both cases, we assume the person was not fully in control of their decision making or actions. But her emotions differ between her brother and this mass killer, so it was difficult for her to see the similarity.

I guess we are all guilty of judging others in similar ways as well. We see their appearance, or hear of something they said or did, and ascribe the quality of person they are based on what little we see or know about them. Our emotions about the situation can magnify the judgement as well (if we feel threatened, injury, flattered, superior, etc.). I think it is natural to do this. It takes a higher level of emotional and intellectual control to reserve judgement until more information is available.

I like the quote in SeattleUte's signature- "Be kind to all, for everyone you meet is fighting a great battle". We can't see the battles that most people are fighting, we usually only see the scars they have incurred.

Chrisrenrut and Dwight,
Chrisrenrut's post on judgement brought to mind a description Dostoevsky writes in "The Brothers Karamazov" of Alyosha. He writes, "...throughout his life he seemed to believe in people and trust them, and yet no one ever thought him simple-minded or naive. There was something in him that made people realize that he refused to sit in judgement on others, that he felt he had no right to, and that, whatever happened, he would never condemn anyone. He gave the impression that he could witness anything without feeling in the least outraged, although he might be deeply saddened.

That struck me. I find myself aspiring to that kind of description - refraining from judgement, seeking understanding, practicing empathy and love for all.

I listened to a fascinating podcast last week. The podcast starts with a daughter interviewing her mother. 20 years after a traumatic event in the mother's life. One evening, 20 years ago, this woman was assaulting in her back yard by a man. She was taking into her home, raped repeatedly, held against her will, and eventually forced to go to several ATMs and withdraw much of her savings and robbed. The whole ordeal lasted 5 hours. This man was eventually arrested. Turns out this attacker had previously been convicted of being involved in a murder and served 20 years in a Pennsylvania prison before his sentence was commuted and he was released. In the 92 days he wasn't in prison, he managed the aforementioned attack, as well as two additional and similar attacks in which the women were both murdered.

In the hour long podcast, the daughter spends 2 1/2 years trying to come to terms with all of the details involved. It addresses the decision to commute the original life sentence, it addresses the political careers that were destroyed and launched (Tom Ridge) due to this decision to commute, this daughter's decision to be involved in a special session to address crime which made future commutes nearly impossible, and now her decision and struggle to forgive.

This story was originally posted to transom.org but it was really nicely packaged together on This American Life. It's not Sacrament talk friendly, but a fascinating picture of many consequences, intended and unintended, of passing judgement. I highly recommend taking a listen.

https://www.thisamericanlife.org/rad...20-years-later