Page 2 of 2 FirstFirst 12
Results 31 to 57 of 57

Thread: Happy for Jim Boylen?

  1. #31
    Quote Originally Posted by LA Ute View Post
    Maybe Red should have said "Macbeth."
    HA! Red wouldn't know Macbeth if it grew in his armpit like a skin tag.

  2. #32
    Quote Originally Posted by Senioritis View Post
    HA! Red wouldn't know Macbeth if it grew in his armpit like a skin tag.
    Which it could.

  3. #33
    Geez. Well said. It's depressing, but dead on. (Nevill, not Macbeth skin tag.)

  4. #34
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Location
    Twin Falls, Idaho
    Posts
    3,405
    Quote Originally Posted by FountainOfUte View Post
    I think this comes from an underlying assumption among Ute fans that we will never be able to recruit enough of the right players to succeed with the "wrong way." At least in my experience watching the Utes for the last 25 years, I think that's probably a correct assumption; we'll always be more Princeton than Showtime. So when Ute fans bellyache about the right and wrong way to play, I think we're just going by the only thing we've seen be successful in our lifetime on the Hill. If LK or some future coach is able to recruit, play, and win like Tarkanian, I think you'd be surprised at how little comlaining there'd be. I'm not holding my breath. Even UNLV hasn't been able to get back to UNLV ball.
    In terms of offensive tempo, BYU today is a lot closer to the Tarkanian/UNLV teams than people give them credit for and their roster is pasty white.

  5. #35
    Quote Originally Posted by SoCalPat View Post
    We're almost as bad as BYU fans when it comes to football and styles. Not pointing fingers here, but we have too many armchair whistleblowers who insist there is a "right" way to play basketball (if the groans were really audible at ESA over how WSU played, then my point is cemented). Me, I'm from the Auerbach school of thought, which says, "There are only two great plays: South Pacific and putting the ball in the basket."

    I'd be thrilled if we played (and won) like a Butler or Princeton; equally so if we won like UNLV. I think we have fans who would rather win 18 games the "right" way rather than cozying up to the idea of playing the "wrong" way and winning 30-plus.
    I agree with you on this, but I also think Fountain hit it on the head with Utah fans knowing that recruiting the big time players was/is simply not a reality here. We love the Chris Hill/Rick Majerus/Kyle Whittingham ability to find and/or develop a diamond in a rough. Think of Utah's most beloved players... Alex Jensen and Morgan Scalley.

    Now as for the groaning at ESA, it was audible, but it also probably had to do with the fact that Wich St. first game could have quite possibly been one of the worst NCAA tournament games I have had the displeasure of sitting through. Both teams played awful in that game and it felt more like a game where the winner was the team that sucked the least.

    Of course Wich St redeemed itself over and over again after that, but I think the Ute fans in attendance were thinking, "We've seen this stuff before and it sucks..."

    I wish I could add to Senioritis's analysis of 'South Pacific', but I'm more of a 'Cats' man myself.

  6. #36
    Quote Originally Posted by SoCalPat View Post
    We're almost as bad as BYU fans when it comes to football and styles. Not pointing fingers here, but we have too many armchair whistleblowers who insist there is a "right" way to play basketball (if the groans were really audible at ESA over how WSU played, then my point is cemented). Me, I'm from the Auerbach school of thought, which says, "There are only two great plays: South Pacific and putting the ball in the basket."

    I'd be thrilled if we played (and won) like a Butler or Princeton; equally so if we won like UNLV. I think we have fans who would rather win 18 games the "right" way rather than cozying up to the idea of playing the "wrong" way and winning 30-plus.
    I don't agree with this at all. If the Utes were able to recruit Jabari, win 30 games with him taking 30 shots a night ala Jimmer, the Huntsman Center would be a lot more packed than it was last year. We are just as fickle as any fanbase...we just want wins, whether it comes from Allen Iverson or a fantastic team playing great team basketball.

  7. #37
    Sam the Sheepdog LA Ute's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Location
    Los Angeles, California
    Posts
    17,726
    Quote Originally Posted by Utah View Post
    I don't agree with this at all. If the Utes were able to recruit Jabari, win 30 games with him taking 30 shots a night ala Jimmer, the Huntsman Center would be a lot more packed than it was last year. We are just as fickle as any fanbase...we just want wins, whether it comes from Allen Iverson or a fantastic team playing great team basketball.
    For the fans who wanted JB to succeed but gave up on him, it was not the style of he play he tried to implement, it was his ineffectiveness implementing any style of play. We've moved on.

    "It is only with the heart that one can see rightly; what is essential is invisible to the eye."
    --Antoine de Saint-Exupery

    "Things fall apart; the centre cannot hold."
    --Yeats

    “True, we [lawyers] build no bridges. We raise no towers. We construct no engines. We paint no pictures - unless as amateurs for our own principal amusement. There is little of all that we do which the eye of man can see. But we smooth out difficulties; we relieve stress; we correct mistakes; we take up other men's burdens and by our efforts we make possible the peaceful life of men in a peaceful state.”

    --John W. Davis, founder of Davis Polk & Wardwell

  8. #38
    I can't believe this debate has gone on this long. STOP IT! Jim Boylen was a complete knave and a fool, a total POS. He failed at every level of coaching. He couldn't even keep a team manned year to year. Kodiak has at least done that. Boylen teams played like they were on the playground. He thought the secret to success was manipulating the press and message boards including by giving free food and beer to fans. He represents nightmare years of Utah basketball, he's the worst thing that's ever happened to Utah athletics. Just look at the wreckage he left behind. I always thought he was a complete bufoon, an idiot. Then he showed he was worse than that when he worked behind the scenes to get O'Brien et al. to transfer after he was fired. I loath Jim Boylen. You all should too. You're way too kind.

    Kill this thread, please.
    One thing I have learned in a long life: that all our science, measured against reality, is primitive and childlike -- and yet it is the most precious thing we have.

    --Albert Einstein

    The fact that life evolved out of nearly nothing, some 10 billion years after the universe evolved out of literally nothing, is a fact so staggering that I would be mad to attempt words to do it justice.

    --Richard Dawkins

    Be kind to all, for everyone you meet is fighting a great battle.

    --Philo

  9. #39
    Quote Originally Posted by SoCalPat View Post
    We're almost as bad as BYU fans when it comes to football and styles. Not pointing fingers here, but we have too many armchair whistleblowers who insist there is a "right" way to play basketball (if the groans were really audible at ESA over how WSU played, then my point is cemented). Me, I'm from the Auerbach school of thought, which says, "There are only two great plays: South Pacific and putting the ball in the basket."

    I'd be thrilled if we played (and won) like a Butler or Princeton; equally so if we won like UNLV. I think we have fans who would rather win 18 games the "right" way rather than cozying up to the idea of playing the "wrong" way and winning 30-plus.
    I have never met a Ute fan who complains about style when we win or who would take 18 wins the right way. If you can find me one, id LOVE to meet them. I don't think that attitude exists, and if it does, its in VERY small doses.

    The only time I ever complain about a playing "Style" is when we are playing selfish, individual oriented-basketball and we lose. (see '09-'10 we had ONE guy who averaged more than 1.25 assists per game!!!!!!! Thats pitiful!)

    Id also be complaining if our team was full of felons or bozos (ala Marshall Henderson) even if we were winning. I dont ask that we fill the team with choir boys, but I do want our team to be smiled on and something that the whole community can get behind.

  10. #40
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Location
    Twin Falls, Idaho
    Posts
    3,405
    Quote Originally Posted by UtahsMrSports View Post
    I have never met a Ute fan who complains about style when we win or who would take 18 wins the right way. If you can find me one, id LOVE to meet them. I don't think that attitude exists, and if it does, its in VERY small doses.
    There were several fans who didn't want Dave Rose during our last coaching search because his teams didn't play defense. Never mind that they win 20 games every year and play an exciting brand of basketball -- Rose was a bad fit because he couldn't get the consensus POY to play like Drew Hansen (Disclaimer: That remark is in no way meant to be a slight against Drew, one of my all-time favorite unsung players. But even Drew would admit you wouldn't win many games if you had 12 of him on your roster).

    You want to see evidence of those who prefer style over results -- just watch until our next head coaching search.

  11. #41
    Quote Originally Posted by SoCalPat View Post
    There were several fans who didn't want Dave Rose during our last coaching search because his teams didn't play defense. Never mind that they win 20 games every year and play an exciting brand of basketball -- Rose was a bad fit because he couldn't get the consensus POY to play like Drew Hansen (Disclaimer: That remark is in no way meant to be a slight against Drew, one of my all-time favorite unsung players. But even Drew would admit you wouldn't win many games if you had 12 of him on your roster).

    You want to see evidence of those who prefer style over results -- just watch until our next head coaching search.
    ah got ya. and yes, id agree. thats dumb.

    And I hope our next hc search is not for another decade or more.

  12. #42
    Quote Originally Posted by SoCalPat View Post
    There were several fans who didn't want Dave Rose during our last coaching search because his teams didn't play defense. Never mind that they win 20 games every year and play an exciting brand of basketball -- Rose was a bad fit because he couldn't get the consensus POY to play like Drew Hansen (Disclaimer: That remark is in no way meant to be a slight against Drew, one of my all-time favorite unsung players. But even Drew would admit you wouldn't win many games if you had 12 of him on your roster).

    You want to see evidence of those who prefer style over results -- just watch until our next head coaching search.
    I think that Rose is a good coach, but this is a reason why his 20 win teams seemed to lose when it matters most.
    “Man cannot discover new oceans unless he has the courage to lose sight of the shore.”
    André Gide

  13. #43
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Location
    Twin Falls, Idaho
    Posts
    3,405
    Quote Originally Posted by Rocker Ute View Post
    I agree with you on this, but I also think Fountain hit it on the head with Utah fans knowing that recruiting the big time players was/is simply not a reality here. We love the Chris Hill/Rick Majerus/Kyle Whittingham ability to find and/or develop a diamond in a rough. Think of Utah's most beloved players... Alex Jensen and Morgan Scalley.
    That can work in the MWC, but we'll never equal our past feats in the MWC with that mentality in the Pac-12. And most of what endeared us so much to Alex and Morgan is that they were big winners. Think we hold Alex in such high esteem if he never plays on a team that makes it past the round of 32?

    Like I said in another thread about Utah hoops, we're not capable of doing anything outrageous and that's why success in our new league will be very hard to come by. We're not only fine with maintaining the status quo as far as we're perceived on the recruiting trail, we embrace it, and UCLA, Oregon and Arizona are more than happy that we're content in not being a threat to them for recruits. The funny thing is, we've long maintained that BYU could never achieve the heights in basketball that Utah has because our pool is much bigger. Now that we've gone close to a decade with mediocre results, it's because our recruiting pool is smaller? What gives?

  14. #44
    Sam the Sheepdog LA Ute's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Location
    Los Angeles, California
    Posts
    17,726
    Quote Originally Posted by Jarid in Cedar View Post
    I think that Rose is a good coach, but this is a reason why his 20 win teams seemed to lose when it matters most.
    I've wondered whether Jimmer would be doing more in the NBA if Rose had insisted that he learn to play defense. When I watched him during the NCAA tournament in his senior year I was embarrassed for him. He didn't even try to play defense.

    "It is only with the heart that one can see rightly; what is essential is invisible to the eye."
    --Antoine de Saint-Exupery

    "Things fall apart; the centre cannot hold."
    --Yeats

    “True, we [lawyers] build no bridges. We raise no towers. We construct no engines. We paint no pictures - unless as amateurs for our own principal amusement. There is little of all that we do which the eye of man can see. But we smooth out difficulties; we relieve stress; we correct mistakes; we take up other men's burdens and by our efforts we make possible the peaceful life of men in a peaceful state.”

    --John W. Davis, founder of Davis Polk & Wardwell

  15. #45
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Location
    Twin Falls, Idaho
    Posts
    3,405
    Quote Originally Posted by Jarid in Cedar View Post
    I think that Rose is a good coach, but this is a reason why his 20 win teams seemed to lose when it matters most.
    And I'm not trying to insist that Rose's defensive schemes or emphasis are without peer. But the man was one HC violation from getting to the Final Four, and maybe even winning it all.

  16. #46
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Location
    Twin Falls, Idaho
    Posts
    3,405
    Quote Originally Posted by LA Ute View Post
    I've wondered whether Jimmer would be doing more in the NBA if Rose had insisted that he learn to play defense. When I watched him during the NCAA tournament in his senior year I was embarrassed for him. He didn't even try to play defense.
    There's the first notch for "Skeptics" in the category of "Is Dave Rose a good coach?" Really now ...

    I'm sure Rose didn't hold Jimmer out of defensive slide drills, or tell him not to worry about being a matador on defense. But if there ever was a player to totally excuse on defense, it would be the guy who sells out arenas, averages 28 PPG and can get to the line at will and shoot 90 percent from there to boot.

  17. #47
    Sam the Sheepdog LA Ute's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Location
    Los Angeles, California
    Posts
    17,726
    Quote Originally Posted by SoCalPat View Post
    There's the first notch for "Skeptics" in the category of "Is Dave Rose a good coach?" Really now ...

    I'm sure Rose didn't hold Jimmer out of defensive slide drills, or tell him not to worry about being a matador on defense. But if there ever was a player to totally excuse on defense, it would be the guy who sells out arenas, averages 28 PPG and can get to the line at will and shoot 90 percent from there to boot.
    I admire Rose as a coach and would have been happy if he had come to Utah. Jimmer's D was still a joke.

    "It is only with the heart that one can see rightly; what is essential is invisible to the eye."
    --Antoine de Saint-Exupery

    "Things fall apart; the centre cannot hold."
    --Yeats

    “True, we [lawyers] build no bridges. We raise no towers. We construct no engines. We paint no pictures - unless as amateurs for our own principal amusement. There is little of all that we do which the eye of man can see. But we smooth out difficulties; we relieve stress; we correct mistakes; we take up other men's burdens and by our efforts we make possible the peaceful life of men in a peaceful state.”

    --John W. Davis, founder of Davis Polk & Wardwell

  18. #48
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Location
    Twin Falls, Idaho
    Posts
    3,405
    Quote Originally Posted by LA Ute View Post
    I admire Rose as a coach and would have been happy if he had come to Utah. Jimmer's D was still a joke.
    It was. Jimmer goes against my belief that elite scorers have the athleticism to be, at worst, average defenders. At the same time, Rose was smart not to waste practice time in trying to turn Jimmer into something he isn't. I doubt either side wanted those kinds of defensive results, but sometimes you gotta make do with what you've got, and I credit Rose for realizing that sooner than other coaches might have done.

    I will remove the notch for you in the Skeptics category and put it in its appropriate place (where I knew it belonged all along).

  19. #49
    Quote Originally Posted by SoCalPat View Post
    That can work in the MWC, but we'll never equal our past feats in the MWC with that mentality in the Pac-12. And most of what endeared us so much to Alex and Morgan is that they were big winners. Think we hold Alex in such high esteem if he never plays on a team that makes it past the round of 32?

    Like I said in another thread about Utah hoops, we're not capable of doing anything outrageous and that's why success in our new league will be very hard to come by. We're not only fine with maintaining the status quo as far as we're perceived on the recruiting trail, we embrace it, and UCLA, Oregon and Arizona are more than happy that we're content in not being a threat to them for recruits. The funny thing is, we've long maintained that BYU could never achieve the heights in basketball that Utah has because our pool is much bigger. Now that we've gone close to a decade with mediocre results, it's because our recruiting pool is smaller? What gives?
    This will change if we steal Chapman from them. At least start to.

  20. #50
    Sam the Sheepdog LA Ute's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Location
    Los Angeles, California
    Posts
    17,726
    Quote Originally Posted by SoCalPat View Post
    I will remove the notch for you in the Skeptics category and put it in its appropriate place (where I knew it belonged all along).
    Good. I was worried that I might have to lodge a protest with Jarid or something like that.

    "It is only with the heart that one can see rightly; what is essential is invisible to the eye."
    --Antoine de Saint-Exupery

    "Things fall apart; the centre cannot hold."
    --Yeats

    “True, we [lawyers] build no bridges. We raise no towers. We construct no engines. We paint no pictures - unless as amateurs for our own principal amusement. There is little of all that we do which the eye of man can see. But we smooth out difficulties; we relieve stress; we correct mistakes; we take up other men's burdens and by our efforts we make possible the peaceful life of men in a peaceful state.”

    --John W. Davis, founder of Davis Polk & Wardwell

  21. #51
    Boylen is the head man (non-interim) with the Bulls. The Chicago Bulls!!!!!

    https://twitter.com/wojespn/status/1069606433237491712


  22. #52
    Quote Originally Posted by sancho View Post
    Wow, I hope he kills it. Seems like a tough spot to fall into, though.

    We ought to have a bingo game for the first time he says

    "Ball didnt go in the hoop"

    or

    "Nice of you to show up."

  23. #53
    Quote Originally Posted by sancho View Post
    That's a cherished Utah basketball memory.
    That is the first time that phrase has ever been uttered about Jim Boylen.
    Last edited by LA Ute; 12-03-2018 at 12:06 PM.

  24. #54
    "Be a philosopher. A man can compromise to gain a point. It has become apparent that a man can, within limits, follow his inclinations within the arms of the Church if he does so discreetly." - The Walking Drum

    "And here’s what life comes down to—not how many years you live, but how many of those years are filled with bullshit that doesn’t amount to anything to satisfy the requirements of some dickhead you’ll never get the pleasure of punching in the face." – Adam Carolla

  25. #55
    Quote Originally Posted by Mormon Red Death View Post
    http://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/id/2...gressive-style

    Trouble in paradise. Who could have seen this coming?

  26. #56
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Location
    Twin Falls, Idaho
    Posts
    3,405
    Quote Originally Posted by Applejack View Post
    http://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/id/2...gressive-style

    Trouble in paradise. Who could have seen this coming?
    There are generals and there are lieutenants. Jimmy clearly demonstrating that he's the latter.

  27. #57
    "Be a philosopher. A man can compromise to gain a point. It has become apparent that a man can, within limits, follow his inclinations within the arms of the Church if he does so discreetly." - The Walking Drum

    "And here’s what life comes down to—not how many years you live, but how many of those years are filled with bullshit that doesn’t amount to anything to satisfy the requirements of some dickhead you’ll never get the pleasure of punching in the face." – Adam Carolla

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •